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How will you be voting in the UKEU Referendum? This poll is closed. |
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| Remain - Keep Britane Strong! |
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328 | 15.40% |
| Leave - Take Are Sovreignity Back! |
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115 | 5.40% |
| Remain - But only because Brexit are crazy |
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506 | 23.76% |
| Leave - But only because the EU is terrible |
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157 | 7.37% |
| Spoiled Ballot - This whole thing is an awful idea |
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61 | 2.86% |
| I'm not going to vote |
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19 | 0.89% |
| I'm not allowed to vote |
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411 | 19.30% |
| Pissflaps |
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533 | 25.02% |
| Total: | 2130 votes | ||
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TACD posted:The Real Labour Party The August and Socialist Party of No Corbyns
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Jun 27, 2016 15:13
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Help Im Alive posted:What are you supposed to tell someone whose one stance on all of this is 'but immigrants' Granted, that doesn't help if you're in one of the areas of the country with less immigration and more fears about immigration  .
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Jun 27, 2016 15:13
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Nocturtle posted:My guess (following an analysis posted here already) is that the eventual UK leader, being the product of the UK political system, will be too cowardly to invoke article 50.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:13
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GargleBlaster posted:It's only an armchair theory but one I've seen is that article 50 is so vague that maybe the referendum itself could be taken as a notification of intention, if the EU really wanted to get nasty about it. One for a law expert to refute, perhaps This isn't true. EU officials have come out and said it needs to be an official motion from the UK government, not someone casually mentioning. They probably don't want to start the precedent of "A referendum is enough to start Article 50" since they don't want people to leave.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:14
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Joda posted:They can't force him out of his MP seat, since he was elected right? that'd be funny actually, Islington broke Remain by a higher % than it broke for Corbyn in 2015
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Jun 27, 2016 15:14
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ronya posted:most voters are not actually really deep thinkers and are swayed by large publicity events. for obvious reasons therefore it helps if they're bipartisan events with bibudgets and biendorsements and bivolunteers from the local parties Well this holds water in the sense that while the media has been diligent about not broadcasting or reporting on Corbyn's events, having Cameron there might've forced them to give him the coverage.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:15
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GargleBlaster posted:It's only an armchair theory but one I've seen is that article 50 is so vague that maybe the referendum itself could be taken as a notification of intention, if the EU really wanted to get nasty about it. One for a law expert to refute, perhaps No. EU council spokespeople have made clear that the UK Govt has to specifically and unambigiously invoke it, whether at a meeting of the European Council, or by writing to it. The Council can't choose to interpret the referendum as an invocation
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Jun 27, 2016 15:15
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Joda posted:Is the no confidence only for MPs? And what happens if it's successful; is Corbyn forced to have another leadership election? They can't force him out of his MP seat, since he was elected right?
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Jun 27, 2016 15:15
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jabby posted:To be fair Corbyn has the unions behind him, a majority of the members, has a (thin) majority on the NEC, and is the incumbent leader. By tonight he will also hopefully have a loyal top team. That means realistically it should be the right of the party that splits off and forms a new one, if that is what will happen. Yes sorry I suppose what I meant was that if the Blairites split then Labour would still have enough for a proper party. If Corbyn remains in place there's no need for a new party, I'm talking about if Corbyn is ousted by some bullshit means there's enough for a diaspora.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:16
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Joda posted:Is the no confidence only for MPs? And what happens if it's successful; is Corbyn forced to have another leadership election? They can't force him out of his MP seat, since he was elected right? Its for the leadership, there will then be another leadership vote which he will win, its irrelevant though as long as he's not the person who speaks for the Labour party when Chilcott is published, that will probably fall to Watson who will probably be a bit nicer to Blair.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:17
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Palpek posted:This isn't this simple though. A politician saying that he/she will ignore the results of the referendum (which not invoking article 50 would be) is political suicide as well as it would mean telling the majority of the country that their opinion doesn't mean poo poo after all. Basically both invoking and not invoking article 50 means the end to the political career of the person doing it which is the whole point of the scuffle happening now. 'we will not invoke article 50 until we are given guaranteed access to the single market by the ec and the 27 other member states' *never invokes it because this never happens*
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Jun 27, 2016 15:18
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StoneOfShame posted:Its for the leadership, there will then be another leadership vote which he will win, its irrelevant though as long as he's not the person who speaks for the Labour party when Chilcott is published, that will probably fall to Watson who will probably be a bit nicer to Blair. The same Tom Watson that brought down Tony Blair's leadership?
