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Aurubin posted:Do Greenskin WAAAGH!!! armies attack targets of their own volition like brayherds? I have a memory of them being very mechanical in comparison. Yes, if you don't tell them to attack anything they'll attack whatever they see. If you do tell them to attack something they'll likely attack any army on the way to it as well. If you don't tell them to attack anything and they don't see anything to attack they'll just raid, even if it's your own territory. The only difference I've noticed between brayherds and waaaagh is waaaagh tend to be kind of low tier units in 20 stacks whereas brayherds are decent-high tier units in 14-15 stacks. And I guess the raiding is less damaging--well, not at all damaging--so you don't have to manage them as carefully. If the game is properly giving them ambush chances in their autoresolves that's probably another point in their favour as well. I've heard people suggest that you can let your greenskin waaaagh get almost wiped out but not actually wiped out to let them global recruit better units, but I'm not entirely sure if that's true. I mean, I'd think the waaaagh would have its statically bad pool of units to recruit given it's technically a separate faction but maybe they clone your global recruit pool to them on creation? Either way, could be an advantage of greenskin waaaagh over brayherds if their starting buildings are basic. Decus fucked around with this message at 07:36 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 07:31
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What I can play of Beastmen is super fun. So far the big pros I see are that they are mostly super fast-moving, their big units hit hard and can massively disrupt formations (really great for breaking past gates in sieges and creating holes for units to pour through), and they turn the battlefield into highly mobile affair. The big con I see is that they are kind of opposite of dwarves in that they have less staying power in long fights. I still have lots of fun with them because their large, charging units will just cut swaths through battlefields, opening up holes to take advantage of, and they have lots of fast, cavalry-like units that are absolute terrors. This is the faction that the blood DLC was made for.
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Jul 29, 2016 07:52
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I prefer the armor/missile resist aura on gorebulls because charging minotaurs already do enough damage and shoring them up against their main weakness seems better.
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Jul 29, 2016 08:02
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My initial impressions of beastmen: - Gorebulls are ridiculous. RIDICULOUS. Not only do you get a big beefy monster unit/hero with super strong leadership, he also boosts the leadership of your entire army by like 30 or something, on top of a totally gross +25 melee attack buff in his aura -Minotaurs are probably the best monster unit in the game. They have great leadership, cause fear from being monstrous infantry, are fast as hell, and absolutely pulp everything they charge. -Cygors are extremely strong -Lore of the wild (I think that's the one) being able to summon a free cygor and also cast devolve, which is basically an AoE fate of Bjuna, is flat out broken The replenishment dark moon event alone makes beastmen about 2x more fun to play as than chaos
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Jul 29, 2016 08:07
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you guys werent kidding about sigvald soloing whole cities.
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Jul 29, 2016 08:16
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I managed to beat my first campagin with dwarves after slaughtering every last orc, vampire, and that yellow empire faction that was really dickish. So i started an empire campaign and im really not sure what to do. With Dwarfs it was just kill the greenies but now im surrounded by other humans and im not sure if i should be trying to assimilate them into a confederation or gently caress em and steamroll over the bastards now that i've got demigryphs.jfood posted:I refuse to believe in a Warhammer world where Lizardman pyramids do not float on water. I will not buy DLC until its Lizardmen.
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Jul 29, 2016 08:32
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madmac posted:Malagor The passive only applies while he's casting, so it's a tactical thing - it also gives a charge bonus I think, so it's worth casting something just before your army makes contact.
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Jul 29, 2016 08:36
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Minor spoilers for the mini campaign In the mini campaign, when you beat Todbringer, you can get a permanent +aura buff and a HUGE +aura leadership buff. This combined with the base Beastlord +leadership skills and the doombull's +leadership skills meant I had an aura the size of the entire map that let my ungor raiders have a 118 leadership. Some of my other guys were nearing 200. Poor leadership is definitely an early game thing for Beastmen, even without the mini-campaign Todbringer Eye buff. Oh, and Todbringer's model updates after the first time you beat him, he gets a little eyepatch.
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Jul 29, 2016 08:40
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DeathSandwich posted:So what I've been picking up is that Beastmen in combat are going to play a lot like Ambushy vampire counts insofar as they have cheap kind of crap cannon fodder line infantry and your monsters are the workhorses that win your fights.Your basic ungor/gors are your anvil and the Centaus/minotaurs/chaos spawn are your horned ragehammer that breaks the enemy line. Sound about right? The basic Gors and Ungors are a lot more killy than undead units and they get a lot of bonuses from leader upgrades, buildings and tech. The monsters are definitely your main killers but the smaller goat can do more damage than most line troops, especially if you use their vanguard ability to set up envelopment.
