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straight up brolic posted:A bunch of apolitical, traditional "vote reds" that I know are changing from Trump to Hillary because he's a vile human being. A good friend of mine is a hardcore libertarian who's always voted right and he's begrudgingly voting for Hillary because he thinks Trump is an absolute conman. He would've begrudgingly voted for Cruz if he was the nominee even though he hated his religious stuff
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Aug 2, 2016 22:48
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H.P. Hovercraft posted:he's also a vietnamese flying ace I mean he's also an rear end in a top hat with terrible opinions and no political spine, on top of the Forrestal. He might be a "war hero" but that doesn't protect him from political criticism nor does it absolve him of the deaths on the Forrestal. Lightning Knight fucked around with this message at 22:52 on Aug 2, 2016 |
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Aug 2, 2016 22:49
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Clinton +3 in Arizona https://twitter.com/PpollingNumbers/status/760568942536585218?s=09
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Aug 2, 2016 22:49
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Ryan and McCain will be fine as long as this is as bad as Trump gets, so no worries.
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Aug 2, 2016 22:49
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:Haven't seen it posted -- here are the numbers ($$$) that the Hilldawg rasied in July: She raised about 9 million of that in 24 hours after her acceptance speech.
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Aug 2, 2016 22:50
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a shameful boehner posted:"The Myth of the Robber Barons" I'm surprised they didn't include the entire "Politically Incorrect Guide to" series.
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Aug 2, 2016 22:50
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Most dem volunteers I've run into are middle aged or older women. Lots of retirees. Granted we are in a blue state and drive over to a swing state to canvass. Most have a very close understanding of who's running at local levels and have volunteered in 00, 04, 08, etc.
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Aug 2, 2016 22:52
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/teddyschleifer/status/759831235900248064 Donors to the Koch Brothers must be awful.
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Aug 2, 2016 22:53
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/teddyschleifer/status/759831235900248064 
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Aug 2, 2016 22:55
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theshim posted:Ugghhh I've spent too much time in the libertarian thread, I recognize so many of those names now
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Aug 2, 2016 22:56
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Lightning Knight posted:I mean he's also an rear end in a top hat with terrible opinions and no political spine, on top of the Forrestal. He might be a "war hero" but that doesn't protect him from political criticism nor does it absolve him of the deaths on the Forrestal. Isn't that one of those chain email legends?
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Aug 2, 2016 22:56
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that AZ pollster is only rated C+ on 538. still pretty funny for Clinton to be leading at all, in any poll, though
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Aug 2, 2016 23:03
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Lightning Knight posted:I mean he's also an rear end in a top hat with terrible opinions and no political spine, on top of the Forrestal. He might be a "war hero" but that doesn't protect him from political criticism nor does it absolve him of the deaths on the Forrestal. uhh how is the forrestal accident in any way mccain's fault
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Aug 2, 2016 23:04
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What kind of miserable people actually read all that stuff? I spend waaaaay too much time keeping up with politics, but I can barely tell you who my senators and representative is. I just do it for the schadenfreude. To donate a bunch of money then be given homework is crazy.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:04
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/teddyschleifer/status/759831235900248064 It's time for everyone's friendly reminder that Von Mises believed that observational data couldn't counter his theories, they were such pure underlying truths of the universe
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Aug 2, 2016 23:04
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Lightning Knight posted:Isn't John McCain the guy who only got anywhere because of nepotism and who actively caused the deaths of dozens of servicemen on the Forrestal and got away with it because nepotism?
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Aug 2, 2016 23:05
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Ryan's campaign has responded to Trump. https://twitter.com/jonward11/status/760595843816693760
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Aug 2, 2016 23:05
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From what I can tell McCain was involved in the incident but nothing in the wikipedia article says that its his fault, or he acted badly during it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1967_USS_Forrestal_fire
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Aug 2, 2016 23:06
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HorseRenoir posted:Clinton +3 in Arizona I was wondering whether to switch my voter registration to Maryland but gently caress that I'll keep in AZ for one more year and hope to be part of swinging it blue.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:06
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emdash posted:that AZ pollster is only rated C+ on 538. still pretty funny for Clinton to be leading at all, in any poll, though It's the only rated post-convention poll, though, so there's that
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Aug 2, 2016 23:07
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Relentlessboredomm posted:I was wondering whether to switch my voter registration to Maryland but gently caress that I'll keep in AZ for one more year and hope to be part of swinging it blue. that is a good idea, we in MD have things under control i'm sure
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Aug 2, 2016 23:07
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Popular Thug Drink posted:uhh how is the forrestal accident in any way mccain's fault It isn't. The Forrestal fire was caused by a short in the firing circuit of a Zuni rocket (not on McCain's plane). McCain was in the cockpit of his plane, which was near/in the flames. He managed to get out on the refueling probe and jump off, whereupon he went down to the squadron ready room and hung out, rather than assist in the damage control efforts. Certainly didn't cover himself in glory, but he wasn't culpable for the fire and loss of life.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:07
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Rise of the Warrior Cop? They do know that's anti police militarization right? They're True Believers so they probably thinking militarized police are suppressing true freedom or something
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Aug 2, 2016 23:09
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emdash posted:that is a good idea, we in MD have things under control i'm sure I have a disturbing number of acquaintances talking going third-party here in Baltimore. Guess their ancestry! Thankfully Maryland is safely Democrat, but it still makes me want to tear my hair out.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:12
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Aesop Poprock posted:A good friend of mine is a hardcore libertarian who's always voted right and he's begrudgingly voting for Hillary because he thinks Trump is an absolute conman. He would've begrudgingly voted for Cruz if he was the nominee even though he hated his religious stuff If he was that hardcore, wouldn't he vote Johnson or does he identify as Libertarian but always follows the "3rd party voting is a waste" rhetoric... or do the Libertarians not support libertarian ideals?
