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This "wink wink, nudge nudge" poo poo needs to get knocked off. I'm making my way through Dark Souls 2 now and I have to say, I agree with Geop's adjustment that sword-and-boarding just feels much, much worse than it used to, and mobility definitely feels more vital.
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Jul 31, 2016 07:40
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1. find a cool moveset. 2. 2-hand or dual-wield that weapon. 3. try rolling double nine fucked around with this message at 11:10 on Jul 31, 2016 |
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Jul 31, 2016 10:50
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Yeah, 2 is very much the dodger's game. There are some areas where having a shield helps a lot but I don't think it's ever as important as in 1 where you wanted to lug one around just in case something will try to take a potshot at you.
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Jul 31, 2016 11:25
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Fister Roboto posted:Actually I think not showing it off is the better choice because now it's going to drive people crazy. I hate you so much right now.  Also, make that two things that I can think of that fit the bill. But still. Yeah, Dark Souls 2 shields are generally not that useful any more as actual shields unless you're parrying things. Aside from that the only way you'll block anything reasonably well is if you pull out a greatshield. But even then, a number of enemies have moves dedicated to guard breaks, and holding up your shield all the time in PvP is really asking for a bad time. The kick from other games is now a slower arm strike move that is a guaranteed guard break if it hits a shield. Although this also works on PvE enemies... most of the time.
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Jul 31, 2016 18:32
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I don't know, I still found shields useful. They weren't as overpowered, but against reasonable impacts they did their job. But then, I'm a dirty caster player.
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Jul 31, 2016 19:33
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Shields aren't high-stability magic wands that make all your problems go away anymore, but they'll still make sure that the next hit doesn't utterly obliterate you if you try and roll too late, and that's often all they need to be.
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Jul 31, 2016 19:43
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double nine posted:1. find a cool moveset. I wasn't complaining or anything, I just think it's funny that Vicas remarked DS2 has enemies which are "gently caress you" to certain playstyles, when the entire game is a "gently caress you" to DS1's most popular playstyle 
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Jul 31, 2016 20:02
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Paracelsus posted:Shields aren't high-stability magic wands that make all your problems go away anymore, but they'll still make sure that the next hit doesn't utterly obliterate you if you try and roll too late, and that's often all they need to be. Yeah, against physical-only enemies, shields are a real help. I'd never want to fight Heide Knights without one, for example.
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Jul 31, 2016 21:28
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Paracelsus posted:Shields aren't high-stability magic wands that make all your problems go away anymore, but they'll still make sure that the next hit doesn't utterly obliterate you if you try and roll too late, and that's often all they need to be. Except for Greatshields. They make all my problems go away. Even the financial ones!
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Jul 31, 2016 22:54
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oh yes oh god yes form the head FORM THE HEAD unghhhh...
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Beamed posted:I wasn't complaining or anything, I just think it's funny that Vicas remarked DS2 has enemies which are "gently caress you" to certain playstyles, when the entire game is a "gently caress you" to DS1's most popular playstyle Nah, DS2 was more of a dick move. Bloodborne was a "gently caress you" to DS1's most popular playstyle. The only shield in the game literally makes fun of you in the description for wanting to use one.
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Aug 1, 2016 00:52
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Like the armor Geop just found?
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Aug 1, 2016 01:32
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I'm a dirty shield turtleman and I have had minimal problems with my playstyle so ...  ?
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Aug 1, 2016 02:49
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SynthOrange posted:Like the armor Geop just found? Yes, actually, now that you mention it. I think heavy armor probably got screwed harder in DS2 than shields did, considering the number of enemies/bosses whose attacks simply ignore armor.
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Aug 1, 2016 02:54
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KieranWalker posted:I think heavy armor probably got screwed harder in DS2 than shields did, considering the number of enemies/bosses whose attacks simply ignore armor. That said, there is a boss fight later in this game that I made much easier for myself by switching to heavy armor.
