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LoL was first on the scene and free. And it was fun enough in the beginning...
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Aug 24, 2016 19:40
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I think the CEO of Riot saying to TSMReginald "maybe you should spend more of your money on your players" may actually be worse than "James is an rear end"
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Aug 24, 2016 19:41
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emdash posted:here's something to distract us all for now: man i neither play nor watch LoL but everything i read about it seems to goddamn shortsighted and idiotic
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Aug 24, 2016 19:42
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how do you enforce no lane swapping pelase explain
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Aug 24, 2016 19:43
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IcePhoenix posted:I don't even understand how this works. Do they put up impassable walls between the lanes or something? bottom lane towers are weaker than the top towers now, the first tower to go down gives a first blood bonus. they basically brought back the old dragon giving gold but instead of a dragon its the bottom lane turret.
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Aug 24, 2016 19:43
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Radical posted:bottom lane towers are weaker than the top towers now, the first tower to go down gives a first blood bonus. they basically brought back the old dragon giving gold but instead of a dragon its the bottom lane turret. they took away the dragon?
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Aug 24, 2016 19:44
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IcePhoenix posted:I don't even understand how this works. Do they put up impassable walls between the lanes or something? They made two primary changes; cannon minions now spawn in different waves per lane (so if you swap at an unfortunate time you miss a bunch of gold) and the first tower destroyed now gives 400 more gold. Kainser posted:Some of the decisionmaking from riot really makes me wonder how they became so dominant in the first place. Buy to play, art design deterioration, quickly earning the title of "worst moba community", and trying "grassroots marketing" (aka please advertise for us)
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Aug 24, 2016 19:44
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Kainser posted:Some of the decisionmaking from riot really makes me wonder how they became so dominant in the first place. HoN died due to the way pricing was structured, and floundered when they tried too late to catch up. It probably would have died harder in the long run due to most heroes being literal copies of dota heroes. And yea back in it's earlier days it was less about presenting itself as a dumbed down dota clone and more it's own game. Riot has since walked that way back and as a brand has focused solely on dumbing it down.
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Aug 24, 2016 19:45
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re: HON just remember that Maliken was 100x worse than Gaben or the Riot CEO
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Aug 24, 2016 19:46
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Neurolimal posted:They made two primary changes; cannon minions now spawn in different waves per lane (so if you swap at an unfortunate time you miss a bunch of gold) and the first tower destroyed now gives 400 more gold. the cannon change didnt actually go through afaik Up Circle posted:they took away the dragon? it doesnt give gold anymore, which effectively was the only reason to contest it (gold advantage is insanely strong early game because of the cost of items vs. the stats you get > the team that got the dragon won 90% of games or some stupid number like that)
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Aug 24, 2016 19:47
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Current-day LoL is pretty complicated in its own way; I wouldn't really call it dumbed down at this point I remember when people got smarmy about lol having 4 item actives total and letting their bursters scale, what wild times we live in Radical posted:the cannon change didnt actually go through afaik My bad on the cannon change, glad they realized how obtuse that was Dragon is randomized now; you can get fire (% damage increase), earth (true damage to towers), water (heal % of your missing mana and hp outside of battle) and wind (out of combat movespeed), and an elder dragon that doubles all earned dargon buffs. If its not air then its still very worth contesting Also the thing out that dragon dominance 8s that doing drake uncontested require that both bot lane and jungler be doing super bad, so it has more to do with normal moba early advantage = likely to win snowballing Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Aug 24, 2016 |
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Aug 24, 2016 19:48
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emdash posted:I think the CEO of Riot saying to TSMReginald "maybe you should spend more of your money on your players" may actually be worse than "James is an rear end" its definitely worse
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Aug 24, 2016 19:48
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i for one am glad the dragon lives more often now
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Aug 24, 2016 19:48
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https://www.twitch.tv/moonducktv Pieliedie is standing in for kaipi again. Maybe he's out of secret too?
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Aug 24, 2016 19:49
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Neurolimal posted:Current-day LoL is pretty complicated in its own way; I wouldn't really call it dumbed down at this point I'll admit I haven't followed LoL since like 2012 but every time I hear anything about it it's some outrage about how Riot is intentionally restricting what roles champions can play or making it harder to solo queue (due to them wanting LoL to be an experience of stacking with your friends and less about finding creative ways to win). That just reeks of dumbed down gameplay to me.
