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Which non-Power of the Daleks story would you like to see an episode found from?
This poll is closed.
Marco Polo 36 20.69%
The Myth Makers 10 5.75%
The Massacre of St. Bartholomew's Eve 45 25.86%
The Savages 2 1.15%
The Smugglers 2 1.15%
The Highlanders 45 25.86%
The Macra Terror 21 12.07%
Fury from the Deep 13 7.47%
Total: 174 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
  • Locked thread
Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

That could be frustrating because sometimes you could see the potential but he just crashed and burned trying to get there, but other times he'd somehow absolutely nail it and produce something magical.

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jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum
Doom Coalition 3 just released! I barely remember what all happened in 1 and 2; can't wait to see how well this one flows with that in mind

EDIT: Absent Friends is garbage. The Doctor says "PIN Number". The N stands for number!!

jivjov fucked around with this message at 11:01 on Sep 22, 2016

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

jivjov posted:

Doom Coalition 3 just released! I barely remember what all happened in 1 and 2; can't wait to see how well this one flows with that in mind

EDIT: Absent Friends is garbage. The Doctor says "PIN Number". The N stands for number!!

ATMOS System is a tautology!

Cerv
Sep 14, 2004

This is a silly post with little news value.

CobiWann posted:

Wait, there are people in England who DON'T live in London?!?

Yea. But if they're not willing to book a last minute megabus for the chance to see Moffat talk about how great he is, are they really true Who fans?

Fil5000
Jun 23, 2003

HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

Cerv posted:

Yea. But if they're not willing to book a last minute megabus for the chance to see Moffat talk about how great he is, are they really true Who fans?

You're right, a true Who fan is willing to spend literally hours trapped in a moving vehicle next to a chemical toilet full of other people's waste. It's no worse than watching The Twin Dilemma.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!
Clearly everyone's rushing to buy those tickets because I can't get access to the Megabus website at all (to tell you how horrifically long my journey would be)

Cerv
Sep 14, 2004

This is a silly post with little news value.

Fil5000 posted:

You're right, a true Who fan is willing to spend literally hours trapped in a moving vehicle next to a chemical toilet full of other people's waste. It's no worse than watching The Twin Dilemma.

Take your iPad and do both at the same time

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!
Other tablets are available

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!
Jesus gently caress it would take over eight hours for me to get to London on a megabus (including the time taken to get to where it picks you up)

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum
Doom Coalition 3, story 3 (The Doomsday Chronometer) major spoiler ahead:

Goddamn I cannot believe it took me until the "You're a time lord??" reveal for me to realize who Octavian was. That said, I did appreciate River's callback to the Octavian she used to know!

CobiWann
Oct 21, 2009

Have fun!

MrL_JaKiri posted:

Jesus gently caress it would take over eight hours for me to get to London on a megabus (including the time taken to get to where it picks you up)

Wow, it would only take me seven-and-a-half hours from Dulles to Heathrow!

Pocky In My Pocket
Jan 27, 2005

Giant robots shouldn't fight!






MrL_JaKiri posted:

Jesus gently caress it would take over eight hours for me to get to London on a megabus (including the time taken to get to where it picks you up)

How? How can it take that long.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!

Little_wh0re posted:

How? How can it take that long.

7 hours 15 for the journey, leaving at 6:30 from Newcastle, an hour to get to Newcastle as they don't stop at Durham.

cargohills
Apr 18, 2014

It would take between 8 and 11 hours for me, which isn't particularly consistent. Aren't buses amazing.

The_Doctor
Mar 29, 2007

"The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

Hell, I live in London and I wouldn't be able to do it, due to being in the middle of the loving work day. Also it's already sold out. Also I'm currently sitting in a coffee shop in Georgia.

egon_beeblebrox
Mar 1, 2008

WILL AMOUNT TO NOTHING IN LIFE.



The_Doctor posted:

Hell, I live in London and I wouldn't be able to do it, due to being in the middle of the loving work day. Also it's already sold out. Also I'm currently sitting in a coffee shop in Georgia.

Georgia the state or Georgia the country?

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

egon_beeblebrox posted:

Georgia the state or Georgia the country?

The latter makes it a better story.

Timby
Dec 23, 2006

Your mother!

CobiWann posted:

Wow, it would only take me seven-and-a-half hours from Dulles to Heathrow!

Yeah, but ... Dulles. :suicide:

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum
No weekend sale from Big Finish these weekend...but some more information about upcoming Counter-Measures releases.

