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Choco1980 posted:I think the weirdest fallout from the Iceman outing is, much like with the whole Caitlyn Jenner debacle, Family Guy is apparently psychic. I might regret this but. Link?
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May 28, 2016 03:53
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BigRed0427 posted:I might regret this but. Link? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nhesX-8DXo
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May 28, 2016 03:54
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Iceman being gay was not a thing Bendis just up and created. It had been a theory for years that never got much traction with fans but just enough to kind of stick around for a while. Bendis is just the one that finally went and did it.
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May 28, 2016 03:58
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Ok, that was kind of funny. poo poo, is this how that starts? 
BigRed0427 fucked around with this message at 04:27 on May 28, 2016 |
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May 28, 2016 03:59
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Well, MegaCon was a grueling experience today, especially after helping a co-worker move up three flights of stairs this past Saturday and shifting several thousand books at work yesterday. I am SORE, and I may have to use the massage gift card I've been carrying around since Christmas, waiting for a celebratory occasion. It was surprisingly crowded for a Friday, starting from the beginning, where an organized, Disney-style line into the exhibit call immediately descended into nerds pushing over the barricades and rushing past the one uninterested security guard and two outnumbered volunteers. That stampede really set the tone. I got annoyed more and more throughout the day by the worthless, confused, and just plain rude volunteers and staff. Paris Cullins, the artist I most wanted to meet today, wasn't at his table all day, despite a sign with his name being there (spelled wrong, of course). Another random artist at the table next to his spread his stuff out over Cullins' table early on. I asked about a dozen volunteers and staff members throughout the day what was going on, if Cullins had canceled or was moved to a different table in the cavernous hall. I was always polite and patient, but nobody knew, nobody could even remember his name seconds after I spoke it, most people shrugged and said "Sorry, I don't know," one girl snapped "What do you want me to do?," and one lady STRODE AWAY WITHOUT A WORD after I asked if she had heard anything about Cullins. The whole convention could have benefitted from more signage and more announcements over the PA system to offer everyone a more pleasant and organized experience, but as someone who works in public service, the surliness and uselessness of the staff boggled my mind throughout the day. I hate to say it, but present company excluded, "nerd culture" doesn't always draw in the best and the brightest. They were like the TSA of nerds, only less helpful. That said, I got to meet Peter David, Gail Simone, David Finch, Leinil Francis Yu, Jose Marzan Jr., and Mike McKone, who were all friendly and gracious, and they signed all the books I schlepped around all day in my rolling luggage. I had much better experiences with Adam Hughes (met him in 2002) and especially Tony Harris (met him in 2001), who must have been having grumpy days back then, but they were warm and welcoming today. I impressed them with the handsome custom-bound hardcover Starman and JLI volumes I asked them to autograph. And maybe best of all, I met one of my lifelong favorite artists again for the first time since I was a teenager in the early '90s, Arthur Adams. I no longer had any works by him, signed or not, after so many collection purges over the years, but I found four of his legendary comics for $2 each and brought them to him to sign today: the New Mutants Special and Uncanny X-Men Annual #9 where they went to Asgard, Uncanny X-Men Annual #10 with the first appearance of Longshot, and the Excalibur: Mojo Mayhem special. Then I picked up the Waid Daredevil issue Mike Allred drew, and a Batman issue (#603) and Catwoman issue (#32) by Ed Brubaker and Sean Phillips, all for $2 each. Yep, once I paid for admission and parking, I got seven comics for $14, and that was all I bought. Figured I should quit while I was ahead (or behind, depending on your perspective). Oh, Frank Miller was not in the building today, and Klaus Janson was demanding $10 PER SIGNATURE at his table, along with their Dark Knight III collaborators Brian Azzarello and one of the Kubert Bros. Yeaaaah, that wasn't happening. And needless to say, nobody was visiting their tables. I never found Paris Cullins to thank him for his work on the '80s Blue Beetle series, either. I hope he's okay.
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May 28, 2016 04:44
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X-O posted:Iceman being gay was not a thing Bendis just up and created. It had been a theory for years that never got much traction with fans but just enough to kind of stick around for a while. Bendis is just the one that finally went and did it. Maybe being voiced by Frank Welker makes people think that. Fred from Scooby Doo, Megatron, Doctor Claw. Think about it.
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May 28, 2016 06:39
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X-O posted:Iceman being gay was not a thing Bendis just up and created. It had been a theory for years that never got much traction with fans but just enough to kind of stick around for a while. Bendis is just the one that finally went and did it.  This is not a man who was dating women with any conviction whatsoever.
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May 28, 2016 06:48
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Yea I can say at least with my anecdote I was not the only gay X-Men fan to say 'well if one of them was gonna come out it'd PROBABLY be Bobby'. It was for sure 'a thing'. A smaller thing than some other similar things, but still a thing.
