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Brainiac Five posted:If national sovereignty propagates racism, then let the hand of God tear it down, by any means. Pluck out thine own eye if it offends thee.
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Jun 22, 2016 22:44
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Brainiac Five posted:Do Europeans think there's one American nationality or something? No. We have these things called history lessons in school. From pre- to high- school. I know that's something you've never heard off but it's regular stuff here.
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Jun 22, 2016 22:47
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pigdog posted:That's a little bit radical, don't you think? Can you think of a country that doesn't have a problem with racism, and how that correlates to their immigration policy? You worm of a man, look up from the soil that is your repast. Art thou committed to the end of injustice, or does thy soul surrender to criminality? Make thy choice.
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Jun 22, 2016 22:47
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Ligur posted:No. So why do you think the nation-state is necessary for a welfare state, then?
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Jun 22, 2016 22:48
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Brainiac Five posted:So why do you think the nation-state is necessary for a welfare state, then? You're going to fast for him, slow down.
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Jun 22, 2016 22:49
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Brainiac Five posted:Do Europeans think there's one American nationality or something?
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Jun 22, 2016 22:50
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pigdog posted:I think it's easy to get a skewed view of the world when your culture dominates the world, and your native language is the lingua franca spoken by everybody including the space aliens on TV. The statehood and nationality of the USA is exceptional. But it came at an expense of a massive holocaust of hundreds of smaller, native American cultures. Dog, the extermination was a product of how European the US was. As we've sloughed off that burden, we have become greater.
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Jun 22, 2016 22:51
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pigdog posted:I think it's easy to get a skewed view of the world when your culture dominates the world, and your native language is the lingua franca spoken by everybody including the space aliens on TV. The statehood and nationality of the USA is exceptional. But it came at an expense of a massive holocaust of hundreds of smaller, native American cultures. And this is why, from that day forward, no American ever called themself nothing other than "American", never once using hyphenation to qualify their one and only American-ness.
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Jun 22, 2016 22:55
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Brainiac Five posted:So why do you think the nation-state is necessary for a welfare state, then? It seems to me that America for all its multiculturalism /social justice movement is in fact by far more of a class based society than European nation states. pigdog fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Jun 22, 2016 |
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Jun 22, 2016 23:00
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pigdog posted:I believe so. Speaking the same language, sharing the same culture promotes trust, equality and compassion. There is a bond, "roots" if you will, that bind you to this particular place and these people. Because here (and only here) you can speak the same language, with people who are similar to you and come from the same conditions. Congrats on rediscovering mudsill theory.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:04
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pigdog posted:I believe so. Speaking the same language, sharing the same culture promotes trust, equality and compassion. There is a bond, "roots" if you will, that bind you to this particular place and these people. Because here (and only here) you can speak the same language, with people who are similar to you and come from the same conditions. So under your logic Canada doesn't exist, right? pigdog posted:It seems to me that America for all its multiculturalism /social justice movement is in fact by far more of a class based society than European nation states. You have a weird definition of "class based" for the vast majority of European nations to not count.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:05
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fishmech posted:So under your logic Canada doesn't exist, right?
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Jun 22, 2016 23:12
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pigdog posted:In my mind it's a more of a nation state. A weird anglo-french kind of nation state, but they definitely have an opinion on what Canadian means. They have heckuva tough immigration laws though, so that sure makes them very racist. In your mind a nation-state=state, got it.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:13
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Brainiac Five posted:So why do you think the nation-state is necessary for a welfare state, then? Geee whizzz, dah uddar social-democratic welfare states during dah history... I mean what the gently caress  Are you just stupid, or just trained in the USA USA (TRUMP!) USA? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 22, 2016 23:15
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pigdog posted:In my mind it's a more of a nation state. A weird anglo-french kind of nation state, but they definitely have an opinion on what Canadian means. They have heckuva tough immigration laws though, so that sure makes them very racist. Considering the Quebecois actively hate much of the English speaking population, that seems, er, highly bullshit. Also how Canada has proportionally more immigrants than the US these days.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:16
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ReagaNOMNOMicks posted:And this is why, from that day forward, no American ever called themself nothing other than "American", never once using hyphenation to qualify their one and only American-ness. Likewise, Finland belongs to the Finns. They should also get to vote and decide who gets to make the laws and decisions to allow anybody in the country. Nobody has an innate right to stay in America, or any other country, except their citizens. Not even refugees, who get to go there by the decision and agreement by the country to ratify the relevant convention. There is no right for anybody to come and stay in America, or any other country (except one), no matter what their race and privilege. Such privileges are merely granted by the elected body of its rightful owners, the citizens.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:20
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pigdog posted:The part before hyphen doesn't really matter for crap. America belongs to the Americans, no matter the hyphenation. They get to vote and decide who gets to make the laws and decisions to allow anybody in the country. In that, the hyphen means poo poo. What's your opinion on Swedish-speaking finns?
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Jun 22, 2016 23:23
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I have to go to bed now but when I wake up tomorrow morning Britain better be still in the EU, you limey assholes. Don't be a quitter.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:25
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ReagaNOMNOMicks posted:What's your opinion on Swedish-speaking finns? Good for them for having learned the Swedish language. 
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Jun 22, 2016 23:25
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Ligur posted:Geee whizzz, dah uddar social-democratic welfare states during dah history... I mean what the gently caress Spain isn't a welfare state? Whodathunkit.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:25
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I agree with pigdog... to some extent, but why are these guys going "DAAHHHRGGG I LOVE TRUMP" without giving anyone reasonable excuse to doing so? ReagaNOMNOMicks, fishmech, Brainiac Five and so on. "I love Trump!" Come on, why? That guy is a crazy Republican and they are all like "I will support TRUMP! if I just get to say racism!" From an Euro point of view it makes so little sense.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:27
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pigdog posted:Good for them for having learned the Swedish language. Answer the question truthfully. Unless you don't know about the minority Swedish-speaking population in Finland?