What's the deal with Counter-Measures? The cover art indicates it's "from the Worlds of Doctor Who". Classic series thing? Or like Bernice and from novels?

cargohills
Apr 18, 2014

They're the proto-UNIT guys from Remembrance of the Daleks.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum
Huh...that's one of the few televised Classic stories I've seen and I barely remember them. Guess they were popular, then.

Fil5000
Jun 23, 2003

HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

jivjov posted:

Huh...that's one of the few televised Classic stories I've seen and I barely remember them. Guess they were popular, then.

I think it's more a case of Big Finish just wanting to get as much stuff out of Who as they can that they could legitimately continue with if they ever lose the license.

cargohills
Apr 18, 2014

jivjov posted:

Huh...that's one of the few televised Classic stories I've seen and I barely remember them. Guess they were popular, then.

You should probably watch more of the old series.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum

cargohills posted:

You should probably watch more of the old series.

I know, I know. I just honestly have more time in my life for audio stories due to commuting and the like, so I've been using those to get my Classic Doctor fix

Open Source Idiom
Jan 4, 2013

Fil5000 posted:

I think it's more a case of Big Finish just wanting to get as much stuff out of Who as they can that they could legitimately continue with if they ever lose the license.

That is a thing that Big Finish does, but they wouldn't be allowed to in this case. The use of Counter Measures, like Gallifrey or Jago and Lightfoot, is bundled up in the Doctor Who licence, as opposed to stuff like Graceless, Vienna or their version of Dorian Gray, which are owned wholly by Big Finish (give or take creator rights, e.g. what's going on with Erimem).

Then there's stuff like Bernice, the Daleks and the Cybermen, which are very much their own thing.

The_Doctor
Mar 29, 2007

"The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

egon_beeblebrox posted:

Georgia the state or Georgia the country?

Georgia the state. I could have said Athens, and then we'd have had even more confusion.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum
Speaking of the Gallifrey series...is there any hope ever of the early stuff getting released as a download? I know there are rights issues and the like with some of those early things...but does BF actually go out and try to renegotiate/secure rights to issue downloads for older stuff?

Edward Mass
Sep 14, 2011

𝅘𝅥𝅮 I wanna go home with the armadillo
Good country music from Amarillo and Abilene
Friendliest people and the prettiest women you've ever seen
𝅘𝅥𝅮
Class will debut its first two episodes on BBC Three on October 22. No date yet for BBC America.

Davros1
Jul 19, 2007

You've got to admit, you are kind of implausible



jivjov posted:

Speaking of the Gallifrey series...is there any hope ever of the early stuff getting released as a download? I know there are rights issues and the like with some of those early things...but does BF actually go out and try to renegotiate/secure rights to issue downloads for older stuff?

Oh yeah. Just keep in mind they are a VERY small company, so with everything else they do, pursuing people to sign off on downloads is low on their list. Then there's the case of something like series one of the Companion Chronicles, were one person REFUSES to sign off, so they can't be released.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum

Davros1 posted:

Oh yeah. Just keep in mind they are a VERY small company, so with everything else they do, pursuing people to sign off on downloads is low on their list. Then there's the case of something like series one of the Companion Chronicles, were one person REFUSES to sign off, so they can't be released.

What/who is the holdout on the Companion Chronicles?

Davros1
Jul 19, 2007

You've got to admit, you are kind of implausible



jivjov posted:

What/who is the holdout on the Companion Chronicles?

BF won't say, because they're not that petty, but if I had to guess, I'd think it's Patrick Chapman, who wrote "Fear of the Daleks", or Mark J Thompson, who directed series 1, since I haven't seen either of them do anything BF related since.

Big Mean Jerk
Jan 27, 2009

Well, of course I know him.
He's me.

CaptainYesterday posted:

Class will debut its first two episodes on BBC Three on October 22. No date yet for BBC America.

They also announced Capaldi will show up in the first episode, just as you'd expect.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

CaptainYesterday posted:

Class will debut its first two episodes on BBC Three on October 22. No date yet for BBC America.

Yeah I'm not gonna watch th-

Big Mean Jerk posted:

They also announced Capaldi will show up in the first episode, just as you'd expect.

Goddammit :cripes:

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum
Its an 8 episode series. If we can suffer through stuff like Cyberwoman and Minuet in Hell, we can suffer through this spinoff if it happens to be bad.

