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turtlecrunch
May 14, 2013

Hesitation is defeat.
Some pics from the cospvp stuff I hosted/played in this weekend :allears:



https://fat.gfycat.com/SorrowfulLargeAdmiralbutterfly.webm

This is not ash lol

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Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

RyokoTK posted:

Just found out that as a single player I can be loving double invaded by Aldritch Faithful. Meanwhile if I ever try to invade anyone, anywhere, it's a loving 3v1.

I'm really not good enough to beat two guys at once, From, I'm sorry.

The Aldrich Faithful zone is probably the most lopsided covenant invasion area ever. If you try to go through it embered solo you're pretty much guaranteed to die, cause dealing with multiple invaders on top of the tough enemy layout is a pain.

Miss Mowcher
Jul 24, 2007

Ribbit
My only wish was that I'd get an ember when I killed invaders. Most of the invasions I got were pretty cool and varied builds, I can't get mad when I'm killed if the guy spent a little effort creating a character. Twink invasions are lame though.

Million Ghosts
Aug 11, 2011

spooooooky
how is the claw so bad? it doesn't even have the one perk of the caestus.

Paracelsus
Apr 6, 2009

bless this post ~kya
The Partizan's Spin Slash does surprisingly little damage when compared with its normal hits.

Trying to build up to a viable sorcerer sucks.

RyokoTK
Feb 12, 2012

I am cool.

Paracelsus posted:

The Partizan's Spin Slash does surprisingly little damage when compared with its normal hits.

Trying to build up to a viable sorcerer sucks.

It's all worth it now that they (slightly) buffed the Moonlight Greatsword. It hits like a train, it's unbelievable.

Stranger Danger Ranger
Jul 21, 2007
There are lizards coming out of my tv.

Internet Kraken posted:

The Aldrich Faithful zone is probably the most lopsided covenant invasion area ever. If you try to go through it embered solo you're pretty much guaranteed to die, cause dealing with multiple invaders on top of the tough enemy layout is a pain.

I just make beeline for Aldrich and deal with the rest later. I think the zone protecting covenants are ultimately poo poo because their zones are too drat big. They got it right with the bell towers in 2. Damnit I'm sounding like a broken record here. Gotta stop complaining about Dark Souls 3!

Synthbuttrange
May 6, 2007

I hope the dlc brings back stuff like bell and ratbros.

Stranger Danger Ranger
Jul 21, 2007
There are lizards coming out of my tv.
I hope there's an arena. They added one in the dlc for 1 so it's not too unlikely.

Gus Hobbleton
Dec 30, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 3 years!

actionjackson posted:

Killed a host, a guy he summoned three times, and a blue. I guess it helped that engaged the adds but still, this was pretty satisfying

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvaNg7aShkA

Jesus Christ that was painful to watch. You get the host down to half, then hit him with an undead hunter charm, so he just turns on invincibility mode by mashing the B button over and over until it wears off.

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer
I got kinda burned out from the lack of fun and diverse builds, so I'm 4000+ posts behind in this thread.

Did poise ever get fixed? Did anything change during that time?

Synthbuttrange
May 6, 2007

"Poise is working as intended"

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

Your Computer posted:

I got kinda burned out from the lack of fun and diverse builds, so I'm 4000+ posts behind in this thread.

Did poise ever get fixed? Did anything change during that time?

No, because according to From poise is not broken. It is working exactly as they intended it too. They didn't say what it actually does in DS3 though. Through player testing, the one thing we do know is tied to poise is hyper armour. If you don't have any poise, hyper armour doesn't work. If you have any amount, even one loving point, it works. There is no known benefit to poise above one.

As for other stuff? There's been some very minor balance changes. Probably the most significant one was fixing the L1 on some dual weapons to make them do proper damage. Nothing that has changed the meta though. They haven't fixed a single infamous glitch either.

EDIT: Oh the FP cost of a bunch of spells and miracles were reduced as well, but the overall status of them is still the same. The few that were good before are still good while most are still garbage.

