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Yeah, but the average racist would use that as an excuse to be extra punitive, instead of just infantilizing the offender, no?
Somebody fucked around with this message at 20:16 on Sep 9, 2022 |
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Jul 6, 2016 03:44
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flakeloaf posted:Hello, have you heard the shameful news? Every time I hit refresh.
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Jul 6, 2016 03:45
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Helsing posted:"Young Conservative" Young, dumb, and full of compassionate conservatism
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Jul 6, 2016 04:06
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Ikantski posted:I think that's what these queen's students were doing. Also I'm sad that I missed both name-chat and racism-chat, because today I found out that one of my patients named her kid Aryan.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:14
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Helsing posted:This idiotic (and, in a weird and self deprecating way, extremely arrogant). Also, "white", "European" and "Eurasian" are really different things. I guess I shouldn't be so vague around certain people when using the term "white" and referencing European and Eurasian. It's not like as if once you eastwardly cross the Bosphorus or go south of Naples that everybody becomes "brown" or "yellow". The majority of immigration into North America and Australia was based around the loose term of "white" which in itself was based on loose definitions of how fair-skinned someone is and whether or not they were Catholic and other stupid things like that--the Irish were not "white" until Kennedy was President. But please. Tell us how "European" and "Eurasian" are two different things because I am sure you can enlighten us all. 
Lain Iwakura fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Jul 6, 2016 |
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Jul 6, 2016 04:18
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LOL at all these self-flagellating white people. If it really bothers you so much, find a black dominatrix to whip you or something, so you don't have to take our your weird neuroses on the rest of us.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:29
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Do any of you absolute loving lunatics actually think convicting an aboriginal woman of a hate crime against a white person would end in anything other than a complete shitstorm as emboldened racist assholes and justifiably really loving angry aboriginal Canadians square off amidst the blasted ruins of the public's faith in the administration of justice
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Jul 6, 2016 04:31
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^^^ You really did come by that avatar honesty, didn't you, you loving muppet? Like I said earlier, it's clearly a crime motivated by animosity toward an identifiable group -- the offender said as much. How can you argue it's not a hate crime? If a white person walked up to a black person and said "I hate niggers" right before punching them, there'd be no equivocation as to whether hate motivated the crime in any way. If someone assaulted someone outside a gay bar while yelling "I hate faggots" it would very rightly be considered a hate crime -- because it very obviously is one. Now, we do need to account for the fact that the offender in this case comes from a disadvantaged background and likely does have some very legitimate grievances with white people -- it sure is a good thing that sentencing guidelines already take into account an offender's First Nations heritage, in that case*! * Even if, as demonstrated by previous decisions, their heritage is mostly immaterial to the case at hand. I don't give a fat gently caress if some First Nations people would be outraged by a hate crimes conviction in this case. They should pick a worthier case to be outraged about than some belligerent First Nations woman punching a white person for no reason right after saying "I hate white people" -- god knows there are so many options to choose from. PT6A fucked around with this message at 04:46 on Jul 6, 2016 |
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Jul 6, 2016 04:38
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OSI bean dip posted:But please. Tell us how "European" and "Eurasian" are two different things because I am sure you can enlighten us all. Mongolians are Eurasian, but they certainly aren't European or white. And they haven't been responsible for any global suffering for at least several hundred years.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:46
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hot take: I think that, perhaps, saying 'white people' is not as bad as 'human being' or 'friend of the family', but then what do I know
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Jul 6, 2016 04:46
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I, a middle-class white person, am deeply outraged that the administration of justice has, for once, attempted to take massive structural and institutional inequality into account when passing judgment. Perhaps the courts are the real racists here,
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Jul 6, 2016 04:48
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JawKnee posted:hot take: I think that, perhaps, saying 'white people' is not as bad as 'human being' or 'friend of the family', but then what do I know Okay then, consider if a white/straight assailant said "I hate gay people" or "I hate black people" immediately before assaulting a member of either group. Should that meaningfully change how the incident should be responded to? I would say not.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:48
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OSI bean dip posted:White people tend to forget that the vast majority of problems today exist because of their European heritage. Almost all of the world's current strife is the result of Eurasian dominance since the dawn of civilization. [invocation of Poe's Law]
