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alcharagia posted:So in Remember11, one of the main characters actually physically changes shape and looks completely different from how he's supposed to because you saw the dude design on the boxart and assumed that was him. wasn't that ever17, or does uchikoshi just go that well a lot
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Jul 2, 2016 16:04
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Cake Attack posted:wasn't that ever17, or does uchikoshi just go that well a lot No no, in Ever17 the appearance of one of the main characters was always different and you just couldn't see him from inside his face. In Remember11 there's actually a body-shift.
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Jul 2, 2016 16:05
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Paul Zuvella posted:Why else would they freeze Phi other than knowing she was patient zero for Radical 6 and thus already had the disease? I find it hard to believe Akane the timelord does not know this, seeing as she knew to gas Sigma before the Mars test site to set everything in motion. She might know that Phi needed to be frozen to preserve the timeline, but that might be it. Kind of like how the only reason Lotus was in 999 was because Akane foresaw she had to be there (and I guess to tell Junpei what prosopagnosia is).
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Jul 2, 2016 16:06
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alcharagia posted:No no, in Ever17 the appearance of one of the main characters was always different and you just couldn't see him from inside his face. In Remember11 there's actually a body-shift. man i don't remember anything about what happened in remember11
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Jul 2, 2016 16:07
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How do you like your coffee?
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Jul 2, 2016 16:09
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I was gonna explain more about Remember11 but then I realized that explaining that game's plot makes me feel high.
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Jul 2, 2016 16:12
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hi friends i just beat this great game. boy what a ride! im very sad eric didnt die a lot more onscreen but we can't always get what we want and i had a whale of a time regardless.
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Jul 2, 2016 16:17
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i mean it was also loving retarded but sometimes that's a plus, like my boy carlos Kool-Aid Manning through the wall to save all of reality. get 'em, carlos!!
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Jul 2, 2016 16:19
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Carlos is a Real American Hero.
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Jul 2, 2016 16:20
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I agree that the connection to VLR has problems, especially in regard to Akane. I guess some of it can be handwaved away by her being a Batman-level mastermind with a literal 45-year plan and keeping everyone else on a strictly need-to-know basis, but then that's a pretty unsatisfactory way of trying to explain that. Some threads from the end of VLR don't get a reasonable conclusion in this one, either, which is kind of disappointing (what happened to Kyle?).
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Jul 2, 2016 16:24
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Ok, I think I finished the game. I really liked it. Two questions though. 1. Is there an actually decision for killing Delta or is it supposed to be ambiguous? 2. Are there aftermath files for Diana, Phi and Sigma? It seems weird that everyone else gets them but them.
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Jul 2, 2016 16:36
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thinking about it, i think the thing that bugs me a lot is how little any of the characters seem to ever accomplish. with the exception of Carlos, real american hero, shifting like mad, it feels like everyone just kinda bumbles along aimlessly until the player has the right info and then delta spouts exposition and the game ends. this was especially bad in the case of sigma and phi, who were supposed to be infiltrating the experiment to stop radical 9, and proceed to basically do nothing all game except get born
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Jul 2, 2016 16:44
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Not much of spoilers, but basically this game contains a robot, a childish murderer who is the sole cause of about 90% of the events that led the people in this list to being who they are, an Ethereal voiced by Wesker, a childish idiot who I wish to throw at the dartboard, and 6 people from Freeza Planet 419, who consist of Yugioh Abridged's Bandit Keith, a man with 40 extra years of horniness attached at no extra cost, the female incarnation of David Xanatos, the biggest stalker of said female, the pacifist nurse meant to balance this crazy out... but only when she's sober, and a girl who's history is so confusingly strange even Hideo Kojima would give up on understanding it. When being the robot in the group makes you the most normal... drat son. 
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Jul 2, 2016 16:45
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I actually went into the game with the prediction/hope that the Dcom incident was actually Brother's plan to capture the body-hopping ? entity somehow. The way the game was laid up with clear requirements for extensive SHIFTing (random chances, memory erasing, alternate X-codes) seemed to confirm my theory at first. I figured ? was jumping between Diana, Carlos, and Sean, and that their memories of each other's experiences was proof of that. Then the explanation with Delta and MIND HACKING came in and that went out the window, but I was really hopeful for a while there. Still, it feels like there's yet another purpose to the game that Delta did not share with us, considering it already filled several purposes. I actually tried replaying the game and going straight to the true end as quickly as I could (spreading the votes, nobody pressing the button, putting in all Force Quit codes and then SHIFTing) with the hopes of unlocking a secret ending, but nope. I just can't drop this feeling that there's more. One scene, one file. Just a little more... But I guess I'll have to wait until the Q&A, and even then it'll probably raise more questions than it answers.
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Jul 2, 2016 16:45
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transporting alien technology is useless at the end, sean is op, and I can't believe the end game solution is "eh let's teleport to a time when we didn't get into this mess".
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Jul 2, 2016 16:53
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Tired Moritz posted:transporting alien technology is useless at the end, sean is op, and I can't believe the end game solution is "eh let's teleport to a time when we didn't get into this mess". But they learned the power of friendship!
