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I think MRMs and different non-clan LBXs could be interesting additions
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Aug 24, 2016 20:17
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What earthly use would SRMs have in a world with MRMs. They utterly supplanted non streak SRMs in every game they have come out in and for good reason.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:27
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 Apparantly these are ERPPCs. Cyrano4747 posted:What earthly use would SRMs have in a world with MRMs. They utterly supplanted non streak SRMs in every game they have come out in and for good reason. If only IS have them, having them stream out and do less damage per missile like Clan streaks could give them a niche.
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Aug 24, 2016 20:43
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I figure you could make them high-damage, high-velocity, unguided, streaming (but not horribly so like clan LRMs) with a long reload time. That'd give them a niche between LRMs and SRMs
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Aug 24, 2016 20:46
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Pattonesque posted:I think MRMs and different non-clan LBXs could be interesting additions I dug through sarna a while ago to see what possibilities there would be. Laser ams, silver bullet gauss, binary laser. AP autocannon ammo, laser heat sinks and blue shield particle screens. Also TSM. hilariously, i think the apollo FCS wouldn't be in time even if MRMs were. but hey, there's rocket launchers at 3050. Of all these things, I think the AP AC ammo is the simplest translation - less ammo, more of a crit chance vs open areas, since tacs aren't a thing in this game. I know I'd love no-ammo ams for my novas though, despite the heat. On the lulzier side of things, we also have mech-portable cannon artillery, such as the thumper. The light gauss arrives in 3056 as well.
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Aug 24, 2016 22:05
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Cyrano4747 posted:Frankly I'm good with weapons where they are. TT got unbalanced enough with the 3050 tech but once you get past 3058 it just got insane with power creep and unbalanced poo poo designed simply to sell the next round of TMs. MW4 is a great example of this. Once you have heavy gauss, heavy lasers, and rotary ACs everything else becomes really outmoded and you flat NEED the right specialist armor to match what the mechs in the next mission are packing. The counterpoint here is tabletop Battletech, where RACs are situational at best, HGRs are gimmicks that you can't even really fit on anything, and HLs are absolute garbage. No weapon in tabletop BT is better than cERPPCs, gauss rifles, cLPLs, and cLRMs. You do see some power creep, but it's mostly at the low end. The best IS weapons, like MMLs, Snub PPCs, and Light PPCs aren't as good as gauss rifles or clan weapons, but they're a cut better than IS SRMs (which are terrible in tabletop) and IS ER lasers (which are okay but not amazing). Unless you count iATMs and streak LRMs (which are invented decades later and only used by one faction in the clan homeworlds), the only new clan weapon worth using is AP Gauss, a gauss machine gun that strictly outclasses all of the other MG/SL/flamer weapons except maybe cERSLs. I don't know or much care about MW4, but weapons didn't power creep by much at all in tabletop. Whether it's 3050 or 3150, gauss and cERPPC snipers are still the deadliest mech killers on the game.
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Aug 24, 2016 22:28
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There's a reason nobody likes the guy who brings this mech: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Hellstar It's a perfectly optimized mech. It's a Warhawk but without the garbage LRM/TC stuff, you can just fire forever with it. It's fast (for an assault), and it has maxed armor with four heat neutral cER PPCs. Nothing really beats that in TT.
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Aug 24, 2016 22:50
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aniviron posted:There's a reason nobody likes the guy who brings this mech: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Hellstar Wasn't Ath in that thing last mission? Guess that showing up is a clear sign that "It's time to go." Edit: OH poo poo wrong thread. Artificer fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Aug 24, 2016 |
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Aug 24, 2016 23:14
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Artificer posted:Wasn't Ath in that thing last mission? Guess that showing up is a clear sign that "It's time to go." Shoot, the optimized 4PPC Awesome the players have is scary enough and the Hellstar way outclasses it
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Aug 24, 2016 23:22
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Pattonesque posted:Shoot, the optimized 4PPC Awesome the players have is scary enough and the Hellstar way outclasses it Is the Hellstar II with the TC better or is the ability to endlessly poo poo out 4 ER PPCs every round provided you don't move worth more? Edit: Wait TC only is 1 ton where the hell did the tonnage on the Hellstar II go?
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Aug 24, 2016 23:27
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Artificer posted:Is the Hellstar II with the TC better or is the ability to endlessly poo poo out 4 ER PPCs every round provided you don't move worth more? quote:Clan Targeting Computers weigh one ton and occupy one critical slot for every five tons of equipment they control (rounded up) So four Clan ERPPCs = 24 tons = 5 tons' worth of TCs.
