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Psion posted:What do you want besides that? REVENGE.
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Jun 7, 2016 22:12
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well play Hoxton Revenge, then
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Jun 7, 2016 23:35
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Where the gently caress did this Dodge VS Armor user slapfight come from? I understand that pubs are crying about Dodge being broken forever because they can't win with just Grinder anymore and skills are different so they'll have to think again, but I don't get where this whole CONSPIRACY TO RUIN DODGE BY THOSE FILTHY ARMOR USERS came from.
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Jun 8, 2016 05:15
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Crabtree posted:Where the gently caress did this Dodge VS Armor user slapfight come from? I understand that pubs are crying about Dodge being broken forever because they can't win with just Grinder anymore and skills are different so they'll have to think again, but I don't get where this whole CONSPIRACY TO RUIN DODGE BY THOSE FILTHY ARMOR USERS came from. Stop reading Steam forums threads?
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Jun 8, 2016 05:24
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Crabtree posted:Where the gently caress did this Dodge VS Armor user slapfight come from? I understand that pubs are crying about Dodge being broken forever because they can't win with just Grinder anymore and skills are different so they'll have to think again, but I don't get where this whole CONSPIRACY TO RUIN DODGE BY THOSE FILTHY ARMOR USERS came from. It's been a thing since dodge builds were I thing, I believe. Both sides manage the impressive accomplishment of both being wrong at the same time.
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Jun 8, 2016 05:33
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I was intrigued enough to go and try to remake a Dodge build. With Rogue, still adds up to 55% dodge in the stats and 10% more when sprinting and 15% more when ziplining . Still pretty good, and I used the bonuses to silent weapons and critical hit chance to make it output absurd amounts of damage. Only tested it on Overkill difficulty so far, though. One skill I'm not so sure about is Trigger Happy. Should I get it at all and must I ace it if I get it?
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Jun 8, 2016 05:43
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Unless something fundamental has changed with that skill all the stacks disappear if you miss a single shot. It's not a great investment.
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Jun 8, 2016 05:46
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Dr Cheeto posted:Unless something fundamental has changed with that skill all the stacks disappear if you miss a single shot. It's not a great investment. Something fundamental changed with the skill and it's amazing now. Missing doesn't reset your stacks, so now you can take a Chimano Custom and within a few bullets be outputting Deagle-level damage for as long as there are cops to shoot. Granted, I think it's only worthwhile if you ace it, since I don't think the 2 seconds basic gives you is enough time. Someone recommend me a HUD mod so I can keep track of my Trigger Happy stacks though, thanks.
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Jun 8, 2016 05:59
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Doesn't PocoHud do that?
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Jun 8, 2016 06:04
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Is PocoHud updated? I've been reluctant to install it since it seems like it breaks every semi-major patch, I'm not sure which version to use, and I don't really want to install it and then turn off 99% of the features. There probably isn't a better option, granted, but I'm asking hoping that there is. I really just want something that tells me about active skills like Trigger Happy and Overkill and has a cooldown timer for Inspire and auto-FAK use.
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Jun 8, 2016 06:09
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I just loaded up Payday to test and when I fired my pistol I crashed immediately so gonna guess it's hosed
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Jun 8, 2016 06:12
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Skunkrocker posted:If I'm around, which... ya know, as of late is super rare, I would love to help anyone get stealth related stuff as I am one of three people who like stealth heists. I'll probably ask you to help me with deathwish and overkill car shop, since everyone hates those maps and i'm atrocious at stealth
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Jun 8, 2016 06:16
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ClonedPickle posted:Something fundamental changed with the skill and it's amazing now. Missing doesn't reset your stacks, so now you can take a Chimano Custom and within a few bullets be outputting Deagle-level damage for as long as there are cops to shoot. Granted, I think it's only worthwhile if you ace it, since I don't think the 2 seconds basic gives you is enough time. Doesn't pocohud do that? But in the end, does trigger happy do enough to warrant 4-12 points spent on it? Especially when you have harder hitting pistols available.
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Jun 8, 2016 06:16
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The answer to that question is always that anything that makes the Stryk even more hilarious is worthwhile.