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Jul 29, 2016 08:46
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Yeah, playing the grand campaign as Beastmen is a loving blast. You look at your objectives and you're like "How the gently caress am I going to do this?" and then Archaon and friends show up and you basically curbstomp the world. It's amazing to work alongside Chaos as Beastmen and stomp everyone into the dirt. Also, Gorebulls are indeed loving insanity. I finished the final quest mission (The Fall of Man, it's you against a combined Empire/Bretonnian force on a ridiculously good hill) and I had a Gorebull that was just single-handedly tanking the majority of the Empire's line. Their charge attack animation is fantastic, as well: they literally dive into the fray and roll, crushing some poor fuckers beneath them. I have to give CA credit, they're really going all out with the animations. I loving love watching Minotaur charges.
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Jul 29, 2016 09:46
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Man, I don't think these mods were as patch-friendly as I thought...considering I don't remember seeing the Beastmen icon during end turn the past few hours... EDIT: One of them edited the startpos 
toasterwarrior fucked around with this message at 10:54 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 10:44
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Quick personal impressions, experience and tips for the DLC so far. First of all, Beastmen owns tons, may end being my new favorite faction at this point, cool units, sweet magics, good lords with nice skill trees, good mechanics and plenty of speedy and killy unit options. All but finished first VH run of the mini campaign (taking my time slow with it before finish), its a nice addition besides grand campaign, I enjoyed it a lot so far, not sure how replayability will be for it however. Mini campaign notes and tips: - Spawn Malagos on turn 1, recruit him 1 unit(for safety against agent assination success not killing whole horde if he is solo) , get him to lvl 3 asap and then use him to reinforce kazrak as your early caster. - Devolve is broken good, if you think Bjuna was/is OP, Devolve will blow you away, can even be overcast for just 16 WoM. That spell has won me soo many battles I would've been curbstomped in otherwise. - Don't rush to raze every city you come across, raze the first 2 towns for growth boost, then build eco by mainly raiding until settlements grow up fat, juicy and ready for you to sack. - Recruit a 3rd lord before first Beast tribe you confederate, that way you only pay 6 growth (every additional confedarated army increases growth cost by 4 for each new lord). - Don't rush for full armies, build infrastrcuture up first, Kazhark with a 17stack followed by Malagos nuking stuff will carry you a long way. Most new lords can run with just a unit in their army to reinforce while you grow them up with skills and buildings. - Centigors, Minotaurs and Cyghors all rule, but keep in mind you eco before you go crazy on them, Beastmen eco is a lot harder then Chaos since you can't chain sack cities. - Grow to tier 5 settlement with maxed barracks before anything else, to improve growth and lower upkeep, the upkeep building is needed before you recruit an army, but it takes away most growth so don't build it too early. - Gorebulls are probably the strongest combat hero in the game by far, recommend having one with each full army, they are super tanky, fun and can murder the poo poo out of infantry. Bonus points for the passive LD and MD skills you can pick to help your army. - The spells to summon free Cygor and Chimera are great, both can add a lot of damage to your army or serve as a great tank or distraction. - Except for Malagos, all lords should invest in blue tree first with 3 points in blessed by evil (upkeep reduction is key to ur eco), and then 3 in growth in the 2nd tier (can skip LS thanks to offensive ambush and relaying on multiple hordes in most every battle its a wasted point for Beastmen imo. After blue tree is done the "+20% WS for ALL units" is best choice followed by 1 point in red tree for the +5 LD, for Kazrak grab the Beastial cunning 1 pointer for extra ambush chance and defence, its real good. For Malagos grab all his magic up until Arcane Conduit before even think about anything else, use him as a reinforce caster until you got all his magic plus have him sorted with his blue tree. - Brayherds can be very derpy, and I never bother with their survability, best used as distraction to stall or weaken enemy armies. Keep in mind only armies with 17 or more units in the stack can spawn a Herd. I've no regrets buying this DLC, so far its been well worth the money (still bit salty about no Jaberslythe or Harpies thou!). Edit; tried out the recommended AI Auto-resolve buff mod, and I find its great. Works way closer to what I feel vanilla should be with auto resolving vs manual fights and its definatly made me enjoy campaigns a lot more. Choyi fucked around with this message at 11:00 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 10:58
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Decus posted:Yes, if you don't tell them to attack anything they'll attack whatever they see. If you do tell them to attack something they'll likely attack any army on the way to it as well. If you don't tell them to attack anything and they don't see anything to attack they'll just raid, even if it's your own territory. I think Waaagh armies were rebalanced as they had a preference for recruiting Arachnaroks and other high tier killy units. If they've refined brayherds to recruit decent units then maybe they'll rebalance at some point, who knows. Personally I like having the lovely chaff, makes it feel more like a proper greenskin horde.
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Jul 29, 2016 11:47
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I think Chaos might be a bit too strong right now in the grand campaign. Playing on very hard I had made my way from badlands-estalia-bretonnia by turn 70 or so, and when I first reached empire territory so was it all mostly ruins already even before Archeon himself had spawned. It was a bit anticlimactic. Tiny sample size obviously.