Internet Kraken fucked around with this message at 08:04 on May 23, 2016

Iretep
Nov 10, 2009

Gus Hobbleton posted:

Jesus Christ that was painful to watch. You get the host down to half, then hit him with an undead hunter charm, so he just turns on invincibility mode by mashing the B button over and over until it wears off.

if he used flame surge to punish roll spam he could probably have killed him. sadly even when roll spam is a well known counter to dying people dont seem to get tools to punish it.

Viperix
Apr 21, 2006
I love how Titanite scales are super rare until you get to Archdragon Peak, then you can upgrade about 5 boss weapons worth.

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

Killed Aldrich on the weekend. Twice since I helped out Anri for her quest. the grave she made for Horace was nice :3:
Progressed Sirris's questline and murdered grandpa Hodrick. Now she's my pal or something.
Ran through fun fun toxic swamp area in the profaned capital without any toxic healing items just to help out Siegmeyer when I could have just handed him the key through the bars.
Freed Karla, hopefully I never have to see the Jailers again.

I feel i'm forgetting about another questline.

Harvey Wallbanger
Aug 15, 2009
Just had probably the funnest PvP time I've had so far in the game - I'm on NG++, SL120, as soon as I got to the Halfway Fortress I embered up, summoned one sunbro, used the dried finger, then started attempting to clear out the level. The next 30 minutes were a blur as we were invaded by reds and watchdogs while also attempting to fight the regular enemies and getting consistent help from darkmoons. It was total chaos, reds throwing fireballs from behind the giant crabs only to be backstabbed by a blue they didnt see, everyone sprinting everywhere trying to keep a handle on where their allies/enemies were, even yellowfinger heysel showed up and got in the action, I kept her alive because she was (hilariously) continually switching allegiances and so contributing to the chaos. I think we earned a lot of forked tongues and concords for all the phantoms involved, and me and my original sunbro (a FUGS-wielder named simply 'Anime') managed to survive the whole thing. A+ would play again.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔

Golden Goat posted:

Killed Aldrich on the weekend. Twice since I helped out Anri for her quest. the grave she made for Horace was nice :3:
Progressed Sirris's questline and murdered grandpa Hodrick. Now she's my pal or something.
Ran through fun fun toxic swamp area in the profaned capital without any toxic healing items just to help out Siegmeyer when I could have just handed him the key through the bars.
Freed Karla, hopefully I never have to see the Jailers again.

I feel i'm forgetting about another questline.
Leonhard, maybe? Greirat? Do you care about Miracles?

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

Greirat is dead thanks to me misreading confirm Siegward's in Irithyl as "talk to him"

Flubby
Feb 28, 2006
Fun Shoe
I've played this game through more times than I'd like to admit and decided to make a total gimmick character (high luck to farm embers) to help out early game pvpers farm their stuff and it worked out pretty well. I basically just sit near Halfway Fortress with a blue covenant on and dried fingers going and sit and watch. Some people attack me straight away, others get it and wait as the summons pour in. I don't interfere in any way. I just watch the fights. I didn't have one instance of anyone ganging up on anyone else the entire night. Sometimes others would even sit next to me to watch as people would 1v1 then tag in and challenge the winner. But I'm wondering, do red invaders get anything at all for killing blues? The Blue Cops and Mads obviously get what they came for, but do reds get anything at all if I live?

Rigged Death Trap
Feb 13, 2012

BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP

Golden Goat posted:

Greirat is dead thanks to me misreading confirm Siegward's in Irithyl as "talk to him"

I talked to Siegward, exhausted his dialog and drank his estus soup.
Still got Greirat to live. You might have hit on the time limit.

The way I did it is I talked to siegward in irithyll, then sent greirat, then stomped the old demon king as soon as I sent him. I came back and greirats all hale and hearty.
Next step would be to send greirat to lothric then tell patches where he is, this gets patches some new items iirc.

its curtains for Kevin
Nov 14, 2011

Fruit is proof that the gods exist and love us.

Just kidding!

Life is meaningless
what if the dlc gives us new covenants?

