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Chamale posted:The speech being the reason for his death is a myth, he probably died after moving in to the White House because its water supply was badly contaminated with human feces. Yeah. It's not often remembered but Washington and the District of Columbia in general was a swampy malarial hellhole until after the Civil War.
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Jul 1, 2016 00:40
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ALL-PRO SEXMAN posted:Yeah. It's not often remembered but Washington and the District of Columbia in general was a swampy malarial hellhole until after the Civil War. How did that change?
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Jul 1, 2016 00:42
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xthetenth posted:How did that change? It hasn't, not altogether at least. But really it was the same sorts of things that were done elsewhere. Improved sewage systems (London had similar problems that required a massive public works project to solve), better sanitation, draining the swamps where the Tidal Pool is now, and lots of other things. Washington wasn't actually a really major city before the Civil War (at least in the sense of being a major population center) because it was still only a few decades old. It wasn't a natural city at all, it was deliberately built to be the nation's capital. Vincent Van Goatse has a new favorite as of 00:53 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 00:48
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DC is still a putrid swamp in the summer, though.
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Jul 1, 2016 00:50
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Crow Jane posted:DC is still a putrid swamp in the summer, though. Dear God is it ever.
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Jul 1, 2016 00:53
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Crow Jane posted:DC is still a putrid swamp in the summer, though. But isn't that when Congress is on break?
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Jul 1, 2016 00:54
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A Fancy 400 lbs posted:But isn't that when Congress is on break? Washington being built in malarial swamps with a summer atmosphere that's like living inside of a boiling kettle is why Congress goes into recess during the summer in the first place. And yes, I know 
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Jul 1, 2016 00:57
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I live in Baltimore, and I dated a guy who lived in DC a few years ago. Broke up with him in late spring, in part because I couldn't stand the idea of having to visit in the summer. Baltimore's pretty bad too, but at least there's a breeze once in a while.
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Jul 1, 2016 00:58
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Crow Jane posted:I live in Baltimore, and I dated a guy who lived in DC a few years ago. Broke up with him in late spring, in part because I couldn't stand the idea of having to visit in the summer. He wouldn't have blamed you for it. I've lived in Arlington and Norfolk so I understand completely.
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Jul 1, 2016 01:01
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Sweet hell, of course the "German as possible official language" story is bullshit, the USA don't even have an official language.
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Jul 1, 2016 02:19
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Boardroom Jimmy posted:Has anyone in this thread heard of the novella "Futility, or the Wreck of the Titan"? The first half of this novella features an ocean liner called the Titan. It's described as the largest craft afloat and is called practically unsinkable. It has triple screw propellers, is around 800 feet long, has a passenger capacity of 3,000 but not enough lifeboats for everyone on board. It then strikes an iceberg on it's starboard side 400 miles off Newfoundland while sailing between New York and London around midnight in the month of April and sinks. All sounds familiar right? I recall when I was very young, learning about this from, I believe, the program Beyond Belief: Fact or Fiction. Neat little coincidence As for more fun facts, New Haven was its own colony separate from Connecticut until the year 1664. New Haven was a strict theocracy while Connecticut was more religiously open. The two colonies were pushed to merge by England to help encourage the takeover of New Amsterdam, leading some folks to leave New Haven to found a new theocracy that became Newark New Jersey. In 1775 the people of New Haven, who originally were against involvement in the Revolutionary War, were led by a Captain Benedict Arnold who forcefully demanded keys to the local armory, outfitting New Haven troops for a march to Cambridge Massachusetts to join George Washington and officially entered the war. A few years later (1779) the British led a series of raids on the Connecticut coast (Tyron's Raid) that landed first at New Haven, which fought back with a militia of Yale students led by the university's former president. The university militia lost and the British took New Haven, but left it largely intact, preserving a lot of historical buildings (the same fleet torched a number of other nearby towns) Maybe it's not that interesting if you're not from the area but I just find local history fascinating
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Jul 1, 2016 03:44
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The Blue Pyramid posted:I recall when I was very young, learning about this from, I believe, the program Beyond Belief: Fact or Fiction. Neat little coincidence Another odd Connecticut thing. When they established the colony they set its borders between two parallels and left the western border undefined as they didn't know how big the continent was. As settlers expanded west, Connecticut claimed the area west of Pennsylvania as their Western Reserve, in what is now northeastern Ohio. Western Reserve College was founded in 1826 in Hudson. The area was finally ceded to Ohio as it prepared for statehood. Western Reserve College eventually merged with the Case Institute of Technology in Cleveland to make today's Case Western Reserve University.  