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Jul 29, 2016 14:36
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I know everyone had moved on to the new hotness, but I just have to say I am having tons of fun as the Greenskins taking over the entire Southeast in my first game. Hoarding around and sicking my WAAAAGH on things is awesome. I'm just about done mopping up the lesser Greenskins tribes, have 4-5 provinces under control, and am just about to return my attention to the Stunties. This game seems to be holding my attention in a way no other Total War has before it.
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Jul 29, 2016 14:49
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I just finished up my greenskin campaign and it was pretty fun. I definitely wanted to make sure that if I was going to fight any race I was going to have a massive horde with me. It was a bit funny to see the chaos forces kind of crumble beneath the weight of over 3,000 units surrounding them on all sides and coming in for a fight. By the time I was fighting them though, they had pretty much razed all of the towns in the North and made me question what exactly happened to all these settlements. The only thing I want them to do with Grimgor is to give him a loving mount. It doesn't have to be a wyvern. It could be a white boar with red warpaint on it. Just give him something so he isn't flailing around when the other side has one. Also, I'm not a big fan of the quest battles and stipulations. I tried some of them, but I eventually got so caught up in my rampaging that I totally forgot about it till the end. Also, now I'm playing the Empire and I'm trying to be more diplomatic with the other human and dwarf races. I've taken Marienburg and the other settlement and now I'm eyeballing middenland and hoping to get the Norscan as a confederate. Any tips on if I should just strong arm the other human factions and try and take out the Vampires as early as possible, or leave a large majority of the human settlements alone and go after the vamps and start raiding the North? I figure if I can bring the fight early to the Chaos and raze and sack a couple of their settlements they won't be as much of a threat.
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Jul 29, 2016 15:09
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Whaaat no you can't confederate with the Norscans.
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Jul 29, 2016 15:13
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Korgan posted:I think Waaagh armies were rebalanced as they had a preference for recruiting Arachnaroks and other high tier killy units. If they've refined brayherds to recruit decent units then maybe they'll rebalance at some point, who knows. Personally I like having the lovely chaff, makes it feel more like a proper greenskin horde. Yeah, it was more than a little ridiculous. In the week or so before the original release, CA community coordinators were live streaming, and the waaagh army that they got on turn 5 of their orc campaign or so had both an Arachnarok and a giant.
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Jul 29, 2016 15:16
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Making an entire army of GoreBulls and Minotaurs sure is a thing.  
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Jul 29, 2016 15:21
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So, has anybody tested Empire Mortars versus Beastmen? They absolutely melt Beastmen infantry, like evaporate an entire unit before they can even rout. Was explosion damage buffed? Go launch a custom battle with a big Beastmen chaff mainline and give the AI 2-3 mortars. Charge in and see how it goes, its absolutely insane. I think the Rocket Batteries should work too. edit/ tested with Rocket Batteries, they gently caress poo poo up too but Mortars are more reliable with their accuracy and cost effectiveness. blindwoozie fucked around with this message at 15:28 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 15:22
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MilitantBlackGuy posted:So, has anybody tested Empire Mortars versus Beastmen? They absolutely melt Beastmen infantry, like evaporate an entire unit before they can even rout. Was explosion damage buffed? Go launch a custom battle with a big Beastmen chaff mainline and give the AI 2-3 mortars. Charge in and see how it goes, its absolutely insane. I think the Rocket Batteries should work too. This is just because the Beastmen have next to no armour, I think. Mortars are similarly lethal against Chaos Marauders.
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Jul 29, 2016 15:27
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All artillery with a couple exceptions got buffed this patch, not sure to what extent. Mortars had their range extended and accuracy increased.
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Jul 29, 2016 15:35
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There was some kind of fix to explosion damage as well, so it's possible that mortars were indirectly buffed by it.
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Jul 29, 2016 15:54
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John Charity Spring posted:This is just because the Beastmen have next to no armour, I think. Mortars are similarly lethal against Chaos Marauders. While I could see it making sense for Beastmen chaff, it doesn't explain Bestigors (100 armour) melting to Mortar fire too. I think something is seriously wrong there. I just watched ONE mortar shot hit the middle of an Ungor Spear Herd, and the explosion rippled out and wiped out probably 80% of the unit. Two shots from a mortar just deletes them from the battlefield. blindwoozie fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 16:10
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Looks like the 100% reinforcement buff from the moon was a typo and they meant it to be 10%.  Edit: or maybe it's just behaving funnylike. Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 16:41 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 16:12
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Gonkish posted:Oh my god, ok I know everyone is jerking off about minotaurs but HOLY poo poo minotaurs. If you have the blood DLC you owe it to yourself to watch those fuckers charge right into the back of an Empire line. They don't just kill dudes on the charge, they straight up MAKE THEM loving EXPLODE IN A SHOWER OF BLOOD. It's insane and wonderful. Also, Minotaurs with Great Weapons are Anti-Large and almost as fast as cavalry with the right techs and lord/agent skills. They're incredible and you should all be using them. I'd put it off but you just sold me on the blood DLC.