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Aug 2, 2016 23:12
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CarterUSM posted:It isn't. The Forrestal fire was caused by a short in the firing circuit of a Zuni rocket (not on McCain's plane). McCain was in the cockpit of his plane, which was near/in the flames. He managed to get out on the refueling probe and jump off, whereupon he went down to the squadron ready room and hung out, rather than assist in the damage control efforts. Certainly didn't cover himself in glory, but he wasn't culpable for the fire and loss of life. isn't that what a pilot is supposed to do? i dont want to spend a million bucks training a guy to fly a war plane only to have him die because he wanted to play firefighter
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Aug 2, 2016 23:14
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CarterUSM posted:It isn't. The Forrestal fire was caused by a short in the firing circuit of a Zuni rocket (not on McCain's plane). McCain was in the cockpit of his plane, which was near/in the flames. He managed to get out on the refueling probe and jump off, whereupon he went down to the squadron ready room and hung out, rather than assist in the damage control efforts. Certainly didn't cover himself in glory, but he wasn't culpable for the fire and loss of life. This is McCain's own account of what happened afterwards: quote:McCain, 1967 statement: I started running over towards him and I was near a group of men with a fire hose. As I was about 10 feet from him the first bomb exploded and blew me back about 15 feet. I sat up and saw a lot of bodies near me (some who had been on the hose) and I ran and jumped over the starboard cat walk [under the flight deck].
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Aug 2, 2016 23:14
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theshim posted:Ugghhh I've spent too much time in the libertarian thread, I recognize so many of those names now The only book I've read from that list is "Rise of the Warrior Cop: The Militarization of America's Police Forces." It's a critique of overly aggressive police tactics written by a libertarian author, with detailed research and valid concerns about why modern day police use military style overwhelming force against non-violent offenders. I think it was written before Ferguson. It might also be the only book praised by Ron Paul and Glenn Greenwald. One of the most interesting parts was the author looking into how tiny towns can easily get funding and equipment for a SWAT team, without having the need, leading to bored departments deploying undertrained officers unnecessarily and with tragic results. It's a good read, the author sticks to facts and I didn't think he espoused fringe views. I can't speak for anything else the author wrote, or any other books on that list.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:15
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emdash posted:that is a good idea, we in MD have things under control i'm sure Is there anything down ballot in Maryland that's going to be close? I haven't dug into the ballot measures and whatnot yet
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Aug 2, 2016 23:17
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CarterUSM posted:It isn't. The Forrestal fire was caused by a short in the firing circuit of a Zuni rocket (not on McCain's plane). McCain was in the cockpit of his plane, which was near/in the flames. He managed to get out on the refueling probe and jump off, whereupon he went down to the squadron ready room and hung out, rather than assist in the damage control efforts. Certainly didn't cover himself in glory, but he wasn't culpable for the fire and loss of life. Not even that, dude jumped into a pool of flaming fuel, got blown a few yards by the whole 'exploding bombs around him' thing, and still managed to run a hose around a bit. I think short of Steve Rodgers standards he did everything a rando soldier could. Like people say when talking about Trump poo poo talking him 'getting captured', there's tons of reasons to hate him for his actual actions and words, we don't need to invent genuinely pretty terrible lies about him.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:19
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Frabba posted:Ryan's campaign has responded to Trump. This will be the ultimate test for how much pull Trump has in the party. Personally, I think he'll shift the results a bit but Ryan will still win.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:22
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Popular Thug Drink posted:isn't that what a pilot is supposed to do? i dont want to spend a million bucks training a guy to fly a war plane only to have him die because he wanted to play firefighter For most damage control, yes. When there's an existential threat to the ship, though, you're expected to pitch in wherever possible. The Forrestal had most of its flight deck firefighters killed or incapacitated by the bomb explosions, and the fire was mainly fought by regular sailors. A few other pilots jumped in and either took command of teams or aided firefighting/DC teams to control the fire. McCain helped a few crew toss bombs overboard, and then went to the ready room (note that he wasn't the only pilot to do so, it's not like he sat there all by his lonesome watching the fire on the monitors). The Forrestal fire was a legitimate threat to the seaworthiness of the ship. Between the explosives cooking off and the potential for blast holes in the flight deck to access the hangar deck (with more aircraft and fuel), it was essential to get the fire under control, or lose the ship. I'm not faulting McCain for his actions (and yeah, my initial post was too harsh in tone...I'm a former sailor, and damage control was drilled into me pretty heavily), mostly saying that he followed basic protocol, but certainly could have gone above and beyond in the face of what was happening. CarterUSM fucked around with this message at 23:26 on Aug 2, 2016 |
