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I think demon trident will be a poo poo idea since I don't have polearm training, so broad axe it is then, and prayers that next Okawaru gift is not 20 more crossbow bolts. So, toward the D:15 now, and if I'm still alive I'll see what bot says about Shoals and Spider.
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May 18, 2016 05:43
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PleasingFungus posted:wait, are you recommending he do vaults:5 before depths? kalstrams posted:I think demon trident will be a poo poo idea since I don't have polearm training, so broad axe it is then, and prayers that next Okawaru gift is not 20 more crossbow bolts.
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May 18, 2016 05:45
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PleasingFungus posted:nope I guess I'll train polearms after I get mindelay on broad axe.
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May 18, 2016 05:48
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kalstrams posted:My other options are: Generally if you want to use a shield it's best to choose a weapon category other than axes, since they have the worst 1h options. Unless you're an orc or dwarf or something and your axe aptitude is better than everything else. e: IronicDongz posted:"Maybe do a bit of depths for XP before getting the 3rd rune", aka see how strong your character is after doing shoals+spider+vault 1-4 and do depths if you feel like you need more XP I don't have much of a grasp on how scary Abyss is but maybe a stealthy or lugonu-y character would grab that rune before depths? But Vaults never. RPATDO_LAMD fucked around with this message at 05:52 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 05:48
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:Generally if you want to use a shield it's best to choose a weapon category other than axes, since they have the worst 1h options. Unless you're an orc or dwarf or something and your axe aptitude is better than everything else.  Please tell me blunt weapons are not the best option for 1h.
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May 18, 2016 05:50
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kalstrams posted:
I mean it's not the end of the world. Broad axes work just fine, and with your current skill investment you're better of sticking to one anyways. Generally, though, you wouldn't want to create a character with axes+shields in mind, and you'd only do it if you found an amazing shield or broadaxe. If you want to use a shield any of the other weapon categories are decent, really. (Staves and shortblades aren't real weapon categories though.) Or just pick Formicid and combine a large shield with an exe axe or triple sword. RPATDO_LAMD fucked around with this message at 05:59 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 05:57
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Volcanoes need to give more random loot and less rf+ body armours. Also a vamp axe + shield is super effective cheese. Especially on a beoghite with a pack of spear-orcs.
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May 18, 2016 06:05
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kalstrams posted:
good m&f weapons are a little more common than the others, but long blades are fine, and polearms are fine too. (demon tridents are the best 1h polearms, and you've already got two!) kalstrams posted:Speaking of Ice Cave, I got one in Lair:5 I think and since volcano was easy I just rushed into it. Almost died a few times fighting a herd of some yeti-looking people ...yaks?
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May 18, 2016 06:10
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:If you want to use a shield any of the other weapon categories are decent, really. (Staves and shortblades aren't real weapon categories though.)
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May 18, 2016 06:28
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PleasingFungus posted:good m&f weapons are a little more common than the others, but long blades are fine, and polearms are fine too. (demon tridents are the best 1h polearms, and you've already got two!) Also ugh, I don't like blunt weapons and ai don't know how to invoke trident for extended reach or whatever so long blades it is on the next MiFi, so I can maintain chain of disappointment that all good weapons that I get are either tridents or crossbows.
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May 18, 2016 06:30
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IronicDongz posted:shortblades are real as hell on the right build, staves are real as hell period now that lajatangs are not as rare as they used to be I would probably not recommend short blades as primary offense at the very least to someone who is this new, unless they were trying out being a stabber or something though. Can't spell lajatang without several letters used in the word love though.
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May 18, 2016 06:35
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kalstrams posted:Not yaks, white human silhouettes. Before that kind of like icy bears, and slightly before that some pushover thrash I don't remember. ice devil! that was gonna be my next guess. to invoke polearms' reaching attack, either hit 'v' or use tab. (tab, aka autofight, automatically uses reaching weapons.)
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May 18, 2016 06:44
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PleasingFungus posted:beautiful Drunk oversight.
