Warhammer Code 30k: Hope Is The First Step On The Road To Disappointment

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Hencoe: Sep 4, 2012; MY LIFE GOAL IS TO STICK A FLESHLIGHT INTO THE END OF A HOWITZER AND FUCK THE SHIT OUT OF IT

yeah but the new vet tactics sound pretty pro, marksman heavy bolter vets in a rhino every time.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:06

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# ? May 17, 2024 02:56

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

Vets getting a discount? Nice buff, but that makes them even more attractive compared to tacticals.

BULBASAUR posted:

FW please hire me, TIA

Hummmmmmmmmm. Only 50% right on this one.

25 points isn't enough without something else too, imo, like invuln re-rolls to template weapons

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:15

adamantium|wang: Sep 14, 2003; Missing you

quote:

Assault Squad
* -75 points.

Breachers
* -25 points.

Tactical Support Squad
* can take additional combat blades for 2 points.

Legion Reconnaissance Squad
* -25 points.

Dreadnought Drop Pod
* +35 points.

Seeker Squad
* -20 points.

Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod
* +15 points.
* has Inertial Guidance System listed in box-out, but not under special rules column. ??
* can transport Legion Dreadnought, Legion Mortis Dreadnought, Contemptor Dreadnought, Contemptor-Mortis Dreadnought or Contemptor-Cortus Dreadnought.

Landspeeder Squadron
* -10 points.
* can take 2 HKMs for 5 points each like the Javelin.

Javelin Attack Speeder Squadron
* -20 points.
* has Strafing Run special rule.
* has "Grav Backwash" special rule. Means enemies have a -2 to hit it in Assault unless it is Immobilised.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:16

Hencoe: Sep 4, 2012; MY LIFE GOAL IS TO STICK A FLESHLIGHT INTO THE END OF A HOWITZER AND FUCK THE SHIT OUT OF IT

People are saying they went UP in cost for additional breachers with a cheaper base cost, this is either someone making GBS threads the bed or they got a rules change on their wargear.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:16

adamantium|wang: Sep 14, 2003; Missing you

quote:

Primus Medicae
* +10 points.
* can't take power fist, chainfist, boarding shield or paired lightning claws.

Chaplain
* causes Fear.

Command Squad
* -25 points.

Veteran Squad
* -25 points.
* additional models -3 points.
* any model can swap bolter for combi-weapon for +10 points.
* Veteran Tactics are very different!
- Resolve Stubborn
- Weaponmasters +1 Weapon Skill
- Machine Killers +1 on armour penetration rolls
- Marksmen Outflank AND Sniper
- Xenobane re-roll To Wound against Monstrous & Gargantuan Creatures.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:17

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

Javelins are loving sweet.
Dreadclaws are scary.
When Alan said "lol breachers need a buff?" We all thought he was kidding, but not really.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:18

Safety Factor: Oct 31, 2009; Grimey Drawer

Why would they add Fear to chaplains? It's not like they needed a buff and their niche was already pretty solid.

Vet changes are interesting, but I don't know why I should bother with anything but Outflank/Sniper dudes. I was already on planning on building two squads and this just cements that idea.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:22

GreenMarine: Apr 25, 2009; Switchblade Switcharoo

Those veteran abilities are neat for making some WE melee vets.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:28

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

Predator Strike Armour Squadron
* Executioner plasma destroyer is +20 points on old price.
* heavy conversion beamer is -5 points.
* if you take 3, one of them can be a Squadron Command Tank for +35 points:
- if unit is in coherency, all ignore Crew Shaken on a 4+.
- if they all shoot at a single target within 24", they gain Tank Hunter and Monster Hunter.

Land Raider Battle Squadron
* Phobos is -25 points.
* Proteus is -20 points.
* Achilles has frag & shatter shells, and can purchase the other new types (including phosphex if Siege Breaker is present).
* Proteus can take a hull-mounted twin-linked lascannon!
* if you take 3, one of them can be a Squadron Command Tank (see Predator notes).

