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Hugoon Chavez posted:Time to campaign and translate everything my friends have to share. If I can get my doctor friend to publicly open up about the "Colosseum Tuesdays" on his emergency unit that would be pretty sweet. Act fast, these calls tend to close quite quickly.
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May 17, 2016 09:32
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Wikkheiser posted:Now take a look at Venezuela's homicide rate, which I've read is comparable to active war zones, and note that all those bodies have to go somewhere. So we're not even seeing the worst photos. Caracas has only one morgue: Bello Monte. That means that every one of the hundreds of murder victims in the city each month have only one place to go. In 2010, El Nacional published a picture taken inside the morgue. The picture showed dead bodies sitting out on the open; bloodied, some half-covered in filthy rags, some laying on the floor and others stacked on top of each other. (This news article contains the picture - needless to say, it's  and  : picture).When the picture was released, it set off a debate about the general state of decay in Venezuela. The government threatened to sue El Nacional for a bunch of reasons. The government said that the picture wasn't recent, that the picture was part of a smear campaign against Chavez, that the picture violated the law by exposing minors to shocking material, etc. I'm not sure what ever came of those threats, but they go to show that the PSUV refusing to engage with reality and deflecting blame to everything/everyone else isn't a new thing.
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May 17, 2016 14:51
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You guys probably already know this, but if you talk to the Guardian, be sure to have your identities concealed somehow. Considering the PSUV gets care mad even about random tweets and blog posts, they will definitely try to gently caress up anyone who appears in this.
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May 17, 2016 16:10
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Vlex posted:The Guardian are asking Venezuelans to share their stories about life in the country. No see you guys the middle-class white man who can buy whatever he wants whenever he wants says this is part of a conspiracy. https://twitter.com/ciccmaher/status/732365236062302208 The Venezuelans trolling his TL are pretty great though. I don't think I'd be see humble were I in their position.
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May 17, 2016 17:07
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Cicarriello is insufferable. He's in the same league as Eva Golinger. He's the epitome of "You should all suffer in deplorable conditions because I need the PSUV to work to validate my world view".
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May 17, 2016 17:29
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http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/17/opinion/venezuelas-downward-spiral.html?ref=americas&_r=0 Holy poo poo, more people were murdered in the first three months of the year in Venezuela than the numbers of civilians killed in Afghanistan in 2015.
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May 17, 2016 18:32
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People are getting desperate, even in nice buildings or gated communities you're seeing neighbors steal from each other, something that almost never happened before. I just can't see a way this country can make it to the end of the year without completely collapsing.
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May 17, 2016 18:58
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I keep loving seeing people rummaging through trash. It's not even hobos, just regular people. And I see them everywhere, even in the east of Caracas.
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May 17, 2016 19:10
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The endgame of socialism is the actual de-evolution of humanity into animals.
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May 17, 2016 19:52
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Chuck Boone posted:Cicarriello is insufferable. He's in the same league as Eva Golinger. He's the epitome of "You should all suffer in deplorable conditions because I need the PSUV to work to validate my world view". I really need to make more tu quoque's in my TL to get more followers. The glasses, beard, java jacket-adorned coffee cup; he has folks reading him despite living up to an old hipster stereotype.
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May 17, 2016 20:14
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Sinteres posted:http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/17/opinion/venezuelas-downward-spiral.html?ref=americas&_r=0 Also note that this isn't someone having fun with disparate population sizes- Venezuela and Afghanistan are extremely close in total population (around 31-32m), with Afghanistan actually being the slightly more populous country
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May 17, 2016 20:36
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I'm not trying to downplay how bad things are in Venezuela, but I'm skeptical of that statistic. Getting that level of precision out of either country seems basically impossible. And you would need to check how the numbers were gathered to see if they were comparable.
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May 17, 2016 21:03
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Patrick Spens posted:I'm not trying to downplay how bad things are in Venezuela, but I'm skeptical of that statistic. Getting that level of precision out of either country seems basically impossible. And you would need to check how the numbers were gathered to see if they were comparable. I don't see why it would, you just count the amount of corpses reaching the morgue. People have phones, you know, doctors at the morgue can contact NGOs directly to provide the information if the government pretends to censor them.
