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Major Ryan posted:So (assuming the Pixel by Google rumours are true) what is the reasoning for Google picking this year to launch its own branded phone again? I mean, they tried this before with the original Nexus which didn't work/wasn't supported/angered the other mobile manufacturers, and I don't see there being any pressing reason why 2016 is the right time to try again. Not exactly correct, the Nexus line has never bothered other OEMs it was the acquisition of Motorola, a brand perceived to be big enough to be a major competitor in the space, that irked the others. Now they were adamant they were doing it for the good of the ecosystem (read: patent defense) and wouldn't actually compete but the patents were essentially worthless and Samsung was obviously going to try to go full Tizen with their line. That still leaves unanswered a very good question you raise: Why now? My thought on this is that they feel the launch of Google Assistant and its integration into their phones (and theirs alone?) is enough to hang a viable brand onto. I'm skeptical, as you note they won't get anywhere without funnelling shitloads of money directly to the carriers to pimp the brand along with heavy subsidies to get them into customers' hands at low costs and advertising enough to convince people to give up on Samsungs. The former maybe they could do, but the latter they'd never do. To do it would guarantee the destruction of the ecosystem. Plus there's the point you correctly raise next: Major Ryan posted:To my mind I still don't see why Google particularly cares who makes android phones as long as they sell lots of them, and on sheer sales numbers Android wins hands down. This alone is the reason Google will never make a play to be a viable brand in phones. The only possible reasoning is they don't like how Samsung is constantly trying to minimize Google's presence on their devices but there isn't that much they can do about that no matter what they do. Major Ryan posted:Is VR really such a big future thing that Google think they need to be physically in on it? Have they finally decided to care about fragmentation enough to try and seize the market in one phone? Do they sense enough weakness in Apple with a boring iPhone 7 announcement that they think this is the year to strike? None of this makes sense. They don't care about their sales relative to iOS, VR will never be that big, and fragmentation isn't a problem (everyone uses Samsungs). Also it should be mentioned that if these phones were supposed to make a big splash against Apple or Samsung, in terms of design they're really meh. Seems to me if Google wants to say "This is the first Google phone for people who love Google!" maybe it's a good idea to have an industrial design that looks premium. These do not. Major Ryan posted:Or is it just another half-baked Google idea that will be dropped again in another couple of years? Both reasonable guesses.
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Sep 5, 2016 23:20
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Humerus posted:They're definitely moving towards a unified experience. Could be great, if they stick with it. And since this is Google, that is a big, big "if." Yeah, because that's been working soo well for Microsoft... Mister Facetious fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Sep 6, 2016 |
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Sep 6, 2016 01:53
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Mister Macys posted:Yeah, because that's been working soo well for Microsoft... You aren't wrong. I think the bigger problem is that Chrome OS and Android just aren't meant to do similar things and by combining them they could very well end up totaling less than the sum of their parts. To me it would seem the primary benefits to Chrome OS are its simplicity, security, and the price. It doesn't handle touch well at all. Android is the opposite in almost every way. It's complicated and insecure and was built to run almost exclusively on touch. From the Chrome OS side of things you can at least say if you want simple and secure then leave the Play Store checkbox unchecked (for now). I can even see the argument that allowing Chrome OS to run Android gives you access to games that you wouldn't otherwise but now you're adding a touchscreen to that formerly cheap Chromebook or you're putting it into a convertible (which always suck). Also if you're adding apps now you've got to add storage to these Chromebook tablet things. We still haven't touched on how Android will impact security. All of that's nice but what does the user gain from the Android side of things? Android already works fine on tablets. You get Chrome desktop with extensions but lovely touch support. You get to run Flash? Why would anyone care? It just seems like it eliminates every Chromebook selling point (simplicity, security, price) for almost no benefit just because nerds like combining two things that have no business being combined.
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Sep 6, 2016 02:25
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For one, nobody questions that Google has more or less absolute power over ChromeOS. Of course people who focus on Apple vs. Samsung rather than iOS vs. Android won't give a poo poo, but are you really surprised the opinion has found purchase here?
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Sep 6, 2016 03:28
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Sir Unimaginative posted:For one, nobody questions that Google has more or less absolute power over ChromeOS. Of course people who focus on Apple vs. Samsung rather than iOS vs. Android won't give a poo poo, but are you really surprised the opinion has found purchase here? I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Could you elaborate? Are you saying that by shoehorning Android into Chrome OS Google has a way of backdooring untampered-with Android onto consumers that they didn't before? I'm genuinely interested in hearing a well-articulated reasoning for merging Chrome OS with Android because I'm convinced that there isn't a sensible reason at all.
