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Pornographic Memory posted:I wonder if it would be possible for somebody to mod in a combined Beastmen and Chaos Warriors army for campaign. It would probably be broken as gently caress, but both armies would cover each other's weaknesses pretty well and just be fun as hell. Having a bunch of cheap Gors throw themselves on the enemy from vanguard deployment to cover an advancing line of Chaos Warriors backed by minotaurs and Hellcannons, actually having archers and light melee cavalry as Chaos... A mixed Beastmen, Warriors, and Demons army would likely be broken as gently caress for player use, but a great final boss opponent.
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Jul 30, 2016 19:30
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I want there to be in the end some kind of ridiculous Battle of the Eight Armies scenario that is just an utter clusterfuck that crashes 80% of computers.
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Jul 30, 2016 19:36
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nopantsjack posted:Enjoy throwing axe centigors! I guess there's always going to be a bit of that League of Legends dynamic to this game. When new factions come out they'll be overpowered, until the first patch afterwards.
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Jul 30, 2016 19:52
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Dandywalken posted:No they're good, and also a buncha sluts from down below in Castle Greyskull. 
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Jul 30, 2016 19:56
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IanTheM posted:I guess there's always going to be a bit of that League of Legends dynamic to this game. When new factions come out they'll be overpowered, until the first patch afterwards. They probably aren't actually broken IMO. They have a few really stupid strong things, but their whole line in general is either ridiculously expensive or super fragile, they aren't too hard to beat so long as you aren't focused super hard on trying to kill gorebulls with 2 potions or something.
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Jul 30, 2016 20:20
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nopantsjack posted:I just got finished playing a beastman campaign where I could recruit chaos units. Thanks. Hopefully we'll see a full fledged Hordes of Chaos mod letting you combine everything from both armies...and also not have infighting.
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Jul 30, 2016 20:46
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IanTheM posted:I guess there's always going to be a bit of that League of Legends dynamic to this game. When new factions come out they'll be overpowered, until the first patch afterwards. I'd rather they fix the vanilla armies first but its nice that they appear to be learning, the beastmen play a lot more like some of the good mod overhauls for the vanilla teams, i.e. they are very focussed on one thing which they do well, their monsters are appropriately killy and their magic is strong. They really didn't need the strongest magic in the game though, fixing a lot of things and further breaking something already broken is classic CA though.
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Jul 30, 2016 20:53
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Just finished my first beastmen grand campaign with a short victory, and i give them A+ will burn the world again. In what i can only imagine is the greatest drunk roadtrip ever, Khazrak took his bros out for a round trip around the mountain chain seperating Brettonia and the Empire,burning across Estalia, Brettonia and finishing with the capital, then rounding the corner and burn through the port city, Reiksland, Nuln etc all the way to blackfire pass. Decided to go south since zombies smell bad and missed the right turn and ended up somewhere in the badlands. Around here the second beastlord probably sobered up enough to say "dude, gently caress the dwarfs" and turned around and went down to party with the border princes and Tilea(Literally party with their dead bodies that is). Around here i noticed that oops Brettonia had survided but that lovely ratswamp was in the way so we headed up towards Athel Loren and took the scenic mountain route, cutting some corners with the beastpaths and snacking on dwarfs on the way. Ended up in the Reiksland again and hi-fived Sigvald and his broes here, though the had brought the everdork with them. Ended up with the beastmen and warriors going full Horde of Chaos mode on what was left from the first pass. Last battle i went with an army of shamans, 2 gorebulls, 4 minotaurs, 2 cygors and a shiton of bestigors because gently caress yeah beastmen. Tactics was gently caress tactics, charge everything until it dies horribly! Now i guess i will have to go and kill those dwarfs though but gently caress me they are annoying. Edit: This was on Hard. Noir89 fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Jul 30, 2016 |
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Jul 30, 2016 21:13
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Is there a difficulty on what changes come with the various difficulty levels? I only found this vague overview and a bunch of reddit posts guestimating that Normal might actually be handicapping enemy units instead of being an even playing field.
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Jul 30, 2016 21:34
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Solution to all dwarfen problems: minotaurs with great weapons. Holy poo poo I almost feel sorry for the little fucks.