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May 28, 2016 06:56
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Tatum Girlparts posted:Yea I can say at least with my anecdote I was not the only gay X-Men fan to say 'well if one of them was gonna come out it'd PROBABLY be Bobby'. It was for sure 'a thing'. A smaller thing than some other similar things, but still a thing. phrasing
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May 28, 2016 07:02
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Soonmot posted:phrasing Look, man, if any X-Man is gonna have problems with a smaller thing than other things, it's the ice guy.
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May 28, 2016 07:07
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Was Angel ever under suspicion? He'd have been my pick.
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May 28, 2016 07:13
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Angel is gay as gently caress, just not the same kind of gay.
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May 28, 2016 07:15
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Hell, Jean saying the "full on gay" thing was only really a problem BECAUSE the previous writers who had hinted at Iceman potentially liking dudes had done so in the same runs that they'd included him having seemingly genuine romantic entanglements with women, Milligan and Liu being two of the most prominent examples. Fans hoping he'd come out as bisexual had a stronger case before Bendis's story than fans hoping he'd come out as a Kinsey six (though both cases were pretty marginal, most groundwork being of the "if you squint," joking, or "it could be that if you want, could also be a dozen other things" varieties), and when the latter was what ultimately happened a few lines that were meant to be reflective of many, many gay people's journeys and experiences became something that could understandably be construed as bi-erasure if you were invested in the idea of him being bisexual. And then people heard the word bi-erasure and didn't bother to think any further about it, because there was a comics thing to get up in arms about. (The "Jean had no right to force him out of he closet!" thing being the dumbest example of that. A teenage telepath privately spoke to her friend who she noticed suffering and tried to help, crossing some very personal lines in the process because she is a flawed teenager. Then she provided moral support while he confronted himself. The horror.) Nobby fucked around with this message at 08:27 on May 28, 2016 |
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May 28, 2016 07:24
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I really dig that cover of Iceman making out with Mystique while half melted into the ground. I've been slowly reading through Claremont's X-Men and the few times he shows up early on, he comes off as kinda gay in the way a book from the late 70's /early 80's had to portray it to keep the comics code from catching on.
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May 28, 2016 08:14
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Skwirl posted:Axis was mostly thought of as poo poo. That was just forgettable. Aphrodite posted:The way they portrayed Iceman coming out. Yeah, this might be it. When people ask that my mind immediately goes to One More Day because there's people who are still mad about it, and nobody thought Peter selling his marriage to the devil was a good thing that they liked. Even the people who swear up and down that Brand New Day wasn't a lovely disjointed mess and was totally worth the horribly clumsy retcon wish it had been done more elegantly and without involving the devil.
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May 28, 2016 11:24
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Nobby posted:Hell, Jean saying the "full on gay" thing was only really a problem BECAUSE the previous writers who had hinted at Iceman potentially liking dudes had done so in the same runs that they'd included him having seemingly genuine romantic entanglements with women, Milligan and Liu being two of the most prominent examples. Fans hoping he'd come out as bisexual had a stronger case before Bendis's story than fans hoping he'd come out as a Kinsey six (though both cases were pretty marginal, most groundwork being of the "if you squint," joking, or "it could be that if you want, could also be a dozen other things" varieties), and when the latter was what ultimately happened a few lines that were meant to be reflective of many, many gay people's journeys and experiences became something that could understandably be construed as bi-erasure if you were invested in the idea of him being bisexual. One issue with Bobby being bisexual is that it makes it very easy for later writers to de-facto undo it, and you end up with Hercules, Deadpool or Constantine (sans the current run, which is great in this regard), who are theoretically bisexual but only romantically involved with women. I think that's something Bendis wanted to prevent, clumsily as it was done.
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May 28, 2016 11:51
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Lurdiak posted:That was just forgettable. Oh poo poo how could I forget One More Day. Yea that may be the worst received thing they've done in a while, I've yet to meet anyone who has a more positive view of it then 'poo poo I guess it wasn't as horrible as I thought it was at first?'
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May 28, 2016 16:02
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Decius posted:One issue with Bobby being bisexual is that it makes it very easy for later writers to de-facto undo it, and you end up with Hercules, Deadpool or Constantine (sans the current run, which is great in this regard), who are theoretically bisexual but only romantically involved with women. I think that's something Bendis wanted to prevent, clumsily as it was done. New 52 Constantine is bi? That's cool (I knew he he was bi in Hellblazer, I just assumed that got quietly swept under the table when he got integrated into the main universe). Also didn't know Deadpool was ever written as bi.
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May 28, 2016 16:14
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Skwirl posted:New 52 Constantine is bi? That's cool (I knew he he was bi in Hellblazer, I just assumed that got quietly swept under the table when he got integrated into the main universe). Also didn't know Deadpool was ever written as bi. The DC-You Constantine had a pretty major subplot/later main plot about Constantine and his boyfriend. Deadpool has never been written as actually going out with guys and I don't think it's ever explicitly come up in comics. I think all it has going for it is some writers have said they consider Deadpool bi (and Ryan Reynolds has said that's how he sees Deadpool), there may be some random lines in books that imply Deadpool might be into dudes, but in comics his only romantic interests are in women.
