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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:I don't know how people are having trouble with the greenskin campaign or their troops, they were by far the easiest campaign for me even with a lovely azhag start, might just suit my playstyle of constant conquest and war, maybe there are people who play them and turtle up and never get a waaargh together? Did you play on VH/VH, VH/H or what? In harder difficulties they do feel a little soft but that can be mitigated by tactics
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Jul 6, 2016 19:13
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| # ? May 22, 2024 08:39 |
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I think most of the problem with the dwarfs is that the game offers shiny prices for expansion north (Gunbad, Ungrim) while your main enemy is to the south. In the end you have a million fronts and a terrible logistic situation with the mountains splitting your realm.
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Jul 6, 2016 20:33
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genericnick posted:I think most of the problem with the dwarfs is that the game offers shiny prices for expansion north (Gunbad, Ungrim) while your main enemy is to the south. In the end you have a million fronts and a terrible logistic situation with the mountains splitting your realm. The Dwarf game would be at least twice as easy if you could easily reach the northern mountain area from your starting section. As it stands, it takes like 6 turns to get there even via tunneling, which is effectively 0 contact. You end up basically having two separate empires
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Jul 6, 2016 20:49
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The Dwarfs settled by the Vampire Counts are always dead to me. Just blot out the Bloody Spearz, maintain the someone peaceful-ish relationship with the Vampire Counts, and prep for the Grimgor shitstorm coming from down south. So much can happen in the meantime though. Just hold off on confederating those dawi. It makes people hate your guts, one of which (VC) is waiting on an excuse to wage war on you. They're spiteful like that.
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Jul 6, 2016 20:49
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Does anyone have some advice for late game Orc army composition? I finally conquered the whole badlands and silver road by turn 85 and am in the process of moving Orcs north to save the world from Chaos who are starting to get a little out of control. Everyone is making a pit stop to recruit new units and so far my 2 fully upgraded stacks look roughly like this: 8 black orcs 3-4 big uns 2 fanatic archers 2 giant spiders 2 giants 1 unit of trolls 1-2 doom divers Will these do ok against late game Chaos stuff? I probably have enough income now to get another 2 or 3 stacks too.
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Jul 6, 2016 21:10
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The catapult does more damage against most of Chaos' units. Doom diver has poo poo for AP.
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Jul 6, 2016 21:20
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genericnick posted:I think most of the problem with the dwarfs is that the game offers shiny prices for expansion north (Gunbad, Ungrim) while your main enemy is to the south. In the end you have a million fronts and a terrible logistic situation with the mountains splitting your realm. His starting units are garbage, but picking Ungrim is amazing considering you can pick up Thorgrim after clearing 8 grudges out of your grudge book, which is a relatively easy task.
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Jul 6, 2016 21:47
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Brasseye posted:Does anyone have some advice for late game Orc army composition? I finally conquered the whole badlands and silver road by turn 85 and am in the process of moving Orcs north to save the world from Chaos who are starting to get a little out of control. Everyone is making a pit stop to recruit new units and so far my 2 fully upgraded stacks look roughly like this: I think it's a bit overkill on the huge monsters (I usually just have 1 giant and 1 giant spider), but if you have the money it sure can't hurt. I also like having more artillery since the catapults get really good with some of the later tech advancements and have higher AP than the doom divers. 3-4 artillery pieces can do a lot of damage to the chaos armies that are pretty much forced to approach you. I also think it's a bit of overkill on the line infantry, but if that's what you like it should work. I'd probably replace the fanatics with forest goblin spider rider archers and maybe replace some of your infantry with a unit or two of boar boyz (I like savage orc big 'uns myself). Also try to squeeze a shaman hero into the mix. They have some really amazing buffs and debuffs that can really help turn the tide of a fight (particularly the AP related ones against chosen and chaos warriors).
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Jul 6, 2016 21:51
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Reik posted:His starting units are garbage, but picking Ungrim is amazing considering you can pick up Thorgrim after clearing 8 grudges out of your grudge book, which is a relatively easy task. Who cares? You get lovely campaign bonuses and have a worse starting army.
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Jul 6, 2016 22:43
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Ungrim is cooler than Thorgrim. Thats why i roll with and ignore the inconsequential campaign buffs and abuse the power of fast dwarves.