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Jul 1, 2016 03:55
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CT has a shitload of interesting history
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Jul 1, 2016 03:57
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The podcast ArchyFantasies has some decent episodes on Connecticut history including the Barkhampstead Lighthouse and vampire burials since one of the hosts is a prominent skeptic and archaeologist from Connecticut. You may know him as the guy who goes on all the lovely History channel psuedohistory shows to explain why they're dumb and that Plato made up Atlantis as a metaphor.
A Fancy 400 lbs has a new favorite as of 04:08 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 04:05
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Wasn't there a thing way back when, too, that Virginia was accepted to extend westward to the then unknown western edge of the continent? I think I remember a teacher mentioning that in high school.
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Jul 1, 2016 04:07
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Filox posted:Wasn't there a thing way back when, too, that Virginia was accepted to extend westward to the then unknown western edge of the continent? I think I remember a teacher mentioning that in high school. I think Kentucky was carved out of Virginia's western claims, and Tennessee from North Carolina's.
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Jul 1, 2016 04:12
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Deteriorata posted:Another odd Connecticut thing. When they established the colony they set its borders between two parallels and left the western border undefined as they didn't know how big the continent was. As settlers expanded west, Connecticut claimed the area west of Pennsylvania as their Western Reserve, in what is now northeastern Ohio. This is also why a whole lot of towns in Connecticut and Ohio share names
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Jul 1, 2016 04:14
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Crow Jane posted:I live in Baltimore, and I dated a guy who lived in DC a few years ago. Broke up with him in late spring, in part because I couldn't stand the idea of having to visit in the summer. I lived in DC for a few years and broke up with a girl because she didn't have AC nor a car so that she could come over to my place, which had AC. She was very cool and pretty, but not that cool and pretty.
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Jul 1, 2016 06:30
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Platystemon posted:Jerningham Wakefield, NZ MP  Looking up that quote lead me to find out his father kidnapped a 15 year old and tricked her in to marrying him for her inheritance. My school assigned me to Wakefield House. It's like discovering I got put in to Slytherin. aardwolf has a new favorite as of 08:06 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 08:00
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Chichevache posted:PYF Fun Fact: all elections everywhere and everywhen have been circuses Sorry to bring up Wojtek chact, and from the previous page no less! But my great grandfather served in Anders' Army during WW2 as a truck driver. Sadly he passed away way before I was born, but apparently never mentioned Wojtek the Bear to anyone in my family. My uncle's name is Wojciech (of which Wojtek is a nickname, like Bill and William), which is less of a coincidence when you realize that Wojciech is a super common name in Poland. Wojciech means "he who enjoys war" or "joyful warrior" BTW 
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Jul 1, 2016 08:38
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SeanBeansShako posted:Shaka's rise, creation of the Zulu Kingdom as a military power and brief reign was before Napoleon's rise to power and outlived Napoleonic France under Napoleon for two more decades. Coincidentally, Napoleon's grandnephew, Eugene Bonaparte (styled Napoleon IV by Bonapartists) would end up dying at the hands of Zulus during the Anglo-Zulu war.