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Jun 22, 2016 23:27
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Ligur posted:I agree with pigdog... to some extent, but why are these guys going "DAAHHHRGGG I LOVE TRUMP" without giving anyone reasonable excuse to doing so? ReagaNOMNOMicks, fishmech, Brainiac Five and so on. "I love Trump!" This is a contemptible gambit.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:28
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Ligur posted:I agree with pigdog... to some extent, but why are these guys going "DAAHHHRGGG I LOVE TRUMP" without giving anyone reasonable excuse to doing so? ReagaNOMNOMicks, fishmech, Brainiac Five and so on. "I love Trump!" A thing happened!
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Jun 22, 2016 23:30
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Brainiac Five posted:Spain isn't a welfare state? Whodathunkit. No it isn't quite like that anymore. 30% or 150% or whatever of young adults have to live with their parents. Because the economy cannot provide jobs that provide housing. I think Hitler is behind that... Brainiac Five posted:This is a contemptible gambit. You actually mean a "compatible" gambit, and that is all good 
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Jun 22, 2016 23:31
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Ligur posted:What the gently caress are you talking about I'm not sure how this makes your xenophobia correct in any way though? Your sudden hyper-defensiveness and desperate deflections are just making the fact that the nail was hit on the head all the more conspicuous. EDIT: pigdog posted:one whom Finland caters perhaps even a little too much. lol Yinlock fucked around with this message at 23:38 on Jun 22, 2016 |
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Jun 22, 2016 23:35
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ReagaNOMNOMicks posted:Answer the question truthfully. Unless you don't know about the minority Swedish-speaking population in Finland?
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Jun 22, 2016 23:36
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Ligur posted:No it isn't quite like that anymore. According to you it'd be because they have Galicians and Basques and Catalans, preventing them from being a nation-state.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:36
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Yinlock posted:I'm not sure how this makes your xenophobia correct in any way though? If you just quit hating women, you would probably get it... but that means it will take a while. That's ok. Tell us again, why did you stop beating your girlfriend?
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Jun 22, 2016 23:39
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Ligur posted:If you just quit hating women, you would probably get it... but that means it will take a while. That's ok. Dude, you're not allowed to post in smug single-sentence 6-8 word posts except in the name of greater social justice.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:45
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I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish. Perhaps instead of blindly lashing out when people call you xenophobic, you could instead look at why people are doing so. Admitting you're wrong has to be easier than melting down every time someone exposes it.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:46
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pigdog posted:Dude, you're not allowed to post in smug single-sentence 6-8 word posts except in the name of greater social justice. Grats on admitting your service to injustice.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:46
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Ligur posted:If you just quit hating women, you would probably get it... but that means it will take a while. That's ok. Nice meltdown
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Jun 22, 2016 23:48
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Brainiac Five posted:Grats on admitting your service to injustice.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:51
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pigdog posted:There is no injustice a country not allowing in immigrants whom they don't like. That is each country's sovereign right. There is no injustice there. There is injustice in sneering at justice.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:52
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Brainiac Five posted:There is injustice in sneering at justice.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:55
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pigdog posted:You specifically asked about Finns who spoke Swedish. Anyhow, what is your point? They are a historical minority, a part of Finland's society, one whom Finland caters perhaps even a little too much. They have a their voice, as citizens, but I'm sure they are quite understanding in that the difference between the states of Sweden and Finland is that the first is dedicated to the nurture and development of Swedish people, language and culture, and vice versa. And that is nice. No other country in the world cares about the Finnish culture and people, other than their own. Would you say the Swedish-speaking minority in Finland shares a bond or whatever with other Finns? If they don't, should they have to or should they secede? In the same vein, would you say inhabitants of Scotland shares a bond with inhabitants of England? Yet again, would you say people who identify as Scottish, regardless of where they live or what their citizenship is, are actually Scottish? Furthermore, is Switzerland a nation-state? Is Austria a nation-state? Is Belgium a nation-state? Is France a nation-state? What if being French means speaking French, should the French then have a claim in reforming their Empire? What if being French means speaking French and being somewhat Western, should the french seize control of Quebec? Nation-state are an abomination because it's an ill-defined notion claiming that being *whatever* in the XIXth century was due to some ancestral, in-your-blood, quasi-mystical property passed down from mommy and daddy that somehow granted you control to the land your nation de facto ruled over but also to the land your identified-as-such brethren also occupied. Turns out there were germans everywhere in Europe! How could this ever go wrong! Turns out the Jews can't be anything other than jews! How could this also go wrong! Nation-state never meant "functioning state" or "modern state" or "the ideas that come to my head haphazardly about what a ntion-sate is". ReagaNOMNOMicks out.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:56
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pigdog posted:Are you justice? You're the guy cracking wise about "social justice", honks.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:56
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ReagaNOMNOMicks posted:Nation-state are an abomination because it's an ill-defined notion claiming that being *whatever* in the XIXth century quote:You're the guy cracking wise about "social justice", honks.
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Jun 23, 2016 00:09
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pigdog posted:Actually it's more like having living in a place for the last 5000 years kind of notion. Sorry if that's too hard to wrap your head around. You are utterly loving naive if you don't think nations and their borders don't matter, after what, a couple of decades of relative peace in the region. I see quite a bit of racism against Hungarians in this post.
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Jun 23, 2016 00:12
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