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The Why Writers Must Be Readers link in the OP is dead and I can't find a copy of it anywhere else online, is it lost forever? e: it works fine now. 
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Jul 21, 2016 05:22
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tbh its p obvs that writers need 2 b readers im not reading that
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Jul 21, 2016 05:28
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I found it on archive.orgspectres of autism posted:tbh its p obvs that writers need 2 b readers You would think so but I've gotten in multiple arguments with writers who don't think you need to read books or do editing.
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Jul 21, 2016 05:45
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Along these lines, does anyone have any good tips for being a good writer-reader? I find that I read like a reader and not like a writer. Mostly I get caught up in the story and don't do so much analyzing. At least in the first read through. Is analysis important or is reading sufficient. I think many people might do what I do initially and therefore totally disregard the craft of what others do. The work of others might come across as effortless to them which makes it seem like reading is a waste of time.
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Jul 21, 2016 18:05
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I'm not an especially analytical reader, myself. I usually just find that I unconsciously absorb certain stylistic tics from whatever I'm reading as I'm reading. One time I read The Fountainhead, and not only did I hate the book itself, I became convinced it was making my writing worse.
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Jul 21, 2016 18:17
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The main thing that I do when reading something as a writer is to watch for points where I hit something that really evokes something in me. When something trips that feeling, I know to stop, look more closely, and pull apart whatever it is that made me feel that way. That's mostly for specific prose beats, I don't think that you need to do something special to pick up on character dynamics aside from possibly just recounting to yourself what happened when you're done reading. I'll do that sometimes and I'll occasionally stumble on some connection or something I had overlooked at first.
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Jul 21, 2016 22:43
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tbh if i analyzed the writing to consciously pick up techniques i wouldnt enjoy anything just read a lot, your unconscious will absorb words and style hacks and then u can b yrself when u write. god life is too short to endlessly pick apart books
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Jul 22, 2016 01:54
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One time I read a books and thought to myself 'I really like how stuff keeps happening in this book, I should try that" and I think that is the closest I got to reading for writing.
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Jul 22, 2016 01:57
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At what point should I get someone else to critique my work? I'm writing the first serious thing I've written in probably four or five years, but it's really flowing pretty freely. But I haven't really given a single thought to overall structure or plot, I've just been writing as long as it feels natural. I'm a little concerned that it'll grow to a point where it's a little ponderous to edit (It's currently only at 1500 words) but I also feel like if it's coming to me easily I shouldn't stop in the middle and start picking it apart. Thoughts?
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Jul 22, 2016 02:13
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My policy is not to overthink and not to worry about details until something is finished.
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Jul 22, 2016 02:19
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Danknificent posted:My policy is not to overthink and not to worry about details until something is finished. Cool. I'll just keep writing until I can't anymore then.
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Jul 22, 2016 02:23
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MockingQuantum posted:Cool. I'll just keep writing until I can't anymore then. This is a good plan. I know from way too much experience (seriously, I have made this mistake too many times to be excusable) that stopping to fixate on editing or have someone go over your stuff before you're finished it can actually be a death sentence for progress. You get too caught up in making what you've already got just right to actually make anything new, and by the time you're to the point where you can move forward again, you've lost all momentum. Editing a huge work might be horribly intimidating, but there's something heartening about being able to go "well, at least it's loving done. (Now it just needs to be more done.)" Speaking of which, I should really stop putting off editing my goddamn book.
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Jul 22, 2016 19:33
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There was a discussion awhile back aboot world building and why you shouldn't make your audience suffer by cramming out into their eyeballs. Anyone got a link to that article?
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Jul 24, 2016 06:26
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Mercedes posted:There was a discussion awhile back aboot world building and why you shouldn't make your audience suffer by cramming out into their eyeballs. Anyone got a link to that article? Probably one of DocK's, I'll have a look. e: Sorry man, i couldn't find it - here's Doctor Kloctopussy's posts in the thread, it might not be in there but you can't go wrong by reading them anyway 
sebmojo fucked around with this message at 08:55 on Jul 24, 2016 |
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Jul 24, 2016 08:24
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I'm curious, what's the draw of writing-specific programs like Write! or Scrivener? A friend has been pushing me to get into Scrivener since I started writing daily and it just seems like total overkill. I get that Word is kind of an industry standard for formatting reasons, but so far I've done all my writing in Google Docs mostly so I can access them from anywhere. Am I missing something major in not using a writing app? For what it's worth I'm not writing novels at this point.
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Jul 26, 2016 20:08
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Scrivner is good for hyper-organizers that like having a digital filing system. It also creates a false sense of progress after you spend all day organizing ideas (but not writing.) That's the only appeal I see.