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Jul 6, 2016 04:48
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Angry Diplomat posted:I, a middle-class white person, am deeply outraged that the administration of justice has, for once, attempted to take massive structural and institutional inequality into account when passing judgment. Perhaps the courts are the real racists here, Perhaps the courts could take into account both the fact that it was a crime motivated by racial bias, and also take the structural and institutional inequality into account, as I already suggested on multiple occasions they should have. The fact that it was a hate crime should mean the sentence is more severe, and the fact that the offender is from a group that experiences structural and institutional inequality should make it less severe. The court can and should consider both of these factors at the same time.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:50
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PT6A posted:Okay then, consider if a white/straight assailant said "I hate gay people" or "I hate black people" immediately before assaulting a member of either group. Should that meaningfully change how the incident should be responded to? I would say not. Hi, hello, as a member of the queer community I am politely requesting that you refrain from using us, any of us, as examples in this incredibly bad and obtuse argument you are making. Thank you for your time. e: lol you legitimately do not grasp the purpose of hate crime laws
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Jul 6, 2016 04:51
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PT6A posted:Okay then, consider if a white/straight assailant said "I hate gay people" or "I hate black people" immediately before assaulting a member of either group. Should that meaningfully change how the incident should be responded to? I would say not. I would say that they should be charged with assault. Let's put it another way, should they be charged with anything, after being caught saying 'I hate <X group' if they do nothing after this?
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Jul 6, 2016 04:51
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Angry Diplomat posted:Hi, hello, as a member of the queer community I am politely requesting that you refrain from using us, any of us, as examples in this incredibly bad and obtuse argument you are making. Thank you for your time. Are you saying that queer people should not be protected by hate crime laws? What point are you trying to make?
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Jul 6, 2016 04:51
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Whiskey Sours posted:Mongolians are Eurasian, but they certainly aren't European or white. And they haven't been responsible for any global suffering for at least several hundred years. We're quick to reference Mongolians here but what about the Japanese and their subjection of Korea in the early 20th Century and the Nanjing Massacre in World War II? Japan coming out of its isolation and entering the Meiji era definitely didn't bode well for east Asia and its interests in the south-east did not make for much peace. It leaving the League of Nations was very much the precursor for World War II. Try again.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:51
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JawKnee posted:I would say that they should be charged with assault. Let's put it another way, should they be charged with anything, after being caught saying 'I hate <X group' if they do nothing after this? No, absolutely not. I think hate speech laws are awful, as are any laws which abridge the freedom of speech, but that's a completely different thing from an actual crime being committed due to prejudice against a specific group.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:53
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PT6A posted:^^^ You really did come by that avatar honesty, didn't you, you loving muppet? Is it a hate crime? Maybe. Will its classification as a hate crime have any impact on the status of white people in Canada? No.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:53
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If CI yelled "I hate white people" and punched PT6A in the face I think I would be okay with sticking to assault over hate crimes.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:53
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Angry Diplomat posted:I, a middle-class white person, am deeply outraged that the administration of justice has, for once, attempted to take massive structural and institutional inequality into account when passing judgment. Perhaps the courts are the real racists here, Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms posted:Every individual is equal before and under the law and has the right to the equal protection and equal benefit of the law without discrimination and, in particular, without discrimination based on race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, sex, age or mental or physical disability. The courts are actually bound by the constitution, over your objections.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:56
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OSI bean dip posted:We're quick to reference Mongolians here but what about the Japanese and their subjection of Korea in the early 20th Century and the Nanjing Massacre in World War II? Japan coming out of its isolation and entering the Meiji era definitely didn't bode well for east Asia and its interests in the south-east did not make for much peace. It leaving the League of Nations was very much the precursor for World War II. Yes, Japan is a bad country, one of the worst in Asia. Please explain how that makes Eurasians the same as Europeans.
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Jul 6, 2016 04:57
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Whiskey Sours posted:Is it a hate crime? Maybe. Will its classification as a hate crime have any impact on the status of white people in Canada? No. Who's to say? What's the loving point of having laws against racially motivated crimes if we don't apply them in the instance of a racially motivated crime?