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Aug 24, 2016 23:31
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Artificer posted:Is the Hellstar II with the TC better or is the ability to endlessly poo poo out 4 ER PPCs every round provided you don't move worth more? TC size and weight is based on your weapon loadout in TT.
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Aug 24, 2016 23:33
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Ah thanks. Thank gently caress this son of a bitch isn't in game.
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Aug 24, 2016 23:35
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Artificer posted:Ah thanks. I can guarantee the game will be dead long before PGI adds anything from the Dark Ages. Even though some of the Dark Ages designs are legitimately pretty neat! Like House Liao's Tian Zong, redrawn for tabletop by the Forums' own T.G. Xarbala  And the Shiro (thanks again, T.G.!)  the 25-ton Gunsmith (not T.G. this time)  and if any of you tells me you wouldn't pilot a Violater you're lying.  And the ones that suck are fun to make fun of! Like the MWDA Spider  The MWDA Mist Lynx  And the Atlas III which, let's face it, even a good artist couldn't save.  But nope! Hope you're all ready to get more marginal designs from the 3050s like the Clint, the Whitworth, and the Hermes II! And they just released some Steel Viper warhorns and stuff, so I expect we'll get the Battle Cobra and the Crossbow pretty quick. For those not in the know, the Crossbow and Battle Cobra were designed by Clan Steel Viper to be as cheap as possible (the Battle Cobra clocks in at about 5 million c-bills which isn't bad for a medium Omnimech). They'd have been great to bring in for beginners right around the time of the steam release, but will forever be under-gunned under-performers. I like both designs but realistically they'll both be hot garbage in MWO. I mean one-trick ponies. And the trick they know (being competitively priced budget OmniMechs) isn't very good. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 00:31
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Artificer posted:Ah thanks. Yeah, thank gently caress.
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Aug 25, 2016 00:34
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Hahahahah. Anyone see that picture of the Assault leaderboards? Kodiaks leading the way with a few Dire Wolves sprinkled in.
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Aug 25, 2016 00:42
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PoptartsNinja posted:But nope! Hope you're all ready to get more marginal designs from the 3050s like the Clint, the Whitworth, and the Hermes II! I really enjoyed your writeups on all the various mechs as they got added to the game. Wish you could do some more of it  I really wish the Assassin was good, but alas such was not meant to be.E: actually a really interesting game mode would be for each side to have a limited amount of C-Bills to spend on mechs - you could buy anything you want up to a limit per side, create a 12 robot group and go hog wild. It'd be interesting to have limitations like that instead of purely weight. Baudin fucked around with this message at 00:52 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 00:45
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Baudin posted:I really enjoyed your writeups on all the various mechs as they got added to the game. Wish you could do some more of it I'm off the Mittani's payroll (I never produced enough content to get paid, it was mostly done for fun. And EVE Spacebucks had no interest for me in any case). I can do more if anyone's interested, but nobody needs me to tell them the Linebacker's hot garbage. It's a low-end heavy looking for a niche to fill. Edit: My preferred 'game mode' for MWO would be a moba-mode. Factories on both sides produce a chain of tanks that drive forward in an attempt to blow up the other side's factory/dropship/whatever, with some territory-capture elements (side factories to contest that will produce cheaper, shittier tanks to help weigh things in one side's favor) spread out in such a way that it's impossible to contest more than one with a full 12 man, so you've got 4-man lances fighting each other while scouts steal undefended locations. Ultimately you'd need the tanks to soak the attention of an enemy Union-class DropShip so your `Mechs can safely engage and kill it. Add in Community Warfare's drop deck and you've got a much more amusing game mode than "capture the base." I trust even PGI could program tanks to follow a set path. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 00:58 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 00:50
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PoptartsNinja posted:I'm off the Mittani's payroll (I never produced enough content to get paid, it was mostly done for fun. And EVE Spacebucks had no interest for me in any case). I can do more if anyone's interested, but nobody needs me to tell them the Linebacker's hot garbage. It's a low-end heavy looking for a niche to fill. I may have read your posts multiple times and immensely enjoyed them. If you ever feel the desire to do a write up I'd be very happy 
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Aug 25, 2016 00:53
