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Vengarr posted:I thought they were trying to complicate her a bit with ALIEN HAND SYNDROME... But nah, it was just Delta mindhacking her into murdering him because reasons? Because he wanted to create more histories, and he knew he'd have to 'nudge' the most morally consistent characters into making out of character choices.
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Jul 26, 2016 04:54
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| # ? May 28, 2024 11:24 |
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Also man with the reveal that they're all in the same ward and awake at different times, it puts a hosed up spin on how unfair the Acid Bath decision game is for the latter teams
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Jul 26, 2016 05:04
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All it would have taken was one more scene like ? in VLR, just vaguely alluding to some observer outside the time stream and driving home the comment about the quantum computer timelines, and it would have tied it together well enough that I would be satisfied. But here we just have that stupid Delta gotcha with literally no reason other than to have a twist. It wouldn't even bug me so much if the overall setting/setup of ZTD is by far my favorite in the series and then it just gets spoiled with "oh yeah there was a guy off screen in this third person game for literally no reason other than because...gently caress you." Despite all that, I still hope we get another one, because I'm some kind of masochist or something and I'm hoping this was a fluke (having never read through the Ever17/whatever series). If we ever did though I hope they basically relegate the Radical-6 future to dialogue and poo poo because it's bleak and we know everything there is to know about it, more or less: -Everything in VLR happens, of course -Akane sets up the AB game and is almost certainly cooperating with Delta when she does, I don't think it's insignificant that she sends Sigma's consciousness back to right after she meets with Delta and Free the Soul -Alice and Clover were probably transported to Rhizome 9 and thus led perfectly normal lives in post-apocalyptic Earth, though who knows if they managed to shift back to their bodies there. If not then Alice and Clover are stuck on the moon and nearly everyone they know is dead. The only missing link is Kyle, who presumably went back to shortly before ZTD to assist Delta at Akane's behest, and ?, who is just never mentioned at all in ZTD despite literally the whole gimmick only making sense if it's involved.
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Jul 26, 2016 06:29
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voltcatfish posted:Also man with the reveal that they're all in the same ward and awake at different times, it puts a hosed up spin on how unfair the Acid Bath decision game is for the latter teams To be fair, Zero could have set it up so that the players who pressed the button fastest in the time relative to being told the message would be the "winner".
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Jul 26, 2016 06:33
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The whole "oh, I never said it would happen NOW. It's time for you to sleep," thing was a hell of a hint about them all being in the same ward, in retrospect.
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Jul 26, 2016 07:09
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Ryoshi posted:The whole "oh, I never said it would happen NOW. It's time for you to sleep," thing was a hell of a hint about them all being in the same ward, in retrospect. At the time when he woke them back up just so they could be awake and suffering during their acid bath, I was like "Oh man what a hilarious dick Zero is"
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Jul 26, 2016 07:13
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Vengarr posted:I thought they were trying to complicate her a bit with ALIEN HAND SYNDROME... But nah, it was just Delta mindhacking her into murdering him because reasons? I definitely prefer to believe it was just her faking it to get out of the whole thing. Zero's explanation at the end wouldn't make sense any other way.
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Jul 26, 2016 13:47
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Please update the OP again, thnx
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Jul 26, 2016 14:43
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Just finished, man that Delta twist actually confused the poo poo out of me until I read the file about Sean. Suddenly they're calling him Sean and I'm like "when did he tell them his name?" Also, in the timelines where Delta is dead, whose perspective were we watching from? edit: Just wanted to say as well that I really liked how they made decisions seem significant again with the shifting explanation of killing the alternate version. In 999, every decision felt like a huge deal and in VLR, they really didn't, so giving the decisions a bit more significance again was nice. Zeeman fucked around with this message at 19:33 on Jul 26, 2016 |
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Jul 26, 2016 19:26
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We are always from ?'s perspective not Delta's I'll maintain this to the bitter end
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Jul 26, 2016 19:31
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Regy Rusty posted:We are always from ?'s perspective not Delta's It doesn't really need to be argued, like 45% of the game happens with Delta Dead.