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Jun 8, 2016 06:19
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ClonedPickle posted:Something fundamental changed with the skill and it's amazing now. Missing doesn't reset your stacks, so now you can take a Chimano Custom and within a few bullets be outputting Deagle-level damage for as long as there are cops to shoot. Granted, I think it's only worthwhile if you ace it, since I don't think the 2 seconds basic gives you is enough time. There's a mod on LastBullet called WolfHUD. It's what I use, but as you know, it's loving bloated and you really need to turn at least half of the features off. It lets you keep track of stacks, though. The issue is that it doesn't appear to have been updated for the latest patch, so there are some issues with skills. Case in point: missing a shot resets your Trigger Happy stacks. So either Overkill hosed it up, or the HUD just isn't working properly yet.
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Jun 8, 2016 06:21
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Psion posted:DW is literally the easiest it's ever been and the least bullshit it's ever been - the two aren't the same thing, but they're both true. You are now a heist wizard who can run at the speed of light, dodge or tank shots, regenerate health from murdering enemies, fire absurdly powerful guns while sprinting and then shouting people back to life through a wall, and standing on random small red things means nothing can kill you dead unless they kill you twice, and they even backed off on the one enemy type who could kill you in 0.14 seconds. What do you want besides that? More free poo poo.
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Jun 8, 2016 06:22
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PocoHud handles it now. Zenyr accidentally pushed a bad build out so if you update Poco it won't crash and covers the new trigger happy. PocoHud since BLT has worked with every single PD2 update without the HoxHUD crash and dev block issues. Poco still worked with the big skills update, the only things that were missing were some of the massive skill changes like Trigger Happy and the new Inspire. If you get it with BLT it will self update so no messing around with poo poo all the time.
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Jun 8, 2016 06:25
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Drewjitsu posted:But in the end, does trigger happy do enough to warrant 4-12 points spent on it? Especially when you have harder hitting pistols available. I've really enjoyed it - I've been flipping between two different pistol builds, one with Trigger Happy aced and one with Sixth Sense aced to buy assets (both with most of the rest of the tree aced - no Custom Ammo, only basic Equilibrium [it's cheaper to get an accuracy bonus out of Oppressor instead  ]) and there's a noticeable, significant difference in cop killin' power. With it, mid-tier pistols can become able to one-headshot Greys without a crit, and specials melt a hell of a lot faster when akimbo Bernettis are doing 70-something damage instead of 40. It also accumulates incredibly quickly with those weapons. Is it worthwhile if you're gonna use a Bronco? Probably not. Is it worth 12 points on paper? Maybe not, but when you're already balls deep in the tree and you're bringing three pistols, why not make the investment to make them even better?
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Jun 8, 2016 06:26
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ClonedPickle posted:Is PocoHud updated? Yes and no. r395 was released yesterday (claims to fix a Trigger Happy-specific crash) but it appears to be the non-BLT hook. Assuming Kilandor's still around, presumably he'll push the update soonish. If I remember right, it's something people could even do for themselves, but don't. Psion fucked around with this message at 06:51 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 06:48
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Anyway, pd2skills still has yet to update so going to use screenshots to share my new grinder build for comments. Skill trees      Overall stats   Couple of things I'm wondering about : 1) Is there any reason med bags would be better than first aid kits? With the grinder regen nerf, I find I do need to top up my health now and then during DW, and first aid kits serve that purpose better than med bags. First aid kits are also easier to share. Might I be wrong? 2) Went for tankiness with Swan Song as a last resort in case things go bad. Good idea, or is this a waste of points? Any other comments/excoriations are most welcome!