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Jul 6, 2016 22:56
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DeathSandwich posted:Having now played all the factions, the one that I feel gets into the most hopeless stalemate slog is the Dwarves. To start I pushed into Gunbad as suggested and began bribing Kazak Kadrin for confederation. The southern border with the greenskins is quiet and I take out the Bloody Spears pretty early to keep them off of me. Pretty much immediately after confederating Kadrin I get declared on by the Vampire Counts and they start raiding me. I send Thorgrim and another stack up to deal with vampires when the border princes declare on the dwarf faction west of my start and my defensive ally, so I make a new army lead by Ungrim to go help with that. For me, grabbing Barak Varr (your 'defensive ally') early was very helpful. Gives you a port and the ability to trade with many many more factions. After getting Gunbad I ignored the north and fought greenskins to the south tooth and nail for 20-30 turns, after which I was able to confederate Barak Varr thanks to my greenskin slaughter. Only after that did I move further north than Gunbad. No point opening up fronts you can't defend without good reason, and most good reasons have to do with money.
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Jul 6, 2016 22:58
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Rygar201 posted:Who cares? You get lovely campaign bonuses and have a worse starting army. Ungrim is a monster on the battlefield, and being a slayer he never breaks so you can squeak out some close victories early on. By the time I'm pushing north and unlocking Ungrim I'm already in the cleanup phase of the campaign. Reik fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Jul 6, 2016 |
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Jul 6, 2016 23:15
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Gejnor posted:Orcs have, without a doubt, the worst line infantry ingame. No mid or late game shield units which makes them melt to normal arrow type ranged. Their ever so 'amazing' black orcs can and will lose out to dwarf warriors, a tier 1 unit, if you don't keep an eye on them 24/7 (had a fight where rank 4 black orcs got murdered by rank 1 dwarf warriors, what the gently caress game?). Their shock cav, the boars, are just straight up weaker than other races cav and are more or less useless in comparison. Trolls flee at the drop of a hat and are terrible overall because of it. The only way to win vs Dwarfs is to have loads of monsterous units like Arachnarock Spiders (which is a legit good unit, one of the few greenskins have) or have a clear and decisive 2 to 1 ratio in numbers, and even then its not guaranteed if those dwarf units are of a higher tier. The only thing holding a greenskin playthrough up is Grimgor Ironhide, and gently caress you if you pick Azhag because then you're in for tortureplay, making Chaos seem like a goddamned pickle. 
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Jul 6, 2016 23:31
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I'm starting Dwarves as Ungrim, and he's pretty awesome? The fast slayers means I properly annihilate enemies after victorious fights, which means I don't have to fight them again. It's actually pretty huge. My slayers are getting something like 150 kills per battle and that's a hundred odd enemies that I no longer have to fight the next time. A strategy I am trying with Dwarves (hard difficulty) right now: after you complete the initial set, immediately GO SOUTH, through the mountains, and nab that Bloody Spears province there. Why? Because this denies Gromnir one battle. Without enough battles, he can't form a Waaagh, which means he wanders up to your provinces with 10 units instead of 40. You can drive Gromnir on to his back foot very effectively from the start.
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Jul 7, 2016 00:40
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Interesting to see people decry the orcs as weak in singleplayer, online they are a top faction. Of course online there are no buffs to enemy unit stats like the AI gets on higher difficulties.
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Jul 7, 2016 00:56
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I'm playing Orcs as my first game on Hard difficulty and every single battle my army routs, even with an invincible Grimgor in the center with leadership buffs. It's getting really annoying to take on the Norsca/Chaos factions and have big uns and black orcs fold so quickly.
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Jul 7, 2016 01:01
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If Black Orks under the command of an experienced general are routing in short order on Hard difficulty then I'm sorry to say the problem is with your play somehow.
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Jul 7, 2016 01:05
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Ammanas posted:Did you play on VH/VH, VH/H or what? In harder difficulties they do feel a little soft but that can be mitigated by tactics I've always played total war games on VH/VH because the AI always needs all the help it can get.
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Jul 7, 2016 01:14
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I think the Greenskin campaign is one of the easier ones if anything, but then, I've been playing naked barbarian factions in TW games since Rome 1 so they're pretty much right up my alley.