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Jul 2, 2016 14:06
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Angry Salami posted:Coincidentally, Napoleon's grandnephew, Eugene Bonaparte (styled Napoleon IV by Bonapartists) would end up dying at the hands of Zulus during the Anglo-Zulu war. I can't believe I forgot that one. but yeah dude was caught short by a Zulu patrol scouting and they pretty much speared the man to death. Still, better than dying of TB wasting away in Austrian Army service! EDIT: Oh, and the Zulu stabbing spear? Shaka invented that and it was one of the things that helped him rise to power. It was also, ironically assassinated with it. Double irony! SeanBeansShako has a new favorite as of 20:11 on Jul 2, 2016 |
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Jul 2, 2016 17:56
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Crow Jane posted:DC is still a putrid swamp in the summer, though. I go to college in Baltimore and my friends and I all have learned the hard way that we can't visit DC outside the months of October to April.
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Jul 2, 2016 18:25
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The Blue Pyramid posted:I recall when I was very young, learning about this from, I believe, the program Beyond Belief: Fact or Fiction. Neat little coincidence I'm from Mystic, and this is a great place to grow up if you love history. Mystic Seaport is definitely one of the coolest places to go if you've ever been interested in New England maritime history or whaling in general. -Whoops, didn't realize I made a double post. Kanine has a new favorite as of 18:33 on Jul 2, 2016 |
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Jul 2, 2016 18:29
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I grew up in Lebanon and am descended from the founders of Lebanon (and prior to that Norwich) so the history of the whole area has always fascinated me. http://stonewall.uconn.edu/investigation/special-places/ Stonewall.uconn.edu posted:Consider Samson’s Rock, in Madison, CT, below which a bronze plaque was placed by the Madison Foundation, Inc., the Rotary Club of Madison, and the Stop and Shop Supermarket Co. It reads: This website has some cool stuff on it and makes me want to explore local areas with my own LIDAR drones just to see what lurks below the visible surface
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Jul 2, 2016 19:23
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EX250 Type R posted:I grew up in Lebanon and am descended from the founders of Lebanon (and prior to that Norwich) so the history of the whole area has always fascinated me. I missed the context and was confused as to how the same family happened to found the city of Norwich, England and the country of Lebanon.
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Jul 2, 2016 20:16
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The hookah was invented in Persia in the 1560s, tobacco wasn't introduced to Persia before around 1600.
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Jul 2, 2016 21:55
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Hashishins were ancient ninjas who would get stoned as gently caress before they did the dirty deed. They got pulled over a lot for doing 35 on the freeway.
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Jul 2, 2016 22:03
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Filox posted:Wasn't there a thing way back when, too, that Virginia was accepted to extend westward to the then unknown western edge of the continent? I think I remember a teacher mentioning that in high school. There was a lot of that sort of thing when the state borders were being created. My personal favorite might be the bit of Minnesota that jumps northward into Canada because of an incomplete map when the borders were being drawn up.
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Jul 2, 2016 23:15
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syscall girl posted:Hashishins were ancient ninjas who would get stoned as gently caress before they did the dirty deed. It took an actual mongol horde to wipe them out, even Saladin feared them.
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Jul 2, 2016 23:17
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Polaron posted:There was a lot of that sort of thing when the state borders were being created. My personal favorite might be the bit of Minnesota that jumps northward into Canada because of an incomplete map when the borders were being drawn up. Michigan and Ohio got into a near war (militias called up, lots of shouting across the Maumee River, a couple shots fired into the air) over their border. Two different surveys had placed the Toledo Strip alternately in one or the other so both claimed it. At the time, Toledo was bigger than Detroit and a seaport thanks to the Erie canal so it was actually something worth fighting about. A canal had also just been finished from Cincinnati to Toledo (the Miami and Erie canal) that made it a significant commercial hub. To settle the issue and get both territories ready for statehood, Michigan finally ceded its claim on the area and got the Upper Peninsula in exchange. Michigan clearly got the better end of the deal.
