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I this tournament I'm watching Mercy replaces Lucio when she's played at all. Which is only with Pharah. Add a Winston and Zarya and an R hero and that's the comp that crushes point 1 and maybe 2 on Numbani and Eichenwald. If Volskaya were every played it'd probably work there too because of those flyers' flank routes. Pharah Mercy Lucio has failed to do so, probably because his ult takes too long to charge. I would think Zen and Ana without Lucio would lack a speed boost to follow up the Nanoboost charge. Zen seems to be able to compete for Ana's spot on KOTH though, maybe because Zen and Lucio more easily survive against both divers and Zarya ult combo.
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Sep 26, 2016 23:27
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ToastyPotato posted:Yes but at lower levels, where most people don't focus fire or even have great aim, his healing boost is much more significant in its role. If your team is losing fights via attrition, the AOE heal can absolutely matter. Simply keeping people alive longer can be better than playing a healer with high dps. It also takes pressure off of a lower level Ana, and she can more reliably concentrate on the most critical heals.
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Sep 26, 2016 23:29
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Zenyatta is secretly just a DPS that has a support ult. The best supports to run at this moment are Lucio and Ana. Ana's ult is bonkers and is getting nerfed whenever the next patch hits, hard counters Zenyatta's transcendence, and is able to counter the opposing Ana's nanoboost with her sleep dart. Lucio's group healing is super good, and speed boost management means your team can cleanly attack or disengage quickly whenever its needed. Mercy and Zen both suffer pretty hard from Ana being fielded.
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Sep 26, 2016 23:31
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Too bad Zen is a fun character and Lucio is a turd
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Sep 27, 2016 00:25
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ToastyPotato posted:Got into an argument last night with a friend because he insisted him picking Zen was a perfectly fine healing choice because he had gold heals despite us getting rolled. He didn't want to accept that despite getting gold heals, he would have had higher healing output if he picked Lucio or even Mercy instead. Medal blindness strikes again. I'm going to send him this video though. If your friend was the only healer in this situation, he is not the problem If your friend was Zen and there was also an Ana on your team then yeah maybe he should have switched but then again maybe not because healing throughput vs. ability to stifle enemy ults is a pretty tough call and depends on the enemy team and how good your tanks are at mitigating damage so you don't have to heal it in the first place, etc.
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Sep 27, 2016 00:42
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flashman posted:Too bad Zen is a fun character and Lucio is a turd I'm playing a game where I've decided to practice my support play, King's Row, I pick Lucio because we have a Mercy. First round is defense and we get pushed all the way back to the final point before we hold it on overtime. Then comes attack. I stick with Lucio, I'm trying to do all the good Lucio things, keeping speed boost on when possible, spamming into fights, dooting people away. It's loving awful, no one is pushing forward, just dicking around at the chokepoint, the red team has a Symmetra who's had all the time in the world to build a teleporter and a Reaper that nobody's killing. After my second fruitless death I say gently caress it and switch to Zenyatta. A quick five player killstreak later we take the point in less than a minute, then leisurely ride the payload all the way to the finish line, just discording and orbing away. I don't even need to use my ult. I think I'm gonna practice more Zen, is what I'm saying.
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Sep 27, 2016 00:44
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ToastyPotato posted:Got into an argument last night with a friend because he insisted him picking Zen was a perfectly fine healing choice because he had gold heals despite us getting rolled. He didn't want to accept that despite getting gold heals, he would have had higher healing output if he picked Lucio or even Mercy instead. Medal blindness strikes again. I'm going to send him this video though. what were you and the rest of the group playing as?