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May 28, 2016 16:20
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There were a lot of jokes about Deadpool having mancrushes and gay sex dreams over the years, and you could do worse than turning those somewhat homophobic gags into him actually expressing his sexuality. E: As an example, this is the "pleasure dream" he sees when hit by Black Mamba's power. 
Lurdiak fucked around with this message at 16:26 on May 28, 2016 |
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May 28, 2016 16:23
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Could someone point out or post some of the more "obvious" past moments that hinted at Iceman being gay? I'm clueless about them, and would very much like to see what is being alluded to.
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May 28, 2016 17:51
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Choco1980 posted:Could someone point out or post some of the more "obvious" past moments that hinted at Iceman being gay? I'm clueless about them, and would very much like to see what is being alluded to. It was less 'obvious' stuff like 'I totally have a girlfriend in Canada...we make out...all the time. I like girls, guys!' and more like he was pretty much the only young guy X-Man in the core roster who didn't have a ton of romance subplots, and the ones he did have he always kinda seemed half-hearted/forced into. It was something a lot of gay fans could kinda identity with at that age, a weird kinda 'going through the motions' that no one else really seemed to deal with unless they were like...robots or aliens who straight up didn't get dating, you know? It was a very coded feeling thing. There has also been some times when it's felt like they were dancing around with the whole 'ok guys Bobby has daddy issues because he's a mutant...get it? He has a rift with his family and wants to show them he can be a normal person to please them even if it means hiding his mutant nature....right???' thing. Of all the characters who got the 'being a mutant...kinda like being some...other minority group...right? Can't really talk about them but you know who I mean....' he got it the hardest, especially in the main cast http://www.tor.com/2015/04/23/iceman-gay-coming-out/
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May 28, 2016 19:14
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Iceman should date a frost giant.
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May 28, 2016 19:40
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Tatum Girlparts posted:It was less 'obvious' stuff like 'I totally have a girlfriend in Canada...we make out...all the time. I like girls, guys!' and more like he was pretty much the only young guy X-Man in the core roster who didn't have a ton of romance subplots, and the ones he did have he always kinda seemed half-hearted/forced into. It was something a lot of gay fans could kinda identity with at that age, a weird kinda 'going through the motions' that no one else really seemed to deal with unless they were like...robots or aliens who straight up didn't get dating, you know? It was a very coded feeling thing. There was also that great coming out scene in the second X-men movie. "Have you tried not being a mutant?"
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May 28, 2016 20:11
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What original, independent (i.e. non-adapted) superheroes have been attempted in film and television? The only ones I can think of off the top of my head are The Incredibles, Darkman and M.A.N.T.I.S. I'm not sure if stuff like Heroes or Alphas counts, but if we're generous and say that it does, and factors in stuff like them, what else is there?
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May 28, 2016 22:35
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You'll have to give a better idea of what you mean by superhero, because anything from Karen Rider to Ben 10 to Buffy the Vampire Slayer might fit what you're looking for.
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May 28, 2016 22:41
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To be honest, I'm not really sure. People with superhuman abilities who fight against supervillains who have their own powers in melodramatic stories? Costumes are optional, of course. So I guess the tokusatsu stuff would count, and probably something like Ben 10. Less sure about Buffy but I'm not sure why, so I suppose it could be fair to count it as well. I had Darkman at the front of my mind when I asked the question, because I watched it fairly recently. I almost mentioned The Crow and The Rocketeer, but they're both adaptations that have pretty much eclipsed their source material.
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May 28, 2016 22:50
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Powder, dude!
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May 28, 2016 23:06
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Teenage Fansub posted:Powder, dude! In that movie the superhero is a child molester!
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May 28, 2016 23:17
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Darkwing Duck, obviously.
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May 28, 2016 23:32
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Travis343 posted:Darkwing Duck, obviously. Also, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYwlXRVWCCI
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May 28, 2016 23:44
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And, hell, can't forget The Adventures of T-Rex. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyqGyRGv1N8
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May 28, 2016 23:52
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Hancock.
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May 29, 2016 00:13
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Blankman. (The best one.)
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May 29, 2016 00:50
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Arguably every single TMNT ripoff (Biker Mice from Mars, Cow Boys of Moo Mesa) could potentially qualify under the Super Sentai clause. Was WITCH adapted from anything?
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May 29, 2016 01:32
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The Greatest American Hero.
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May 29, 2016 01:35
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Do things based off toylines count as adaptations, in this? Because that could open the goddamn floodgates.
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May 29, 2016 01:36
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Underdog. Meteor Man.
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May 29, 2016 01:36
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If we're going down this road: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXiShTDcr1I
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May 29, 2016 01:58
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Squizzle posted:You'll have to give a better idea of what you mean by superhero, because anything from Karen Rider to Ben 10 to Buffy the Vampire Slayer might fit what you're looking for. Kamen Rider's an edge case, isn't it? I know there's a manga, and also that Ishinomori had another, darker series that was basically the inspiration for Kamen Rider.
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May 29, 2016 02:07
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