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Aug 1, 2016 03:39
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I always felt heavy armor is a good choice if you feel no need to dodge roll like a pure turtling build, or if you're confident in killing your enemy before they hit/stun you. This is how I first played DS2 since I didn't get adaptability since I played through without looking up anything so I thought dodging wasn't very useful, I was dead wrong but I didn't have a hard time playing through after finding a good gently caress off armor and shield combination.
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Aug 1, 2016 04:28
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KieranWalker posted:Yes, actually, now that you mention it. I think heavy armor probably got screwed harder in DS2 than shields did, considering the number of enemies/bosses whose attacks simply ignore armor. Wait, seriously? Armour ignore is a thing in this game? That's... kind of unreasonable. But Dark Souls 2 does still have Poise, at least, which still has its uses. MGlBlaze fucked around with this message at 05:14 on Aug 1, 2016 |
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Aug 1, 2016 05:10
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MGlBlaze posted:Wait, seriously? Armour ignore is a thing in this game? That's... kind of unreasonable. It's more that certain attacks have multiple elements attached to them so they'll always deal a bunch of damage even if you have armor with a ton of, say, fire resist on it (because then it doesn't have a ton of magic/physical defense, so lots of magic/physical damage of that attack gets through.)
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Aug 1, 2016 05:23
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MGlBlaze posted:Wait, seriously? Armour ignore is a thing in this game? That's... kind of unreasonable. There do exist ways to auto-break your shield, but then again if you're always holding your shield up against someone then you're inviting them to break your guard.
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Aug 1, 2016 05:47
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Geops co-commentators should remind him more often that most illusory walls are activated with the use button and not by hitting. Then again, there would be no reason for me to scream at my screen anymore, so  .
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Aug 1, 2016 07:37
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Anime Reference posted:Heavy armor has never been all that good in the Souls games as far as I know (I never played Demon's Souls so maybe it's better there.) I have it on good authority that wearing the Giant's Set made you unstoppable. IronSaber posted:Except for Greatshields. They make all my problems go away. Even the financial ones! Greatshields can be great, but for comparison in DS 1 a +5 Silver Knight Shield had 76 stability, a +15 Kite Shield had 72, a +15 Eagle Shield had 84, and the GSoA had 88. In DS2, a +10 Royal Kite Shield has 58 stability, a +10 Twin Dragon (aka Eagle) Shield has 73, and a +5 Dragonrider shield has 75. Greatshields in DS2 have comparable stability to medium shields in DS1.
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Aug 1, 2016 07:46
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Rubberduke posted:Geops co-commentators should remind him more often that most illusory walls are activated with the use button and not by hitting. Then again, there would be no reason for me to scream at my screen anymore, so The dumb thing is that there are walls that break that rule, and you open them by hitting them. We've even seen one example in the LP already. The room where Geop had the staredown with the crystal lizard was accessed by attacking the wall. Likewise, anything you activate with a Pharros Lockstone is attacked. The game is really inconsistent with it, because I dunno, Dark Souls 2? Paracelsus posted:I have it on good authority that wearing the Giant's Set made you unstoppable. Memes aside, this was kinda-sorta the case for both DS1 and 2. While heavy armor isn't super useful in PvE, but it WILL reduce damage taken and make you stagger less. The value of armor in PvE is kinda lessened by how good both rolling and blocking are, though. But it gets completely different in PvP, where you can easily punish blocks and rolls, you have to deal with latency, etc. Poise gets even more important so that fast weapons wont stunlock you to death, and a full set of upgraded super-heavy armor (think like DS1 Havel's set or the DS1 Giant set) will heavily reduce damage. I'm not an expert on the matter, but there are probably calculation differences that make armor matter more vs. players than NPC enemies. In both DS1 and 2, high level PvP is eventually dominated by dudes in absurdly heavy armor. Attestant fucked around with this message at 07:57 on Aug 1, 2016 |
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Aug 1, 2016 07:50
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It's because that wasnt an illusory wall, just a substandard wall. Illusory, push button, substandard, push over.
