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Zereth posted:Don't forget their claim they absolutely would not just abandon the game, followed shortly by them doing exactly that. My favourite part about this whole shitshow was how they acted indignant that people were upset, and that any gameplay deficiencies could be fixed by modders. And by favourite I mean gently caress Doublefine forever
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Jun 22, 2016 23:22
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I dunno, I think Tim Schafer is ok, but i will never ever hand him any money for a game that is not released yet
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Jun 23, 2016 00:19
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The reason why people get away with bullshit is cause of the poster above. Guy swindles money, "eh he's alright. Id think twice though!!!!"
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Jun 23, 2016 00:27
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Rupert Buttermilk posted:I haven't REALLY been following the Mighty No. 9 stuff, but like... how in the hell do you gently caress up a professionally-produced Mega Man-esque platformer? And how does it take THAT long to make it in the first place? C'mon now, you've made countless MM games in the past, here's another one that's like it but without the name, why all the problems? So like "Mighty Number 9's devs didn't understand what made Mega Man good" versus "Starbound's devs didn't understand what made Terraria good"
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Jun 23, 2016 00:32
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Blacktoll posted:The reason why people get away with bullshit is cause of the poster above. Guy swindles money, "eh he's alright. Id think twice though!!!!" I mean, I liked psychonauts, but im sure as hell not gonna help fund the second game.
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Jun 23, 2016 00:44
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Hitlers Gay Secret posted:Starbound, Unsung Story, and Mighty No. 9 taught me to never crowdsource anything ever again. Remember that when they first started selling the game they didn't even frame it as crowd funding, just a pre-order. I wonder if the game would have turned out better if they hadn't gotten millions of bucks. It might have kept the scope and time line in check. Probably not.
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Jun 23, 2016 00:44
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The Moon Monster posted:It might have kept the scope and time line in check. Probably not. In my opinion I don't think it would. I've found that most (but not all) indie devs are terrible at logistics and long term planning. Typically in the old days, it was the publisher's way or the highway unless you could afford to fund development out of your own pocket, and it was almost always aimed at balancing artistic integrity with getting a product out the door. With crowdfunding there isn't that control, so devs are more prone to just run free and do whatever they want and hope a game materialises, else they always have that option of begging for more money or expecting people to work for free.
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Jun 23, 2016 00:59
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Party Plane Jones posted:People are still dumb enough to give Tripwire money after the utter shitshow of Red Orchestra 2 post-launch? I swore off giving them another red cent after that. KF2 is another case of "Promising start!... Why are you making this baffling change while yelling 'It tested well internally!'?" on repeat. The latest one was shoving a brand new "Even trash enemies will be highly resistant to shotgun blasts if we feel like it" resistance system on top of everything else in the beta, most feedback saying it's poo poo. They get defensive and say "We worked really hard on it! besides it's not like we shoved it into live!". Quickly shove it into live with it slightly tweaked , etc. The resident staff member quit the thread because it was the straw that broke the camel's back for a lot of people not responding politely to being told "It tested well internally! Give this latest bullshit a chance!" even though it's not even his job to be PR or nearly every baffling design decision anyways. The biggest surprise is TWI is slightly backing down on the resistance thing, a few days after telling people "Sorry guys, maybe we'll get adjusting it. We're so busy" (They are only going to remove it from "Trash" enemies, though that's a varying term), but less surprising was passivly aggressively dropping "Even though we worked really hard on it and thought you guys would love it" despite it being nearly universally hated since it's beta implementation except for the sort of people who praise all of Starbounds more bullshit slog. Section Z fucked around with this message at 02:29 on Jun 23, 2016 |
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Jun 23, 2016 02:26
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I'm glad I held off on KF2. I got an alpha key for a weekend and it seemed incredibly promising so I just figured I'd wait for it to come out and grab it then, but then I every time I hear about it is worse and worse. It's no wonder they took ages to update the game at that point--They weren't just working on the classes and maps like everyone thought they were, they were spending time on dumb poo poo no one asked for like a competitive mode(???) What the hell is the point of a resistance system anyway, the big enemies were already appallingly bullet spongey when I played Rhopunzel posted:In my opinion I don't think it would. I've found that most (but not all) indie devs are terrible at logistics and long term planning. Typically in the old days, it was the publisher's way or the highway unless you could afford to fund development out of your own pocket, and it was almost always aimed at balancing artistic integrity with getting a product out the door. With crowdfunding there isn't that control, so devs are more prone to just run free and do whatever they want and hope a game materialises, else they always have that option of begging for more money or expecting people to work for free. Star citizen is sort of a case study in what happens when a developer is going to do this but then they never have to stop, because dumbasses just keep throwing money at them forever. There is no point where a game magically appears after enough dollars and time have been wasted. It will go on for exactly as long as people let it, and it won't be one bit better for it in the end.