Edward Mass
Sep 14, 2011

𝅘𝅥𝅮 I wanna go home with the armadillo
Good country music from Amarillo and Abilene
Friendliest people and the prettiest women you've ever seen
𝅘𝅥𝅮
I just wish they had chosen a more interesting name. Call it 'Coal Hill' or something.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum

CaptainYesterday posted:

I just wish they had chosen a more interesting name. Call it 'Coal Hill' or something.

Also, where is literally anyone we recognize from the handful of times we've seen modern Coal Hill?

(If they have William Russell cameo in the flesh as the head of the school board, I will :toxx: myself to watching every single episode of Class they ever produce. Has to actually be Ian as played by William though. No pictures or busts or namedrops)

Edward Mass
Sep 14, 2011

𝅘𝅥𝅮 I wanna go home with the armadillo
Good country music from Amarillo and Abilene
Friendliest people and the prettiest women you've ever seen
𝅘𝅥𝅮

jivjov posted:

Also, where is literally anyone we recognize from the handful of times we've seen modern Coal Hill?

(If they have William Russell cameo in the flesh as the head of the school board, I will :toxx: myself to watching every single episode of Class they ever produce. Has to actually be Ian as played by William though. No pictures or busts or namedrops)

Mr. Armitage is the only character I can find from modern Coal Hill to be in Class.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum

CaptainYesterday posted:

Mr. Armitage is the only character I can find from modern Coal Hill to be in Class.

In looking this up to refresh myself; I saw the news that the main character was a bi/gay male with a boyfriend. I'm seriously and honestly surprised that I've not heard anything (negative or positive) about that so far. Hopefully lovely internet people won't ruin this for anyone.

Tim Burns Effect
Apr 1, 2011

Davros1 posted:

Oh yeah. Just keep in mind they are a VERY small company, so with everything else they do, pursuing people to sign off on downloads is low on their list. Then there's the case of something like series one of the Companion Chronicles, were one person REFUSES to sign off, so they can't be released.

When I saw Jason Haigh-Ellery at a convention panel earlier this year, his most interesting story about rights issues had to do with "Sapphire and Steel". Unfortunately I can't remember all the details, but essentially all the paperwork involved was never digitized and has changed hands so many times that it got lost in NYC somewhere along the line. So they can't renew the license literally because no one knows where the original documents are.

Also I think the creator might have lost the rights to the IP in a divorce settlement at some point? Basically, it's a mess.

(Honestly I thought Jason was the most interesting speaker there because he's the guy who has to make all those deals and I'm a sucker for those kinds of stories)

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Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?



Short Synopsis: The Doctor tops Trump.

Long Synopsis: The Sixth Doctor ruins he and Charley's vacation in order to crack a rather mundane mystery. A genius is seeking to stop an intergalactic war with the help of a very unlucky man, and an overworked and underappreciated cop just wants to get away from it all.

What's Good:
  • The innocuous origin. Whether television or audio, often a story kicks off with the Doctor either getting caught up in events or dragged into them deliberately. In this story, we begin with the Doctor and Charley enjoying a completely casual and relaxing vacation, and it is the Doctor's eagerness to explore a rather mundane and even silly "mystery" that he reads in a lovely tabloid that inadvertently pulls him into the edges of a plot already unfolding . He doesn't just arrive on the scene mid-action or get caught in a trap, he just sets off to investigate a minor thing on the periphery of the main story that rather naturally sees him circle his way into the main plot. It makes a nice change of pace - he sees a newspaper story about a pound coin minted in the future, tracks down the person who used it and ends up involved in a plot to end a long-running intergalactic war.... and it feels completely natural!

  • The "antagonist". The bad guy of the story only makes fleeting appearances throughout the first couple of episodes, usually speaking vaguely in terms of some master plan he has, coming across as oily and cold and sinister.... and then when we finally get to meet him we learn there is far more to the character than it first appears. He never really gets completely "redeemed", he's far too morally compromised by the decisions he's made and the willingness he's had to sacrifice others for his concept of the greater good.... but there IS more to him than would first appear from his rather cliched initial appearances. There are moments where he seems almost desperately eager to follow the leads of others when they offer solutions he hasn't thought of, and for all his earlier faults and willingness to kill or let people die you get the sense that if he'd just had some other figure to give him direction (say the Doctor) he would never have gone down that track. There is a level of depth to him beyond what you might normally see, though to be fair far too often villains in Doctor Who can be really shallow so even the appearance of a level of depth makes them seem like more well-rounded characters.