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Jul 30, 2016 21:59
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Gonkish posted:Solution to all dwarfen problems: minotaurs with great weapons. Holy poo poo I almost feel sorry for the little fucks. Great Weapons on minotaurs don't actually give them any additional AP damage, they just add a bonus vs. large. It's really a silly oversight with regards to their regular naming scheme. So regular minotaurs would kill dwarfs just as quickly (actually even a bit better because they've slightly higher melee attack), and shielded ones might even be all around the best to weather the hail of crossbow bolts.
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Jul 30, 2016 22:21
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There any mods to allow me to use slow combat speed on legendary difficulty? Slow mode (and pause) is nice for being able to do some micro. I like playing on legendary aside from that one thing.
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Jul 30, 2016 22:49
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can you raise your income with a horde army or is it stuck at 2500?
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Jul 30, 2016 22:49
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Randler posted:Is there a difficulty on what changes come with the various difficulty levels? I only found this vague overview and a bunch of reddit posts guestimating that Normal might actually be handicapping enemy units instead of being an even playing field. Well I suppose there's a reason why the "Hard" difficulty is in the middle of the slider. Considering the fluidity with which the AI is able to use skirmishers and light cavalry, it's not surprising to me. I imagine you could use Cheat Engine to determine the differences if you had the time.
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Jul 30, 2016 22:53
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Descar posted:can you raise your income with a horde army or is it stuck at 2500? Chaos has a money building, but all Beastmen can do is lower upkeep or raid.
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Jul 30, 2016 22:54
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just fought my favorite battle ever. my Grimgor and a stack with nothing but black orcs, some boar boys, and big uns vs beastmen and a brayherd, underway. just two armies designed the smash into each other in a narrow space. it was a bloodbath, but Grimgor is indeed the greatest. unrelated, but The Fall of Man quest battle is also really fun. Wish there were more things like it in other campaigns. Jamwad Hilder fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Jul 30, 2016 |
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Jul 30, 2016 23:18
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Yukitsu posted:Got any replays? I may be able to toss in some advice for you there. Sure. These are my present set ups against Brets and Orcs. https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxL-q9Tcsh-aMDFXai1GRHkxSVk/view?usp=sharing
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Jul 30, 2016 23:34
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Does the AI research bonuses etc like players do? Would you have to worry about insane leadership Beastmen in lategame vs them in the campaign?
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Jul 31, 2016 01:22
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It just now occurred to me that Space Marine Dante is the 40K analogue of Balthazar Gelt. 
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Jul 31, 2016 02:33
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I just started a campaign as Balthazar and his spell seemed to literally do nothing. We're talking zero kills here. Did they just fail to fix a bug or something? I mean, how can this be working as intended? He literally just stands there and looks pretty during combat.
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Jul 31, 2016 03:10
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It's a hp thing, his spells do damage but tiny amounts to different units. It helps, but not a lot. Gelt is poo poo
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Jul 31, 2016 03:14
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Helion posted:I just started a campaign as Balthazar and his spell seemed to literally do nothing. We're talking zero kills here. Did they just fail to fix a bug or something? I mean, how can this be working as intended? He literally just stands there and looks pretty during combat. Gelt is the worst LL in the game, because he specializes in Lore of Metal which is still the shittiest magic lore after two patches for mysterious reasons. Searing Doom in particular actually got (Kind of?) buffed, it covers a wider area than before and the missiles splash more so they actually hit things occasionally, however each projectile is about as damaging as a lovely arrow and is too spread out to kill anyone barring a miracle, it just shaves off a few HPs here and there.
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Jul 31, 2016 03:21
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madmac posted:Gelt is the worst LL in the game, because he specializes in Lore of Metal which is still the shittiest magic lore after two patches for mysterious reasons. I wonder if they need to make it do morale damage or something, because at this point it's pointless.
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Jul 31, 2016 04:00
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On the plus side it feels like mortars are really strong now.