Rough Lobster
May 27, 2009

Don't be such a squid, bro

RabidWeasel posted:

Corvian Greatknife low level PvP trip report: this thing is so loving fun to use, why do daggers have to have garbage damage? Or at least let me have a decent crit multiplier and not :effort: oh boy 10% more damage so I can do 1/2 instead of 1/3 of the damage of a heavy weapon crit.

It's kind of weird because daggers would actually be pretty good if they had proper scaling but most of them start off e/e or e/d and the ones which don't have even crappier base damage than the others.

I did a daggers only run recently on my rogue themed guy.

I've had really great luck with both the bandit's knife and the brigand twindaggers on my DEX/LCK build (30 DEX, 40 LCK). The Bandit's Knife is great and can proc bleed really quickly, but it's more for PVE I've found. The Twindaggers can really wreck face in PVP if you're careful. I alternate between Bleed infused and Hollow w/Rouge, but they'd probably be really good for a quality build with Refined infusion. The bleed infusion does insane bleed damage, and it racks it up really quickly. But I like the hollow version for damage and the ability to coat the blade in whatever.

Anyway, I have a poo poo ton of stamina, and wear super light armor so I can stay under 30%. That way I get super long rolls, as well as shorter quicksteps for maneuverability and unpredictability. I have the Knightslayers ring and the one that increases attack power on repetitive attacks +Carthus beacon, and the Hornet ring. The left attacks come out so fast that if someone tries to put a shield up thinking the dagger will ping off will be guard broken in seconds, and then get stabbed for a nice juicy crit. The right light attacks are super quick and it's easy to beat people in trades because of the sheer speed. Also you get to keep your kick which you lose with stuff like Gravewarden twinblades. With stuff like straight swords you'll get two hits in and the guy's rolling away to heal. With Rouge on and a little luck I can bust someone down real quick, bleed em, and shank em and it's game over. I keep a Simple infused parrying dagger in my other hand for endless quicksteps and to fool people who aren't paying attention to precisely what knife is in my offhand.

The Corvian Greatknife is cool and has great reach for its attack speed, but I haven't really found a good infusion for it. Maybe there's not one for my build. I had a raw one I used for a bit early level.

The Rotten Ghru Dagger actually increases the poison effect when you infuse it with bleed. Might have some utility there, but poison seems so weak I usually don't bother with it. Although I do understand poison got buffed recently. I bet it would be really good for low level invasions where HP is low, estus flasks are few, and mosses are nonexistent. I tried infusing the Bandit's Knight with poison, but it just suffered.

I could see the standard Dagger being lethal in the hands of a parry master, but I am not one Probably something that can be switched to really fast for that sweet 1.3x multiplier on crits.

I've gotten some kills in Irithyll by using the Tailbone Shortsword's special ability on the Silver knight walkways. They're a pain in the rear end to farm for with super low drop rates so I imagine most people have never seen them. It's basically an emit force spell that travels on the ground a short distance and can easily blow people off ledges. It has a deceptively wide area of effect. Super crappy scaling so I haven't actually used it to hit dudes with, but maybe there's a handy infusion for it.

Still haven't found a harpe.

OF course you'll still get your rear end kicked a fair amount of time as expected, but it can be fun using daggers.

Thanks for reading my many words on daggers.

Dazzling Addar
Mar 27, 2010

He may have a funny face, but he's THE BEST KONG

Flubby posted:

I've played this game through more times than I'd like to admit and decided to make a total gimmick character (high luck to farm embers) to help out early game pvpers farm their stuff and it worked out pretty well. I basically just sit near Halfway Fortress with a blue covenant on and dried fingers going and sit and watch. Some people attack me straight away, others get it and wait as the summons pour in. I don't interfere in any way. I just watch the fights. I didn't have one instance of anyone ganging up on anyone else the entire night. Sometimes others would even sit next to me to watch as people would 1v1 then tag in and challenge the winner. But I'm wondering, do red invaders get anything at all for killing blues? The Blue Cops and Mads obviously get what they came for, but do reds get anything at all if I live?