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Jul 7, 2016 01:18
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Chomp8645 posted:If Black Orks under the command of an experienced general are routing in short order on Hard difficulty then I'm sorry to say the problem is with your play somehow. Well usually it works like this. Infantry line advances, with support guys behind. They get hit by hellcannons which softens them up, but the two lines meet, 20 seconds later the trolls are first to rout, then the Big uns, then the Black orks and Grimgor are just like "Uhh?" while a loving chariot runs figure eights through the line. Add in charging horseman fuckery and the line breaks. Giants and Spiders are fantastic though.
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Jul 7, 2016 01:21
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Rand alPaul posted:Well usually it works like this. Infantry line advances, with support guys behind. They get hit by hellcannons which softens them up, but the two lines meet, 20 seconds later the trolls are first to rout, then the Big uns, then the Black orks and Grimgor are just like "Uhh?" while a loving chariot runs figure eights through the line. Why are you just taking that hellcannon bombardment? Where's your own artillery? Do you not bring any cavalry at all? Hellcannon are powerful armour piercing artillery that apply a leadership debuff. You really do not want to let them just pound on your elite infantry. Fangz fucked around with this message at 02:54 on Jul 7, 2016 |
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Jul 7, 2016 02:50
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Do Black Orcs have a leadership Aura? Or are Orcs just limited to Grimgor or Warboss for aura fields?
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Jul 7, 2016 02:59
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Fangz posted:Why are you just taking that hellcannon bombardment? Where's your own artillery? Do you not bring any cavalry at all? They're advancing across the map, the AI (like in almost every TW game) usually will kill more of your units than your artillery will of theirs. I have Doom Drivers that I shoot at the Helcannons and they don't usually kill them fast enough. In this battle I had 2 boar big uns that didn't really do poo poo except fight off a marauder charge against said Doom Drivers. Arcsquad12 posted:Do Black Orcs have a leadership Aura? Or are Orcs just limited to Grimgor or Warboss for aura fields? Just limited to the Bosses I think. I just got done playing as Dwarves so I'm really missing their fight-to-the-last-man infantry.
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Jul 7, 2016 03:00
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What do I do with Waaaaaagh!s? Their turn comes after mine, so they're never in position to help in a battle. Do I just use them to skew autoresolves in siege battles?
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Jul 7, 2016 03:25
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Rand alPaul posted:They're advancing across the map, the AI (like in almost every TW game) usually will kill more of your units than your artillery will of theirs. I have Doom Drivers that I shoot at the Helcannons and they don't usually kill them fast enough. In this battle I had 2 boar big uns that didn't really do poo poo except fight off a marauder charge against said Doom Drivers. Playing as orcs and you only have 2 units of cav? Orc Boar Boy Big'uns are far and away the most useful cavalry anywhere near that kind of price. Its heavy armor, has a shield, armor piercing damage, anti-large, and has a huge charge bonus. If they came unmounted in unit sizes of 60+ they would be exactly the kind of strong line infantry people have been complaining about orcs not having earlier in this thread. They are amazing counter cavalry because of their huge damage vs enemy armored cavalry and the morale shock of a full rear charge from these guys is comparable to Reiksguard-tier cavalry. Their only weakness is low morale and relatively lovely combat stats when they aren't charging, but they are so cheap it almost doesnt matter because you can bring 4 boar boy big uns for every 2 units of heavy cav your enemy can field. Use half your boar boys to deal with enemy cavalry, either by tying them up long enough for AP infantry to surround them or by getting your melee line charged and then hitting them in the back with the boars And then use the other half to disable the enemy artillery and harry their missile infantry
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Jul 7, 2016 03:27
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KillerQueen posted:What do I do with Waaaaaagh!s? Their turn comes after mine, so they're never in position to help in a battle. Do I just use them to skew autoresolves in siege battles? Designate the enemy army you want to destroy as the Waaaagh's target and then just move next to it and end turn.
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Jul 7, 2016 03:28
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Chomp8645 posted:Designate the enemy army you want to destroy as the Waaaagh's target and then just move next to it and end turn. Wouldn't the target just move away?
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Jul 7, 2016 03:41
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KillerQueen posted:Wouldn't the target just move away? No because the waaagh moves right after you so it'll initiate the battle before the enemy can move away.