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Sep 27, 2016 00:49
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cosmicjim posted:what were you and the rest of the group playing as? There was a Rein, Dva, Reaper, Bastion, Ana, Zen to start. I was Rein, our other player was Reaper, and the pubbies were Bastion (then Mei at some point), Ana and D.va(don't remember how long they were D.va.) The funny thing is, that was the only match of the night where we didn't have a Lucio (because I rolled Lucio whenever we didn't have a big healer) and it was the only time we got steam rolled. We lost other matches for sure, but none were that bad. It fell apart because our friend saw the comp and felt we had little chance from the start so he rolled Zen to "melt the tanks", meanwhile, we had no good stims, Bastion wasn't helpful (pretty sure they switched to Mei at some point) and D.va didn't contribute very much and I think switched to DPS at some point early on. And I am just not a good enough player to carry a team, or else I wouldn't be a low ranked gold player. None of the three of us are good enough to carry, which is why I would prefer we work together and pick smart when we play together. I'm willing to admit, and frequently do when I am playing, that I have serious flaws with aim, positioning, and ult usage, but drat man, it isn't hard to recognize basic strats, and its rough when people never find fault in their own play and then throw medals in your face. That is probably the biggest weakness of most players. I remember telling him afterward if he really didn't want to play heals, he should have told me and we could have swapped, but he said he didn't want to force me to play a role... For the rest of the night I played Lucio whenever we didn't have a solid healer and we didn't lose that decisively again and I am by no means a great Lucio. We still went 2-1-3, but I'll take close losses over complete steam rolls any day.
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Sep 27, 2016 01:42
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Snazzy Frocks posted:junkrat is basically bad pharah in terms of functionality hm no
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Sep 27, 2016 02:05
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KoB posted:Because Zen is the worst healer. Yea, just saying that 2 supports is almost always gonna be best.
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Sep 27, 2016 02:12
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Snazzy Frocks posted:i rather not have the game encourage some idiot's pick just because he somehow killed three people very quickly and then did nothing the rest of the game your team losing doesn't mean you didn't do anything. if you happen to get a teamkill by yourself and then lose the game, I'd rather see that than the mercy on the winning team res 2 guys then die
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Sep 27, 2016 02:21
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I'm actually starting to like playing Zen. I've traditionally gone for Lucio or Mercy as my healers because my aim is pretty mediocre, but earlier today we needed another healer to go with Lucio and I don't like using Mercy when we have a D.Va. Turns out my aim is still as mediocre as I remember it but throwing darts at large boys when they get too rude is easy and effective.
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Sep 27, 2016 03:06
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Lucio is the best solo support but Ana is more fun to play. I get to do more things.
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Sep 27, 2016 03:33
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I see people talk about lucio being boring a lot and I figure those people just aren't taking advantage of his kit well you can do a lot of things with lucio that nobody else can
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Sep 27, 2016 03:51
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Manatee Cannon posted:I see people talk about lucio being boring a lot and I figure those people just aren't taking advantage of his kit well I agree with this
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Sep 27, 2016 04:05
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Not sure if it would be OP but I feel the only change lucio needs to be a fun character to play is make his gun full auto. It doesn't do anything except feed the other healers ult charge as is.
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Sep 27, 2016 04:23
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all lucio needs to be fun is for you to play him properly ride walls, boop people off cliffs or to save your team/yourself, learn how you're actually supposed to manage your speed/heal boost. don't be the guy that just stands in the middle of the point and fires off potshots because lucio is better than that
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Sep 27, 2016 04:34
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Overbite posted:Lucio is the best solo support but Ana is more fun to play. I get to do more things. With an unorganized team typical of the console, on some maps I'm thinking I have a better chance of healing people whether they want it or not with Ana than anyone else. Manatee Cannon posted:all lucio needs to be fun is for you to play him properly Yeah this is the answer though. Lucio is so fun to play for me for your listed reasons and the healing is just a nice side effect.
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Sep 27, 2016 04:35
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lucio is kinda like reinhardt where I think the basic utility of the kit blinds people to even the concept of nuance, so they just kinda sit around doing the very least it is possible to do and think that's all there is
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Sep 27, 2016 04:42
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Snazzy Frocks posted:junkrat is basically bad pharah in terms of functionality bad opinions
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Sep 27, 2016 04:49
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Manatee Cannon posted:lucio is kinda like reinhardt where I think the basic utility of the kit blinds people to even the concept of nuance, so they just kinda sit around doing the very least it is possible to do and think that's all there is Yeah even outside of his mobility and wallrun potential, if you're actually nailing hits with his blasts you do decent damage. A lot of ppl are too lazy to even try leading shots or firing in a horizontal spread. Then you get into situational stuff like booping aggressive enemies away from your team, or an ulting reaper etc. Lucio's great.