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Aug 1, 2016 07:52
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Attestant posted:But it gets completely different in PvP, where you can easily punish blocks and rolls, you have to deal with latency, etc. Poise gets even more important so that fast weapons wont stunlock you to death, and a full set of upgraded super-heavy armor (think like DS1 Havel's set or the DS1 Giant set) will heavily reduce damage. I'm not an expert on the matter, but there are probably calculation differences that make armor matter more vs. players than NPC enemies. I imagine there probably is some calculation difference for PvP. I did some Dark Souls 2 PvP both back when it was sorta new and recently. It's not a very fun experience when a dude is rocking the highest stat armour in the game. It actually makes them incredibly difficult to kill. Especially since you can stack buffs in this game - which isn't nearly as common any more, but it ends up pushing things into being ridiculous. I know the idea of "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em" but I care about Fashion Souls way too much to be able to load up on that ugly poo poo. But it also means I invariably lose to them because I'm not all that good at PvP. Also I would rather not spread the cancer, if I could avoid it. EponymousMrYar posted:It's more that certain attacks have multiple elements attached to them so they'll always deal a bunch of damage even if you have armor with a ton of, say, fire resist on it (because then it doesn't have a ton of magic/physical defense, so lots of magic/physical damage of that attack gets through.) Good to know, thanks. Kind of an odd point, considering in Dark Souls 1 multi-type attacks tended to be weaker since you were dealing with multiple defence stats. I imagine this is another example of defences just scaling differently than you'd think in this game. I did some searching and apparently the formula for physical damage is; Damage = (AR – (DEF * 0.1)) * 5/6 * MOD Where AR = Attack Rating DEF = Specific Physical Defense (Strike / Slash / Thrust) MOD = Attack specific Swing Modifier I can't seem to find anything for elemental damage, unfortunately. But the fact that any given defence only counts for one tenth of what it actually is probably has something to do with needing to go to such ridiculous extremes for significant damage reduction - and it's a linear scale, so there isn't much reason not to at that point. MGlBlaze fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Aug 1, 2016 |
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Aug 1, 2016 13:54
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MGlBlaze posted:I imagine there probably is some calculation difference for PvP. I did some Dark Souls 2 PvP both back when it was sorta new and recently. It's not a very fun experience when a dude is rocking the highest stat armour in the game. It actually makes them incredibly difficult to kill. Especially since you can stack buffs in this game - which isn't nearly as common any more, but it ends up pushing things into being ridiculous. There's actually an item (that we'll see way, way later in to the LP, discussing it further would be spoilers) that made heavy armor builds in DS2 a lot less common. There was a period where if you were level 120+, like good 80% of the fights would be against somebody in ridiculous heavy armor. It was still really popular right up until DS3's release, but thankfully there was a lot more variety than right after launch.
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Aug 1, 2016 14:09
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I miss Giantdad.
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Aug 1, 2016 14:40
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Paracelsus posted:I have it on good authority that wearing the Giant's Set made you unstoppable. Do those numbers even mean the same thing between games? Given the pile of new stats, there are probably differences in the calculations using them.
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Aug 1, 2016 15:07
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I very vaguely recall stability being a percentage figure. A 75 stability shield would use half the stamina a 50 stability shield would use to block, and a 100 stability shield would never cost anything to block at all.
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Aug 1, 2016 15:13
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LeftistMuslimObama posted:Do those numbers even mean the same thing between games? Given the pile of new stats, there are probably differences in the calculations using them. Stability the stat is exactly the same as it was in DS1.