Red phantoms actually get a bonus from killing arbiter spirits - the forked blue tongue. When used, the forked blue tongue gives you two pale tongues. Rosaria's Fingers have it tough, but they at least got the blues right in that regard: it makes the situation more dangerous if one is summoned via concord, but you get even more rewards for defeating them. Tongues are also the only covenant turn in you would ever conceivably need more than 30 of, so it's nice. If only we got some tangible benefit from defeating purples, golds and whites. If they dropped tongues too it would make gank squads much more tolerable.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔
Nice post about daggers! I'm wondering about the Simple offhand for Quicksteps, though. Doesn't Quickstep work even without FP?

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

Rigged Death Trap posted:

I talked to Siegward, exhausted his dialog and drank his estus soup.
Still got Greirat to live. You might have hit on the time limit.

The way I did it is I talked to siegward in irithyll, then sent greirat, then stomped the old demon king as soon as I sent him. I came back and greirats all hale and hearty.
Next step would be to send greirat to lothric then tell patches where he is, this gets patches some new items iirc.

The conditions for keeping him alive is more confusing now. I think I talked to Seig and then sent Greirat out. What's the time limit?

Simply Simon posted:

Nice post about daggers! I'm wondering about the Simple offhand for Quicksteps, though. Doesn't Quickstep work even without FP?
Yup works without FP and a godsend for the swamp.

E: VV Oh that's actually a nice change instead of it disabling the skill.

Golden Goat fucked around with this message at 12:17 on May 23, 2016

Dazzling Addar
Mar 27, 2010

He may have a funny face, but he's THE BEST KONG

Simply Simon posted:

Nice post about daggers! I'm wondering about the Simple offhand for Quicksteps, though. Doesn't Quickstep work even without FP?

I believe somebody did some research and found that without FP, you still get the animation, but your iframes are reduced or removed entirely. Could be useful for general mobility purposes if you want to rock out in heavy armor. Now I'm curious, actually. Can you quickstep while over 100% encumbrance/in Iron Flesh?

Instant Grat
Jul 31, 2009

Just add
NERD RAAAAAAGE

Simply Simon posted:

Nice post about daggers! I'm wondering about the Simple offhand for Quicksteps, though. Doesn't Quickstep work even without FP?

Like most weapon arts, it still works without FP, but with some sort of penalty. I believe the quickstep loses a lot of its i-frames if you use it without FP remaining - irrelevant when using it to traverse Farron, fairly important when using it in battle.

Also like most weapon arts, having even a single FP will allow you to use it at full efficiency, which is why simple infusions on your offhand have the possibility of being so useful.

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

Dazzling Addar posted:

Now I'm curious, actually. Can you quickstep while over 100% encumbrance/in Iron Flesh?

You can. I don't know if you get any penalties but visually the animation is unchanged.

Ineffiable
Feb 16, 2008

Some say that his politics are terrifying, and that he once punched a horse to the ground...


If they did a new covenant, I want one that's priority matching invasions into world's with already one invader.

Or make invasion as a sunbro work like that.

The idea would be that you priority match people that already have at least one summon phantom and one invader. So it's a gank busting/fair playing field covenant. Increased priority on worlds with more than one white/gold.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔

Golden Goat posted:

The conditions for keeping him alive is more confusing now. I think I talked to Seig and then sent Greirat out. What's the time limit?
Not sure about the time limit, but did you set foot in the dungeon after sending Greirat but before killing a boss? I think it's confirmed that this is a surefire trigger to outright kill Greirat, because it will (probably) cause Siegward to get imprisoned and thus make him unable to rescue Greirat. Though why the same logic applies apparently for you sending Patches to send him is anyone's guess. The entire quest is backwards-logic anyway; Greirat upon being rescued will claim that he was saved by someone in Onion Armor, deliberately open-ended because it can be both Siegward and Patches, and as Siegward has other problems later and Patches would never admit having done a good deed himself, that's actually a neat way to allow for two outcomes without changing dialogue. BUT you could also assume that it is a "hint" of sorts on how to get Greirat rescued in the first place - it has to be someone in Onion armor - but that's nonsense, because of course he only drops the "hint" if you already got him rescued! It's also worthless for subsequent playthroughs, because you have to be so incredibly specific about having Siegward rescue him first, then Patches, and that doesn't even work on your NG anyway. It's just so weirdly made, and despite all the other shittily obscure sidequests, I find this one especially baffling because how the three players interconnect is almost really cool and well done, but they details just make the entire thing fall apart on the seams.