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May 18, 2016 06:47
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kalstrams posted:Also ugh, I don't like blunt weapons and ai don't know how to invoke trident for extended reach or whatever so long blades it is on the next MiFi, so I can maintain chain of disappointment that all good weapons that I get are either tridents or crossbows.
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May 18, 2016 06:49
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I feel like posting about this character is setting me up for death within the next five minutes but I've never had so much dumb luck. I started a Minotaur Monk with the intention of picking Gozag and seeing if it was sustainable to feed a minotaur entirely through purchasing food shops. On D3 I was reading unidentified scrolls and got my first Identify scroll, which I used on a potion that turned out to be a potion of experience. Cool, I drank it and steamrolled up through the temple, where I debated not picking Gozag and playing something I knew would work to not waste the boon of a D3 potion of experience. I chose Gozag anyway and worked my way down to D8 when I fell down a three-floor shaft to D11. I had a hell of a time finding any upward stairs and eventually had to pass a room with glass walls and dozens of orcs and bears inside. They saw me and came charging out, the fight was going to be savage so I quaff-ID'd two potions and hoped for the best. The first was Beneficial Mutation which gave me sharp toenails, and the second was a potion of rage. I kicked, punched and head-butted my way through the fleet of bears and hopped in to the glass room for loot, but lo and behold I fall in another three-floor shaft and find myself on D14. I land on a tile adjacent to a shop, a potion shop. Upon opening it up I see that they're selling both a potion of experience and a potion of beneficial mutation so I put that Gozag money to good use. The beneficial mutation regrettably gave me +10% MP and I'm currently debating whether I want to spend the potion of experience on small-ish unarmed/dodge/fighting boosts, 0->9.4 Shields (I haven't even found a shield yet), or 0->5.4 Spellcasting to make grabbing some cheap spells like Apportation easy if I eventually find them. The moral of the story is Gozag is the good god for cool people and I would vote for him as President. e: I chose Shields and found a shield a few tiles away  e2: I died 5 minutes later to a monster Hydra on D14 before I found the stairs. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 06:58 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 06:49
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kalstrams posted:Not yaks, white human silhouettes. Before that kind of like icy bears, and slightly before that some pushover thrash I don't remember. Ice devils? After frost beasts and wolf/bear/yak packs. And why don't you like blunt weapons? Your character in Crawl is like 10 pixels high IF they're an image and not an @ sign. Appearance doesn't matter. You evoke polearms with V I think, or v if the other evokes wands. Also I finally got past my recent string of Lair branch deaths by playing really safe, culminating in killing my nemesis the Lernaean hydra. (Also the last unique my team needed a kill for  ) Cruised to three runes, started clearing out Zot. Then remembered I could do some zigging for a couple more things I wanted, like more cMut. Got cocky and didn't play safe (I can totally take one more level for that enchant armour scroll to open up that trove) and died to a lowly slime creature with -20 corrosion. Oh well, I got some tzitzimitl kills for team ZeeZeeMeatls and like 45 team points in zig level clears. I've also decided next tournament's team is going to be Gastronok Slug God of Free Hats or something like that.
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May 18, 2016 06:51
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It's obviously simulacra. Ice devils and polar bears don't spawn in the same ice caves, do they? Most of them are fragile pushovers and then an iron troll simulacra freezes your face off. Shakill OReal posted:I started a Minotaur Monk with the intention of picking Gozag and seeing if it was sustainable to feed a minotaur entirely through purchasing food shops. A regular character without hunger abilities is sustainable entirely off floor food, you don't need food shops.
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May 18, 2016 07:07
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Simulcra of enemies with multiple attacks per turn are disproportionately powerful because the simulacrum bonus damage gets added to each of their hits. So two similar-HD simulacra can have hugely different damage potential and take you off-guard.