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Jul 26, 2016 19:36
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Paul Zuvella posted:It doesn't really need to be argued, like 45% of the game happens with Delta Dead. And yet people keep assuming the opposite for some reason
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Jul 26, 2016 19:42
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Delta's whole plan was actually made together with Phi and was meant to make his sister, who was the strongest and first SHIFTer, into a true 4th dimensional being. This by first sending a copy into the future and making her go through VLR and ZTD and force her to make many decisions and SHIFT a lot so the limits on her brain would slowly erode, giving her access to the 4th dimension without having to store up brain slingshot power - by doing so, humanity in turn would answer and would evolve into greater beings who can access the 4th dimension where their consciousnesses are stored. This was Delta and Phi's true goal - taking humanity to the next step. The entire game is actually seen through Phi's eyes directly after CQD2 End, and she has to go back and ensure everything happens as it does so that, once the last SHIFT happens, her mind would be set free. :fanfiction:
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Jul 26, 2016 19:50
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Regy Rusty posted:And yet people keep assuming the opposite for some reason When you tell Sean to kill Delta with the crossbow, he shoots at "you"
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Jul 26, 2016 20:25
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Zeeman posted:When you tell Sean to kill Delta with the crossbow, he shoots at "you" I mean, yeah. Because the camera shifts to his view right after you select the choice. That doesn't have anything to do with the rest of the game.
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Jul 26, 2016 20:36
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Momomo posted:I definitely prefer to believe it was just her faking it to get out of the whole thing. Zero's explanation at the end wouldn't make sense any other way. It makes sense if you think he was doing it to screw with Diana, who can SHIFT. Or the player, because that's how Zero rolls. I mean, Carlos says the exact same thing in his button push/bad vote scenes. "It felt like someone took control of my hand!" And while it makes zero sense for Delta to mindcontrol someone into killing him, he does that explicitly with Eric's shotgun after the Force Quit boxes are open. Maybe Delta was just kind of suicidal.
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Jul 26, 2016 20:43
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Paul Zuvella posted:I mean, yeah. Because the camera shifts to his view right after you select the choice. That doesn't have anything to do with the rest of the game. I don't know, they also show the cameras cutting out from your perspective during the Q Force Quit segment when Sean shuts them down
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Jul 26, 2016 20:54
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Also Delta said he had a security camera feed going into his glasses, which explains the camera angles not from his direct perspective.
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Jul 26, 2016 21:08
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It can easily be patched up by saying that your perspective was the cameras the whole time, even if Delta was dead.
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Jul 26, 2016 21:11
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It's quite simple. Blick Winkel/?/the player is the glasses.
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Jul 26, 2016 21:14
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Ibram Gaunt posted:It can easily be patched up by saying that your perspective was the cameras the whole time, even if Delta was dead. You know, for all Delta's talk about not being able to SHIFT, he pretty obviously knows everything that goes on in the shelter across all timelines - the shelter is run by the same quantum computer Sean is running on, after all, so it makes sense that his magic glasses would be hooked into the system too. That's probably actually the intended twist of the game, that the player literally is always Delta, occasionally watching from another timeline. It still sucks and needed one more scene to pull it together, and that "THE TRUTH IS INVISIBLE" clue is going to bug me forever.
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Jul 26, 2016 21:25
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People are straight up making up non-existent plot twists at this point smh
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Jul 26, 2016 21:27
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Paul Zuvella posted:People are straight up making up non-existent plot twists at this point smh Yeah, Blick Winkel is a pretty stupid idea.
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Jul 26, 2016 23:34
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Terper posted:Delta's whole plan was actually made together with Phi and was meant to make his sister, who was the strongest and first SHIFTer, into a true 4th dimensional being. This by first sending a copy into the future and making her go through VLR and ZTD and force her to make many decisions and SHIFT a lot so the limits on her brain would slowly erode, giving her access to the 4th dimension without having to store up brain slingshot power - by doing so, humanity in turn would answer and would evolve into greater beings who can access the 4th dimension where their consciousnesses are stored. This was Delta and Phi's true goal - taking humanity to the next step. Dr. Sam Beckett never returned home.
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Jul 27, 2016 00:54
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"Al, where am I now?" "Hoo boy, Sam, this one's a fuckin' doozy."
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Jul 27, 2016 01:36
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Blick Winkel being Sam Beckett is my headcanon now.
