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theblackw0lf posted:Dem platform draft committee voted to put opposition to the death penalty in the platform
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Jun 25, 2016 02:23
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Thundercracker posted:Is Cameron the dumbest PM in UK history, or is there another example? Chamberlain doesn't count, he was threading a needle during war times. This is an unforced error. SpaceDrake posted:It's been said, but he's quite possibly a greater screw-up than even Anthony Eden. Eden at least had reason for trying what he did during the Suez Crisis; Cameron has destroyed the British Union purely as a side effect of a political trick that didn't work. Yvonmukluk posted:Chamberlain was actually stepping up rearmament for the conflict with Germany (but knew Britain was nowhere near ready for war) and had to answer to an electorate that was still not willing to go to war, he's streets ahead of Call Me Dave. There's not going to be any Cameron revisionists speaking up in his defence in 70 years, this was almost entirely his fault. David Cameron: "Quite possibly the dumbest PM in UK history, and yes we're including Anthony Eden and Neville Chamberlain when we say that." I honestly agree with calling him the dumbest PM in UK history, because at least Eden's and Chamberlain's fuckups weren't self-inflicted/self-created and 100% avoidable.
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Jun 25, 2016 02:32
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JT Jag posted:If you think about it this is actually a pretty practical time to start pushing against the death penalty, considering the difficulty that many states are having performing it Unfortunately, both Presidential candidates support it.
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Jun 25, 2016 02:37
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JT Jag posted:If you think about it this is actually a pretty practical time to start pushing against the death penalty, considering the difficulty that many states are having performing it Could pushing against the death penalty at the same time as all this increased focus on rape potentially muddle both issues? Considering a lot of the most popular examples people cite against the death penalty are black men who are exonerated for decades-old rape charges on recently-discovered DNA evidence. Pakled fucked around with this message at 02:40 on Jun 25, 2016 |
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Jun 25, 2016 02:37
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fishmech posted:Because other people don't care? I mean you really aren't very bright if you think everyone hates Wal-Mart as much as you. Half their locations wouldn't still be in business if that's how things worked! I don't hate Wal-Mart. I just prefer to shop elsewhere and I have the money to. You don't think their business subsists on people with low incomes?
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Jun 25, 2016 02:39
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Noam Chomsky posted:I don't hate Wal-Mart. I just prefer to shop elsewhere and I have the money to. You don't think their business subsists on people with low incomes? It doesn't, otherwise they wouldn't be nearly as big as they actually are. There are tons of middle income and even high income people who shop there, and at many locations these days they're the majority shoppers, because there simply aren't that many low income people in the midst of the wealthy suburbs and so on where the store is located. Unless your definition of "low income" is "not a millionaire"? Remember they don't really operate meaningfully different to say a Target on the customer's end. The idea that poor people are the majority of their shoppers comes from assuming that every Wal-Mart is out on the outskirts of tiny small towns where everyone's broke, when that's never been the case. If you're going out to the Wal-Mart in Brokefarm County, Iowa, yeah they're reliant on poor people, but only because there's barley anyone who isn't poor around. If you're going out to the Wal-Mart in Richsuburb County, there's going to be a lot less poor people at the store. fishmech fucked around with this message at 02:46 on Jun 25, 2016 |
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Jun 25, 2016 02:43
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The platform committee also rejected a statement against TPP, which is odd, since both Bernie and Hillary oppose it.
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Jun 25, 2016 02:46
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fishmech posted:It doesn't, otherwise they wouldn't be nearly as big as they actually are. There are tons of middle income and even high income people who shop there, and at many locations these days they're the majority shoppers, because there simply aren't that many low income people in the midst of the wealthy suburbs and so on where the store is located. Unless your definition of "low income" is "not a millionaire"? So would you say raising the minimum wage would benefit Wal-Mart, if so thanks for supporting my original point. My reason for not shopping at Wal-Mart is that all of the local ones are dirty and disorganized. I tend to dislike Target almost as much. Department stores in on general suck.
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Jun 25, 2016 02:46
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fishmech posted:It doesn't, otherwise they wouldn't be nearly as big as they actually are. There are tons of middle income and even high income people who shop there, and at many locations these days they're the majority shoppers, because there simply aren't that many low income people in the midst of the wealthy suburbs and so on where the store is located. Unless your definition of "low income" is "not a millionaire"? Would you agree that those with higher incomes have more options for their shopping for a variety of things than Wal-Mart?
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Jun 25, 2016 02:48
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:I never thought I'd ever see WalMart ever spoken in a positive matter in this thread, or this subforum, or this website.