  • The world-building. It's a pet peeve of mine to see particular authors bring back their "pet" characters over and over again when no other writers seem to have demonstrated any interest in using them since. I'm always willing to make an exception for Eddie Robson because he's written some of my favorite Big Finish audios, and I do feel like he uses the returning characters well as part of his efforts in world-building. D.I. Patricia Menzies returns from The Condemned, a story in which she learned about alien life on Earth and those who would exploit them. In this story they use that basis to help set the foundation - Menzies is not only aware of aliens but has become a fixture in their community, she helps aliens out of sticky situations without involving the authorities, and they in turn help her out as she investigates both regular and "extraordinary" cases, acting as a network of informants and providing services the actual police can't (or won't). This also helps further the storylines of both the Doctor (she gives him the resources he needs for his own investigation) and Charley (Menzies is able to bring Charley to an alien who reveals some unsettling facts to her) and her own story soon overlaps with theirs and brings everything together. There is a sense that the story is happening in a living, breathing world peopled by characters who know, react, interact and work either with each other or within a larger network that encompasses them all.

  • Furthering the Doctor/Charley storyline. After the previous story faked out Charley revealing her origins to the Doctor, I was frustrated that it was back to the regular status quo. This story explores this a little further (this story was actually written as an extra, the Charley storyline was actually intended to have reached its end by this point) from Charley's perspective, as it lays out some unpalatable truths for her about the dangers of continuing to travel with an earlier version of somebody she isn't meant to meet until much later in his life. This also leads into Charley doing some very peculiar things that are meant to make both the Doctor and the listener start to question just exactly what Charley is up to, and whether she's as moral as we might think. Whether this will go anywhere I don't know, but Charley's plan to "fix" everything certainly raises some eyebrows, as the Doctor points out that he is positive she knew far better.

  • The Doctor's choice of final game. Everything boils down to a game of chance at the High-Risks table where reality itself can be altered, and the Doctor gambles EVERYTHING on a game of..... well, it's a fantastic choice of game :)

What's Not:

  • The Raincloud Man. The titular character is very interesting, has a lot of potential to explore and.... is unceremoniously killed off at one point in the story and everybody just kind of moves on without more than a fleeting backward glance.

  • Sidelining the consequences/Casual Death. In addition to the above, while a lot of good work is done in terms of world-building and providing characters with depth, there is an unfortunately tendency for a lot of destruction and death to be glossed over or otherwise ignored. One supporting character who has a lot of important things to say is killed off-screen and, after a brief subplot of Charley being suspected of the murder, is basically forgotten about. An alien race attacks with spaceships, lasers and other highly visible pieces of advanced technology but it is all swept under the rug without even a rudimentary explanation of HOW. To make matters worse, the action is quickly shifted to Rio where things become a lot more public before finally being resolved, and the only comment made about all the destruction is,"Well I'm glad I'm not the one who has to explain this" before everybody just moves on. There is a sense (unintentional for sure) that because it has happened in Rio it's less important/doesn't really matter, whereas the far less impactful events in Manchester were somehow more relevant. Whether Big Finish was taking their cues from the TV show at the time where public and acknowledged alien attacks were the norm or whether Robson just didn't bother to concern himself with the consequences on the world of the story he wrote isn't as important as the fact that it stands out like dog's balls - you can have aliens show up publicly and blow a lot of poo poo up before disappearing and NOT give an explanation for why they did it, but 9 times out of 10 it's going to sit poorly with the listener. Or maybe that's just me.

Final Thoughts:

Despite the large number of notes for what I liked and the comparatively small number of dislikes, The Raincloud Man is "only" a solid story. I like 6th Doctor/Charley stories, I like Eddie Robson stories, so I was always predisposed to think well of this. But while it's a good listen with plenty of good character moments and a neat resolution to the main threat, it doesn't quite hold up to the quality of other recent stories like The Doomwood Curse, with just a couple of niggling little aspects to it that detract from what is otherwise a very listenable story. It's not the kind of story I would eagerly suggest you go out of your way to get, but nor is it something I would suggest avoiding. In the overall Six/Charley storyline I think this one will stand out as a fairly key story due to the importance of a couple key scenes where the enormity of Charley's predicament is explored. But on it's own? It's "just" good, the type of story you put on and listen to and think,"That was good" and then probably don't think about again until somebody else brings it up. Not a bad story at all, but probably not a particularly memorable one.... outside of the Doctor's choice of final game at the High Stakes table, which is a goddamn loving masterpiece.

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