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berryjon posted:Thief would like to have a word with you. As would some of the better Splinter Cell games. And Gunpoint. To be fair, in gunpoint you tend to beat people senseless. Besides uncharted is based on the same pulp fiction adventure stuff as Indiana Jones, if there aren't a ton of colossal unrealistic shootouts it's not true to it's roots.
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Jun 2, 2016 19:37
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FoolyCharged posted:To be fair, in gunpoint you tend to beat people senseless. Why would you do that? Are you trying to see if you get an achievement or something? Because that is among the worst reasons to punch a guy in the face 64,397 times.
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Jun 2, 2016 19:38
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berryjon posted:Thief would like to have a word with you. As would some of the better Splinter Cell games. And Gunpoint. Imagine any of those games where you only get to sneak around once.
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Jun 2, 2016 20:01
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RareAcumen posted:I think ludonarrative dissonance is dumb when it comes to Uncharted and the only reason anyone cares is because 1) they're human beings being killed 2)Nathan Drake is not a broken man or soldier. If they were aliens, robots, demons, ghosts, fish people, or elves then no one would give a poo poo, AFAIC. Ehhh, games can definitely work with high bodycounts while retaining a narrative, and the beauty of some games is tying the bodycount into the story. A good pulp Indiana Jones style game would, funnily enough, be an Indy game, specifically Fate of Atlantis. Why's that? Because it takes multiple narrative paths... While still remaining true to Indy's world and character. Want to be Temple of Doom Indy? Go Fists, and screw over half those goshdurn puzzles (Also sod Sofia, she can take care of herself!) Or perhaps Lost Ark is more your style? Team might be for you, and hey, multiple character puzzles, cool! Or, perhaps you want a more cerebral experience, solving all those puzzles and riddles like Last Crusade Indy and his dad? Wits, Crazy Medium lady optional! Similarly, while Spec Ops: The Line is a bit more hamhanded than critics first gave it credit for, the bodycount is definitely in service to the story there, especially right at the end, where one of your options is to kill 'em all... All of 'em. So yeah, bodycount's not generally a thing that stretches the bounds of narrative, although done badly, it's just dull... But I want you to go back to that previous post where you explain the chain of events that lead up to and back from said boat, and read it. Think about how often that would happen in an Indy movie, just... Coldcocked, and suddenly, you're not in Yemen (and the middle of Yemen, no less), but off the coast. I can think of a lot of travelling montages, and within cities, and the like, but that's stretching it. And it's stretching it because somebody decided to have a sinking ship setpiece before the story was set down (Which you might think would be a first task... But often isn't), and then other folks decided to set the game in the middle of Yemen.
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Jun 2, 2016 20:30
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JamieTheD posted:Ehhh, games can definitely work with high bodycounts while retaining a narrative, and the beauty of some games is tying the bodycount into the story. A good pulp Indiana Jones style game would, funnily enough, be an Indy game, specifically Fate of Atlantis. Why's that? Because it takes multiple narrative paths... While still remaining true to Indy's world and character. Want to be Temple of Doom Indy? Go Fists, and screw over half those goshdurn puzzles (Also sod Sofia, she can take care of herself!) Or perhaps Lost Ark is more your style? Team might be for you, and hey, multiple character puzzles, cool! Or, perhaps you want a more cerebral experience, solving all those puzzles and riddles like Last Crusade Indy and his dad? Wits, Crazy Medium lady optional! Sure, I don't think that the concept of having a high body count character is in itself impossible or anything- It'd certainly make creating Punisher games bewildering-, I just tend to  at it when it gets brought up in Uncharted's case since that's basically how most action adventure games work for the most part. Saints Row, GTA, DMC, COD, GOW, Halo, etc. It's not like we're a Dynasty Warrior character racking up thousands upon thousands of kills every map there.And look, I'm gonna be honest with you, I've seen some of the Indiana Jones movies and I can't remember which ones or most of the movie at all so most of the details are basically dust in the wind to me. But I'm still going to try with my awful memory to remember things that follow that same process. Only thing that comes to mind is when they pulled that same thing in MGS after getting caught by Sniper Wolf. So they smack you on the back of the head with a gun and then you wake up in the electric torture harness. But yeah, anyway, the ship part is just a giant fun diversion, all things considered, since it just drops you off where you began anyway, it's basically going around the Monopoly board only without even getting paid to brighten things. Yeah, I'm sorry this didn't come out well at all.
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Jun 2, 2016 20:58
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berryjon posted:Thief would like to have a word with you. As would some of the better Splinter Cell games. And Gunpoint. Now, shooting people may not happen much in Gunpoint, but you sure as hell can pounce on a dude quite a bit and punch his face off...