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Jun 27, 2016 15:18
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Nocturtle posted:My guess (following an analysis posted here already) is that the eventual UK leader, being the product of the UK political system, will be too cowardly to invoke article 50. This will delegitimize both the UK govt and democracy with the entire world watching. Baron Corbyn posted:Chuka Umunna wanted to change the name of Labour to the Democratic Party last year.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:18
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Tigey posted:No. EU council spokespeople have made clear that the UK Govt has to specifically and unambigiously invoke it, whether at a meeting of the European Council, or by writing to it. The Council can't choose to interpret the referendum as an invocation Which is exactly what the European Council don't want, because they're making GBS threads bricks about the possibility of a 'domino effect'. They want a clean break from it as soon as possible, and looking at the current state of UK politics it doesn't seem they'll be getting that any time soon.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:19
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So, Labour is really arguing about who gets to lead the band on the titanic?
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Jun 27, 2016 15:19
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TACD posted:The Real Labour Party The People's Party for Labour Not to be confused with the Labour Party of People.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:19
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Baron Corbyn posted:The same Tom Watson that brought down Tony Blair's leadership? Yeah but Tom plays the game, then it was best for him for Brown to leave now it would be best for him to have the PLP loving him whilst never seeming to betray anyone.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:20
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Zanu Liebour
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Jun 27, 2016 15:21
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https://twitter.com/ChrisGiles_/status/747418086031097856/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw TLDR is we are completely and totally hosed and everything is going to burn to the loving ground.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:21
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Dominionix posted:Which is exactly what the European Council don't want, because they're making GBS threads bricks about the possibility of a 'domino effect'. They want a clean break from it as soon as possible, and looking at the current state of UK politics it doesn't seem they'll be getting that any time soon. Being fair the domino effect is probably our best bet right now. If enough countries domino out then the trade disadvantage starts to disintegrate. Potentially being replaced by a new common market without free movement of people. ~pipe dreams~
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Jun 27, 2016 15:22
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Metrication posted:'we will not invoke article 50 until we are given guaranteed access to the single market by the ec and the 27 other member states' I am genuinely conflicted that my only real hope, is the assumption that in a contest between a relatively clear democratic mandate, and the interests of Capital, that the latter will somehow find a way to prevail...
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Jun 27, 2016 15:23
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Tigey posted:I am genuinely conflicted that my only real hope, is the assumption that in a contest between a relatively clear democratic mandate, and the interests of Capital, that the latter will somehow find a way to prevail... At the moment i'm with Capital. Capital is good. Capital is what's keeping us from drowning.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:24
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I have Labour's new theme tune: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTXeg-Swq9w from the album Niggamortis
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Jun 27, 2016 15:26
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I'm not convinced that the other EU members considering referendums are looking at the UK thinking "Wow, we should get on this bandwagon" tbh.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:26
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to think that lexit was a non-niche position in UKMT a few days ago
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Jun 27, 2016 15:26
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Tesseraction posted:Being fair the domino effect is probably our best bet right now. If enough countries domino out then the trade disadvantage starts to disintegrate. fwiw I would prefer the free movement of people, but ARE CUNTRYmen are clearly Not Keen
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Jun 27, 2016 15:26
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Classy https://twitter.com/katie_martin_fx/status/747430986720382976 E: apparently you can send stuff from their address somehow, perhaps using a petition? Idk distortion park fucked around with this message at 15:29 on Jun 27, 2016 |
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Jun 27, 2016 15:26
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StoneOfShame posted:Its for the leadership, there will then be another leadership vote which he will win, its irrelevant though as long as he's not the person who speaks for the Labour party when Chilcott is published, that will probably fall to Watson who will probably be a bit nicer to Blair. How can they stop him from speaking if they can't sack him as leader until the membership has spoken.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:26
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Tigey posted:I am genuinely conflicted that my only real hope, is the assumption that in a contest between a relatively clear democratic mandate, and the interests of Capital, that the latter will somehow find a way to prevail...