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May 17, 2016 21:11
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It's fair mentioning than a lot of those murders are the product of inter gang violence. We aren't generally at a crazy point like el Salvador, but there are many sectors that do resemble it. Killing and dying for those dudes is a daily struggle. Plus, sometimes, killing someone from the outside.
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May 17, 2016 21:40
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Caracas feels like the closest thing to what Dredd might be like in real life.
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May 17, 2016 21:44
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Wikkheiser posted:Caracas feels like the closest thing to what Dredd might be like in real life. I've made this comparison several times before, actually.
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May 17, 2016 21:49
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How do people stay wealthy when inflation is so bad? Do you just keep assets in other currencies or do you get more near-worthless dollars than poor people in order to keep pace?
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May 17, 2016 22:22
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Patrick Spens posted:I'm not trying to downplay how bad things are in Venezuela, but I'm skeptical of that statistic. Getting that level of precision out of either country seems basically impossible. And you would need to check how the numbers were gathered to see if they were comparable. Comparing crime statistics across countries is extremely difficult for the reasons that you've pointed out (definition and methodology). A particular crime might have different definitions in two different countries, and the way in which the countries collect data may also differ in important ways. However, as fnox pointed out, homicide is perhaps the "easiest" crime to compare across borders, since its definition is often fairly consistent (the killing of one human by another), and generally speaking the fact that there is often a dead body makes it relatively simple to count. The Venezuelan homicide statistic (the 4,696 number) comes directly out of the mouth of Attorney General Luisa Ortega Diaz, who released the figure at a press conference some days ago. Diaz is in charge of the Public Ministry, of all policing and of the administration of justice in the country. In other words, that figure is official. I don't know who tallied up the number of civilians killed in Afghanistan, or how. My issue with that comparison is that it's a bit like apples and oranges. It's comparing homicides to civilian casualties of war, which are two different things. I guess the point of the comparison is to be shocking by making you think, "Wow, more people died in Venezuela than in a war zone". It makes much more sense to compare homicide rate to homicide rate, and the result can be just as shocking. That same article cites an (official) figure of more than 17,000 homicides in 2015. Canada, which is slightly larger in population (35 million vs. 30 million) saw 516 homicides in 2014. The United States, with a population ten times that of Venezuela (318 million), saw 13,427 "murder and nonnegligent manslaughter" (here's an example of the definitional challenges when comparing crime statistics) in 2014. Anyway, comparisons are fun to do, but the fact is that Venezuela has one of the highest (or the highest, if you go off unofficial figures) homicide rates in the world.
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May 17, 2016 22:23
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I remember when I was a kid in the 90s my parents would let me play out on the streets all day without a worry but now parents don't want their kids to even take a taxi alone much less play on the streets. My grandmothers house had a waist high fence and she used to leave her car on the street but now any of that is unthinkable because of the crime.
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May 17, 2016 22:33
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Chuck Boone posted:Comparing crime statistics across countries is extremely difficult for the reasons that you've pointed out (definition and methodology). A particular crime might have different definitions in two different countries, and the way in which the countries collect data may also differ in important ways. However, as fnox pointed out, homicide is perhaps the "easiest" crime to compare across borders, since its definition is often fairly consistent (the killing of one human by another), and generally speaking the fact that there is often a dead body makes it relatively simple to count. The figure for Afghanistan is a best-guess estimate compiled by the UN for 2015. The Taliban actually complained that they were inflating civilian casualties by including Taliban fighters who were not wearing uniforms. It's definitely an apples and oranges comparison that doesn't stand up to any level of scrutiny.
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May 17, 2016 23:01
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Krispy Kareem posted:How do people stay wealthy when inflation is so bad? Do you just keep assets in other currencies or do you get more near-worthless dollars than poor people in order to keep pace? I assume the rich keep their wealth in more stable forms such as dollars, euro, stole medical supplies, and bricks of cocaine.