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Jul 6, 2016 04:59
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Whiskey Sours posted:Yes, Japan is a bad country, one of the worst in Asia. Please explain how that makes Eurasians the same as Europeans. Explain to me what the delimiter is between European and "white". Eurasia is a large concept and trying to throw in Mongolians in some half-witted attempt to throw me off is pretty disappointing on your part. Do I refer to people who are white in say Lebanon as "European" or "Asian" or "Eurasian"? The fact that you default to Mongolian, Sino, Korean, or Japanese as a description instead of Lebanese, Jordanian, Iraqi, Afghani, et cetera tells me that you have no clue about what "white" or "Eurasian" means.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:00
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tagesschau posted:The courts are actually bound by the constitution, over your objections. That particular passage seems to mean discrimination in treatment by the government, unless I'm misreading it? PT6A posted:No, absolutely not. I think hate speech laws are awful, as are any laws which abridge the freedom of speech, but that's a completely different thing from an actual crime being committed due to prejudice against a specific group. I guess that's a consistent position to take; personally I think hate-speech laws are great, but I think the bar to judging speech as hate-speech needs to be high, and merely saying 'I hate white people' is not enough. Maybe, maybe it would be if there were some obvious slanderous term going on there - but there isn't. In any case, I don't think this is a hate crime - it certainly involved a crime (assault), but again, I don't think the bar has been cleared based on what was said.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:01
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tagesschau posted:The courts are actually bound by the constitution, over your objections. Not quite equal actually, we got all pissed off about it a few months ago. http://www.durhamregion.com/news-st...e-judge-failed/ quote:http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/judges-must-weigh-cultural-factors-in-native-sentencing-court-rules/article535585/
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Jul 6, 2016 05:01
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PT6A posted:No, absolutely not. I think hate speech laws are awful, as are any laws which abridge the freedom of speech, but that's a completely different thing from an actual crime being committed due to prejudice against a specific group. I knew this would be the exact poo poo you would go off on. You loving predictable gently caress.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:01
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lmao rodeo shithead just called someone a 'loving muppet' stop watching coronation st idiot
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Jul 6, 2016 05:03
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PT6A posted:Who's to say? What's the loving point of having laws against racially motivated crimes if we don't apply them in the instance of a racially motivated crime? 15(2) of the Charter, or at least the spirit of it. OSI bean dip posted:Explain to me what the delimiter is between European and "white". Eurasia is a large concept and trying to throw in Mongolians in some half-witted attempt to throw me off is pretty disappointing on your part. Do I refer to people who are white in say Lebanon as "European" or "Asian" or "Eurasian"? The fact that you default to Mongolian, Sino, Korean, or Japanese as a description instead of Lebanese, Jordanian, Iraqi, Afghani, et cetera tells me that you have no clue about what "white" or "Eurasian" means. White is an arbitrary social construct based on some combination of light skin tone and heritage from certain parts of northern Europe. European, Asian and Eurasian are based on geography. Someone from Lebanon is not European, unless they were born in Europe and emigrated to Lebanon. They would be Asian and Eurasian, because Lebanon is part of Asia and Eurasia. edit: OSI bean dip posted:But please. Tell us how "European" and "Eurasian" are two different things because I am sure you can enlighten us all. All Europeans are Eurasians, but not all Eurasians are Europeans. Eurasians are from Europe or Asia, while Europeans are only from the Western portion of Eurasia, which is called Europe, and is separated from Asia by the Ural Mountains, the Caucasus and the Turkish straits. Whiskey Sours fucked around with this message at 05:14 on Jul 6, 2016 |
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Jul 6, 2016 05:09
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apatheticman posted:I knew this would be the exact poo poo you would go off on. Would you care to actually disagree with it, or is your apparent objection to my post based purely on its predictability?