quote:

Yup works without FP and a godsend for the swamp.
So I thought you could use a Blessed Parrying Dagger instead because every bit helps...

Dazzling Addar posted:

I believe somebody did some research and found that without FP, you still get the animation, but your iframes are reduced or removed entirely. Could be useful for general mobility purposes if you want to rock out in heavy armor. Now I'm curious, actually. Can you quickstep while over 100% encumbrance/in Iron Flesh?
...but that is also very interesting. I haven't toyed around with it at all, but plan to do so. With the Manikin Claws, actually. I think I asked this before but didn't get an answer (or forgot): those have Quickstep instead of the strange headshot thing the Claws have, and they also seem to have more base damage and more scaling while only being very slightly heavier. Why would you ever not use them if you wanted to use Claw-type weapons? Though admittedly it's lovely if you want to follow Yuria's questline at the same time (opportune because hollowing from the quest + luck build synergize of course), and you can't get the M. Claws if she doesn't hate you.

And why are the loving Claws so late in the game anyway?

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

Simply Simon posted:

Not sure about the time limit, but did you set foot in the dungeon after sending Greirat but before killing a boss? I think it's confirmed that this is a surefire trigger to outright kill Greirat, because it will (probably) cause Siegward to get imprisoned and thus make him unable to rescue Greirat.

That's gotta be it then though a little out of order. I stepped into the dungeon for the bonfire, went back and talked to Sieg, sent Greirat and I think killed Pontiff Sully after.

Rigged Death Trap
Feb 13, 2012

BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP

Golden Goat posted:

The conditions for keeping him alive is more confusing now. I think I talked to Seig and then sent Greirat out. What's the time limit?


Theres (supposedly) some unspecified time limit between him being sent out and him dying, if you dont beat a boss within that hes dead, iirc it's quite lenient.
Siegward also doesnt save him if you so much as trigger the dungeon's opening text, that instantly moves him there.
An Alternative way to save him is to not buy the armor off patches (supposedly, I havent found a source that says he can without the armor) and also tell him where greirat is.

[e]: Huh that's weird. maybe triggering the dungeon than talking to Sieg moved him to his cell after you left.

GulagDolls
Jun 4, 2011

i would like a new covenant that fixes the other ones

the one change (besides having it work lol) i would like to be made to sentinels (Darkmoon should be its own thing for punishing sinners) is that I would like it if sentinels were only summoned to the worlds of people with no or one phantom. in the context of the world, the blue sentinels are supposed to be protectors of the weak, not the fourth ranger of an unstoppable mindless murdersquad that rolls over all opposition unchallenged. and since invaders are prioritized to invade worlds with phantoms, when you're summoned as a blue it's almost always into aforementioned murdersquad worlds. it's not really fun. i've had two blue summonings where i actually felt like I was protecting the host from something and those were cool, but mostly it's just following the host and his friends around until the invader decides to attack and dies within two seconds.

Ineffiable
Feb 16, 2008

Some say that his politics are terrifying, and that he once punched a horse to the ground...


Just a quick confirmation. I think if you don't go to these areas too early you won't break NPC quests by going someplace early right?

Don't kill abyss watchers/go to catacombs before finishing deacons.

Don't go to ithyrall dungeon, even for the bonfire at entrance until after maybe pontiff.

I think that's the only two times you could wander into another area that could be considered out of order for NPC stuff. (note doing dancer at any point, even before Vordt will not break any NPC quests)

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

Rigged Death Trap posted:

[e]: Huh that's weird. maybe triggering the dungeon than talking to Sieg moved him to his cell after you left.