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Cyrano4747 posted:Frankly I'm good with weapons where they are. TT got unbalanced enough with the 3050 tech but once you get past 3058 it just got insane with power creep and unbalanced poo poo designed simply to sell the next round of TMs. MW4 is a great example of this. Once you have heavy gauss, heavy lasers, and rotary ACs everything else becomes really outmoded and you flat NEED the right specialist armor to match what the mechs in the next mission are packing. Are you like, a complete idiot? All of the later era tech with the exception of like C3i basically was designed to allow IS mechs to keep pace with clan mechs. Light ACs meant that there was now a valid reason to not have LBXs (UACs were always terrible and worthless in TT unless you allowed the optional unjamming rules). Heavy Gauss was a fantastically designed weapon that paid a really huge risk for that firepower and only had a very small range bracket of actually being any good (a range bracket that required you to keep pretty mobile). There was only a single chasis (the barghest) that mounted one in a clever and useful manner. Even the new clan tech was pretty clever in terms of use, Heavy Lasers had a pretty smart idea behind it (though unfortunately the heat scales were far enough off that only mediums were usable) and existed because of the Targetting Computer problem introduced when clans showed up. It allowed a mech to have only some weapons that had the bonus to hit while others just removed a penalty inherent with them (heavy lasers) meaning you could have laser based mechs that didnt suddenly go turbo hit everything kill sprees like the Nova Cat. The best weapons and gear in the game are already implemented, everything else are just cool little niche weapons that add a lot of interesting flavour to the game. I'd even take all the weird failed tech that goes out too. MRMs and SRMs can both even have a purpose if you rig up MRMs to be scatter short corkscrew like crazy as their penalty to hit in TT reflects. SRMs are still mostly on target but MRMS are completely unreliable to hit even 50% unless you are rubbing. Give me some different armour types and some of the weird battletech poo poo like stealth armour and null sig systems or that one piece of tech that shows ghost mechs on your sensors. kingcom fucked around with this message at 01:28 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 01:21
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PoptartsNinja posted:I'm off the Mittani's payroll (I never produced enough content to get paid, it was mostly done for fun. And EVE Spacebucks had no interest for me in any case). I can do more if anyone's interested, but nobody needs me to tell them the Linebacker's hot garbage. It's a low-end heavy looking for a niche to fill. I genuinly disagree with that sentiment about the linebacker, its a 65 tonner with an XL390 and 9 clan energy hardpoints 6 of which are high torso mounted, it is going to go like a nova with its arse on fire and boat clan ER mediums like an utter champ, same principle as the Gargoyle. Wont be able to do much else, but it will do that well.
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Aug 25, 2016 02:01
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PoptartsNinja posted:I trust even PGI could program tanks to follow a set path.
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Aug 25, 2016 02:21
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Artificer posted:Hahahahah. Anyone see that picture of the Assault leaderboards? Kodiaks leading the way with a few Dire Wolves sprinkled in. The leaderboard kodiaks were most likely using either 4 LBX10s or the 2x UAC10, 2x UAC5 build. Long range, lowish heat, huge damage and dps.
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Aug 25, 2016 02:56
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what is the quickest way to drop a tier
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Aug 25, 2016 02:57
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Polyakov posted:I genuinly disagree with that sentiment about the linebacker, its a 65 tonner with an XL390 and 9 clan energy hardpoints 6 of which are high torso mounted, it is going to go like a nova with its arse on fire and boat clan ER mediums like an utter champ, same principle as the Gargoyle. Or you could get a Timber Wolf and not only be able to do that, but also a whole bunch of other things too! That's why the Linebacker sucks. The only thing it has on the Timber is it's speed and it gives up a bundle of other things for that.
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Aug 25, 2016 02:58
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Banano posted:what is the quickest way to drop a tier You basically don't. You somehow have to be so bad that it causes your team to lose, and even then, the rate of ranking loss is so slow that losing ranking is a monumental grind. You'll spend weeks tanking to get where you want, and then climb right back after winning a few matches against inferior competition.
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Aug 25, 2016 03:05
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Banano posted:what is the quickest way to drop a tier Control Panel -> Uninstall or Change a Program -> Right Click MWO -> Uninstall
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Aug 25, 2016 03:08
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EponymousMrYar posted:Or you could get a Timber Wolf and not only be able to do that, but also a whole bunch of other things too! A 65 ton heavy that will go north of 100 with speed tweak and having the acceleration to match will find a niche, its a heavy mech that goes significantly faster than most mediums and mounts more high lasers than the TW, it will play like a heavy medium mech and its something im really looking forward too.
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Aug 25, 2016 03:09
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Polyakov posted:A 65 ton heavy that will go north of 100 with speed tweak and having the acceleration to match will find a niche, its a heavy mech that goes significantly faster than most mediums and mounts more high lasers than the TW, it will play like a heavy medium mech and its something im really looking forward too. How much tonnage does it have spare.