Achilles-Alpha Land Raider
* has frag & shatter shells, and can purchase the other new types (including phosphex if Siege Breaker is present).

Legion Artillery Tank Squadron
* still 0-1
* if you take 3, one of them can be a Squadron Command Tank (see Predator notes).

Vindicator Siege Tank Squadron
* if you take 3, one of them can be a Squadron Command Tank (see Predator notes).

Spartan Assault Tank
* +10 points.
* flare shield +20 points over old cost.

Sicaran Battle Tank
* +30 points.

Kharybdis Assault Claw
* -30 points.

Deredeo Pattern Dreadnought
* new weapon! May swap autocannons for a single Arachnus pattern heavy lascannon battery for +50 points. 48" range, AP2, Heavy 2, Exoshock (if you score a Penetrating hit, on a 4+ you score another Penetrating hit with no cover save).

Phosphex lanraiders lol

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:29

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

I'll take a chaplain buff, even though he didn't need it. Why on earth did they nerf the Medicae more? His special rule already sucks and now he's barely worth his points. I think the Dreadnought Drop Pod nerf is also a bit harsh. Dreadclaw is better now and still undercosted.

Vet changes are interesting. I know why they removed their special rules, but now there's no reason to not take Marksmen. Weaponmasters and Xenobane are particularly situational. They should have done a better job with these imo. Letting them have combi weapons also carves away at the only real niche seekers had.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:31

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

"Can we sell more dread claws?"
"Say no more, I got you covered!"

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:34

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

And extra breachers indeed cost 5 extra points each. Because MSU breachers was such a plague. Retards.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:35

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

Nice to see the old squadron command tank rules are back :dance:

The nerfs to executioners and sicarans are painful though. Admech now have the best tanks by long stretch. Land Raiders are still a bit expensive, but it's closer to how much they should be IMO. Now somebody needs to dig through all the special rules changes and tell us what we can't use anymore

Mango Polo posted:

And extra breachers indeed cost 5 extra points each. Because MSU breachers was such a plague. Retards.

15 points a model? Christ. Well, thankfully we still have our league rules. Maybe hardened armour lets you re-roll all armour saves?

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:38

Hencoe: Sep 4, 2012; MY LIFE GOAL IS TO STICK A FLESHLIGHT INTO THE END OF A HOWITZER AND FUCK THE SHIT OUT OF IT

There has to be a change to hardend armor or boarding shields, that seriously makes no sense.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:39

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

I bet they lost defensive grenades and that's why they cost 5 extra points

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:40

Safety Factor: Oct 31, 2009; Grimey Drawer

Mango Polo posted:

And extra breachers indeed cost 5 extra points each. Because MSU breachers was such a plague. Retards.

MSU breachers are slightly better off. Large squads have taken a hit. It changed from 225/325 to 200/350 for min/max squads. It's still loving stupid.

I'm not upset about the nerfs to executioners because they were honestly too cheap. +20 points is a bit steep, but it's manageable. Sicarans were too much of a no-brainer at 135 so an something was probably needed there too. I can see where they're coming from.

Did they do anything with destroyers? :ohdear:

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:44

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

Those are still the same cost for some dumb reason. I don't get the logic behind some of these changes (or lack thereof).

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:46

Safety Factor: Oct 31, 2009; Grimey Drawer

Mango Polo posted:

Those are still the same cost for some dumb reason.

Goddamnit. :negative:

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:47

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

Medusan Immortals cost less than regular breachers now, per model anyway. Unless they gave them some cool new rules it's really dumb.

I wouldn't really complain about the tanks getting more expensive, but the Krios is now king of the budget tank world. And why bring an executioner when you can just take a scorpius instead? I was expecting for it to go up in price, honestly.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:49

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

typhon is +45pts base

Honk honk

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:51

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

No changes to breachers rules. Ayyyyy

# ? Jul 15, 2016 01:56

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:02

Safety Factor: Oct 31, 2009; Grimey Drawer

BULBASAUR posted:

Needs to vibrate like the regular one.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:03

Hencoe: Sep 4, 2012; MY LIFE GOAL IS TO STICK A FLESHLIGHT INTO THE END OF A HOWITZER AND FUCK THE SHIT OUT OF IT

Safety Factor posted:

Needs to vibrate like the regular one.