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Jun 8, 2016 06:54
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Lemon-Lime posted:Unless they changed it back, unlocking achievements with SAM stopped giving you unlocks around when BBQ pack came out. this was never a thing
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Jun 8, 2016 07:16
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Wastrel_ posted:Anyway, pd2skills still has yet to update so going to use screenshots to share my new grinder build for comments. 1) Med bags would be better than first aid kits if you have a crew of two other people bringing FAKs and a guy bringing ammo or something. So, most of the time, yes you should probably bring FAKs. Just remember to share! 2) Swan Song owns. Would recommend acing Nine Lives instead of taking basic Up You Go or whatever that is, though - it's one more point, but it's one more down. 3) The flat pistol damage bonus is dumb. Ace the skill next to it instead (to get 50% faster reload speed). 4) I don't think the basic Unseen Strike is worth it - it's hard to tell without indicators, but when I played with it I couldn't really tell a difference between just Low Blow and Low Blow + basic Unseen Strike. It looks like you're pretty committed to suppressed guns, though - I get the One Handed Talent investment now. Personally I'd rather just use loud guns and get Trigger Happy, but I've never tried stacking suppressor damage on the pistol +15. 5) Don't ace Steady Grip, the stability bonus isn't worth it for pistols. The accuracy bonus is good, so leave it basic. 6) Get Transporter basic. Try and ace Bullseye, too; the increased armor regen will help when your armor is your only defense. Shock and Awe basic might not be necessary if you have a teammate wearing ICTV - chances are he's got it, and it's not a stacking team bonus. Although I do get that it's mostly just to climb towards +30% armor (which is only 21 extra armor in the LBV, but you've got no dodge so I guess every little bit helps). Take everything beyond 2) with a grain of salt, that builds looks pretty different from how I prefer to play (despite also being an akimbo grinder build).
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Jun 8, 2016 07:40
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Pickle beat me to it, and I mostly agree with him, but here's my phrasing of it all anyway:Wastrel_ posted:Couple of things I'm wondering about : 1) It's almost always going to be the case that someone in your group gets downed 3 or 4 times. It happens, even if people are trying really hard to stay on FAKs. And if people aren't trying all that hard, it'll happen more often. At that point, if there are no medbags around, the next down is custody. That said, the best setup for DW presently seems to be something like 2xFAKs, 1xMedbags, 1xAmmo. 2) Swan Song is really good, and fairly accessible. If you've got the points, you should always take it, IMO. Unless you're really, really good and never go down. Regarding your build: Things that are bad and should be changed: 1. You don't have the bag tossing skill. You probably should. 2. Only taking basic in Unseen Strike seems like a trap to me, especially without dodge. It also looks like you're going to be fairly close to the action, so it seems even more likely that Unseen Strike basic will not help you much. Ace it or don't take it. That's just my opinion, though. 3. Desperado seems like a much better choice than One Handed. Basic Desperado is dumb, but the reload speed boost is really good. Someone can tell me I'm wrong if they want to do the math, but I don't believe that the extra damage on your pistols will make a particularly meaningful difference. Fake edit: Napkin math says the +15 damage doesn't really help much at all. You save yourself an extra bullet for Tans and Tasers, assuming headshots. Matters of taste: I was going to say that concealment doesn't matter for your build, but I see now that you have basic Low Blow. I feel kind of conflicted about this, since I feel like you'd get more mileage out of switching to a suit and going for dodge skills if you're going to worry about concealment. You could drop Low Blow, and then also drop Optical Illusions aced, and Inner Pockets. Your call. If you were going to make this a dodge-based build, you'd want to switch to a suit, drop armor skills (keep Bullseye), and invest in relevant dodge skills. Consider also that you could use different types of weapons. You can run concealable shotguns and rifles as well. You don't need to, but it's always fun to experiment.
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Jun 8, 2016 07:48
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Oh, also, if anyone is feeling like they just don't have room for enough builds, try this: More Skillsets mod You can find an unedited version elsewhere, probably on Last Bullet. This particular version is edited so that unlocking the extra slots doesn't cost any money, if you care about that sort of thing. Sometimes patches cause it to undo itself, and spending money on those slots more than once feels wrong. You also need to hit Infamy 25 to use all the slots, I think. That can also probably be edited out. E: Seven's version is better, actually. Looks like you can edit his version to have however many extra sets you want, and they're not gated behind anything. So use that instead. Seven has a lot of good stuff, and I'm really excited that Pickle pointed me toward his Bitbucket. LuciferMorningstar fucked around with this message at 07:58 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 07:53
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LuciferMorningstar posted:Oh, also, if anyone is feeling like they just don't have room for enough builds, try this: More Skillsets mod How exactly do I even download Seven's? I am not familiar with open-source repositories and they all seem to try their best to be as obtuse to the layman as possible.