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Aug 25, 2016 03:12
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kingcom posted:How much tonnage does it have spare. Id guess at 15, but im not sure about the numbers im using for ferro armor.
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Aug 25, 2016 03:18
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Banano posted:what is the quickest way to drop a tier  as many pubbies as you can.
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Aug 25, 2016 03:43
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Banano posted:what is the quickest way to drop a tier Take company command before the match and move people around randomly until one of the pubbies gets mad and teamkills you at the start.
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Aug 25, 2016 04:14
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Banano posted:what is the quickest way to drop a tier Drop with Corn (or me). kingcom posted:Control Panel -> Uninstall or Change a Program -> Right Click MWO -> Uninstall Also a solid option.
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Aug 25, 2016 04:27
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I would probably turn this into a TMC article if TMC hadn't turned to poo poo, but here's Future Battletech Weapons In MWO. For reference, it's either 3052 or 3053 in MWO. Succession War tech: These weapons aren't from the original 3025/"tech 1" ruleset, but they are balanced with those weapons. All of these already exist in-universe; they just are too weird or obsolete to see widespread use. Binary lasers/blazers are two large lasers duct taped together, with severe diminishing returns on performance. They're extremely hot, extremely heavy, and thoroughly underwhelming in tabletop; their only niche is that they do exactly enough damage for a headshot, which isn't something they could reasonably do in MWO. While at one point they appeared in datamined MWO files, they're so inefficient that their only use in MWO would be squeezing a tiny bit more max damage (12 per shot) out of a single Inner Sphere energy hardpoint. Mech Mortars in tabletop are hilariously inefficient and inaccurate low-tech LRM replacements. They're completely useless in tabletop: while they have the "advantage" of ignoring AMS, they mostly do less damage than LRMs shooting into AMS anyway. They might be interesting as an alternative indirect-fire weapon, but since they're so obscure and bad in TT, I doubt PGI would bother. Artillery already exists as well, both three classes of tube artillery cannon (the Long Tom is the largest) and Arrow IV missiles (which are technically 3050 tech). When direct-fired at a visible, nearby enemy in tabletop, they're rather underwhelming for their size and weight - Long Toms and Arrow IV only do 20 damage - they do that damage in a 40m-ish radius, spreading that damage all over the target and possible damaging nearby targets. (The main difference between tube artillery and missile artillery in TT is that missiles can be guided with TAG. That's TAG's main use in TT.) Splash damage weapons would be a huge gamechanger in MWO, diminishing the value of grouping up tightly and taking cover, but would be a massive undertaking to implement. Rocket Launchers are extremely efficient midrange brawling weapons, similar to MRMs. The catch is that they're all one-shot weapons. I don't see how this could place nicely with MWO's weapon hardpoint system, and other than that they're almost identical to MRMs if MRMs weren't horribly inaccurate. 3050s-3060s Inner Sphere: The Clan Invasion and Fedcom Civil War means lots of new Inner Sphere weapons get invented. Some of them don't spread out of a particular faction hardly at all. Silver Bullet Gauss Rifles already exist, although they aren't mainstream until 3080. In tabletop, they're cluster-only LBX gauss rifles, basically. More accurate, but they spread out damage in many small pellets. They're not especially useful in tabletop, and while they'd fit into MWO just fine, they'd need extra damage to be worth using. Would you use an LBX gauss rifle that weighed the same as a regular gauss rifle? Enhanced LRMs (invented 3054, widespread much later) are LRMs with a moderately shorter minimum range and a larger weight/size. You don't want NLRMs. Extended LRMs (also invented 3054 and widespread later) are Longer Ranged Missiles with almost double the range. In return, XLRMs have almost double the weight and size, and a minimum range longer than a large laser. They're garbage and would be terrible for MWO. Light Gauss Rifles (3056, more or less Marik/FWL-only) are gauss replacements for AC10s. They fling 8 damage a really long way, but they still weigh 12t. They're heavy and anemic and land in the exact same niche as the best weapon in Battletech - but remember that's also true of the AC5. They could slot into MWO as a snipey alternative to the AC10 for mediums that don't want to risk the facetime of smaller ACs, but can't practically fit an AC20 or gauss. X-Pulse Lasers (3057) are longer-ranged pulse lasers that are just ridiculously hot. They're halfway between IS and Clan pulse lasers in performance, but about half again as hot. They never really catch on. They would fit into MWO easily - they're just longer-ranged, hotter pulse lasers - but they don't fit into any new unfilled niche. IS Ultra autocannon (3057) fire two shots but have a chance to jam. Shocking, right? The UAC2 and UAC10 aren't going to