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May 18, 2016 07:48
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kalstrams posted:I guess I'll train polearms after I get mindelay on broad axe. As a general rule, don't train multiple weapon types. There are rarely any advantages to doing so and it eats up lots of experience you could use for defenses, magic and ranged attacks. Since your demon trident is an amazing type with an amazing brand that requires low skill investment and crosstrains with axes, it's probably worth it to switch. You have huge amounts of +int, so it's probably a good idea to learn a little necromancy and poke things from behind zombies. Maces and flails are indeed the best one-handed weapon type and almost certainly the best weapon type overall. When in doubt, go for blunt weapons. It's easy to find good base types early in the game, they have the best base one-handers and while greatmaces do a little less damage than other top tier weapons, they require considerably less XP investment, are much easier to find and because you find so many, it's quite common to find one with a really strong brand like pain or holy wrath. Long blades aren't very good in general. The one-handed options are generally a little weaker than maces and flails while also being considerably rarer in the early game. Greatswords are nice in the mid game, but fall off later. Triple swords are good, they're the most damaging weapon type most characters can use and require less investment than executioner's axes or bardiches, but chances are you'll never find one unless you worship a weapon gifting god. Polearms have good options in both fields, and have reaching, which is crazy good, but the top one-handed polearms are demon tridents, and those are hard to find. It's rare to go through a game without finding a bardiche, and halberds are common in the early game, so polearms are very good for two-handed characters. They're better than blunt weapons on some character types. Axes, like long blades, are also a little weak as a category. Hand axes and war axes suck, broad axes require a lot of investment for mediocre damage and executioner's axes are overly rare, similar to triple swords. Cleaving is lots of fun, though, and can be helpful as long as you remember that you're always better off fighting enemies one-on-one.
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May 18, 2016 08:06
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I agree but I think axes are better than long blades for a melee focused character, because axes and M&F both crosstrain with each other, so you can easily switch if you find a good weapon of the other type relatively early and if you're going 1-handers you can with fairly small XP investment use both. Long blades crosstrain with short blades, which only matters if you're a long blade user who finds an invis cloak or a stabby short blades user who later wants to upgrade to higher base damage for tanky targets.
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May 18, 2016 08:30
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"Hmm, do I want to start an other Tengu Ae or yet another Formicid Fi, lets go for Tengu." D:5 drops an -3 executioner axe and I've found 3 scrolls of Enchant Weapon already. CRAWL  And now D:6 shop is selling quicksilver dragon armor for 660, should I save for it? Zernach fucked around with this message at 12:39 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 12:37
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So, if I don't have any Necro skill, is pain brand worth it? For a MiFi^Oka, which weapon is better?
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May 18, 2016 12:41
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Zernach posted:"Hmm, do I want to start an other Tengu Ae or yet another Formicid Fi, lets go for Tengu." QDA is pretty good for tengu since they're strong at both armor and dodging and it benefits a lot from training both. I'd buy it. Also, nothing is stopping you from becoming a hybrid and using that executioner's axe, since you've got a good aptitude for it. Have you already chosen a god? If not, both of those are good signs that you could do well with Ashenzari, though you could still just ignore the axe and take Vehumet. Unimpressed posted:So, if I don't have any Necro skill, is pain brand worth it? For a MiFi^Oka, which weapon is better? Pain won't do anything for you if you don't have any points in necromancy. It doesn't take all that much (7-8 levels) for it to become very good though, and necromancy is really useful. I think the demon blade would still be best without necro skill, but I might be wrong.
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May 18, 2016 12:47
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Unimpressed posted:So, if I don't have any Necro skill, is pain brand worth it? For a MiFi^Oka, which weapon is better? Without good Necromancy, pain is useless (it adds 1d<Necro> to your attacks). The demon blade is still better for average damage output, but the elec blade could potentially out damage it when it triggers.