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Jun 2, 2016 23:03
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I feel that if the shooting doesn't ever get boring in the game, you're not shooting too many dudes.
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Jun 3, 2016 06:05
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Speaking of other stealth games, Scruffy, do you think you'd ever do a LP for something like Mark of the Ninja? It seems like it might possibly be your speed.
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Jun 3, 2016 06:31
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I don't think anybody's saying "there's too much shooting in Uncharted games," specifically. The argument I've heard (and tend to agree with) is "the light-hearted tone of the game (the vibrant color palettes, two-fisted pulp adventure plots, Drake's wisecracking devil-may-care attitude), taken next to shooting literally hundreds of dudes (the core gameplay) create some serious tonal whiplash when you stop to think about the sheer scale of the bloodshed being perpetrated." Not that it's the most egregious example of that kind of dissonance, but it is a very clear example of a successful, generally well-liked franchise where the designers - for any number of potentially valid reasons - decided to fall back on tried-and-true videogame competencies in the form of ultra-violence and gunfights, even when it fails to support - or even actively undermines - telling the sort of story and depicting the kind of protagonist they evidently wanted to. Edit: A great video on violence in games, and specifically why violence is so easy as a go-to for game designers. Ghost of Starman fucked around with this message at 08:51 on Jun 6, 2016 |
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Jun 6, 2016 07:03
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The Last Of Us was an attempt to do a less shooty, more focused game where bad guys all had personalities, and even then you still kill like two hundred dudes and one woman. Of course the real best way to do it was Metal Gear Solid 3 where you walk down a river of death and every single enemy you've killed, to a maximum of 100, walks past you and remembers exactly how you killed them. Including if you killed one, then let a vulture feed on his corpse, and then killed and ate the vulture. "You fed on me!" Then after that part, you get to go on a motorcycle chase where you're automatically given an SMG, you probably already have a machine gun, and the game gives you infinite ammo. bewilderment fucked around with this message at 09:12 on Jun 6, 2016 |
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Jun 6, 2016 09:09
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Hey folks. Sorry for the myriad delays. I've been busy with this musical stuff (AND IT'S GOING REALLY WELL I'M HAVING FUN AND EVERYONE LOVES IT) and work but I haven't forgotten about this yet. Today I'm joined by berryjon! Go check out his Exile SSLPs, they're pretty good. Disappointment/PolsyNew story: The Mission This next weekend is our last show weekend so maybe a week after that I should be back to a regular schedule. Maybe. But we're really on the downhill slope. Sorry again! Also apparently I just passed 1K subscribers. How 'bout that? edit: Hobgoblin2099 posted:Speaking of other stealth games, Scruffy, do you think you'd ever do a LP for something like Mark of the Ninja? It seems like it might possibly be your speed. I played Mark of the Ninja and thought it was pretty good but I try to stick to games nobody else has done, I know Mark of the Ninja was done pretty competently. I may have ideas for a few more stealth games though! dscruffy1 fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Jun 6, 2016 |
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Jun 6, 2016 16:45
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Oh please, you could never track down the Riddler by paint sales. Obviously he produces it himself, because no one else would ever manage to produce this perfect shade of green.
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Jun 6, 2016 18:26
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I've been wondering for a while but are you going to show off the two extra things with Manbat? Also Arkham Beyond is definitely what I'm hoping for as there's a lot of potential for the game. They could even frame it as the Joker's Return story-line and then swerve to a different villain in mirror of Arkham Origins. Could even have this game referenced where Bruce is afraid he missed someone infected and they've been hiding all this time, only to discover it's someone unexpected.
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Jun 6, 2016 18:34
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I haven't been paying much attention to the Arkham Knight comics because they're pretty silly. The only thing I knew was that Jason killed Bane and that Captain Boomerang was also killed by Deadshot. On the topic of DLC, I know it's mentioned that Red Hood kills Killer Moth at some point offscreen in one of them.
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Jun 6, 2016 18:40
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I just love that no matter how technologically advanced stuff gets, the cops will always use a fax machine 
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Jun 6, 2016 19:21
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KGBeast was in the Assault on Arkham film, which is canon to the Arkham-verse. He's one of the few good things in that movie, to be honest./
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Jun 6, 2016 19:26
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OldMemes posted:KGBeast was in the Assault on Arkham film, which is canon to the Arkham-verse. He's one of the few good things in that movie, to be honest./ That doesn't sound like a compliment, considering his head was blown up five minutes in.
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Jun 6, 2016 19:31
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The game I mention at the start of the video is Arkham City Escape.