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Jul 2, 2016 23:50
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syscall girl posted:Hashishins were ancient ninjas who would get stoned as gently caress before they did the dirty deed. The founder of what became known as the Assassins was Hassan ibn al-Sabbah, a Persian-born convert to Ismailism. in 1090, after years of infiltrating the fortress of Alamut, he turned up on the doorstep and suggested that it might be in the best interest of the castellan to skedaddle, which he did with an IOU to be redeemed by a wealthy patron. He would spend the rest of his life there. They were feared across the Umma and Outre Mere, but not because they sent doped-up chumps to do their dirty work. They were meticulously educated in local languages, customs, modes of dress, you name it. They were trained to blend in, watch, and wait until the right moment presented itself. That was the real scary part--there was no obvious suspect to look out for. Of course, Hassan eventually died, and he was a tough act to follow. The Assassins persisted for a couple hundred years afterward, during which time they dialed up their doctrinal differences right the gently caress up to 11--if I recall correctly, denying the divine origin of the Quran, the validity of the Five Pillars, the 12 Imams and the essential deliciousness of pistachios--and were eventually displaced from Alamut. By that time, though, they were a pale remnant of their former glory.  Alamut still stands, a potential UNESCO Heritage Site, and one of the places I would most like to visit on the planet.
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Jul 3, 2016 01:46
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John Big Booty posted:This is almost certainly not true, as is the competing story that potential assassins (more on this later) were drugged with hashish, shown some phony bullshit sound stage paradise, then told when they sobered up that they could get right back to the party if they died murdering someone. It's really on par with the Messalina/Scylla sex contest in terms of likeliness. The real story, as completely as it can be known, is much more interesting. That's what I get for telling tales out of school (erowid.com I think) you making this good post.
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Jul 3, 2016 02:02
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syscall girl posted:That's what I get for telling tales out of school (erowid.com I think) you making this good post. It was a pretty common belief, it's actually how they got the name Hashishins (assassins) after all. The spooky thing about these guys was that there were limited ways of stealthily killing a dude back then - particularly those available to people of restricted means - so they just didn't give a gently caress when it came to the actual deed in some cases. Out of nowhere there would just be this guy shiving the everloving poo poo out his mark without regard for personal safety once the right opening presented itself. Their apparent contempt for their own well-being made them ludicrously successful (not to mention the demoralizing effect this kind of dramatic spectacle would have on their enemies) and the only way their contemporaries could explain that kind of self-sacrifice was through the use of drugs during the killing. e: VVV It was intense. You have to imagine it was like seeing the same friendly dude on your way home from work/school everyday in a public space who politely smiles and waves at you like he does with everyone else. Then one day you pause to tie your shoes and suddenly you've already been stabbed 60 times in 20 seconds and nobody can pull this snarling berserker off you because he simply doesn't give a gently caress what happens to him beyond this point. hard counter has a new favorite as of 03:14 on Jul 3, 2016 |
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Jul 3, 2016 02:32
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hard counter posted:It was a pretty common belief, it's actually how they got the name Hashishins (assassins) after all. The spooky thing about these guys was that there were limited ways of stealthily killing a dude back then - particularly those available to people of restricted means - so they just didn't give a gently caress when it came to the actual deed in some cases. Out of nowhere there would just be this guy shiving the everloving poo poo out his mark without regard for personal safety once the right opening presented itself. Their apparent contempt for their own well-being made them ludicrously successful (not to mention the demoralizing effect this kind of dramatic spectacle would have on their enemies) and the only way their contemporaries could explain that kind of self-sacrifice was through the use of drugs. Dang. I was reading this piece http://disinfo.com/2012/07/hasan-bin-sabbah-and-the-secret-order-of-hashishins/ and whoa. But you seem to have summed it up better. Asymmetrical as heck.