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Jun 8, 2016 09:12
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So, I did some digging. Number one, I found a Poco alternative that suits my needs. Had to download Notepad++, dig into the lua, and turn off a bunch of poo poo I don't care about, but I think I'm happy with it (besides maybe the location on the screen but I'll look into that later). More importantly, number two, I discovered how Trigger Happy worked. As I was playing with HUDList I noticed that the damage bonus from Trigger Happy was totaling up to 107% instead of 80% and it seemed like once the timer ran out from the first stack, the whole buff evaporated. I figured maybe that was just the HUD being inaccurate, but nope, that is exactly how the skill works: when you shoot a cop with a pistol, it creates a 10-second window of damage buff. It starts at 1.2^1 and can go to ^4, ending up at +107% damage, and once the timer from the first shot expires, the whole buff ends. It can of course be immediately restarted, so Trigger Happy favors light and medium-tier pistols for their fire rate and mag size. Avid users of the Deagle or Revolver tier might not get a whole lot of use out of Trigger Happy. Oh, and that's all assuming aced. Basic is a 2-second window of damage buff, so you'd end up constantly losing the buff and it would really only apply to face-loving dozers. Not really worth it. Anyway that's a lot of text and I meant to just copy+paste how Frankelsteiner lays it out, so go look at all the data-mined new skills enjoy: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/pd2mech/discussions/0/350532795327646342/ Rhjamiz posted:How exactly do I even download Seven's? I am not familiar with open-source repositories and they all seem to try their best to be as obtuse to the layman as possible. Hit "Downloads" on the Navigation tab on the left and download the repository. It took me a few minutes to figure out myself, don't worry. From there just plop it in your BLT folder.
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Jun 8, 2016 09:14
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ClonedPickle posted:1) Med bags would be better than first aid kits if you have a crew of two other people bringing FAKs and a guy bringing ammo or something. So, most of the time, yes you should probably bring FAKs. Just remember to share! You and Lucifer might be right about Unseen Strike - I'm not totally convinced about it either. It does have use in flattening dozers, though; When I see them coming, I take cover for 4 seconds, try not to get hit, then pop out and unload into their faces. Usually get multiple critical hits from that. If I took it away, I would get Transporter basic (2 points)... and I'm actually not sure what else. Underdog, maybe? That would leave me with 1 point more which I might just waste on reducing damage from melee attacks. I chose the other branch over Desperado because Basic Desperado is useless, and because I realized I tend to run into cover to reload anyway. You're probably right about the stability bonus, I'll put it into Up You Go instead and try it out. I think I designed this build as a sort of jack-of-all-trades build. Has armour to tank hits, especially from snipers and even to a lesser extent dozers, can flee if that tankiness is not sufficient, and can do good damage from both short and long range. Due to the silenced weapons and low concealment, can even act as an accessory to stealth heists. Maybe I'll look into how I can specialize it more by focusing on loud guns instead, that's an idea!
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Jun 8, 2016 09:30
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ClonedPickle posted:Is PocoHud updated? I've been reluctant to install it since it seems like it breaks every semi-major patch, I'm not sure which version to use, and I don't really want to install it and then turn off 99% of the features. There probably isn't a better option, granted, but I'm asking hoping that there is. I really just want something that tells me about active skills like Trigger Happy and Overkill and has a cooldown timer for Inspire and auto-FAK use. It works fine for me, but I had to go get a patch from their Steam group. e; BLT pocoHUD just updated for me on launch so I imagine Kilandor did the update. ClonedPickle posted:Something fundamental changed with the skill and it's amazing now. Missing doesn't reset your stacks, so now you can take a Chimano Custom and within a few bullets be outputting Deagle-level damage for as long as there are cops to shoot. Granted, I think it's only worthwhile if you ace it, since I don't think the 2 seconds basic gives you is enough time. 2 seconds is plenty with akimbo Berettas, though! Coolguye posted:this was never a thing It definitely was when the game first launched, and it took them a while to decouple achievements from unlocks. They might have fixed it earlier than the BBQ pack, though, it's been a while. Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 09:37 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 09:33
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ClonedPickle posted:Hit "Downloads" on the Navigation tab on the left and download the repository. It took me a few minutes to figure out myself, don't worry. From there just plop it in your BLT folder. That doesn't seem to be working. I've tried both throwing the lua file in the mods folder as well as tossing the whole folder in. 