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Jun 25, 2016 02:49
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Noam Chomsky posted:So would you say raising the minimum wage would benefit Wal-Mart, if so thanks for supporting my original point. Lol that's a hell of a backpedal. Raising the minimum wage benefits all retailers period - it's the real purpose of raising minimum wages instead of having guarenteed minimum incomes. A store where no one who ever shopped there had made less than twice the median income would be helped by a raised minimum wage too. But your actual point was that Wal-Mart was primarily shopped at by people too poor to have another option. So you didn't ever stop to think that maybe whatever random place you live isn't reflective of the totality of a chain? Interesting, care to make yourself look more ignorant? Noam Chomsky posted:Would you agree that those with higher incomes have more options for their shopping for a variety of things than Wal-Mart? No, Wal-Mart really isn't significantly cheaper than other similar stores, despite what their advertising would have you believe. Glad to hear you buy into their marketing so hard though! Primary reason for people to have Wal-Mart as their only choice is because they live in places so low population that you won't realistically support multiple competing stores. And those same conditions result in only a Target, or only any of a number of regional supermarket chains and the like in other places. fishmech fucked around with this message at 02:55 on Jun 25, 2016 |
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Jun 25, 2016 02:50
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Joementum posted:The platform committee also rejected a statement against TPP, which is odd, since both Bernie and Hillary oppose it. You can't undermine a popular president, who could play a big role in you winning.
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Jun 25, 2016 02:50
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TyrantWD posted:You can't undermine a popular president, who could play a big role in you winning. Someone should tell the presumptive nominee of the party who has publicly opposed his trade deal in the primary 
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Jun 25, 2016 02:59
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WinCo here has far superior produce compared to the Walmart. Both selection and quality.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:00
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DemeaninDemon posted:WinCo here has far superior produce compared to the Walmart. Both selection and quality. And have 105 stores in only eight states.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:08
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Joementum posted:Someone should tell the presumptive nominee of the party who has publicly opposed his trade deal in the primary Whatever you say during the primary gets tossed out at nonsense. Coming out of the convention with a platform that's a stern rebuke of the party leader's agenda is just asking for the Republicans to beat you over the head with it. It's the same way Trump shits on free trade and TPP, but is going to come out of Cleveland with nothing in the party platform that addresses TPP.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:10
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As chair of the veteran's affairs committee he blocked requests to investigate complaints about the VA healthcare system. Dismissing them as partisan/ideological instead of substantive. While it is true that complaints about long wait times is a standard attack by people who oppose socialized medical systems, it is also true that any medical system with insufficient funding will have long wait times. Shooting messengers who tell you things you don't want to hear is a bad practice. People died and folks advocating for a real NHS in this country were effectively shut out of the discussion for the foreseeable future. He also has a history on the veterans affairs committee of spending lots of times advocating for alternatives to medicine. For example he pushed for VA hospitals to provide acupuncture, yoga, and animal assisted therapy. http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/must-read/senator-backs-alternative-treatments-for-vets-pain He also proposed amendments to the ACA putting alternative medicine on the "must cover" lists that were voted down in a bipartisan fashion. As well as hosts summits about the benefits of alternative medicine: http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/must-read/sanders-remarks-on-complementary-and-alternative-health-care And he worked to get naturopaths ( the inject you with colloidal silver people ) licensed as medical professionals in Vermont. https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/legislative-alchemy-revisited-naturopathy-in-vermont-and-colloidal-silver/ I don't think a chair ( or member for that matter ) of any healthcare related committee should be so deeply involved in fake medicine. That he turned his back on veterans asking for medical care is the reason to list to avoid debating fake medicine as if it might have benefit. In retrospect, that isn't something I have to tip toe around in this forum so I won't.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:10
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the Winco in my city also has p.good cheap lunch options. when you hear "pizza by the slice $2" you probably think "this must be poo poo", but it's actually decent. very thick, fluffy crust. Depressingly, my city has TWO loving WALMARTS. It is a bedroom community with a whole mess of low-income housing and approximately two gazillion apartment complexes (lol the city council FINALLY passed a moratorium on the approval of new apartment complexes, too late to stop the gigantic one right on the biggest road, but better late than never). The last time I was in one of them, a few years ago looking to see if they had cheaper prices on DS games (they did not), the store was a mess. there's no reason to shop at WalMart if you have a Target in town, and really no reason to grocery shop there. Grocery Outlet is better, if you have one near you (but they're only on the West Coast, and, randomly, Pennsylvania).
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Jun 25, 2016 03:10
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Star Man posted:And have 105 stores in only eight states. Not my fault you live in a poo poo state, star man.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:10
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It will be hard to get a truely meaningful increase in Min Wage as long as people think it's just what teenagers and losers who work at mcdonalds earn.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:10
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DemeaninDemon posted:Not my fault you live in a poo poo state, star man. WinCo is headquartered in a state full of Libertarians and Mormons 
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Jun 25, 2016 03:12
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Hillary up 13 points in new Reuters poll. 