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Jul 31, 2016 04:09
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stopgap1 posted:I wonder if they need to make it do morale damage or something, because at this point it's pointless. What they need to do is turn it back into a magic missile, like it is on the drat tabletop. Or if they absolutely have to model the individual shards to distinguish it from the other magic missile spells, turn it into a breath-type attack like 'eadbutt and have it spawn X shards that then fly forward to fill the cone, like a magic shotgun. That way, even if a shard misses one target, it could conceivably hit the guy behind him. And buff final transmutation back to vanilla strength. Jesus CA, metal is already the worst lore. What about it made you look and go "yeah, this needs nerfs"?
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Jul 31, 2016 04:10
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It's weird how they saw fate of bjuna, realized it was too powerful and then next patch made devolve the way it is. I think people find the magic more enjoyable when it's based on your positioning or requires something to take advantage of the temporary weakness, it's not all that fun when it's a point and click debuff that obliterates your elite units and it's spammable. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 04:40 on Jul 31, 2016 |
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Jul 31, 2016 04:35
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Just finished the eye for an eye campaign. It was pretty fun, though I would say the ability to constantly ambush armies everywhere made it pretty easy. I could not do the 'ultimate' finish since the other beastmen herds mostly died out on their own, and the few who did survive never even considered confederating with me no matter what I did. I can't say I'm a fan of the 'confederate 2 herds' victory condition, since it seems kind of random if they will every actually accept or not.
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Jul 31, 2016 04:42
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Mukip posted:Sure. These are my present set ups against Brets and Orcs. Those are wins. :p Makes it a bit moot to give advice if you win.
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Jul 31, 2016 05:15
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After doing some testing, I'm almost convinced Wild Magic is just kind of hosed in general. Devolve is ludicrously broken, most of the other spells are, uh, Interesting. Notes on Wild Magic: Mantle is a rad super strong single target buff that sounds scary because it inflicts damage on the buffed unit. This is also pretty much bullshit, the damage isn't applied at all until the buff ends (The buff lasts almost a full minute, mind.) and then it's totally negligible, like ~450 HP. Bray Scream seems like an experiment in how useless you can make a breath type spell. Granted it costs like 6 mana, but it pretty much literally does nothing, about 200 HP off a single unit in a clean hit, and zero disruption, the units hit by the spell just kinda sidestep very briefly like they caught a whiff of a mildly unpleasant fart. The overcast version adds a completely pointless amount of AP damage, climbing the dizzying heights of doing like 300 HPs worth of total damage per unit hit, maybe. Viletide also does lovely damage, but it's still probably the third or fourth best spell purely for the huge amount of cheap disruption it does. Dropping the explosion dead center on a unit does about 300 HP, roughly double that if you overcast (about half of which is AP.) In most cases the damage is totally ignorable but it can do acceptable damage with extremely closely packed units, like siege battles, and it has a pretty good morale hit in addition to chucking units everywhere. It's a decent spell as long as you aren't expecting it to kill anything. Traitor Kin sells itself as a damage spell attached to a speed debuff, this is, unsurprisingly, also bullshit. It's a 12 second speed debuff that inflicts ~400 HP per unit. Overcasting doubles the speed debuff (still 12 seconds though) and raises the damage to a staggering 600 HP. I tested it on both Single model and normal units, that whole "Less effective against multiple combatants) bit in the tooltip is exactly as bullshit as...every other spell that has that tooltip, actually. TLDR: Devolve is straight broken, the passive buff, Savage Dominion and Mantle are all super great, Viletide is ok, Traitor Kin should only ever be used for the (very brief) speed debuff, and Bray Scream is 1000% useless. madmac fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Jul 31, 2016 |
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Jul 31, 2016 05:22
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drat Dirty Ape posted:Just finished the eye for an eye campaign. It was pretty fun, though I would say the ability to constantly ambush armies everywhere made it pretty easy. I could not do the 'ultimate' finish since the other beastmen herds mostly died out on their own, and the few who did survive never even considered confederating with me no matter what I did. I can't say I'm a fan of the 'confederate 2 herds' victory condition, since it seems kind of random if they will every actually accept or not. It's my understanding that Confederation requires a positive relationship (to any degree) and a difference in relative strength (to a huge degree). It's typically easy to do this with non-Horde factions because whenever the AI gets its army wiped, its empty cities will happily Confederate with you. Obviously that's not an option with Beastmen in the mini-campaign because army wipe = elimination, so you have to just be hugely powerful to convince them.