Rhjamiz fucked around with this message at 09:45 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 09:41
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ClonedPickle posted:Anyway that's a lot of text and I meant to just copy+paste how Frankelsteiner lays it out, so go look at all the data-mined new skills enjoy: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/pd2mech/discussions/0/350532795327646342/ According to that there's a number of skills that are still busted, including Aced Unseen Strike. 
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Jun 8, 2016 09:52
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ClonedPickle posted:Anyway that's a lot of text and I meant to just copy+paste how Frankelsteiner lays it out, so go look at all the data-mined new skills enjoy: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/pd2mech/discussions/0/350532795327646342/ Just wanted to plop a few PSAs out there for anyone who doesn't feel like reading this: Resilience basic does nothing (instead of +15% armor recovery speed) Kickstarter basic sets drill auto-restart chance to 30% (even if you didn't take Hardware Expert basic - can confirm that having just Kickstarter basic will provide auto-restarting drills) Second Wind basic provides a crew speed bonus, ace does nothing Unseen Strike will lose the +35% crit bonus upon being hit - the 6s/18s timer afterward doesn't appear to be working Martial Arts basic does nothing, ace will provide the melee damage resistance that basic should (but not the knockdown) Overkill! e: damnit, beaten sort of Rhjamiz posted:That doesn't seem to be working. I've tried both throwing the lua file in the mods folder as well as tossing the whole folder in. //steamapps/common/PAYDAY 2/mods/HUDList/ All the files from the folder "pjal3urb-hudlist-2843a7928a5f" are located there on my end, except for the "Obsolete" folder. If doing that exactly doesn't work for you, I dunno what's up. Is your BLT hook up to date? (This is weird to ask because mine isn't completely up to date )
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Jun 8, 2016 09:53
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Wastrel_ posted:You and Lucifer might be right about Unseen Strike - I'm not totally convinced about it either. It does have use in flattening dozers, though; When I see them coming, I take cover for 4 seconds, try not to get hit, then pop out and unload into their faces. Usually get multiple critical hits from that. If I took it away, I would get Transporter basic (2 points)... and I'm actually not sure what else. Underdog, maybe? That would leave me with 1 point more which I might just waste on reducing damage from melee attacks. Re: Unseen Strike -- Pickle's link makes it clear that a number of skills are not worth taking. Unseen Strike is one such skill. The aced version has no effect, and apparently, it might be the case that getting hit cancels the effect. On the whole, not a skill that will be useful terribly often. You've also got One Handed aced, so you can definitely ace Desperado. Basic might be useless, but One Handed really isn't changing breakpoints for the weapons you're using. Faster reloads, however, are always useful. Rhjamiz posted:That doesn't seem to be working. I've tried both throwing the lua file in the mods folder as well as tossing the whole folder in. Download this file, unzip it, and drop it in your mods folder. If you want to change the number of skills unlocked, change the number at the top of the lua file. E: The "issue" with the skillsets mod is that it doesn't come packaged with a BLT-compatible mods.txt. I made one. It's probably not totally right, but it gets the mod to load and function, as far as I can tell.
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Jun 8, 2016 09:58
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ClonedPickle posted:Anyway that's a lot of text and I meant to just copy+paste how Frankelsteiner lays it out, so go look at all the data-mined new skills enjoy: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/pd2mech/discussions/0/350532795327646342/ Great, Rifleman only applies to ARs and snipers instead of "all weapons."  Speaking of which, what's the best primary for a Sharpshooter build? DMR'd AK .762? e; do any of the perk decks still have faster weapon swap? It's a bit silly that the non-pistol-specific skill one is in Overkill Ace.
Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 10:50 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 10:07
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I could've sworn aced Unseen Strike was working in the beta, but it also could've been a placebo effect or something else since I also put aced Low Blow on the same build. That will save me a bunch of points at least. Also good to have confirmation that I was not imagining the faster reload after getting a multi-kill with the RPG.
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Jun 8, 2016 10:27
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I got some mileage out of unseen strike basic even in its current state. If you're using suppressed weapons in the first place then there's a good chance the enemy won't be shooting at you. Today I intermittently vaporised a stream of cloakers and tasers pouring into the first time lock in the diamond (they would not stop spawning) with LMG crits all the way down the corridor from the side stairwell. It's a mostly safe place as cops either use the side stairs or not at all during an assault wave. Another addition to my staple loadouts is LBV crook 2.0. Inspire, ironman, maxed sneaky blow basic with a VSS and HE judge and swan song. It survived the beta intact and optic illusions helped keep it all down low. As a bonus I didn't need to switch out the giant brick suppressor to reach three detect! It's far more survivable, sneaky, shooty and speedy than my pre-overhaul masterforcer. If I went up to nine detect then I could use almost any combination of my guns.
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Jun 8, 2016 11:06
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Delacroix posted:I got some mileage out of unseen strike basic even in its current state. If you're using suppressed weapons in the first place then there's a good chance the enemy won't be shooting at you. Yeah. I'd still take Unseen Strike Basic on something like an akimbo silencer build, just because you'll generate very little threat while firing, and you fire those akimbo Bernettis very fast, which means having the crit state cancelled by being shot at won't matter as much. e; drat it, Uppers Ace and Swan Song don't work together. Uppers ace triggers instead of going down, Swan Song triggers after you go down, which means you either don't go down (Uppers Ace) or you go into Swan Song and Uppers Ace won't save you even if Swan Song ends next to a FAK with the cooldown expired. Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 12:35 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 11:53
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Lemon-Lime posted:Yeah. I'd still take Unseen Strike Basic on something like an akimbo silencer build, just because you'll generate very little threat while firing, and you fire those akimbo Bernettis very fast, which means having the crit state cancelled by being shot at won't matter as much. I found this out as well, though I suppose it would be pretty ridiculous to see the Swan Song timer, throw down a FAK and live forever. I found out you can get behind the accepted level geometry on Goat Simulator day2 though. Next to the hay bales where the cops come down, if you're standing on the right spot when one starts rappelling, it can force you outside of the bounding box for players. Since cops make a physical object on the ground that they're rappelling to in order so that they have a place to "land", being in that spot when it's triggered forces you weird places. Also, you can't throw bags back into the bounding box, the wall is two-way!
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Jun 8, 2016 13:10
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DelphiAegis posted:I found this out as well, though I suppose it would be pretty ridiculous to see the Swan Song timer, throw down a FAK and live forever. A simpler solution would be to disallow placing deployables during Swan Song.
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Jun 8, 2016 13:38
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Lemon-Lime posted:Yeah. I'd still take Unseen Strike Basic on something like an akimbo silencer build, just because you'll generate very little threat while firing, and you fire those akimbo Bernettis very fast, which means having the crit state cancelled by being shot at won't matter as much. They used to work together when the beta first started and it was broken as gently caress.
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Jun 8, 2016 13:52
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The revive radius was also 15m so needless to say, extremely generous on most maps. It was hard not to stumble into range with swan song since you can pepper the place with FAKs beforehand. If anyone was curious, bulletstorm does not stop deploying sentries from draining ammo, I imagine swan song would be the same. The suppressed sentry gun gadget in the equip menu doesn't reflect the bonus sentries from the capstone but the bonus is applied all the same. Six sentries makes undercover positively pedestrian even on DW. Unless I was missing something obvious, I couldn't reload sentries unless I deployed them all to gain the ability to pick them up. It can be a nuisance at times and an outline wouldn't be asking too much. Delacroix fucked around with this message at 14:20 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 14:17
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