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May 17, 2016 23:04
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The National Assembly has just voted to reject the state of exception. The way this is supposed to work is that the president makes the decree and passes it on to the Supreme Court and the National Assembly, which then accept/reject the decree. You know, balance of power and whatnot. Anyway, there's a 100% chance that Maduro/the Supreme Court will just ignore the National Assembly. Also, Maduro gave a speech today and he said this about the National Assembly: quote:The National Assembly lost its political validity. It’s only a matter of time before it disappears. I’m sure that they will reject the [state of exception] decree (…) they want to destroy the economy (…) [They are] a little bit crazy and desperate. LGD posted:The figure for Afghanistan is a best-guess estimate compiled by the UN for 2015. The Taliban actually complained that they were inflating civilian casualties by including Taliban fighters who were not wearing uniforms. It's definitely an apples and oranges comparison that doesn't stand up to any level of scrutiny. Krispy Kareem posted:How do people stay wealthy when inflation is so bad? Do you just keep assets in other currencies or do you get more near-worthless dollars than poor people in order to keep pace? Ordinary folk have it tougher, because they can either stick with a worthless currency or spend tons for foreign currencies. I know a couple of people living in Venezuela who provide online services and get paid in US dollars. I suspect that the overwhelming majority of people are in a really tough spot, though.
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May 17, 2016 23:13
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Chuck Boone posted:Caracas has only one morgue: Bello Monte. That means that every one of the hundreds of murder victims in the city each month have only one place to go. "Caracas coroner" has to be one of the more hellish and weirdly heroic jobs available that (probably) doesn't carry much risk of personal harm.
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May 17, 2016 23:23
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GreyjoyBastard posted:"Caracas coroner" has to be one of the more hellish and weirdly heroic jobs available that (probably) doesn't carry much risk of personal harm. There have been plenty of cases where a gang storms a morgue to try to reclaim the body of one of their own, there have also been plenty of cases of rival gangs going to hospitals to finish off someone. You are not safe anywhere here and anyone who thinks they are is a fool.
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May 18, 2016 00:02
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Krispy Kareem posted:How do people stay wealthy when inflation is so bad? Do you just keep assets in other currencies or do you get more near-worthless dollars than poor people in order to keep pace? I'm pretty sure all the rich people in Venezuela have fled the country by now
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May 18, 2016 00:03
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Krispy Kareem posted:How do people stay wealthy when inflation is so bad? Do you just keep assets in other currencies or do you get more near-worthless dollars than poor people in order to keep pace? When you're wealthy enough you can straight up have a lot of land, be able to hold assets in overseas banks and currency, hell maybe even have precious metals and gems at home in a strong safe and with the security detail to keep it safe.
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May 18, 2016 00:12
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Krispy Kareem posted:How do people stay wealthy when inflation is so bad? Do you just keep assets in other currencies or do you get more near-worthless dollars than poor people in order to keep pace?
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May 18, 2016 00:32
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Krispy Kareem posted:How do people stay wealthy when inflation is so bad? Do you just keep assets in other currencies or do you get more near-worthless dollars than poor people in order to keep pace? They probably kept most of their wealth in Dollars.
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May 18, 2016 02:03
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If poo poo keeps getting worse there's going to be an armed uprising from hungry and desperate people, giving Maduro the perfect excuse to use the army to purge everyone who disagrees with him. 
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May 18, 2016 03:09
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Old James posted:They probably kept most of their wealth in Dollars. More accurately, they keep them in things, houses, cars, even random luxury objects like electric guitars. Stuff that is worth something and that will continue to be worth something in the long while and that aren't that terribly easy to steal. The truth is that very people actually save any amount of money, even the richer folk, if they make money in bolivares it simply makes no sense to save it. The amount of dollars you can buy with a ridiculously high salary like Bs. 200000 a month is pitiful, so nobody can feasibly save any significant amount of dollars, unless they already have an income in dollars.
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May 18, 2016 04:03
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Chuck Boone posted:Also, Maduro gave a speech today and he said this about the National Assembly: Maybe there's something being lost in translation, maybe I'm reading too much into it, but to me that sounds an awful lot like he's deliberately planning to forcibly dissolve the National Assembly.
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May 18, 2016 04:27
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Maybe there's something being lost in translation, maybe I'm reading too much into it, but to me that sounds an awful lot like he's deliberately planning to forcibly dissolve the National Assembly. He said he would, yes. I believe they haven't done it yet because the backlash would be actually pretty real. The government wants a coup so they can attempt the same thing Chavez did.