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Jun 23, 2016 02:41
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Digirat posted:I'm glad I held off on KF2. I got an alpha key for a weekend and it seemed incredibly promising so I just figured I'd wait for it to come out and grab it then, but then I every time I hear about it is worse and worse. It's no wonder they took ages to update the game at that point--They weren't just working on the classes and maps like everyone thought they were, they were spending time on dumb poo poo no one asked for like a competitive mode(???) I forget the exact words a dev used to deride the concept of a "Head clicking simulator" to justify why trash enemies need several headshots from fancy handguns to put down. A Dev also said that RPGs are supposed to be used for precision single target kills when people complained about splash damage reductions  Also their official forums filter posts through a moderator, even Chucklefish doesn't do. Granted that's probably as much because that would give chucklfish forums a workload.
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Jun 23, 2016 03:06
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Nothing makes me think "precision single target" like a high-explosive rocket, yes Good god I just looked at the thread for the first time in a year. What the gently caress is this poo poo  I thought this game was a first person shooter? What happened to it? Why are there tons of redundant categories for bullet guns? What is a "rifle" vs an "assault rifle?" What exactly does "stuns," "stumbles," "knockdowns" mean when "gun hits" and "melee hits" are in the same categories? What the gently caress does any of this mean, and how is anyone supposed to keep track of it when there are 30 enemies of 6 different types on the screen at once?
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Jun 23, 2016 03:52
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That post was relevant to starbound by the way.
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Jun 23, 2016 03:54
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Digirat posted:Nothing makes me think "precision single target" like a high-explosive rocket, yes holy sweet mother of overengineering
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Jun 23, 2016 04:04
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I'm much angrier about spacebase than starbound. it came out while Doublefine had good will, there was a surge of purchases, that rapidly trailed off, and when it stopped making money and was down to one guy tasked with finishing the few features they had announced, such as making the power generators that had been in the game from the beginning actually do anything, stapled on steam mod support, called it a day and said "If you want it mod it in, go gently caress yourself." Keep in mind the gold game frequently generates unusable maps especially when you ask for a challenge, and other poo poo that's angering.
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Jun 23, 2016 04:17
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Digirat posted:Nothing makes me think "precision single target" like a high-explosive rocket, yes 
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Jun 23, 2016 09:40
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i like how it has color indicators showing you that the head is the weak spot and the armored chest isn't
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Jun 23, 2016 09:44
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I'm just glad so many friendless goons shoveled all their dollars into this trashfire so I can legitimately touch the poop without having to pay a dime for it.
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Jun 23, 2016 10:06
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Rhopunzel posted:In my opinion I don't think it would. I've found that most (but not all) indie devs are terrible at logistics and long term planning. Typically in the old days, it was the publisher's way or the highway unless you could afford to fund development out of your own pocket, and it was almost always aimed at balancing artistic integrity with getting a product out the door. With crowdfunding there isn't that control, so devs are more prone to just run free and do whatever they want and hope a game materialises, else they always have that option of begging for more money or expecting people to work for free. "Terrible at logistics and long term planning" often means "nerd with great ideas and a lot of natural intelligence that really doesn't like working 8+ hour days ever, or really even 2+ hour days ever." Let's just be honest - there are jokes, that aren't really jokes, made on these forums every day about the technically bright and gifted manchildren of the world who are technically bright and gifted who are lazy, have no direction, and sort of float through the world. Early access, Kickstarter, etc. give money raising platforms to those people. Yet it is somehow surprising when the companies/products they promise turn out to be train wrecks. Because taking in money is easy. Knuckling down to grind out thousands of hours of development, programming, etc., when you don't have a boss checking results, is not nearly as fun as chain watching Orange is the New Black and making Facebook posts about it.
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Jun 23, 2016 16:07
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SlyFrog's hatred of talent continues from the League of Legends thread, where he has gone on record saying he is too literally old to ever improve at League and also that people who play at a high level and call themselves bad are universally humblebragging instead of speaking honestly about the gap they see between themselves and pro players
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Jun 23, 2016 17:15
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who cares
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Jun 23, 2016 20:47
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Anybody who plays a MOBA is probably a bad person so whatever
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Jun 23, 2016 20:53
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people who play mobas are not always bad people, but rather the people who CREATE mobas are bad people. in fact, they are the worst people.