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Jun 25, 2016 03:12
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TyrantWD posted:Whatever you say during the primary gets tossed out at nonsense. Why are you OK with the politician you support lying to you? I honestly would like to know.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:14
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Star Man posted:WinCo is headquartered in a state full of Libertarians and Mormons Worth it to live in Idaho if you're a white male. Hetero too sadly.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:15
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DemeaninDemon posted:Worth it to live in Idaho if you're a white male. Truth: Boise State is a school on my list of places to apply to grad school. Turns out that Denver and other major cities are too drat expensive to live in when you're a wage worker for the city, so schools in places that are cheap to live are appealing to me.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:18
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Star Man posted:Truth: Boise State is a school on my list of places to apply to grad school. Turns out that Denver and other major cities are too drat expensive to live in when you're a wage worker for the city, so schools in places that are cheap to live are appealing to me. They have a grad school? Hrmph. I'm a Vandal grad Really though Idaho's cheap as dirt and has just as nice outdoorsy stuff as CO.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:24
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Sanders trying to take the chair of HELP is another excellent example of him trying to step in front of a woman (in this case, Patty Murray, who is well-liked by her colleagues and in leadership, as well as having served in the Senate as long as Sanders has been in Congress.) He ain't getting HELP - he doesn't have seniority over Murray and he isn't going to get voted chair over her either. He only has Budget because she passed on it for HELP chair.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:25
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Joementum posted:Someone should tell the presumptive nominee of the party who has publicly opposed his trade deal in the primary Joe, you're smart enough to recognize the distinction between "willing to say a thing is bad" and "willing to put thing's badness in the party platform."
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Jun 25, 2016 03:25
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Wyld Thang posted:VP is presidential life insurance / assassination detractor. McCain picked Palin for reason #2. Nobody's going to want him dead if it means a crazy meth head with a chip on her shoulder to prove she smart and leader good by golly gee. Mr Interweb posted:I haven't been following this Brexit stuff closely, so apologies for the possibly dumb question, but why did Cameron resign? He wanted to Stay and the people voted Leave so the UK needs someone to actually lead them right now and Cameron is nothing if not a huge worthless sack of poo poo. If he was a half decent leader he'd be working to stave off the Leave from actually happening but he won't because he's the UK's version of Dubya minus the multi-trillion dollar war. Besides, he's got other things to do. Dead pigs don't gently caress themselves you know. PostNouveau posted:He's a humongous dipshit who could have prevented the vote from even happening, but he allowed it to go on to gain points with the racist party. And now the U.K. is hosed because of it. Scotland may well just secede so it can rejoin the E.U. North Ireland probably will as well. Cameron's going to potentially go down in history not simply as the worst but also as the last leader of the UK because it's entirely likely that Scotland could hold another vote and leave the UK and NI might do the same now. David Cameron aimed the UK at a wood chipper just because he could. Noam Chomsky posted:If I have other options I don't shop at Wal-Mart. Why would you? Some people aren't lucky enough to have a Costco nearby. I am. Costco's great as long as you don't mind buying in bulk. Their baked goods are pretty drat good too and they don't gently caress around with the toppings for their pizzas either.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:28
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DemeaninDemon posted:They have a grad school? Hrmph. Trust me, I know. Though most of my time spent in Idaho was in Idaho Falls because we'd be going around Yellowstone and usually stop there on the way to western Montana to visit my dad's family. But yeah, city living's only great if you can afford it. You can't do it on $11.50 an hour or on the pittance you get from a teaching assisstantship very easily. So going back home to Wyoming is a very attractive prospect when I graduate from MSU Denver this December and then finding a graduate program in a cheap place to live like Laramie, Boise, or Missoula is a pretty good idea in my eyes.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:33
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fishmech posted:Lol that's a hell of a backpedal. Raising the minimum wage benefits all retailers period - it's the real purpose of raising minimum wages instead of having guarenteed minimum incomes. A store where no one who ever shopped there had made less than twice the median income would be helped by a raised minimum wage too. But your actual point was that Wal-Mart was primarily shopped at by people too poor to have another option. So, I've been to multiple Wal-Marts in multiple states and in multiple areas of my home state and they're all fairly messy and disorganized. I personally don't buy into their low-price marketing but it's fairly apparent that low income folks, and to your point, even middle and higher income folks do buy into their marketing and, as such, shop there. I, personally, see absolutely no incentive to shop at Wal-Mart if you don't care about allegedly low prices, which was actually part of my original point to the poster who claimed higher wages would not help Wal-Mart. I am SO loving SORRY that I assumed low income folks were a major consumer demographic for a business that endlessly advertises rock bottom prices, and has a habit of moving into a town, slashing prices so other businesses are then uncompetative and close, so that Wal-Mart ends up as the only game in town. http://www.businessinsider.com/meet-the-average-wal-mart-shopper-2014-9 quote:According to the data, the average Wal-Mart shopper is a white, 50-year-old female with an annual household income of $53,125. Why the gently caress would such a person shop there if not for the, I guess allegedly, low prices?