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Jun 27, 2016 15:27
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Fans posted:This isn't true. EU officials have come out and said it needs to be an official motion from the UK government, not someone casually mentioning. Thanks, hadn't seen that. Makes sense now you mention it So they're in an odd situation of trying to make demands that we hurry up and gently caress off already, before we've actually stated a formal intention to do so. I think it'll definitely happen still, as the leadership process will be all about selecting someone for that specific task. They're hardly going to bring in Boris only for him to say "aw haw haw yes well dibble dibble I've kind of changed my mind! Huuzah!"
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Jun 27, 2016 15:27
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Nothing is surprising this week.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:29
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pointsofdata posted:Classy has she included the bit showing the email address?
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Jun 27, 2016 15:29
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Palpek posted:This isn't this simple though. A politician saying that he/she will ignore the results of the referendum (which not invoking article 50 would be) is political suicide as well as it would mean telling the majority of the country that their opinion doesn't mean poo poo after all. Basically both invoking and not invoking article 50 means the end to the political career of the person doing it which is the whole point of the scuffle happening now. I agree with this. Working from the principle that UK politicians work solely for short-term political gain AND that the next leader will be a Tory (Boris?), I expect that they will pay lip-service to the referendum result while trying to indefinitely delay invoking article 50 until the general public forgets. As you pointed out this is directly contrary to the desire of EU, which wants this whole issue dealt with NOW to end any political uncertainty. It seems like the EU can't actually force the UK govt to invoke article 50, so we'll get an awkward stalemate unless the EU leadership gets creative. But really, what can they do except scold the British?
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Jun 27, 2016 15:30
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Is it time for Scottland and Northern Ireland to kick England and Wales out of Great Britain?
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Jun 27, 2016 15:31
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Laradus posted:I'm not convinced that the other EU members considering referendums are looking at the UK thinking "Wow, we should get on this bandwagon" tbh. Euroskeptic parties will take every excuse to talk about this but as the magnitude of the clusterfuck emerges everyone else will safely ignore them. And the UK wasn't/isn't even in the Eurozone. Over here only the lunatic fringers have brought up the possibility of a referendum, the actual euroskeptic party's like "whoa, nope, not now." I liked the argument that "the EU has only brought chaos!" as the reason to conduct an exit referendum though. Yep, definitely, avoiding chaos is the exact reason to leave the EU, yup yup.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:31
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I hope someone starts going on about Hitler and we get to do the whole "when I say Zionists I totally don't mean Jews" thing again, it was fun. Maybe we could mix in some complaints about Globalists and cosmopolitans?
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Jun 27, 2016 15:31
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Jose posted:has she included the bit showing the email address? she has not, it does not in fact show anything suggesting a toolbar so it could be MS Word for all we know not to pretend their aren't anti-Semites in the Momentum camp (moreso than Labour proper) but she wouldn't be the first MP to fake this poo poo in the past year
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Jun 27, 2016 15:31
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Jose posted:has she included the bit showing the email address? she appears to have used her phone to take a picture of an email, then uploaded it to Twitter, without including the incriminating email Jesus wept.
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Jun 27, 2016 15:31
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pointsofdata posted:Classy
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Jun 27, 2016 15:31
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Keir Starmer is out https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/747435929942560768
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Jun 27, 2016 15:31
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