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Jul 26, 2016 20:28
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HIJK posted:Scrivner is good for hyper-organizers that like having a digital filing system. It also creates a false sense of progress after you spend all day organizing ideas (but not writing.) That would be my big concern. I'm prone to that kind of poo poo in my day job, I feel like having a program that encourages that in my writing would be a step backwards.
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Jul 26, 2016 20:29
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MockingQuantum posted:That would be my big concern. I'm prone to that kind of poo poo in my day job, I feel like having a program that encourages that in my writing would be a step backwards. IMO you can re-create the Scrivner experience with post-it notes/index cards and possibly a corkboard, if you're the kind of person that likes organizing ideas. Keeping it physically finite also stops you from going down the digital rabbit hole. On the other hand if what you have works for you then just keep doing that. Scrivner is just a tool and it won't necessarily help you write more stuff.
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Jul 26, 2016 20:36
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If you're happy not using any software, don't use any software. For me Scrivener probably only shows its strength when I am composing works of tens of thousands of words since you want to start rejiggering entire chapters or rearranging scenes. I don't see the need for shorter pieces.
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Jul 26, 2016 20:39
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Scrivener owns for writing novels but I can't explain why right now because I have to keep writing my novel in Scrivener. This is an example of Chiasmus
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Jul 26, 2016 21:21
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My favorite thing about Scrivner is the ease of exporting in easy to print and read formats. As for helping writing, like McMurtry said, you either do it or you don't.
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Jul 26, 2016 22:33
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Reading reviews, it seems like Scrivener in particular is a "you don't need it until you realize you really need it" kind of program. I'm happy with what I've got for now. Maybe someday when I get paid for my writing I'll put my first $50 towards Scrivener (hah)
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Jul 26, 2016 22:38
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If you want to try out something very similar to Scrivener without spending money, yWriter5 is still free.
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Jul 27, 2016 02:23
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Scrivener has been a godsend for me because I can keep the manuscript drafts, query drafts, synopsis drafts, and cut material all in the same document. Also I have outlines and character details I can refer back to with a single click if I ever forget something, rather than having to hunt through some other folder or something.
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Jul 27, 2016 05:44
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Echo Cian posted:If you want to try out something very similar to Scrivener without spending money, yWriter5 is still free. Is there any reason I'd want to use yWriter5 over yWriter6? Edit: I just saw that Scrivener offers a decent discount for NaNoWriMo participants and winners, and I'm planning to do that later this year, so maybe I'll just grab it then, or pick up the free demo a little before November to see if it clicks with me.
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Jul 28, 2016 00:39
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MockingQuantum posted:Is there any reason I'd want to use yWriter5 over yWriter6? I don't know, I only used 5 before 6 existed.
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Jul 28, 2016 02:48
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I have a question about research. In the internet age it's pretty easy to find information on like physics and historical events, but what do I do if I want to know something more... Trivial? What I mean is, in this example, I have this story rattling in my head where the main character is a Lithuanian immigrant going to an American community college. Only, because I'm a non-student in Germany, I have no idea what her actual day-to-day experience would be like. Things like: What would a regular day's schedule look like? What small daily challenges is she likely to encounter? What's it like for a relatively poor/financially insecure person to try and get an education in America? How do I best go about googling for questions about lived experience? Also: I just finished a 7000-word story and would like to get feedback for it, is it ok if I make a thread for it or is that more length than most people in this forum would bother reading?
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Jul 28, 2016 12:10
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Terry van Feleday posted:I have a question about research. In the internet age it's pretty easy to find information on like physics and historical events, but what do I do if I want to know something more... Trivial? Googling? Dude, talk to people! In real life, if you can at all, or phone/email/internet if you simply cannot find anyone. This is not something you google for research, this is something you ask human beings about.
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Jul 28, 2016 12:43
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Terry van Feleday posted:I have a question about research. In the internet age it's pretty easy to find information on like physics and historical events, but what do I do if I want to know something more... Trivial? Can't comment on story, but I can talk research. I can't tell you how to google, but I can tell you about my experience looking for similar information: I once needed information on Norwegians, so I asked one personally (online), he answered many of my questions, and also recommended that I watch Lilyhammer. It was actually good advice. So for this, I personally try to 1) find a relevant native to talk to, or failing that, 2) find some relevant media and glean what I can. Ideally both. I'm also an American who's been to community college, so you can PM me if you like.
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Jul 28, 2016 12:49
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Yes, definitely post it in a thread of its own.
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Jul 28, 2016 13:06
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Danknificent posted:So for this, I personally try to 1) find a relevant native to talk to, or failing that, 2) find some relevant media and glean what I can. Ideally both. And yeah, I posted a thread.