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May 18, 2016 12:53
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PleasingFungus posted:ice devil! that was gonna be my next guess.  Edit: gently caress you too game, I can't stand loving Shoals after doing just the level of it, and now you crash in the end of Shoals:2 and I have to play an extra level of SHoals.
cinci zoo sniper fucked around with this message at 14:33 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 13:22
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Note that although blunt weapons are best and long blades or axes are worst, the difference isn't huge. If you want a one-handed character, you'll do just fine with a long blade or a pole arm. All the weapon choices are viable, going with maces and flails makes the game a little easier, but if you don't like them for flavor reasons, you can happily avoid them.
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May 18, 2016 15:21
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Would a Chei NAIE want to go dodging or armor early? I assume dodging & catch up armor once I can cast in plate?
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May 18, 2016 15:44
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Stoat posted:Would a Chei NAIE want to go dodging or armor early? I assume dodging & catch up armor once I can cast in plate? I think so. Nagas' deformed body mut gives them bad returns on armor, especially before they have a barding. Fighting might be a good option too because they have a 0 aptitude for it and +20% HP. They're a large body race too, which counts against their evasion (not sure how this works).
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May 18, 2016 16:21
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Is there any good reason for ice dragon to be on Lair:2? I just arrived so it's not some kind of high turn count thing.
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May 18, 2016 16:37
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It's for you to get that badass dragon skin, dawg.
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May 18, 2016 16:38
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There's a vault with an Ice Dragon guarding its hoard across a small brook. It's normally inside that vault because it's rather a large cul-de-sac but something must have disturbed it and it managed to wander out.
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May 18, 2016 16:39
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Fitzy Fitz posted:I think so. Nagas' deformed body mut gives them bad returns on armor, especially before they have a barding. Fighting might be a good option too because they have a 0 aptitude for it and +20% HP. They're a large body race too, which counts against their evasion (not sure how this works). Pretty sure fighting is always a good option no matter what, hit points are good. Not sure that it exists in opposition to armour/dodging.
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May 18, 2016 17:40
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Yeah, but every point put into fighting is a point that isn't going into dodging. I meant that a naga might be better off skipping dodging (almost) entirely in the early game in favor of more fighting, whereas a race with higher dodging aptitudes might do the opposite. e: this does apply less on a Cheibro Fitzy Fitz fucked around with this message at 18:15 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 17:49
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Stoat posted:Would a Chei NAIE want to go dodging or armor early? I assume dodging & catch up armor once I can cast in plate? Dodging, absolutely. Dodging is really good and important for Chei characters. It will give much better returns in defense because of your high dex. The fact that you're an ice elementalist makes the choice even clearer because of ozo's armour.
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May 18, 2016 18:01
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Fitzy Fitz posted:It's for you to get that badass dragon skin, dawg. Sadly, it was a (unprepared) draconian transmuter. What's funny, though, is that I rolled another DrTm and got a similar vault but with a fire dragon. This time I was prepared  Still no sweet dragon armor for me, I wish draconians could wear it again.
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May 18, 2016 18:14
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I've been lugging around a GDA since like D1 on this DgHu. I'm wondering if there will come a time when my xtreme demigod stats will make it useful. e: now I have a crystal plate armor too, and I still haven't found Lair.. Fitzy Fitz fucked around with this message at 18:47 on May 18, 2016 |
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May 18, 2016 18:17
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May 18, 2016 19:57
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Fitzy Fitz posted:I've been lugging around a GDA since like D1 on this DgHu. I'm wondering if there will come a time when my xtreme demigod stats will make it useful. You probably have to be picking str every time if you want to have any access to spells at all.
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May 18, 2016 20:05
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Oh and yeah some people were mentioning that I should play online, so that's what I'm doing now, I guess. Does it matter which server I'm on or something?
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May 18, 2016 21:45
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kalstrams posted:Edit: gently caress you too game, I can't stand loving Shoals after doing just the level of it, and now you crash in the end of Shoals:2 and I have to play an extra level of SHoals. please upload the crash log and anything you remember about what was going on at the time to mantis, it'd be very helpful! crash logs are in the morgues directory, next to the saves directory - hitting # should send you in the right direction also, nice av 
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May 18, 2016 21:48
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