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Sep 6, 2016 05:16
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Samsung can't gently caress around with Chrome OS whereas they can and do gently caress around with Android. Same applies to any manufacturer making Chromebooks but I have no idea how Google would be able to press that same sort of control down to mobile devices if that was their plan. No idea whether there would be someone willing to fill a Samsung sized market gap if they tried and Samsung said no thanks and transitioned the GS line to Tizen or whatever in-house abomination they have. Assuming people would be turned off to a significant degree by Samsung doing so, which they might not.
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Sep 6, 2016 05:22
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FAUXTON posted:Samsung can't gently caress around with Chrome OS whereas they can and do gently caress around with Android. Same applies to any manufacturer making Chromebooks but I have no idea how Google would be able to press that same sort of control down to mobile devices if that was their plan. No idea whether there would be someone willing to fill a Samsung sized market gap if they tried and Samsung said no thanks and transitioned the GS line to Tizen or whatever in-house abomination they have. Assuming people would be turned off to a significant degree by Samsung doing so, which they might not. They couldn't exert that kind of control over mobile devices, it's ridiculous to think they'd try. Why would they even want to? The fact that devices have to pass the CTS is enough to ensure they get what they want out of those devices in terms of presence and data. Why would they care how awful Touchwiz is as long as people are using it? Right now Android on Chrome OS is more accurately the Play Store on Chrome OS, therefore still entirely within Google's control. I guess the question of how much further integration people expect. The idea that Chrome OS and Android would be the same OS in some Windows 10-style abomination that would be present in the same form on all devices is just... horrifying.
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Sep 6, 2016 05:52
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LastInLine posted:I'm genuinely interested in hearing a well-articulated reasoning for merging Chrome OS with Android because I'm convinced that there isn't a sensible reason at all. The lowest possible hanging fruit would be sharing the lower level stuff (e.g. things like this) to reduce the amount of duplicated work across Android and Chrome OS.
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Sep 6, 2016 07:36
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b0lt posted:The lowest possible hanging fruit would be sharing the lower level stuff (e.g. things like this) to reduce the amount of duplicated work across Android and Chrome OS. That was literally the only thing I could think of. Maybe some common APIs here and there. But if that was the only goal then there's really no reason to talk publicly about merging the two at all since you could do all of that in the background without ever involving the public. To my mind there must be some better reason to want to merge them other than just deduplicating work that's solely at the framework level. Why talk about it publicly if the results aren't public-facing?
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Sep 6, 2016 07:52
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Google isn't exactly known for being good at PR. Maybe expecting them to have thought about the consequences of advertising such a merger is too high a bar. In any case, web-driven everything (perhaps with a modest offline web-app starting load) seems to be at least one of their objectives, and their design language lends itself to being platform-agnostic. We know they're trying to make Chrome touch-friendly (or at least touch-viable, insofar as a browser's interface can be, page content being largely out of its purview) because Chrome.apk exists. And since Google is pretty okay at web-apps and mobile design, I'd at least like to think it's not outlandish they'd think to combine the two? A rather large subset of what apps can do is now provided by HTML5, asm.js, and standard extensions; whether the rest even should be is a matter of open debate (see: apps that mostly exist so that app developers and publishers can micromanage the mobile experience when the website would work just fine). There's even provisions as of a year and change ago for HTML5 dialers. Then again I think WebOS's cardinal sin was being too ahead of its time, so I freely acknowledge I'm weird and probably neurointeresting.
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Sep 6, 2016 08:31
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Aren't you still in a position where the shell would either have to be Android-like or Chrome OS-like depending on the form-factor? Is the future a world where Chrome OS is just Android with a different launcher running what would look like a desktop version of Chrome? Where does that leave extensions? It also seems like that isn't really "merging" the two, that's replacing Chrome OS with Android. I don't deny that's something they could do, Android is certainly becoming more laptop/desktop-friendly, but it's not the same thing and it doesn't fill the niche Chrome OS currently occupies.
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Sep 6, 2016 08:56
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Other way around. ChromeOS has an existing APK compatibility stack; that's enough to accommodate a transition. Whether the stack needs to endure for apps with actual utility that are Android-exclusive, or for (hypothetical?) games that are on no other platform that will be worth playing once Android is retro, is an open question. You've argued that Google can get its tracking information off of most platforms and the data people already give them because anyone otherwise inclined to use Google is either already using it (giving up their data to Google) or doesn't have access to Google (and so Google can only get their metadata in transit anyway). I guess the question becomes why Android at all?