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Jul 28, 2016 19:16
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I have what is likely a very stupid question about horror writing, but bear with me. I have a bunch of ideas for short horror stories, but none of them are intrinsically all that frightening/suspenseful/terrifying. Is it possible that I could craft them to be any or all of the above as I move through drafts and edit them, or is an unfrightening core idea never going to be very bone-chilling? I'm planning on writing all of my ideas anyway, since I'm pretty new to writing seriously and need the experience, but I kinda want to know what I should be shooting for.
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Jul 30, 2016 00:28
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I think Stephen King said once that the key to horror is taking something and asking "how can I make this worse?" And then ratcheting that up over the course of the story. Carrie is about bullying, and Pet Semetary is about grief, and those are really mundane concepts really.
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Jul 30, 2016 00:52
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MockingQuantum posted:I have what is likely a very stupid question about horror writing, but bear with me. I have a bunch of ideas for short horror stories, but none of them are intrinsically all that frightening/suspenseful/terrifying. Is it possible that I could craft them to be any or all of the above as I move through drafts and edit them, or is an unfrightening core idea never going to be very bone-chilling? I'm planning on writing all of my ideas anyway, since I'm pretty new to writing seriously and need the experience, but I kinda want to know what I should be shooting for. Horror doesn't necessarily have to terrify people, it just has to incorporate elements and structures that people associate with the genre (often aesthetic spookiness) in an enjoyable way. If your goal is to scare people and you don't think your ideas are scary, you may have to escalate your ideas. If you just want to write horror, the scare-bar for entry to the genre is very low. As long as your stories engage, you don't have to literally make people afraid. A little spookiness is enough to get you through the door, and general-purpose suspense is also a good substitute for groundbreaking horror hooks.
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Jul 30, 2016 01:23
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Danknificent posted:Horror doesn't necessarily have to terrify people, it just has to incorporate elements and structures that people associate with the genre (often aesthetic spookiness) in an enjoyable way. If your goal is to scare people and you don't think your ideas are scary, you may have to escalate your ideas. If you just want to write horror, the scare-bar for entry to the genre is very low. As long as your stories engage, you don't have to literally make people afraid. A little spookiness is enough to get you through the door, and general-purpose suspense is also a good substitute for groundbreaking horror hooks. Thanks, that gives me a better picture. The bulk of advice I'm finding online amounts to "start by writing believable and robust characters and settings, and the rest will tend to follow." I think this is an indicator that I just need to read more (or more varied) horror to calibrate my expectations too.
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Jul 30, 2016 01:33
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HIJK posted:I think Stephen King said once that the key to horror is taking something and asking "how can I make this worse?" And then ratcheting that up over the course of the story. Carrie is about bullying, and Pet Semetary is about grief, and those are really mundane concepts really. Threaten a character we care about.
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Jul 30, 2016 02:52
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This is a long shot, but I'm not sure where else to ask. Maybe five or six years ago I read a short story online and I want to find it again. The only thing I remember is that it had a group of people going through a post-apocalyptic America and there was a Starbucks involved (I think it was a Starbucks, could have been a Wal-Mart or McDonald's or something). That sounds pretty generic, but it was really good, really witty and fresh. It's likely I found it on the SA forums in the first place, so does this ring any bells at all?
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Jul 30, 2016 09:55
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Consider trying the Identify that Story/Book thread https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=2704537&pagenumber=118#lastpost
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Jul 30, 2016 13:29
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MockingQuantum posted:I have what is likely a very stupid question about horror writing, but bear with me. I have a bunch of ideas for short horror stories, but none of them are intrinsically all that frightening/suspenseful/terrifying. Is it possible that I could craft them to be any or all of the above as I move through drafts and edit them, or is an unfrightening core idea never going to be very bone-chilling? I'm planning on writing all of my ideas anyway, since I'm pretty new to writing seriously and need the experience, but I kinda want to know what I should be shooting for. The core I use when I'm thinking about a horror story is breaking a rule that's taken for granted. For instance, in John Carpenter's The Thing, the idea that you can trust someone is broken by The Thing's ability to mimic people and The Thing itself breaks a lot of biological rules. Home invasion thrillers break the rules of being safe in your home. Evil Dead 2 practically lives on weird stuff happening that shouldn't. The most recent horror story I wrote was about being forced to feel a certain emotion, which breaks the rule that your emotions are your own, and played up the uncanny valley angle with the monster, which is breaking a lot of rules we have as humans about how creatures should act. That's how I handle horror on a concept level. When it comes to tension, I think that's more about focus, established stakes, that sort of thing.
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Jul 30, 2016 14:21
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Danknificent posted:Consider trying the Identify that Story/Book thread Good call, thanks!
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Jul 30, 2016 17:11
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