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Jul 2, 2016 17:02
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am i supposed to believe mira was going to willingly turn herself in, or actually listen to eric
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Jul 2, 2016 17:02
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Did Sigma and Phi even jump once? They were the SHIFT masters in VLR but it was more Team C shifting this time.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:02
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I think making shifting blatantly visible took a lot out of it. In VLR, basically every time you selected another node on the flowchart, that was shifting in action. In ZTD, it seems it only actually takes place whenever the glowy balls show up and everything else is just ???.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:11
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Hahahaha Uchikoshi is an absolute madman. He really did it, leaving a sequel hook at the end of a game which almost never got made in the first place.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:13
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaggy_dog_story
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Jul 2, 2016 17:15
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voltcatfish posted:Did Sigma and Phi even jump once? They were the SHIFT masters in VLR but it was more Team C shifting this time. They SHIFTed in the D team execution scene. Phi even calls out to Sigma to do so.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:22
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korrandark posted:Ok, I think I finished the game. I really liked it. Two questions though. 1. Nope, Delta was the one making all of the decisions in the game via mind hacking, so you don't get one there because he promised he wouldn't use it on Carlos. 2. Nope! Probably will have to wait till the Q&A to learn what happens with them.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:22
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Personally I think the interpretation that "The player is actually Delta mindhacking everyone!" is dumb and wrong, if only for the fact that he's dead in a bunch of the timelines anyway. It's way more likely in my opinion that the decisions and the transfer of information between characters is ?/Blick Winkel's unstated role in the game.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:29
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Did Mira kill Akane's dad? Why were Eric and Mira even there?
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Jul 2, 2016 17:32
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fadam posted:Did Mira kill Akane's dad? No, Mira killed Eric's mother (probably). Akane's dad was somewhere nearby at the time and was arrested and convicted for the crime.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:33
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fadam posted:Did Mira kill Akane's dad? Akane's dad was executed in Jail for a crime he didn't commit. Mira killed Eric's mom, however.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:33
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Regy Rusty posted:Personally I think the interpretation that "The player is actually Delta mindhacking everyone!" is dumb and wrong, if only for the fact that he's dead in a bunch of the timelines anyway. The game pretty much flat out states that's the case for some of it though. Hitting the button as Carlos, or Diana for example. Both of them swear they didn't do it, and it pretty much implies Delta was behind it. Now that I actually think about it though, yeah I suppose saying that Delta did all of the decisions doesn't make sense.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:34
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Ibram Gaunt posted:The game pretty much flat out states that's the case for some of it though. Hitting the button as Carlos, or Diana for example. Both of them swear they didn't do it, and it pretty much implies Delta was behind it. They did it because the player forced them to do it in order to get all the information you need to complete the game. Those specific decisions are actually what I consider to be ?'s biggest influence on the game, not Delta's.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:36
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I wonder what Carlos whole role was in the whole VLR timeline? Akane didn't erase his memories so he must have been involved in the AB project right? And also yeah I don't know why people are freaking out about "?" not coming up, like they are us the player, the whole Akane saying "that you will have major role" is saying to us "yo buy and play this game when it comes out pls". That's it.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:37
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IceBorg posted:I wonder what Carlos whole role was in the whole VLR timeline? Akane didn't erase his memories so he must have been involved in the AB project right? Well the reason is that at the time it seemed like a very clear nod to Ever17 and seemed like it was Uchikoshi saying that he was going to use the plot device of Blick Winkel in a very big way in the next game. In actuality it seems like that's not what he was saying, but I think there's still evidence that the influence of a fourth dimentional entity (?/BW/the player) is there in ZTD. Mind Hacking certainly confuses the issue but I think it's way less powerful and all present than people seem to think. I don't think Delta controlling literally everything is what the game was going for.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:40
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Though the part of VLR's epilogue that I think really bothers people is that Akane was very explicit in saying that Kyle had jumped back as well because Sigma wouldn't leave him behind. We had no idea what the mechanism of that would be and it was not brought up in the slightest in ZTD. That I have no explanation for other than it was dropped/forgotten.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:42
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In a timeline we didn't get to see, baby Delta suddenly opens his eyes and exclaims "Father! I have come to aid you!" Surprised, Sigma drops the baby, killing it.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:46
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The Q&A will reveal that Kyle actually jumped back and helped them hack the D-com database to get them there in the first place, well. there you go.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:46
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the Q&A will reveal that kyle is gab
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Jul 2, 2016 17:47
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Terper posted:In a timeline we didn't get to see, baby Delta suddenly opens his eyes and exclaims "Father! I have come to aid you!" Surprised, Sigma drops the baby, killing it. Perfect Poonerman posted:the Q&A will reveal that kyle is gab This was literally my theory for much of the game
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Jul 2, 2016 17:47
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Uchikoshi also said Dio would be ZTD (although "not as we know him") but I guess that went nowhere either. That kind of makes it sound like maybe Delta was supposed to be Left or something at some point?Regy Rusty posted:This was literally my theory for much of the game I'd like to think Delta shot Gab for the express purpose of enabling him to Shift to the CQD-END:2 timeline.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:49
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I'm unsure why people think Delta was making every choice, but there's no way he's not responsible for the "No it wasn't me! I swear!" choices.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:53
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where was it stated that the person Mira killed was Eric's mom? Also I still don't understand Sean's ability to shift. He's a robot?
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Jul 2, 2016 17:54
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Tired Moritz posted:where was it stated that the person Mira killed was Eric's mom? Quantum computer antics.
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Jul 2, 2016 17:54
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