Just the eyeballs.

E: from the crusade and heresy Facebook page. https://m.facebook.com/notes/garro/30k-legiones-astartes-army-list-changes/1161772003843394/

Hencoe fucked around with this message at 02:19 on Jul 15, 2016

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:06

panascope: Mar 26, 2005

Dreadclaws getting Inertial Guidance is the ballinest change ever. :vd:

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:25

Mango Polo: Aug 4, 2007

I can't complain too much, the list I was working on instantly got a 110 points reduction. Noice.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:31

panascope: Mar 26, 2005

What is the point of a dreadnought drop pod now that you can get the much better dreadclaw for fewer points?

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:33

Safety Factor: Oct 31, 2009; Grimey Drawer

Oh, hey, tacticals got a 25 point decrease too. I'll take that. Volkite chargers and rotor cannons ( :lol:

) are free upgrades for support squads now.

panascope posted:

What is the point of a dreadnought drop pod now that you can get the much better dreadclaw for fewer points?

Leviathan delivery?

Safety Factor fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Jul 15, 2016

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:33

panascope: Mar 26, 2005

Vets are the best generic troops choice in the game with these changes. Outflank and Sniper together is too bonkers.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:36

Hencoe: Sep 4, 2012; MY LIFE GOAL IS TO STICK A FLESHLIGHT INTO THE END OF A HOWITZER AND FUCK THE SHIT OUT OF IT

panascope posted:

Vets are the best generic troops choice in the game with these changes. Outflank and Sniper together is too bonkers.

Thats probably because they are elites until you add RoW's or characters.

Some dude is claiming scorpius rounds are S5 ap2 now instead of a shred and rending bolt shot.

Hencoe fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Jul 15, 2016

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:46

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

The big head scratchers so far:

I'm glad I chose the Falchion as my LOW, because it now costs even more for some reason
Venators can take an additional pintile weapon. Cool. Because they'll still always snap fire it
All the deredeo weapon options except the stock loadout are comically overpriced
Lightnings, one of the few counters to knight titans and spartans, now cost even more points
Still no changes to destroyers, the scorpius, box dreads, or bikes

I agree with my gay boyfriend panascope, expect to see lots more vets. I also like how they changed some of the special rules for them, so now somebody like Alpha Legion can stack even more special rules ontop. Tank Hunters and +1 on the damage table? Helloo melta gun.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:50

Safety Factor: Oct 31, 2009; Grimey Drawer

Ironwing Outflank/Sniper vets wounding on a 3+ within 12". :getin:

Toss in two acid heavy bolters for shits and giggles.

But then you're playing Dark Angels and trying to make Ironwing work. Like me. :smith:

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:53

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

Armoured Breakthrough tank commander has master of the legion. Hell yes.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:57

panascope: Mar 26, 2005

Hencoe posted:

Thats probably because they are elites until you add RoW's or characters.

Tons of special characters make them troops (e.g., Maloghurst) and Pride of the Legion is pretty drat good now with these changes. Still gonna be Long Marching with Sons though.

# ? Jul 15, 2016 02:59

Hencoe: Sep 4, 2012; MY LIFE GOAL IS TO STICK A FLESHLIGHT INTO THE END OF A HOWITZER AND FUCK THE SHIT OUT OF IT

panascope posted:

Tons of special characters make them troops (e.g., Maloghurst) and Pride of the Legion is pretty drat good now with these changes. Still gonna be Long Marching with Sons though.

Well yeah, I've been running primarchs chosen almost religiously because robots are cool and warsmiths are worthless, I'm super excited for the vet changes. Them not being 300 points for a unit with HB is awesome, add in a free turn 1 outflank? :getin:

# ? Jul 15, 2016 03:07