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Jul 29, 2016 16:15
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GreyjoyBastard posted:Looks like the 100% reinforcement buff from the moon was a typo and they meant it to be 10%. The buffs and penalties from the full moon events are semi random. Sometimes you get 10% replenishment, sometimes you get 100%
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Jul 29, 2016 16:28
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GreyjoyBastard posted:Looks like the 100% reinforcement buff from the moon was a typo and they meant it to be 10%. It varies. It can either be 10%, 50% or 100%. The first two are fine if you're just moving along after a battle and want to replenish a bit faster, but when you get the 100% and it's timed right it's magical. It lasts two turns, and once I was attacking a well defended city in the north. Close fight, lost half my army but then they all recovered by the next turn just in time for 3 full stacks to sweep up. I fought them off one at a time, but it cost me most of my unit strength again. No worries though, because the second full heal turn kicked in an everyone was back in business. I find that the huge growth penalty doesn't hurt much later in the game. My main stack had something like 16-20 stored surplus and a +18 growth so just missing a few turns barely mattered
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Jul 29, 2016 16:35
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Kainser posted:I think Chaos might be a bit too strong right now in the grand campaign. Unless you're playing them yourself, in which case you'll face empire knights and beastmen with your shitvikings. The basic chaos chariot is so weak that they should just remove them from the game and put gorebeast chariots in one of the existing building chains.
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Jul 29, 2016 17:04
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I hope that Empire gets a bunch of DLCs that make it progressively harder and harder to play, since that makes the most thematic sense.
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Jul 29, 2016 17:10
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The Khazrak unlock is sacrifice, right? I'm starting to worry it's bugged. Wish there were a way I could check the progress.
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Jul 29, 2016 17:16
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MilitantBlackGuy posted:While I could see it making sense for Beastmen chaff, it doesn't explain Bestigors (100 armour) melting to Mortar fire too. I think something is seriously wrong there. I just watched ONE mortar shot hit the middle of an Ungor Spear Herd, and the explosion rippled out and wiped out probably 80% of the unit. Two shots from a mortar just deletes them from the battlefield. This definitely doesn't sound right (or match up to my own experience facing mortars as beastmen). What unit size are you playing on?
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Jul 29, 2016 17:18
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WHAT A GOOD DOG posted:I hope that Empire gets a bunch of DLCs that make it progressively harder and harder to play, since that makes the most thematic sense. That's probably the plan. I do like the idea of completely remaking the "Grand Campaign" map to make things flow a little better with the number of factions that need to interact. E: For example whenever the next "full game" hits the current map is renamed "Chaos in the Old World" or whatever and they have a new map called "A Whole New World" for people that only own that game. Then if you have both games there's a new Grand Campaign that consolidates and shrinks the main factions a bit so it's more about having them fight each other. Triskelli fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 17:26
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What will the objective of the Wood Elves be anyway, liberate all the woods?
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Jul 29, 2016 17:28
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Kainser posted:What will the objective of the Wood Elves be anyway, liberate all the woods? Kill all sentient non-elves/treekin in the continent.
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Jul 29, 2016 17:35
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ZearothK posted:Kill all sentient non-elves/treekin in the continent. Well, in every province that has a tree.
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Jul 29, 2016 17:37
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John Charity Spring posted:This definitely doesn't sound right (or match up to my own experience facing mortars as beastmen). What unit size are you playing on? I'm playing on Ultra. I don't have any mods that gently caress with any sort of unit statistics whatsoever. I'd like to capture it on video, any good game recording programs?
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Jul 29, 2016 17:41
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DeathSandwich posted:The buffs and penalties from the full moon events are semi random. Sometimes you get 10% replenishment, sometimes you get 100% If you look at enough of them in a row, I wonder if they would be cyclical, to reflect phases of the moon? That would be a nice touch. So 10, 50, 100, 50, 10 repeating or something.
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Jul 29, 2016 17:44
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Total Warhammer doesn't like me bringing two full-ish stacks and their two brayherd buddies to the party. It crashes. Guess I'll autoresolve this siege, although I was sort of looking forward to a mega-brawl at Middenheim (where my brayherd bros die in their hundreds).
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Jul 29, 2016 17:46
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ZearothK posted:Kill all sentient non-elves/treekin in the continent. Speaking of, did anyone else ever find it super weird in the Mark of Chaos CGI intro that the wood elf decided to help the clearly doomed Imperial company?
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Jul 29, 2016 17:48
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