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Aug 24, 2016 19:50
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Radical posted:the cannon change didnt actually go through afaik Lmao what the gently caress does the dragon give now then? Some kind of buff?
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Aug 24, 2016 19:51
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theres 4 elements of dragons and each one gives a stacking buff: ad/ap, movement speed, hp/mana over time, and bonus 'objective' (neutral monsters and buildings) damage i actually think the idea is really good i just dont think it really works in league of legends, the relationship between gold and item efficiency in that game has always been flawed but they refuse to really look at it despite almost every champion design and art asset from the same period those metagame things were originally designed being scrapped.
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Aug 24, 2016 19:54
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Angrymantium posted:I'll admit I haven't followed LoL since like 2012 but every time I hear anything about it it's some outrage about how Riot is intentionally restricting what roles champions can play or making it harder to solo queue (due to them wanting LoL to be an experience of stacking with your friends and less about finding creative ways to win). That just reeks of dumbed down gameplay to me. I think most ppl think of like HOTS when they think of dumbing down, at this point. Actually simplifying trademark mechanics of the genre like last hitting, xp vicinity per team instead of per hero, team wide xp, no items, etc. What riot does is more treating their player base as an adversary
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Aug 24, 2016 19:54
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Oh my god this League drama is amazing.
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Aug 24, 2016 19:54
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In all fairness talking about LoL has been a dota2 thread tradition for as long as actually playing/watching dota2
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Aug 24, 2016 19:56
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I tried watching a TSM v. CLG playoff game and then they had to remake due to a graphics bug and then disabled the hero for the rest of the series. Apparently the hero was a signature hero for CLG. How is this acceptable. I mean Dota has its bugs and has screwed over teams, but happens with lol way more.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:07
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mikeraskol posted:This seems really stupid to me. PPD captains the team to three straight top 3 TI finishes, including one win, and he's out? And who replaces him as captain with Fear gone as well and Rtz in? There's nobody else on that team that can lead. Speaking of things going disastrously in LoL, EG split into two teams there a few years ago and it was a disaster.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:09
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Angrymantium posted:HoN died due to the way pricing was structured, and floundered when they tried too late to catch up. It probably would have died harder in the long run due to most heroes being literal copies of dota heroes. And yea back in it's earlier days it was less about presenting itself as a dumbed down dota clone and more it's own game. Riot has since walked that way back and as a brand has focused solely on dumbing it down. To be fair HoN died because Dota 2 came out because that game was sorta just Dota 1.5
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Aug 24, 2016 20:09
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It's a shame too because they released a lot of cool gimmicks and features, its just....they came after they realized DOTA2 was sucking away its playerbase. Maliken & co. were really confident that HoN generated player loyalty beyond "its standalone dota that looks nicer", which was just lmao
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Aug 24, 2016 20:16
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Its funny hearing people discuss the history of League and Dota and HoN and talk about why certain games find success and why others don't when my personal decision to play Dota2 (I never played Dota1) was based on the thirty second google search that told me you had to pay per hero in League and Dota2 was free, and then looking at one screenshot of HoN.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:18
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Goetta posted:To be fair HoN died because Dota 2 came out because that game was sorta just Dota 1.5 it died cus they refused to spend money on advertising and instead wanted to rely on word of mouth. But word of mouth is they are gently caress-ups who don't deliver their promises and get into slap fights with pro players on their forums (and all the Maliken poo poo). Then Dota2 is announced and they went F2P too late and added buying heroes/EA.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:18
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Dota doesn't have the CEO dropping slurs in pub games which is a nice upgrade from hon
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Aug 24, 2016 20:19
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Goetta posted:To be fair HoN died because Dota 2 came out because that game was sorta just Dota 1.5 Yea at the very least there aren't many LoL heroes that are pretty much an actual existing dota hero but more powerful; obviously LoL champions have a lot in common with dota heroes but there are fewer direct ports than HoN had. more like dICK posted:Dota doesn't have the CEO dropping slurs in pub games which is a nice upgrade from hon LoL has that in the form of devs banning people for randoming in ranked so
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Aug 24, 2016 20:20