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May 18, 2016 05:15
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There is an opposition demonstration planned for today that is supposed to gather at Plaza Venezuela and then march west to the headquarters of the Consejo Nacional Electoral. However, Maduro and other PSUV figures have repeatedly said that no opposition protest could take place in the west of the city (that's where all the government buildings are), so it's not clear what will happen today. This morning, the Plaza Venezuela subway station and fourteen others in the general vicinity were shut down. They've since re-opened five. The purpose of the shutdown is presumably to stop people from getting to the protest site. Surface bus routes have also been closed. I'm also seeing lots of pictures on Twitter of hundreds of security forces (National Guard and National Bolivarian Police) concentrating around various areas of Caracas. Here are some pictures, supposedly from the area around Plaza Venezuela:    Also, the PSUV has started to bus in supporters to Plaza Venezuela, because due to an embarrassing schedule error they're also having their own demonstration at the exact same time and place as the opposition. Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Maybe there's something being lost in translation, maybe I'm reading too much into it, but to me that sounds an awful lot like he's deliberately planning to forcibly dissolve the National Assembly. The phrase Maduro used is "Es cuestion de tiempo para que desaparezca". The literal word-for-word translation is "It's an issue of time for it to disappear"; meaning, "It's a matter of time before it disappears". The word "desaparezca" is a verb form of the word that means "to disappear", and it's strange that he would use that word because it has the same meaning in Spanish as it does in English. He could have said something like, "It's only a matter of time before there are new elections and the opposition deputies are voted out", but he didn't. I think you're absolutely right in taking this as a not-so-thinly-veiled-threat, but maybe some of the other Spanish speakers can chime in with their own interpretations of the phrase? Chuck Boone fucked around with this message at 15:07 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 15:02
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fnox posted:More accurately, they keep them in things, houses, cars, even random luxury objects like electric guitars. Stuff that is worth something and that will continue to be worth something in the long while and that aren't that terribly easy to steal. I figured as much. During the Greexit drama, some Greeks were buying used luxury cars to store wealth in case Greece shut down the banks and converted everything to Drachmas. I was just curious how Venezuelans were handling it. It sounds like everyone just spends everything they've got at the first opportunity since you don't know what prices will be tomorrow or whether anything will be in stock.
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May 18, 2016 15:13
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If anyone wants to follow today's protest, Vivoplay usually has decent coverage (in spanish) for this stuff and their online channel is open for today. https://www.vivoplay.net/main/?selected_page_index=1&now=32
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May 18, 2016 15:14
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Krispy Kareem posted:I figured as much. During the Greexit drama, some Greeks were buying used luxury cars to store wealth in case Greece shut down the banks and converted everything to Drachmas. I was just curious how Venezuelans were handling it. It sounds like everyone just spends everything they've got at the first opportunity since you don't know what prices will be tomorrow or whether anything will be in stock. This is correct. Nowadays not many people have money for luxury (or first-needs...) items, but those who do are spending their Bolivares as soon as they can, because your 1000 bsF might buy you a 2L coke today, but will only pay for 1L next week, to use a rather dumb example. My mom for instance told me the other day that she found some basic medicine (Ibuprofen and paracetamol) and basically spend half her salary on it. She was happy.
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May 18, 2016 15:25
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What are the demonstrators hoping to accomplish?
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May 18, 2016 15:31
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The main opposition march is on the Libertador Avenue, moving west. The National Guard and National Police have blocked access to the avenue key access points. A small group of protesters broke through one of their lines, and they're now ahead of the main opposition group. The National Guard has already fired teargas and rubber bullets to repel the protesters, but they're sticking around. GlyphGryph posted:What are the demonstrators hoping to accomplish?
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May 18, 2016 15:37
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GlyphGryph posted:What are the demonstrators hoping to accomplish? Supposedly, reach the Electoral Council headquarters in order to pressure them to adhere to the rules and not drag their feet with the recall referendum process. However, this is the third countrywide demonstration in a week for that same purpose and at least in the Caracas there doesn't seem to be any thought out plan, route, or logistics involved from the opposition leadership.
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May 18, 2016 15:38
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So what is the longterm effect of people spending all their money and presumably taking on as much debt as possible? Will they ever pay it back in any capacity or will the nation collectively default?
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May 18, 2016 15:49
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