significantly rock the boat. The UAC20 might (assuming it doesn't use splash damage or Clan-style salvos), but PGI can punt on it for a bit, since it was invented later, in 3060. IS ER lasers (3058) do exactly what you'd think. They're hotter and longer-ranged and replace normal lasers in almost every post-3060 IS mech. These would slot into MWO easily, and wouldn't fill any new niche. IS LBX autocannon (3058) also don't bring any surprises. They're slightly longer-ranged than other IS ACs, but they weigh the same amount and take up an extra crit, unlike the LBX AC10. They'd need the same damage buffs PGI seems to currently be considering for the LBX 10 to be worth bothering with - although energy draw may give them a viable role. IS Streaks (3058) are streaks, how much do I need to explain here. Medium Range Missiles (3058) are midrange brawling weapons and completely inaccurate garbage that only Kuritans think is good. They're huge (they come in MRM20, 30, and 40, and an MRM30 is a drop-in swap for an LRM20), hot, and shoot a lot of missiles, none of which ever hit. This could easily be a terrible wide-choke shotgun in MWO. I'll do Clan poo poo and 3060s poo poo later if I feel like it. Cease to Hope fucked around with this message at 05:45 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 05:15
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BTW the Linebacker is going to be complete poo poo because it's on the far side of engine diminishing returns. Specifics are  but it has poo poo for pod space.
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Aug 25, 2016 05:18
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Cease to Hope posted:Extended LRMs (also invented 3054 and widespread later) are Longer Ranged Missiles with almost double the range. In return, XLRMs have almost double the weight and size, and a minimum range longer than a large laser. They're garbage and would be terrible for MWO. Yeah, because Pubbies would have an excuse to stay behind the team. And they certainly would like to support their team. From far behind them.
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Aug 25, 2016 08:31
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Cease to Hope posted:BTW the Linebacker is going to be complete poo poo because it's on the far side of engine diminishing returns. Specifics are Yep. It's got slightly more pod space than a Shadowcat. Trying to play it like a 45 ton harasser in the form factor of a blocky cauldron born is going to end badly. No jump jets either.
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Aug 25, 2016 09:26
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Cease to Hope posted:BTW the Linebacker is going to be complete poo poo because it's on the far side of engine diminishing returns. Specifics are That reminds me, there was an impressive effort-Powerpoint posted somewhere that estimated the optimal mech size / engine size based on the desired speed. Might have been posted on either the brown sea or r/mwo before the goon takeover, not sure. Did anybody save it?
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Aug 25, 2016 12:39
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NihilCredo posted:That reminds me, there was an impressive effort-Powerpoint posted somewhere that estimated the optimal mech size / engine size based on the desired speed. Might have been posted on either the brown sea or r/mwo before the goon takeover, not sure. Did anybody save it? This is aimed at tabletop BT and doesn't take endo into account (endo makes heavier mechs marginally better), nor does it take into account armor capacity, but it does give you an idea of where the inflection points are. Cease to Hope fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 13:39
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| # ? May 28, 2024 08:23 |
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Derp. Hot fix today, surprisingly, they aren't touching the Cyclops. Crimson Strait: Fixed collision issues with the central mountain that could cause 'Mechs to phase through. • MechLab: Fixed an issue where accessing the Cockpit Item screen for the first time in a session would cause the Owned and Sale filters to not function. • Mini-Map and BattleGrid: Improved the readability of Sector designations over the changes from the August 23rd patch. Sector designations now have slight drop shadows and are fully opaque. • Supply Caches: Fixed an issue where a specific Supply Cache was listing Rarity types for some of its items that were inconsistent with the Rarity type of those items in other Caches. This was contrary to the intended design that items have the same Rarity type across all Caches. The Rarity type of the affected items in that Cache did accurately reflect their Rarity type in that Cache, however. We have opted to remove this Cache, replacing it with a new Cache containing items of higher overall value. • Atlas: Fixed an issue where the Founder and Loyalty variants were not provided with the entirety of their intended Pattern support in the August 23rd patch. • Centurion: Fixed an issue where the Loyalty variant was not provided with the entirety of its intended Pattern support in the August 23rd patch. • Hunchback: Fixed an issue where Founder variant was not provided with the entirety of its intended Pattern support in the August 23rd patch.
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Aug 25, 2016 16:52
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