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A lot of people I talk to when playing Dota have switched over from LoL due to Riot being cartoonishly inept in every way, so I wouldn't be surprised if their numbers keep dropping.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:21
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Neurolimal posted:They made two primary changes; cannon minions now spawn in different waves per lane (so if you swap at an unfortunate time you miss a bunch of gold) and the first tower destroyed now gives 400 more gold. I guess I don't understand how this prevents lane swapping, but those seem very silly anyway.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:22
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IcePhoenix posted:I guess I don't understand how this prevents lane swapping, but those seem very silly anyway. When you would lane-swap, both teams would exchange tower kills, too. Since there is now a first blood on towers, you do all you can to prevent yours from going down in the first few minutes of the game.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:27
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IcePhoenix posted:I guess I don't understand how this prevents lane swapping, but those seem very silly anyway. League snowballs ridiculously hard so giving up any gold advantage is going to cost you the game.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:32
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IcePhoenix posted:I guess I don't understand how this prevents lane swapping, but those seem very silly anyway. keep in mind they don't have tp scrolls or glyph. so they can't rush a tower then glyph and tp back to defend one. so you're basically trading towers and you don't want to be slower/leave it to chance. Early gold snowballs stupidly because the more gold you spend the more efficiency you get per gold spent on items.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:32
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Kild posted:keep in mind they don't have tp scrolls or glyph. so they can't rush a tower then glyph and tp back to defend one. so you're basically trading towers and you don't want to be slower/leave it to chance. This is what I was missing. Thanks everyone.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:33
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Kibner posted:When you would lane-swap, both teams would exchange tower kills, too. Since there is now a first blood on towers, you do all you can to prevent yours from going down in the first few minutes of the game. For a game whose initial conceit was "let's make DotA but without a lot of the legacy Warcraft 3 nonsense in DotA", Riot seems fairly content to add new nonsense to their game.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:34
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Neurolimal posted:They made two primary changes; cannon minions now spawn in different waves per lane (so if you swap at an unfortunate time you miss a bunch of gold) and the first tower destroyed now gives 400 more gold. Who would have thought a game with lolita style character design has a bad community? Edit - Oh wait, you're talking about HoN and not League. Mekchu fucked around with this message at 20:42 on Aug 24, 2016 |
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Aug 24, 2016 20:35
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IcePhoenix posted:This is what I was missing. Thanks everyone. they technically have it in the form of "summoner skills" but I think no one has ever picked the fort one, and the tp one was only used sparingly and only on 1 person on each team. e: also they're 300s cd.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:35
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Kild posted:Early gold snowballs stupidly because the more gold you spend the more efficiency you get per gold spent on items. Why is it more efficient the more you spend? I've never played LoL so I don't understand this.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:38
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Incoherence posted:And because the bottom tower is weaker than the top tower, the team that switches to top probably loses the race. Well, over the last 2 or so years the biggest obtuse changes have been that and giving top lane (and only top lane) giant armor/mr buffs to the tower for the first 6 minutes to counter the fact that 1 successful gank meant your top tower was gone Iirc they extended that one to all lanes and added a tool tip to the towers explaining them, so thats not too bad What was said earlier about the balancing being "player adversarial" is pretty true; they aren't actively malicious, but they want a specific metagame for esports and will take out off strats to circumvent it. This does lead to a fun arms race in its own way, of pro teams trying to find an exploitable mechanic to deploy in the big tourneys. El Golden Goose posted:Why is it more efficient the more you spend? I've never played LoL so I don't understand this. Finished items have a higher value than unfinished items. It's different from dota where you finish items to free up item slots
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Aug 24, 2016 20:40
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El Golden Goose posted:Why is it more efficient the more you spend? I've never played LoL so I don't understand this. In dota, iron branch is pretty much the most gold efficient item but you can't abuse it because you can only hold six things. So as you spend gold to make bigger items in dota they get much less efficient for what you receive. In league its the opposite, the cheap small items are inefficient while LoLs equivalent of Daedalus is very gold efficient, so having a very small advantage quickly snowballs into a bigger and bigger advantage as you complete more higher tier items. Thats how it was when I stopped playing/watching lol at least.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:43
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