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V. Illych L. posted:toxic_masculinity.txt yeah people have gone to jail to uphold that out of principle as well.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:18
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Disinterested posted:who cares about snowden or his personal characteristics honestly i don't even care about him, this the wikileaks taking info from russians is clearly unrelated to him
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Jul 25, 2016 17:19
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:I don't think it's bonkers to say that if you're going to do something you should be willing to accept the known consequences. And, ironically, make it harder for you to ever be pardoned in the first place. why? a group of guerillias pulling of an ambush on an enemy column and then, their objective achieved, running away to avoid being obliterated are not cowards you're saying that he's a coward for not going to jail for literally no reason
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Jul 25, 2016 17:19
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which is, uh, insane
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Jul 25, 2016 17:20
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sudo rm -rf posted:yeah you're definitely wrong about this, the email you're referring to was just mocking trump. look at the email's date - may 6th I wonder if Volk knows the relation between May 6th and 'Cinco de Mayo'
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Jul 25, 2016 17:20
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V. Illych L. posted:why? a group of guerillias pulling of an ambush on an enemy column and then, their objective achieved, running away to avoid being obliterated are not cowards those are completely different situations. also he would have reason. he loving broke the law, like it or not.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:20
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My b Tess I thought you were being for real cuz I k ow people who really do think that sorry bro
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Jul 25, 2016 17:20
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chicken strips are so good. man I'm hungry
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Jul 25, 2016 17:20
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:The context is blatantly loving obvious. Quote the context?
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Jul 25, 2016 17:21
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ever since I started running I feel like I've been constantly hungry
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Jul 25, 2016 17:21
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:those are completely different situations. also he would have reason. he loving broke the law, like it or not. no they are not. they are analogous in that they both involve people pulling off an action and then refusing to take "the consequences" of said action, and though obviously in one case it's an unknown fate in the US system and in the other it's certain death to bombardment that's a difference in degree, not in kind the guerrillas are also breaking the law, in a much more spectacular fashion than anything snowden did
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Jul 25, 2016 17:21
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Aeryk posted:chicken strips are so good. man I'm hungry Have a Hungry Man
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Jul 25, 2016 17:21
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V. Illych L. posted:why? a group of guerillias pulling of an ambush on an enemy column and then, their objective achieved, running away to avoid being obliterated are not cowards running away undermined his overall point, and he chose to anyways. he could've defended himself in court and people would've followed the story and he would've been a martyr. instead he did the whistleblowing equivalent of shitposting. you say "literally no reason," but the reason is the exact same one that he felt was important enough to whistleblow over in the first place. if that's not a reason worth going to jail for, then obviously it's not a significant thing, and he had other reasons for releasing the stuff.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:22
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Arrgytehpirate posted:My b Tess I thought you were being for real cuz I k ow people who really do think that sorry bro Yeah I was making fun of them. The whole phrase completely shits on "those who would give up an essential liberty to gain some temporary security deserves neither." It may not be 1984 levels but it's some serious panopticon poo poo.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:22
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paranoid randroid posted:edward, come, we go to eurotrash club to sniff dope and get assaulted by Swedish House Mafia remixes of show tunes. harasho. basically but more importantly he's on tight surveillance and gets regularly bandied about onto russian media to talk about how the US is bad, russia good and then putin turns to the camera like this 
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Jul 25, 2016 17:22
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V. Illych L. posted:no they are not. they are analogous in that they both involve people pulling off an action and then refusing to take "the consequences" of said action, and though obviously in one case it's an unknown fate in the US system and in the other it's certain death to bombardment that's a difference in degree, not in kind except your missing the context of one being an illegal action that you knew the consequences to when you did the thing they're not at all alike.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:22
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you want to see real surveillance state? come, i show you real surveillance state
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Jul 25, 2016 17:23
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:except your missing the context of one being an illegal action that you knew the consequences to when you did the thing what are you even arguing here
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Jul 25, 2016 17:23
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Gravel Gravy posted:Quote the context? https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/728297587418247168 For the record, those bowls are not available in Trump Tower. It was made especially for this photo op as they're no longer on the menu.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:23
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that is the best gif
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Jul 25, 2016 17:24
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:except your missing the context of one being an illegal action that you knew the consequences to when you did the thing exactly. if it was worth the crime, it was worth the time.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:24
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i think the point is just that if we're going to laud snowden as a moral hero we have a right to expect him to actually behave heroically if you don't have that expectation of him, well, easier conversation
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Jul 25, 2016 17:24
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he didn't have a whole lot of options but the one he basically ended being dealt with was probably one of the more existentially questionable ones next to you know actually being locked up in the us i guess
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Jul 25, 2016 17:24
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going into exile at the mercy of putin of all people is absolutely a consequence of one's action
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Jul 25, 2016 17:24
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Tesseraction posted:https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/728297587418247168 Yeah i know this but I meant the references in the DNC emails
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Jul 25, 2016 17:24
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V. Illych L. posted:what are you even arguing here he broke the goddamn law and knew he was doing it, then ran away. like he wasn't even facing deathly consequences.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:25
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I don't think we should lionise him but I do think he did a good thing by exposing the depth of surveillence.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:25
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Volkerball posted:exactly. if it was worth the crime, it was worth the time. this is a very perverse attitude
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Jul 25, 2016 17:25
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what snowden did was probably correct but i tend to view getting exiled to putins back pocket kind of hilarious in a twilight zone kind of way
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Jul 25, 2016 17:25
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Gravel Gravy posted:Yeah i know this but I meant the references in the DNC emails they were doing it like the day after that
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Jul 25, 2016 17:25
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V. Illych L. posted:going into exile at the mercy of putin of all people is absolutely a consequence of one's action a consequence of being pathetic.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:25
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Tesseraction posted:https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/728297587418247168 this was hilariously actually debunked after the buzzfeed writer wrote it, he called the wrong trump tower cafe it turned out later
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Jul 25, 2016 17:26
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Disinterested posted:i think the point is just that if we're going to laud snowden as a moral hero we have a right to expect him to actually behave heroically He did a heroic act then went into self preservation mode. What would have been accomplished from him going to jail?
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Jul 25, 2016 17:26
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V. Illych L. posted:this is a very perverse attitude for the record, i don't have a problem with him actually leaking the information. i have a problem with everything he did after that. which is different from vb's point.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:26
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Gravel Gravy posted:Yeah i know this but I meant the references in the DNC emails https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/5492 quote:
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Jul 25, 2016 17:26
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Disinterested posted:i think the point is just that if we're going to laud snowden as a moral hero we have a right to expect him to actually behave heroically basically this
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Jul 25, 2016 17:27
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Berke Negri posted:this was hilariously actually debunked after the buzzfeed writer wrote it, he called the wrong trump tower cafe it turned out later hah, fair enough bloody buzzfeed
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Jul 25, 2016 17:27
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Arrgytehpirate posted:He did a heroic act then went into self preservation mode. What would have been accomplished from him going to jail? he would've looked serious and of strong moral character. instead he looked like a shitposter.
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Jul 25, 2016 17:27
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V. Illych L. posted:going into exile at the mercy of putin of all people is absolutely a consequence of one's action that isn't the way people treat that
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Jul 25, 2016 17:27
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:he broke the goddamn law and knew he was doing it, then ran away. like he wasn't even facing deathly consequences. influential people were openly calling for trying him for treason & the death penalty, it is not unreasonable of him to fear such in any event, i'm not arguing that snowden is a paragon of courage or anything, merely that he is not a "coward"
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Jul 25, 2016 17:27
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