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Aug 1, 2016 15:19
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Grayshift posted:I very vaguely recall stability being a percentage figure. A 75 stability shield would use half the stamina a 50 stability shield would use to block, and a 100 stability shield would never cost anything to block at all. Correct. If something hits you and you block it, it does X Stamina 'damage'. So if it did 100 Stamina damage and you had a 50 stability shield, you would lose 50 stamina instead of 100. I wish more stats were as easy to math out as Stability
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Aug 1, 2016 15:26
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Rubberduke posted:Geops co-commentators should remind him more often that most illusory walls are activated with the use button and not by hitting. Then again, there would be no reason for me to scream at my screen anymore, so Kuvo posted:Please stop telling Geop to press A on walls, I get a chuckle every time he bonks his mace against one. RBA Starblade posted:I miss Giantdad. Speaking of Giantdad some dood on deviantart sculpted and made a cast of it.   http://mongrelman.deviantart.com/art/Giant-Dad-mask-and-Hood-Numero-Deuce-600577598
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Aug 1, 2016 17:46
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Kuvo posted:Speaking of Giantdad some dood on deviantart sculpted and made a cast of it. That's
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Aug 1, 2016 17:57
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MGlBlaze posted:Good to know, thanks. Going back to multi-typed damage, EponymousMrYar was referring to the reverse of what you're thinking of. The idea you're thinking of was that splitting some of your physical damage off into elemental damage was a poor idea in the late game or NG+ because elemental resistances got high enough, such that you actually did less damage through the process of damage reduction being checked for each component. But what he's referring to is to split some part of elemental damage into physical damage, which is harder to be resistant to. Recall how abyss spells were pretty good at damaging folks in DS1? Same principle.
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Aug 1, 2016 19:00
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Kuvo posted:Speaking of Giantdad some dood on deviantart sculpted and made a cast of it. That is absolutely glorious! NGDBSS posted:Going back to multi-typed damage, EponymousMrYar was referring to the reverse of what you're thinking of. The idea you're thinking of was that splitting some of your physical damage off into elemental damage was a poor idea in the late game or NG+ because elemental resistances got high enough, such that you actually did less damage through the process of damage reduction being checked for each component. But what he's referring to is to split some part of elemental damage into physical damage, which is harder to be resistant to. Recall how abyss spells were pretty good at damaging folks in DS1? Same principle. I think the finer points of the distinction between those two are lost on me. I think I get the general idea of what you guys meant now at least, though.
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Aug 1, 2016 19:58
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MGlBlaze posted:I think the finer points of the distinction between those two are lost on me. I think I get the general idea of what you guys meant now at least, though. Actually the distinction is meaningless in the cases I'm talking about, because they're working off of enemy attacks. The attacks that are balanced to kill you really quick. You're right in that multi-element attacks are weaker because of dealing with multiple resistances, but 'weaker' to a boss usually means 'does 500 damage instead of 600 and will still kill you in 4 hits. Oh by the way 300 of it is magic and will chunk you through your shield, killing you in 8 hits through your block.' There's an optional boss later on that emphasizes this neatly and in a very painful way by utilizing a basic mechanic that the player can do, only with Boss Numbers to back it up.
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Aug 1, 2016 21:16
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Kuvo posted:Speaking of Giantdad some dood on deviantart sculpted and made a cast of it. Now i want GiantDad cosplay. Has to have all the elements, including the rings.
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Aug 1, 2016 21:34
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Frionnel posted:Now i want GiantDad cosplay. Has to have all the elements, including the rings. Good luck supporting the zwei when WWIIing.
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Aug 1, 2016 21:39
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Paracelsus posted:Good luck supporting the zwei when WWIIing. That's what the Havel's Ring is for. 
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Aug 1, 2016 21:47
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My favorite thing about Dark Souls 1 and how it handled multiple resistances is that just about everything that an enemy could do that looked like fire or lightning was secretly just magic so if you tried to equip a good fire shield to fight the Demon Firesage it'd just blow you up anyway.
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Aug 1, 2016 21:58
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Paracelsus posted:Good luck supporting the zwei when WWIIing. u mean the BASS CANNON right  http://mongrelman.deviantart.com/art/giant-dad-costume-wip-509673987
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Aug 1, 2016 22:42
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| # ? Jun 12, 2024 14:57 |
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 Short update! Needed a break-point for the remainder of the session and this worked out Next update will be a little early, probably.
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Aug 2, 2016 02:12
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