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Jun 23, 2016 21:13
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SlyFrog posted:"Terrible at logistics and long term planning" often means "nerd with great ideas and a lot of natural intelligence that really doesn't like working 8+ hour days ever, or really even 2+ hour days ever." no one cares about your desperate desire to be young again
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Jun 23, 2016 21:24
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SlyFrog posted:Knuckling down to grind out thousands of hours of development, programming, etc., when you don't have a boss checking results, is not nearly as fun as chain watching Orange is the New Black and making Facebook posts about it. while i will be the first to admit that getting blazed and watching grandma's boy is more fun off-hand than blindly coding hitbox algebra, seeing a project build the way you imagined it working is one of the best feelings in the world
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Jun 23, 2016 22:33
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SlyFrog posted:"Terrible at logistics and long term planning" often means "nerd with great ideas and a lot of natural intelligence that really doesn't like working 8+ hour days ever, or really even 2+ hour days ever." In my opinion it's less not wanting to work and more not willing to compromise on pet ideas, which being their game means all of them, lack of discipline with schedules let alone ability to make ones that account for errors, and failure/refusal to efficiently manage talent because ~being manager means you just boss people around right?~
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Jun 23, 2016 23:26
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Babe Magnet posted:who cares I'm filing a complaint with your team lead
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Jun 24, 2016 00:17
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we fired that dude
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Jun 24, 2016 00:29
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I'm gonna say it. I played the nightly, and I like the new hotbar. Having a bunch of sets of items you can switch between is better than having to go into your inventory every few minutes to move poo poo and awkwardly scroll around your in-hand items if you're a troglodyte who doesn't use the number keys like me. The fact that the items don't actually go into your hotbar is weird at first, but means that you can have the same item in more than one set at once, which is nice because you can go sword/bandage, gun/bandage, gun/material, etc. It's a good change. As a matter of fact, I was kind of having... fun? Backwards walking being gone makes everything so much less sluggish, and I like the new monster capture system. They work like pokeballs now, you throw them but they stay in your inventory and you can recall them from anywhere. It's actually kind of rad. Food doesn't stack, which is dumb, but it has its own inventory section now so it's not a huge deal. There are still dumb decisions, but it feels closer to how it used to before they started Dark Soulsing it to hell. Which is insanity, because that would make it backwards progress, but for them going backwards is actually going forwards. It's dumb as hell, but any kind of progress at all is amazing to me. I guess Tiy hasn't found his way out of that broom closet yet.
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Jun 24, 2016 14:16
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Kris xK posted:
Is this true? With the summer sale going on iv'e been thinking about picking it up. I need something chill to play inbetween the bouts of pain and vomiting that has been my "four day weekend". If you wish to replicate this experience download spacebase DF-9.
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Jun 24, 2016 14:34
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OrangeSoda posted:Is this true? With the summer sale going on iv'e been thinking about picking it up. I need something chill to play inbetween the bouts of pain and vomiting that has been my "four day weekend". It's weird and slow (who makes a DF-like with no fast-forward feature?), but "suck" would be putting very strongly.
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Jun 24, 2016 16:38
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OrangeSoda posted:Is this true? With the summer sale going on iv'e been thinking about picking it up. I need something chill to play inbetween the bouts of pain and vomiting that has been my "four day weekend". See, the difference with Clockwork Empires is that Gaslamp Games already built up a good rapport with its userbase by releasing Dungeons of Dredmor full-out, continuing to update it, and even releasing expansion packs of both the "free" and the "pay for it DLC" versions for about a year after the game launched. The fact that they're pretty transparent about what's going on in their offices helps, too. I will admit it's not perfect and still needs a lot of work (see the post above) but it's solid enough for an EA game.
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Jun 25, 2016 00:14
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Yeah you couldn't draw a stronger contrast between development behavior. Go read this: https://clockworkempires.com/development.html It's extremely clear what they're doing, what they've done, what they plan to do, why they're doing it, and how they're reacting to feedback and bumps in the road. That doesn't mean CE is automatically a great (or even good) game, but just in terms of how to handle an EA project... not even close.
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Jun 25, 2016 05:49
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victrix posted:Yeah you couldn't draw a stronger contrast between development behavior. Speaking of, is there a "best of" failures from the EA genre? There are a lot of neat looking games that just stopped getting updates pushed out but were only minor hits at best so there's not much outrage just recent reviews being "mostly negative". There are some good examples of successes and ongoing EA games that are still well supported. The Road Rash clone is still getting updated regularly, but its been almost 2 years. Prison Architect went to 1.0 after 1.5 years and is amazing apparently. Kerbel Space was a huge hit that stayed in EA for 1+ years, Grim Dawn seemed to work out as a final project despite constant core gameplay changes during the EA phase.
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Jun 25, 2016 20:48
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Broforce did EA right.
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Jun 26, 2016 04:47
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OrangeSoda posted:You know how the old hotbar worked and was like any other hotbar? No way
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Jun 26, 2016 05:13
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hey is this game good yet
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Jun 26, 2016 21:20
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Eonwe posted:hey is this game good yet yes
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Jun 26, 2016 22:01
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wait you missed it, it's bad again sorry
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Jun 26, 2016 22:02
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Is there a mod that puts sand mining back in?
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Jun 26, 2016 23:26
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Mod is dead, we're the ones that killed it
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Jun 27, 2016 08:03
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