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Jun 6, 2016 21:34
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdEQmpVIE4A
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Jun 6, 2016 21:55
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From Ty Templeton's Bun Toons:
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Jun 6, 2016 22:45
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And the villain from Batman '66 would be King Tut. Not the weirdest clip involving King Tut (That would be the one where King Tut is using Hypnosis and Free Love for nefarious ends), but he would indeed be a heck of a villain... In the modern day, his role is sorta filled by Maxie Zeus, but only sorta, because... Well, there's that 60s touch, y'know? Also, sadly Berryjon's story about WB meddling comes as little to no surprise, especially considering how the same happened with Origins. As I said before... I want to say that lessons will be learned from Arkham Knight... But I don't have much faith that either DC or Rocksteady will really learn them. Still wouldn't mind either an Arkham Beyond or '66, even if I'm decidedly uncertain either will happen. But hey, we can all dream. 
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Jun 6, 2016 22:50
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The comics company you were trying to think of was Charlton Comics, which had the Blue Beetle (both Dan Garrett and Ted Kord versions), Captain Atom, and the Question.
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Jun 7, 2016 01:10
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I think I may have watched too many of these games. The other night, I dreamed I was playing a 2D side-scroller similar to the Castlevania games, only instead of being vampire hunters in a haunted castle, you played Arkham villains rampaging all over Gotham City. Each villain had a unique ability; Joker could blow up cracked walls with his long-barrelled revolver, Two-Face had a double-jump(naturally), Penguin could glide with his umbrella, Mr. Freeze could make ice floes to traverse bodies of water, the Ventriloquist could send Scarface into small spaces to hit switches or grab items, etc. The game started with an Arkham breakout level, of course. Reaching certain areas of the city would trigger boss-fights with members of the Bat-family, with the Dark Knight himself as the final boss. Then I woke up. I don't usually dream about video games, so I'm going to blame this on the LP.
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Jun 7, 2016 01:17
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I think the episodic format could work if you copied the latest Hitman style. If they were to do a Batman 66 episode or series of episodes, do you play it completely straight, or do you indulge in the camp of it all? Also, while you guys were talking, I thought about Bane done in '66 style, where he's literally just a Luchador, but done up like the guy in the Juicy Drop candy commercials. You know, like that really rear end-backwards 60's style "Ooh, Helen, have you ever tried tay-cohs?" kind of way. Have his fight be in a wrestling ring, but it's decorated with pinatas and there's a mariachi band playing. Like it's racist, but not out of malice, just stupidity. King Tut would be fun, because you could do a special stealth room where he has to be the last one standing, and you have to hit him on the head so he goes back to normal. '66 Hush would be fun from a story perspective. I'm picturing Commissioner Gordon is talking to someone off camera, Batman bursts in because Gordon called him, and it turns out the commissioner wanted to get Batman involved because Bruce Wayne here thinks someone out there is impersonating him. Also, I hate to bring it up, but if Adam West is unwilling or unable to voice Batman, Comedian Mike Toomey does a great West impression. I mean, really him and Burt Ward and Julie Newmar are the only living cast regulars left. Be nice to have if at all possible.
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Jun 7, 2016 02:10
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CzarChasm posted:Also, I hate to bring it up, but if Adam West is unwilling or unable to voice Batman, Comedian Mike Toomey does a great West impression. I mean, really him and Burt Ward and Julie Newmar are the only living cast regulars left. Be nice to have if at all possible. West and Ward have both agreed to voice their characters for the animated '66 movie coming out this year or next.
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Jun 7, 2016 03:02
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That talk about the Arkham Knight originally supposed to be like the next Harley Quinn got me thinking: Why didn't they make Harley Quinn the Knight, if they didn't want to make a new character? She has a connection with Arkham Asylum (more than any of the other supervillains, who didn't actually show up in Asylum), she has a personal reason to hate Batman (she still thinks he killed Joker), and more importantly she's been in all of the previous games. And if it was really because of this Jason Todd promotion, I'm morbidly curious what they were promoting.
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Jun 7, 2016 03:19
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SardonicTyrant posted:That talk about the Arkham Knight originally supposed to be like the next Harley Quinn got me thinking: Why didn't they make Harley Quinn the Knight, if they didn't want to make a new character? She has a connection with Arkham Asylum (more than any of the other supervillains, who didn't actually show up in Asylum), she has a personal reason to hate Batman (she still thinks he killed Joker), and more importantly she's been in all of the previous games. because they couldn't let a woman be effective
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Jun 7, 2016 03:41
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CzarChasm posted:I think the episodic format could work if you copied the latest Hitman style. If they were to do a Batman 66 episode or series of episodes, do you play it completely straight, or do you indulge in the camp of it all? Do it the way they did the 66 level in Lego Batman. So, definitely indulge in the camp.