Yeah I'd say after I talked to him the moment I rested anywhere he moved into the dungeon since it's flagged I visited there.

It's fine though I don't think I missed too much with him dead unless he's tied to somebody else's quest.

Rigged Death Trap
Feb 13, 2012

BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP

Golden Goat posted:

Yeah I'd say after I talked to him the moment I rested anywhere he moved into the dungeon since it's flagged I visited there.

It's fine though I don't think I missed too much with him dead unless he's tied to somebody else's quest.

Nah, you just miss on two kinds of bolts and the ability to buy -
Well lets let fextralife tell you:

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

Ah, so that's how you turn on Poise.

Rough Lobster
May 27, 2009

Don't be such a squid, bro

Simply Simon posted:


So I thought you could use a Blessed Parrying Dagger instead because every bit helps...

...but that is also very interesting. I haven't toyed around with it at all, but plan to do so. With the Manikin Claws, actually. I think I asked this before but didn't get an answer (or forgot): those have Quickstep instead of the strange headshot thing the Claws have, and they also seem to have more base damage and more scaling while only being very slightly heavier. Why would you ever not use them if you wanted to use Claw-type weapons? Though admittedly it's lovely if you want to follow Yuria's questline at the same time (opportune because hollowing from the quest + luck build synergize of course), and you can't get the M. Claws if she doesn't hate you.

And why are the loving Claws so late in the game anyway?

Yeah I use the Simple offhand because it seems that quickstep with no FP gives you an I-frame penalty. Be sure to upgrade the weapon though, it gives FP faster the higher level it is.

Also if I had to use claws it would probably be manikin claws since they seem to have a bit more reach, but claws overall seem very slooow. The jump attack on the other claws is cool looking though.

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Escape_GOAT
May 20, 2004

Jaaam posted:

I dunno, I tried it in 1 and found dodging to be too fiddly. For starters you can only roll in 4 directions when locked on, and there seems to be a delay before the dodge happened. Either way, 2 is where it clicked, and I never have more fun in a souls game than when I've got a non-lovely spell in one hand and a non-lovely weapon in the other. Sucks that in 3 you need to invest so much more for that to happen. I really miss the infusion/enchantment system in 2, it was so good. Current version is poo poo. Bloodbourne's system would have been better, gently caress split damage.

Maybe I'm just burnt out on souls games? It feels like 3 doesn't bring anything new to the table, most of the fun weapons and spells are the same fun weapons and spells from the past games, except now combinations of the two require massive stat investment or some major gimping somewhere in your build. I'm sure the dlc will help a lot, but I doubt they're going to fix the poo poo that I'm complaining about, would require too much rebalancing.

Also, what's up with lightning? At some point during 2's life, it seems like they decided lightning is actually meant to be poo poo so they made all its spells take longer to cast, do less damage AND cost more stamina. Why From? Why do you hate fun?

Seriously, I'd really like to know the logic behind their balancing decisions, cause why waste time adding this poo poo into the game if it's not worth using? Is it a meta commentary on disparity? Is this whole thing a part of the light/dark life/death good/poo poo theme they've got going?

edit: what set this off is the Murakumo. In 2, with base stats, and infused Murakumo did great damage. I just chaos infused one at 30/30 int/faith and an enchanted raw rear end outdamages it. So there goes that idea. This happens most times I try something new in the game. 2 felt like a branching tree full of build possibilities, while 3 is a dead stump. Makes me sad.

Yea, I'm on NG+++ and I really want to use another weapon other than the Wolf Knight Greatsword that I've been using since I beat the Abyss Watchers in NG, but nothing else really clicks for me. I like ultra greatsword, but the wind up delay for their attacks get punished too much and I usually only get four swings before my stamina is gone.

In DS2, I had a literal armory of weapons that I'd swap between that were all viable. I don't really feel like I have that in DS3 yet. Maybe with the DLC...

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