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Jul 6, 2016 05:10
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Whiskey Sours posted:15(2) of the Charter, or at least the spirit of it. What in the Criminal Code carves out such an exception (that would be permitted under 15(2))? The trial court doesn't have the power to create legislation out of whole cloth.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:13
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Whiskey Sours posted:15(2) of the Charter, or at least the spirit of it. Like I said, I have no problem with the offender being given a lenient sentence in consideration of her background. I have a problem with it not being called a hate crime when it clearly is one. It should be recognized as such, but the sentence should be less severe than it would be for a white offender assaulting a First Nations person (for example), in consideration of the offender's background.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:13
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Helsing posted:This idiotic (and, in a weird and self deprecating way, extremely arrogant). Also, "white", "European" and "Eurasian" are really different things. "It's all our fault and only our fault!" is reverse Burden.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:13
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namaste faggots posted:stop watching coronation st idiot What the gently caress is coronation st? Is that some sort of retarded trash they put on TV in Vancouver?
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Jul 6, 2016 05:16
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Whiskey Sours posted:White is an arbitrary social construct based on some combination of light skin tone and heritage from certain parts of northern Europe. Partially correct. "White" was really you passed with the correct skin colour and were of the appropriate religious faith or observed something that nobody cared about. Someone in the Middle East could pass for "white" just as much as someone in Brittany. quote:European, Asian and Eurasian are based on geography. Someone from Lebanon is not European, unless they were born in Europe and emigrated to Lebanon. They would be Asian and Eurasian, because Lebanon is part of Asia and Eurasia. What part of "Eurasian" dominance are you overlooking then? Much of human history owes its successes to the early dominance of the fertile crescent (which is not European) and only the latter half of the second millennium CE did Europe show up to the game with any level of adequate force. If Japan hadn't entered into its period of isolationism for several centuries where all it did with the outside world was think that the Dutch were the poo poo and if China's leadership didn't prevent its near-industrialization in the 14th Century, what we have today would be radically different but it would have still been Eurasian dominance. The Sinosphere was only prevented growing further because of a lack of competition in China; unlike Europe where everyone was competing amongst themselves. So yeah. Please tell me more about how Mongolians were the only people to commit atrocities in Eurasia and how Europe were really the only dominators.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:17
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OSI bean dip posted:What part of "Eurasian" dominance are you overlooking then? Much of human history owes its successes to the early dominance of the fertile crescent (which is not European) and only the latter half of the second millennium CE did Europe show up to the game with any level of adequate force. If Japan hadn't entered into its period of isolationism for several centuries where all it did with the outside world was think that the Dutch were the poo poo and if China's leadership didn't prevent its near-industrialization in the 14th Century, what we have today would be radically different but it would have still been Eurasian dominance. The Sinosphere was only prevented growing further because of a lack of competition in China; unlike Europe where everyone was competing amongst themselves. This is so divorced from any semblance of a point that I question why you took the time to even type it out.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:19
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PT6A posted:This is so divorced from any semblance of a point that I question why you took the time to even type it out. Said PT6A, renowned anti-intellectual misanthrope, whilst arguing that laws intended in part to curb violence against the marginalized should instead be used to justify incarcerating them for longer because they don't like white people.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:24
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tagesschau posted:What in the Criminal Code carves out such an exception (that would be permitted under 15(2))? The trial court doesn't have the power to create legislation out of whole cloth. PT6A posted:Like I said, I have no problem with the offender being given a lenient sentence in consideration of her background. I have a problem with it not being called a hate crime when it clearly is one. It should be recognized as such, but the sentence should be less severe than it would be for a white offender assaulting a First Nations person (for example), in consideration of the offender's background. It's less that there's a legal argument against it, and more that I don't think it's something worth caring about. If white men ever lose their status at the top of society, I promise I'll be the first to start complaining. I'm perfectly okay with allowing a few hate crimes committed by victimized minorities to go half-punished in order to keep our appeals courts from being clogged up.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:27
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Angry Diplomat posted:Said PT6A, renowned anti-intellectual misanthrope, whilst arguing that laws intended in part to curb violence against the marginalized should instead be used to justify incarcerating them for longer because they don't like white people. Not true, I already said so-called "hate speech" is acceptable, so don't try to confuse the issue. I have no problem with people hating white people, even expressing their hatred toward white people; it makes a lot of sense. I have a problem when it motivates them to commit crimes against random white people, and I think it's an issue that needs to be addressed.
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Jul 6, 2016 05:27
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