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Jun 7, 2016 04:13
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berryjon posted:West and Ward have both agreed to voice their characters for the animated '66 movie coming out this year or next. Wait what. Details now!
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Jun 7, 2016 04:28
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The Deathstroke fight being a wet fart really underscored the fact that - more than ever - none of the villains were allowed to be competent. Batman shrugs off everything in this game and comes out none the worse for it. When you couple that with how often the bad guys taunt you over the microphone, it really turns all of them into whining teenagers who can't accomplish anything - at least, not for more than 10 minutes. Which might actually be the intention for Arkham Knight, but then you have Deathstroke desperately wanting Batman-sama to notice how cool he is even as he's getting mopped up or Scarecrow's shortest-lasting apocalypse ever.
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Jun 7, 2016 04:29
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bunnyofdoom posted:Wait what. Details now! Here you go.
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Jun 7, 2016 04:35
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For me the problem of a last minute mandate from dipshits in CEO chairs isn't the worst thing. The worst thing still is that even with possibly the very late push to Jason Todd, they don't even try to make it something of a mystery. They already had Red Hood models but didn't think of using that even as some kind of slight side track of some other hooded figure showing up to maybe play with Jason sort of wanting to convince Batman to his side or just general unhinged behavior of moonlighting against himself. They couldn't be bothered to even use my other idea of having it turn out to be Stephanie Brown AKA The Spoiler for a real loop even if that also would be letting a woman have some sort of agency in Arkham Knight. But you gotta have some loving suspects, the least you could do is use The Creeper and every other sort of ally and make Batman have a realistic reason to mistrust and keep his allies in the dark if he isn't sure one of them isn't Arkham Knight instead of what we got. I mean, gently caress, they're already using Azreal. Build up some potential suspects! Yeah, I just learned today that there's now a Dark Knight 3 and A loving FOURTH in the works and Master Race is the Kryptionians from the now restored city of Kandor, basically a surviving bottled city from Krypton of shrunken people because Brainiac's an rear end in a top hat and basically the entire reason Superman was controlled by Lex in that universe, and something all the heroes struggled to save in Dark Knight Strikes Again, now have the idea to threaten the human population to submit to their rule or die by using Moscow as an example. Superman also has a kid with Wonderwoman, I forget her name but she's Amazonian and Kryptionian at the same time and she joins ze Kryptionian Nazis in their bid to take over the world. I don't even think it really ends but I don't want to read that poo poo to find out if its on a loving cliffhanger or not because Frank Miller is a nutjob. Crabtree fucked around with this message at 07:15 on Jun 7, 2016 |
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Jun 7, 2016 06:41
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Oh hey I saw an Avenue Q live musical only 2 weeks ago it was spectacular. However I wasn't warned about puppet sex though.
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Jun 7, 2016 10:10
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Spudd posted:Oh hey I saw an Avenue Q live musical only 2 weeks ago it was spectacular. However I wasn't warned about puppet sex though. Hey, pleasant surprise, then! 
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Jun 7, 2016 16:30
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Considering how poorly their writing and character development has gone, im glad dc/wb didnt let rocksteady force a "new" character into the mythos. Harley quinn was good because she was a complicated character who wasnt a dolled up sex fiend then look what they did to her in arkham asylum.
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Jun 7, 2016 17:12
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Avenue Q is a great show. I really think the episodic nature would be great for an Arkham game. They could even keep the free roaming city available if they really wanted (though I kinda feel if they don't, they should go back to being more of a Metroidvania like AA), so you could run around and collect poo poo between episodes. I'd probably murder someone for Arkham Beyond.
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Jun 7, 2016 17:13
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The obvious game to make would be Arkham: Beyond '66.
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Jun 7, 2016 17:27
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bassguitarhero posted:Harley quinn was good because she was a complicated character who wasnt a dolled up sex fiend Not that I'm saying her portrayal in the Arkham series has been good considering she's only really around to be called dumb and knocked out in one hit, but even in the comics Harley was kind of that way.  Here's a write-up on the matter. Blueberry Pancakes fucked around with this message at 17:47 on Jun 7, 2016 |
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Jun 7, 2016 17:44
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They've been kind of steering away from that in recent years, though. Harley is a legit doctor with a PhD. She saved a dying monkey, god drat it!
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Jun 7, 2016 18:10
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She's a psychiatrist and a veterinarian?
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Jun 7, 2016 18:49
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