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Sep 6, 2016 09:17
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The answer to that is simple, they can't give OEMs (Samsung) any chance to leave the OHA plus that's no different in practice from what I was saying above. Let's say you replace all of Android with whatever is different about Chrome OS. It would still have to maintain compatibility with existing Android apps and be customizable by carriers and OEMs. Whatever it is underneath it has to do those things otherwise they won't get any data because there won't be an ecosystem or anyone making these handsets. Then you're right back to what I was saying, you've created an OS that has none of what Chrome OS offers now, at the expense of having an OS that is not Android but is in every way exactly what Android is now doing desktop duty. No matter how you cut it, a merge is replacing Chrome OS with Android or an Android clone because Android is too valuable to alter in any way that matters.
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Sep 6, 2016 09:50
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In the midst of the Galaxy Note 7 exploding news, there was an HTC phone exploding too, apparently. Relatively close to me as well.
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Sep 6, 2016 10:20
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ThermoPhysical posted:In the midst of the Galaxy Note 7 exploding news, there was an HTC phone exploding too, apparently. "A cocktail bomb" eh?
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Sep 6, 2016 10:35
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LastInLine posted:The answer to that is simple, they can't give OEMs (Samsung) any chance to leave the OHA plus that's no different in practice from what I was saying above. What even is the Open Handset Alliance still doing that's useful? Their own website hasn't updated in like five years and Google has been pulling AOSP apart to the point where the OHA has basically no core anymore. Also congratulations on dehumanizing yourself and facing to Samsung I guess? Is this part of the wireless charging grief process or something?
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Sep 6, 2016 10:55
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Oh you're right, the OHA does nothing anymore--it was only useful to force OEMs to standardize on Android and now that it's done the ecosystem costs to leave are too great for anyone to bear. Now it only exists to bar OEMs from making any devices running any other OS. But that exactly is my point, to invalidate the existing app library is to give Samsung an excuse to say gently caress it, and pull an Amazon. Any move that could be perceived as burning it down and starting over is an excuse for Samsung to leave because there is simply no reason to keep on keeping on with a deal that's positively rotten for anyone who isn't Samsung and is just bad if you are Samsung. As it stands now, Google gets inroads on every non-Apple handset sold. Why would they possibly do anything to endanger that? They certainly wouldn't do so to make Chrome OS or some variant thereof slightly more appealing given that there's a pretty solid ceiling as to how popular it could ever be on the one hand and they already make the world's most popular, data-sucking browser on all the other platforms on the other.
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Sep 6, 2016 12:13
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LastInLine posted:Now it only exists to bar OEMs from making any devices running any other OS.
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Sep 6, 2016 13:10
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Yeah, there's nothing stopping OHA members from using *other* OSes. They just can't use forked Android. If they wanted to make a Windows 10 phone or an Ubuntu phone (or Tizen if you're Samsung), there's nothing stopping them other than lack of consumer interest. Samsung has continued to manufacture Tizen phones, in fact. Preventing all OSes would be incredibly anti-competitive and I'm not sure even Google could get away with that. That said, it doesn't seem to have forced any changes on Samsung since they still helpfully install two browsers and two email clients and two app stores and so on. Anyway, neither Android nor ChromeOS will be on the desktop since that would mean Linux is on the desktop and that's not until Next Year.
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Sep 6, 2016 13:43
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What's the phone case company you nerds like aside from diztronic?
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Sep 6, 2016 16:26
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mango sentinel posted:What's the phone case company you nerds like aside from diztronic? I've had good luck with Tudia.* My diztronic case for my Turbo became loose somehow, and their support completely ignored me when I asked about it a few times. * I've only gotten one case from them for my Turbo, and it's held up well. "Good luck" should be taken with a grain of salt as I've only dealt with them and their products once.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:35
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mango sentinel posted:What's the phone case company you nerds like aside from diztronic? I really like Spigen as of late. I've been buying a Thin Fit and Neo Hybrid case for every phone I've had in the last couple years using the TF for day to day and Hybrid for when I feel like I might drop my phone. The Thin Fit one on the Note 7 feels really nice and doesn't take away from the cosmetic appeal of the phone but helps with the slippery feel.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:40
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Seconding Spigen.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:59
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First impressions on the R1 HD. It's rad as hell.
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Sep 6, 2016 18:22
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LG is announcing the V20 today. Anyone have any experience with the V10?
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Sep 6, 2016 19:02
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It apparently suffers from the bricking issues that the LG G4 suffered from.