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Jul 27, 2016 01:39
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Waffleman_ posted:Blick Winkel being Sam Beckett is my headcanon now. Diana suddenly gives a rousing performance of "Great Balls of Fire" on the healing room piano, despite it only having 1 octave.
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Jul 27, 2016 01:42
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Vengarr posted:It makes sense if you think he was doing it to screw with Diana, who can SHIFT. Or the player, because that's how Zero rolls. To try and guilt her for something that wasn't actually her doing is just lame though. We have infinite universes, which means there are ones where Diana and Carlos both pressed the buttons, so we really didn't need MIND HACK to explain it.
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Jul 27, 2016 01:47
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Waffleman_ posted:Blick Winkel being Sam Beckett is my headcanon now. thinking about quantum leap makes me sad there aren't any evil shifters trying to thwart your time travel shenanigans
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Jul 27, 2016 01:54
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MegaZeroX posted:I didn't know there was a spoiler thread! I wish I started posting in here earlier.
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Jul 27, 2016 10:23
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I have a couple of problems with the game. 1. Akane freaking out about Junpei dying or w/e, literally a year after she had him kidnapped and locked in a compound where he was continually exposed to danger, all so that she could save herself. 2. I loved the Q/Delta/Zero reveal but some things about it don't really make much sense. He's the leader of Free the Soul so in the VLR timeline he goes and makes lots of clones of his dead adoptive brother, then tries to sabotage the Nonary game on the moon because I guess his motives are ~~complex~~.
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Jul 27, 2016 11:05
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irlZaphod posted:
The threat was needed so that his dad would shift a lot and flip the genetic switches so he could be born with superpowers
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Jul 27, 2016 11:08
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irlZaphod posted:I have a couple of problems with the game. well, there was never any bombs in the bracelets anyway. the one bad dude was ace, and crazy clover.
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Jul 27, 2016 11:24
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irlZaphod posted:You piece of poo poo Uchikoshi
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Jul 27, 2016 13:11
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Irony Be My Shield posted:Also note that the way out was the 'X door' this time. Terper posted:The threat was needed so that his dad would shift a lot and flip the genetic switches so he could be born with superpowers Tired Moritz posted:well, there was never any bombs in the bracelets anyway. the one bad dude was ace, and crazy clover. They weren't actually on a sinking ship either but still, Junpei is killed in several endings so he really was in danger depending on what choices he made.
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Jul 27, 2016 13:21
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I think they said at the end that only the bad guys actually had bombs in them.
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Jul 27, 2016 13:55
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Honestly, I kinda don't care that Kyle/? wasn't brought up again. I mean I guess it could have been cool if they were, but I suppose I just like ZTD so much that it not having them in it/them not being a big deal (if indeed they are in the game somewhere) is not a huge deal to me.
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Jul 27, 2016 14:24
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irlZaphod posted:omgggggggg Well, VLR and ZTD Akane is very adamant about there being a "true" or "best" timeline. She doesn't care about condemning her alternate timeline self to death in order to demonstrate SHIFTing to Carlos. Nor does she show the least remorse in telling Junpei "yeah those forty years you struggled to survive and make something of your life? They're not important because I consider this timeline I'm trying to bring about to be the true one". So 999 is easily resolved in her mind as "In the timeline I am alive in, which I consider to be the true timeline I'm bringing about, Junpei was never hurt or in any danger past being brought in to play the game". She knows what happens in the future she survives in, and she knows that Junpei is perfectly fine, ergo, no moral problems. That there are multiple timelines where Junpei does die horribly because of the situation is immaterial: as far as Akane's concerned, those don't count. She's very consistent with this attitude. She's also consistently hypocritical about it, as demonstrated by her getting mad at Delta setting up the Decision Game in order to achieve his....complex goals. When Akane does it, it's okay, because she's trying to bring about a noble outcome (in her mind). When someone else does it, it's usurping God's right as to who lives and who dies. Akane being outright shown to be little better than Delta while being outright convinced of her own righteousness is one of the best parts of ZTD, really.
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Jul 27, 2016 14:35
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Jul 28, 2016 05:44
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lmao
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Jul 28, 2016 05:58
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