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Jul 31, 2016 05:23
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Helion posted:I just started a campaign as Balthazar and his spell seemed to literally do nothing. We're talking zero kills here. Did they just fail to fix a bug or something? I mean, how can this be working as intended? He literally just stands there and looks pretty during combat. While searing doom is weak(but cheap), its one of the spells that won't register kills, same with Bjuna and Devolve, like I've literally seen Malagor single handily take out 80% of the enemy army before they routed and still showed him with 0 kills despite the ground being littered with corpses from Devolve overcasting.
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Jul 31, 2016 05:24
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Some follow-up testing with Lore of Beasts, shorter this time because it's way less janky in general. Amber Spear most closely resembles fireball except better (also more expensive.) It's essentially a laser beam with high AP damage, it pierces units very effectively and is just generally really good and badass looking. Nothing to add about the buff/debuff spells, they seem to work entirely as described, ditto the Manticore summon. Flock of Doom is kinda like a more reasonable Devolve, it does "only" about 500/1500 HP damage, which sounds semi-reasonable until you note the very low winds cost and cooldown. It's also literally Final Transmutation but better in every way, Final Transmutation overcast costs roughly twice as much winds with a smaller aoe and 33% less damage, because there is no end to how much CA shits on Lore of Metal in this game. Overall Beast is a really solid lore, aside from Flock of Doom being at least borderline OP I don't have anything negative to say about it and all the spells are solid to good.
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Jul 31, 2016 05:42
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Just wrapped up Eye For An Eye - it was a fun campaign and a good model of how CA can add value to race DLC in the future. It'd be nice to have been able to play as Todbringer and Middenheim but I understand the map as-is wouldn't contain much to do for an Empire faction. It's designed around being a slaughter playground for Beastmen and it worked perfectly for that. Just going to chime in that I also failed to confederate two tribes before the end, leaving me high and dry for the ultimate victory. I was having fun so I pushed on and wiped out the remaining human factions just to be thorough, but once Hochland was done I just quit. They really should have either made the brayherds respawn or make confederation the quest reward for impressing them. Otherwise they just wander off and get themselves killed. On to the grand campaign - going to start with Malagor.
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Jul 31, 2016 06:57
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I don't know how many other spells do this but overcasting Viletide gives it something like 600m range. Useful in campaign when you get Malagor to reinforce. It feels pretty great to snipe a unit from across the map just as its bracing for a charge. Or just mess with units on the walls in a siege.
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Jul 31, 2016 06:58
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The only thing I wish for in this game is chaos dwarves. Is there any indication that the madman assyrian/babylonians will ever be put in?
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Jul 31, 2016 07:48
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I can't imagine them being put in as their own faction, but there's a chance there'll be some update that adds units to every faction, and chaos dwarves would be a good addition to the chaos faction.
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Jul 31, 2016 07:53
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NewMars posted:The only thing I wish for in this game is chaos dwarves. Is there any indication that the madman assyrian/babylonians will ever be put in? The data miners who found the "wh_dlc03_bst_beastmen" stuff also found "wh_dlc13_chd_chaos_dwarfs" files, among others, so it seems that Chaos Dwarves were at the very least in the planning at one point.
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Jul 31, 2016 08:11
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Dartonus posted:The data miners who found the "wh_dlc03_bst_beastmen" stuff also found "wh_dlc13_chd_chaos_dwarfs" files, among others, so it seems that Chaos Dwarves were at the very least in the planning at one point. As has been brought up, datamining showed a lot of planned DLC Races
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Jul 31, 2016 08:24
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Wood elves are next in the unlikely condition that the listings were accurate, right?
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Jul 31, 2016 08:29
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Dandywalken posted:Wood elves are next in the unlikely condition that the listings were accurate, right? Yup, which makes sense, that's what all those impenetrable forests are for.
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Jul 31, 2016 08:31
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