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Jul 7, 2016 03:45
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420 Gank Mid posted:Playing as orcs and you only have 2 units of cav? Orc Boar Boy Big'uns are far and away the most useful cavalry anywhere near that kind of price. Its heavy armor, has a shield, armor piercing damage, anti-large, and has a huge charge bonus. Alright I'll try again with more cav. I have been using more the spider cav for flanking and poison debuff.
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Jul 7, 2016 03:56
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Rand alPaul posted:Alright I'll try again with more cav. I have been using more the spider cav for flanking and poison debuff. Greenskins are really hurting for armor piercing damage early. Dwarf infantry have a floor somewhere around 60-80 armor (bar slayers) and plenty are in triple digits, half of them hold shields to boot. Goblin archers (even the higher tier ones) do a grand total of ~1 armor piercing damage and orc arrer boyz aren't much better. On harder difficulties AI dwarfs will fight to the last man every time so your archers (especially mounted archers) will run out of ammunition before making a significant dent in their numbers and then be unable to shock the dwarves into routing. Boar Boyz will at least be able to chop them up a bit and has enough mass to knock down those dwarf axe lords that are so nearly invincible early on
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Jul 7, 2016 04:11
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I keep seeing a lot of Greenskin armies with lots of archers and no cav against Dwarfs, which is a fight you will definitely lose since archers have lovely AP and dwarf infantry is amazing. You have to bring a waaagh army and lots of boar boys, your cav and superior numbers are your only advantages against them.
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Jul 7, 2016 04:25
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Are people just not using the mobility of the greenskins, I wonder? Your boyz will lose in a 1-1 fight against dwarf warriors, but your units are faster. If you're using a melee army. Use goblins to tarpit/distract enemy quarrelers, flank with your boyz. If your going ranged. Use goblins to tarpit the dwarfs, then use Orc arrer boys to shoot at any blobs that form. Often, your goblins are short enough to let you fire over their heads straight into the melee. I used this to beat the top knotz using 70% goblin armies.
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Jul 7, 2016 04:42
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rock lobbas all the way
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Jul 7, 2016 05:37
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Use chariots to disrupt dwarf lines too, it breaks their charge defence bonus
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Jul 7, 2016 05:59
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Because I'm a terrible nerd, I've gone through the effort of trying to figure out the next batch of free DLC. After the new lore and hero, we're going to get a legendary lord from the vampire counts, going off the schedule posted by CA. Currently, the vampires are missing one of the lores they have access to, the lore of shadow. I think they're going to release the lore of shadow, with the accompanying empire mage, and then the vampire legendary lord will also use the lore.
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Jul 7, 2016 06:12
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I'm personally hoping for a Strigoi ghoul-king that's just a horrifying melee monster. Like a grimgor that regens.
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Jul 7, 2016 06:30
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Grognan posted:rock lobbas all the way This. Rock lobbas are invaluable against dwarves since they are high damage, armor piercing, and come out early in the campaign. Dwarves tend to clump in tight formations and are slow so you get a couple of free volleys while waiting for them to waddle up to your lines.
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Jul 7, 2016 06:30
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unwantedplatypus posted:Are people just not using the mobility of the greenskins, I wonder? Your boyz will lose in a 1-1 fight against dwarf warriors, but your units are faster. If you're using a melee army. Use goblins to tarpit/distract enemy quarrelers, flank with your boyz. If your going ranged. Use goblins to tarpit the dwarfs, then use Orc arrer boys to shoot at any blobs that form. Often, your goblins are short enough to let you fire over their heads straight into the melee. I used this to beat the top knotz using 70% goblin armies. Yeah, pretty much this. My first campaign was the Dwarfs, and then when I got to Orcs I became very happy since I didn't know how much I had missed having cavalry. I am guessing that people who have problems with Orcs go a little too heavy on the infantry while neglecting things like wolf riders, boar boyz, gobbos and stone throwers. The traditional way of playing Orcs is to use gobbos as chaff and then hit them hard with the boys. Especially wolf riders and wolf rider archers were invaluable in the early game for killing arty, archers and hunting down fleeing troops.
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Jul 7, 2016 06:40
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KillerQueen posted:I'm personally hoping for a Strigoi ghoul-king that's just a horrifying melee monster. Like a grimgor that regens. Close. I'm guessing it'll be Konrad.
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Jul 7, 2016 07:09
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I'm hoping they just say screw it and put Vlad in. He's just as dead as Konrad.
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Jul 7, 2016 07:32
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