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Aug 2, 2016 23:23
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Relentlessboredomm posted:Is there anything down ballot in Maryland that's going to be close? I haven't dug into the ballot measures and whatnot yet http://www.elections.state.md.us/elections/2016/ballot_questions/index.html Only question listed is an Amendment to ensure the governor chooses someone from the same political party if the AG or Comptroller steps down. I believe Van Hollen(D) is expected to win the Senate seat in a walk, but I don't know of any new pooling there to confirm. farraday fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Aug 3, 2016 |
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Aug 2, 2016 23:23
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Lightning Knight posted:I mean he's also an rear end in a top hat with terrible opinions and no political spine, on top of the Forrestal. He might be a "war hero" but that doesn't protect him from political criticism nor does it absolve him of the deaths on the Forrestal. no, a vietnamese flying ace as opposed to one for the USAF b/c he lost 5 planes
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Aug 2, 2016 23:24
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Paradoxish posted:Could Ryan even reasonably retract his endorsement? I mean, obviously he could, but the Speaker of the House pulling back his endorsement of his party's candidate for a purely self interested reason seems like a potential disaster. It seems like Trump endorsing Ryan's primary opponent would leave Ryan with literally no acceptable options. To be a poo poo-fly on the wall of anyone caught in Trump's poo poo cyclone. I just want a sample of their candid conversations with family members and advisers, quietly/privately freaking the gently caress out that an orange man has come out of their TVs like that girl in The Ring to gently caress their political lives up.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:24
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CarterUSM posted:For most damage control, yes. When there's an existential threat to the ship, though, you're expected to pitch in wherever possible. The Forrestal had most of its flight deck firefighters killed or incapacitated by the bomb explosions. A few other pilots jumped in and either took command of teams or aided firefighting/DC teams to control the fire. McCain helped a few crew toss bombs overboard, and then went to the ready room (note that he wasn't the only pilot to do so, it's not like he sat there all by his lonesome watching the fire on the monitors). The Forrestal fire was a legitimate threat to the seaworthiness of the ship. Between the explosives cooking off and the potential for blast holes in the flight deck to access the hangar deck (with more aircraft and fuel), it was essential to get the fire under control, or lose the ship. I'm not faulting McCain for his actions (and yeah, my initial post was too harsh in tone...I'm a former sailor, and damage control was drilled into me pretty heavily), mostly saying that he followed basic protocol, but certainly could have gone above and beyond in the face of what was happening. Mind you, I don't know whether those other pilots who chipped in more were quite as injured as McCain. Apparently, he came out of it with some fairly unpleasant burns and shrapnel wounds.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:26
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Ryan's primary gets me thinking about longer term strategy. In the 2018 midterm elections, D's are going to face a lovely senate map. They need to start tying potential challengers to Trump in the most damning ways possible now, and not give anyone viable a chance to lay low. Trump could be a concrete block cast around the proverbial elephant ankles, but Dems have a fair amount of maneuvering to do to push it to the edge of the pier.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:27
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CarterUSM posted:For most damage control, yes. When there's an existential threat to the ship, though, you're expected to pitch in wherever possible. The Forrestal had most of its flight deck firefighters killed or incapacitated by the bomb explosions. A few other pilots jumped in and either took command of teams or aided firefighting/DC teams to control the fire. McCain helped a few crew toss bombs overboard, and then went to the ready room (note that he wasn't the only pilot to do so, it's not like he sat there all by his lonesome watching the fire on the monitors). The Forrestal fire was a legitimate threat to the seaworthiness of the ship. Between the explosives cooking off and the potential for blast holes in the flight deck to access the hangar deck (with more aircraft and fuel), it was essential to get the fire under control, or lose the ship. I'm not faulting McCain for his actions (and yeah, my initial post was too harsh in tone...I'm a former sailor, and damage control was drilled into me pretty heavily), mostly saying that he followed basic protocol, but certainly could have gone above and beyond in the face of what was happening.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:27
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Darth Walrus posted:Mind you, I don't know whether those other pilots who chipped in more were quite as injured as McCain. Apparently, he came out of it with some fairly unpleasant burns and shrapnel wounds. True. I went back and looked at the account, and I hadn't realized that he got shrapnel wounds from the sympathetic explosions. That's definitely a fair point.
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Aug 2, 2016 23:30
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HorseRenoir posted:Clinton +3 in Arizona I'm assuming the remaining 9% went to harambe
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