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Jun 25, 2016 03:41
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Evil Fluffy posted:McCain picked Palin for reason #2. Nobody's going to want him dead if it means a crazy meth head with a chip on her shoulder to prove she smart and leader good by golly gee. Hence my stating and re-stating an "IF YOU HAVE OTHER OPTIONS" qualifier. Alternatively, just don't go to a department/big-box store. Go to an actual grocery store, or a specialty store, or order things online. I don't get the department store fetish. I am probably just weird; I hate them.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:42
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Joementum posted:The platform committee also rejected a statement against TPP, which is odd, since both Bernie and Hillary oppose it. Hillary won't mention it again until after the election and then she'll support it
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Jun 25, 2016 03:43
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Joementum posted:Why are you OK with the politician you support lying to you? you forgot the first rule of politics: lol, nothing matters
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Jun 25, 2016 03:45
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:spoiler: any increase is going to pass on an entirely party line vote, so whatever's in the democratic platform is gonna be the increase that we wind up with, if any I propose an alternate algorithm. Line up all the people who support an increase in order of the amount they support. Count down from highest to lowest till you get to the person who puts you in the majority. That person's number, whatever it is, a the number you get. Nobody else's number matters. The high guy could be one penny or $100 dollars over. It matters not one whit. If you run out of people before you hit that guy it doesn't raise at all. This is why we can pass a raise even against a GOP held house btw. The fracturing of GOP party discipline increases the likelihood of defectors. The more soundly they are thumped in the general the easier to get defectors. But their numbers will be decided by the cost of living in their home districts.
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Jun 25, 2016 03:54
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Noam Chomsky posted:So, I've been to multiple Wal-Marts in multiple states and in multiple areas of my home state and they're all fairly messy and disorganized. I personally don't buy into their low-price marketing but it's fairly apparent that low income folks, and to your point, even middle and higher income folks do buy into their marketing and, as such, shop there. I, personally, see absolutely no incentive to shop at Wal-Mart if you don't care about allegedly low prices, which was actually part of my original point to the poster who claimed higher wages would not help Wal-Mart. I am SO loving SORRY that I assumed low income folks were a major consumer demographic for a business that endlessly advertises rock bottom prices, and has a habit of moving into a town, slashing prices so other businesses are then uncompetative and close, so that Wal-Mart ends up as the only game in town. Great for you. There's literally thousands of the stores, and you didn't see a representative sample. Nice meltdown though. It's really interesting that you can't see any reason to shop at a Wal-Mart besides low prices. Why the gently caress would someone shop there? Well, why shop anywhere, ya loon? There's absolutely nothing special about Wal-Mart in the customer-facing side. Why are you so insistent that there be a special reason to shop at Wal-Mart, but not Target, or Menard's or Safeway or Acme or Stop & Shop? They're all just loving stores, the prices tend to be very closely comparable, and the primary factor behind anyone going to any store is that it be convenient to get to and not unusually expensive. So it works out that for a lot of people from all sorts of income ranges, the Wal-Mart is the most convenient place to go to, or maybe somewhere slightly more convenient popped up but they're already used to it. You can buy basically the same things, the things you can't are usually of similar quality. The customer service is usually about the same. There is no ethical consumption under capitalism. Noam Chomsky posted:Hence my stating and re-stating an "IF YOU HAVE OTHER OPTIONS" qualifier. Alternatively, just don't go to a department/big-box store. Go to an actual grocery store, or a specialty store, or order things online. I don't get the department store fetish. I am probably just weird; I hate them. What makes every other store so much more naturally appealing, in your mind, to people who aren't you (i.e. obsessed with hating this one particular avatar of capitalism)? Also it's pretty funny that you expect people to go to a specialty store to buy say, a cheap TV, or some printer paper, or basic clothes, or a car battery. People don't have a department store "fetish", it's an inherently convenient format - you usually don't need the extra selection of a dedicated store for basic goods. The last people who hated department stores as much as you seem to were the Nazis though (that's not a joke, it was one of their major Things before the holocaust started to get rid of department stores).
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Jun 25, 2016 03:54
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boy oh boy, never thought I'd live to see Noam Chomsky arguing about Wal-Mart!
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Jun 25, 2016 04:00
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McAlister posted:I propose an alternate algorithm. cool story bro
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Jun 25, 2016 04:01
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Platform voted to break up the big banks and implement a modern glass-steagal act, at least according to what I read on Bernie's site
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Jun 25, 2016 04:02
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Walmart, I Can't Quit You Walmart's a poo poo hole, no doubt about it. But let's not pretend because we're better for shopping somewhere else for whatever reason it is.
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Jun 25, 2016 04:02
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