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Sep 6, 2016 19:05
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Mogomra posted:I've had good luck with Tudia.*
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Sep 6, 2016 20:08
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Major Ryan posted:So (assuming the Pixel by Google rumours are true) what is the reasoning for Google picking this year to launch its own branded phone again? Third time's the charm: first the Nexus One revolutionised how people buy their phones (unsubsidised, from the manufacturer's website, and if something goes wrong or you need support just post on their forum!!); then the roaring success of the Google Play Edition devices proved that, when comparing handset specifications side by side and using an identical OS for control, customers will make the natural, rational, logical choice and buy an iPhone; and so 2016 brings with it Google's own VR so you can strap your phone to your phace on purpose, Google's own 'assistant' AI so you can send those phoney annual Happy Birthday Grandma texts while distainfully avoiding human contact, and this time there are two of Google's own messaging apps that will be abandoned by the next dessert flavour OS release cycle. [e] device updates, user experience consistency, user support in general, and other controversial topics are definitely on the 'future issues' whiteboard, if not the actual We Need To Talk About This agenda; but I'm of no doubt that a lot of people at Goophabet care deeply about how the little people actually use their products. In the meantime, how about some emoji? spincube fucked around with this message at 20:27 on Sep 6, 2016 |
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Sep 6, 2016 20:18
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so I could say that I finally figured out what this god damned cube is doing. Get well Lowtax.
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I dunno, but my Nexus 5X got the latest update the day it was released, and when I had a QC issue with it, I called support and there was a new one cross-shipped to my house two days later. thanks bye.
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Sep 6, 2016 20:28
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JayKay posted:It apparently suffers from the bricking issues that the LG G4 suffered from. The rumor is that this was due to a defect specific to the Snapdragon 808 so FWIW that probably won't happen with the v20. Probably.
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Sep 6, 2016 20:36
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I'm really pleased that everyone is certain Google is going to gently caress this up. It's the only thing I've got faith in them to do. Well, I've faith in them reinventing the wheel four times before December (quietly dropping the most round one sometime in January), but apart from that it's illogical decisions all the way down. And I'll still buy it and like it.
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Sep 6, 2016 20:47
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The Nexus 1 and AFAIK, all subsequent devices have had really good phone support. At least in my experience.
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Sep 6, 2016 20:54
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Thermopyle posted:The Nexus 1 and AFAIK, all subsequent devices have had really good phone support. The Nexus S didn't because that fell in that period after they'd abandoned internet sales of the device but before they started selling devices in the Play Store. All Nexus S handsets were serviced by the manufacturer or through the carrier which sold them.
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Sep 6, 2016 21:37
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Went to AT&T today and traded my Note7 in on an S7 Edge until the new Notes ship. It's a nice phone and all, but it's definitely not the Note7.  now to play the waiting game.
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Sep 7, 2016 00:57
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10 Beers posted:Went to AT&T today and traded my Note7 in on an S7 Edge until the new Notes ship. It's a nice phone and all, but it's definitely not the Note7. Are they letting you give the S7 Edge back when the replacement Notes arrive? Rogers is being a big load of dicklords and offering you a swap to an S7/S7 Edge plus credit, but you can't swap it back to a Note7 when the replacements come.
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Sep 7, 2016 01:14
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T-mobile isn't doing loaners either unless you are on the jump plan thing. Supposed to get new Notes from Samsung next week here locally. It charges pretty fast so I've just switched to charging it in the mornings and turning it off at night. I went ahead and installed a battery temp monitor to keep an eye, but haven't seen a temp at all particularly high. There are few specifics on these incidents but I'm guessing they tend to be like the Australian guy who had one of the bad ones and left it charging overnight on a bed. That isn't a crazy way to use a phone by any stretch but I wouldn't do stuff like that with these potentially dodgy phones. Might as well take off the case too since its getting replaced and don't want to affect cooling at all. This seems like it is gonna make it a pain to ever sell these phones. Unless Samsung has a simple way to check if a phone is a 'bad' one there's not gonna be a great way to show someone you got it replaced.
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Sep 7, 2016 01:40
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Honestly, the risk is severe enough that Samsung should push an update out to brick affected devices once there's ample replacement ones in the retail channel. That's the only way to ensure compliance with the recall and the only way to not tank resale value.
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Sep 7, 2016 01:43
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The TSA should ban note 7s from planes honestly.
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Sep 7, 2016 02:20
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Major Ryan posted:So (assuming the Pixel by Google rumours are true) what is the reasoning for Google picking this year to launch its own branded phone again? I mean, they tried this before with the original Nexus which didn't work/wasn't supported/angered the other mobile manufacturers, and I don't see there being any pressing reason why 2016 is the right time to try again. Google needs a phone nice enough that they're happy to use it internally without getting whatever actual consumers buy. Basically google employees don't want to get Samsung'd.
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Sep 7, 2016 02:23
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Nitrousoxide posted:The TSA should ban note 7s from planes honestly. This but do it after Sept 20 please
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Sep 7, 2016 02:24
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