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Jul 3, 2016 02:38
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Sabbah was also extremely pious, and kept strict watch over the behavior of his followers with zero tolerance for anyone who broke the rules. Considering that he (allegedly) had his own son executed for consuming alcohol, it's pretty doubtful he would have tolerated hash use by any of his followers (let alone his most trusted fedayeen). E: syscall girl posted:I was reading this piece http://disinfo.com/2012/07/hasan-bin-sabbah-and-the-secret-order-of-hashishins/ and whoa. Reading that essay, it sounds like he got most of his info (especially the idea that Sabbah's core philosophy was the idea that "nothing is true; everything is permitted") from the 1938 fiction novel "Alamut": Wikipedia posted:Bartol first started to conceive the novel in the early 1930s, when he lived in Paris. In the French capital, he met with the Slovene literary critic Josip Vidmar, who introduced him to the story of Hassan-i Sabbah. A further stimulation for the novel came from the assassination of Alexander I of Yugoslavia perpetrated by Croatian and Bulgarian radical nationalists, on the alleged commission of the Italian Fascist government. When it was originally published, the novel was sarcastically dedicated to Benito Mussolini. I definitely recommend giving Alamut a read if you're interested in the assassins, it's a great story but bear in mind that it's more fiction than non and the reality wasn't quite as sexy as Bartol made it out to be in his novel. Also, if you played Assasin's Creed a lot of stuff in Alamut is gonna sound pretty familiar. If you want to read something less sensational and based more on the little bit of actual history that's available about the Nizari then I recommend The Secret Order of Assassins: The Struggle of the Early Nizari Ismai'lis Against the Islamic World by Marshall Hodgson. When it comes down to it, though, just about all of the information we have about Sabbah and the assassins comes from sources written by their enemies; none of Sabbah's writings (or writings by any of his contemporaries within the assassins) survived the fall of Alamut so a lot of our current information is based on (well) educated guesswork. the future is WOW has a new favorite as of 04:10 on Jul 3, 2016 |
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Jul 3, 2016 03:18
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The Mentalizer posted:Sabbah was also extremely pious, and kept strict watch over the behavior of his followers with zero tolerance for anyone who broke the rules. Considering that he (allegedly) had his own son executed for consuming alcohol, it's pretty doubtful he would have tolerated hash use by any of his followers (let alone his most trusted fedayeen). For perspective, the Islamic prohibition against alcohol (which is, nota bene, an Arabic loanword) wasn't really universally enforced. Omar Khayyam wasn't put to death for his poetic fondness for bread, verse and wine. Neither was Rumi (note well, "The Roman"). Hassan was a single-minded, studious, and utterly devoted person. I think he would have been absolutely horrified by the actions of his successors, because every step of his religious progression was dictated by his understanding of the correct succession from the Prophet. quote:Reading that essay, it sounds like he got most of his info (especially the idea that Sabbah's core philosophy was the idea that "nothing is true; everything is permitted") from the 1938 fiction novel "Alamut": quote:I definitely recommend giving Alamut a read if you're interested in the assassins, it's a great story but bear in mind that the reality wasn't quite as sexy as Bartol made it out to be in his novel. If you want to read something less sensational and based more on the actual history of the Nizari then I recommend The Secret Order of Assassins: The Struggle of the Early Nizari Ismai'lis Against the Islamic World by Marshall Hodgson.
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Jul 3, 2016 04:24
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John Big Booty posted:Supplementing that, The Crusades Through Arab Eyes. Oh yeah, I've heard good things about that one. I actually have it but haven't had a chance to read it yet, and I don't like recommending books I haven't read myself. John Big Booty posted:Not even that. He probably got it from William S. Burroughs. Fair enough, although I think it's a pretty safe bet that Burroughs got it from Alamut.
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Jul 3, 2016 05:35
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The Mentalizer posted:Oh yeah, I've heard good things about that one. I actually have it but haven't had a chance to read it yet, and I don't like recommending books I haven't read myself. quote:Fair enough, although I think it's a pretty safe bet that Burroughs got it from Alamut. History is one of the most disappointing sciences. Even when you cut through all the bullshit propaganda, it's still all the same sad poo poo.
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Jul 3, 2016 06:15
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It took Mississippi until 2013 to ratify the 13th amendment. This is the only state that has the Confederate flag on it's state flag so maybe this isn't surprising.
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