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Sep 27, 2016 07:07
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Kai Tave posted:I'm playing a game where I've decided to practice my support play, King's Row, I pick Lucio because we have a Mercy. First round is defense and we get pushed all the way back to the final point before we hold it on overtime. Then comes attack. I stick with Lucio, I'm trying to do all the good Lucio things, keeping speed boost on when possible, spamming into fights, dooting people away. It's loving awful, no one is pushing forward, just dicking around at the chokepoint, the red team has a Symmetra who's had all the time in the world to build a teleporter and a Reaper that nobody's killing. After my second fruitless death I say gently caress it and switch to Zenyatta. A quick five player killstreak later we take the point in less than a minute, then leisurely ride the payload all the way to the finish line, just discording and orbing away. I don't even need to use my ult. I have said it a thousand times and I'll say it again: Zen is the healer you pick when your team isn't using your healing to click on red team until they fall down. Therefore: always be picking Zen, because that's always the problem as support with soloqueue teams.
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Sep 27, 2016 08:14
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DrSeRRoD posted:There's an interview that mentions potential Symmetra rework, aimed for no earlier than November. There are new Voicelines on PTR suggesting that she will Augment Shields or boost Sheilds in some way - so maybe she can regen Rein's shield or make Zarya's shields last longer, also its suggesting that the Teleport will have up to 10 charges instead of 6
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Sep 27, 2016 09:19
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it's probably referring to the shields she gives players (blue health is shields) maybe she can buff them somehow, who knows
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Sep 27, 2016 09:38
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Manatee Cannon posted:lucio is kinda like reinhardt where I think the basic utility of the kit blinds people to even the concept of nuance, so they just kinda sit around doing the very least it is possible to do and think that's all there is Man, do I hate a disappointing Rein. Lots of dumbasses flail the shield around and whiff on blocking the important damage, to say nothing of loving up against the enemy Rein's ult. That's another job I like doing well and definitely notice the improvement over a bad one.
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Sep 27, 2016 10:24
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Willie Tomg posted:I have said it a thousand times and I'll say it again: Zen is the healer you pick when your team isn't using your healing to click on red team until they fall down. The absolute biggest hurdle I'm having to overcome with regard to playing support is the feeling of helplessness that occurs whenever I wind up getting focused and I can't find where I should be to avoid getting ganked all the time. Mercy and Lucio have some movement options but playing Zen means that if you get dived on and no one is there to help you out that you basically have to pull off the 1v? on your own or you're screwed and it gets really frustrating sometimes when I'm used to heroes like Winston and D.Va who can hit a button and simply be somewhere else.
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Sep 27, 2016 11:03
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How the christ do you dislodge a Junkrat from the upper left window (seen from spawn) at the destination point on King's Row? Can't hit him with splash since he can go to the other side, can't teleport up there with Reaper since he'll destroy you before you even materialize. Enemy pulling that trick completely wrecked my team's defense.
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Sep 27, 2016 11:44
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Thoughtless posted:How the christ do you dislodge a Junkrat from the upper left window (seen from spawn) at the destination point on King's Row? Can't hit him with splash since he can go to the other side, can't teleport up there with Reaper since he'll destroy you before you even materialize. Off the top of my head you can send Winston or D.Va up there, Genji can climb the wall, Hanzo can shoot scatter arrows, you can send a Pharah around the way to bombard him...there are some options.
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Sep 27, 2016 11:47
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I want to try overwatch with 24/32 player dedicated servers. With 20/30 min map rotations. And maybe a ctf map or two tossed in. And custom maps, jump maps, walkway.
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Sep 27, 2016 13:02
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junan_paalla posted:I want to try overwatch with 24/32 player dedicated servers. That would be absolutely awful
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Sep 27, 2016 13:03
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junan_paalla posted:I want to try overwatch with 24/32 player dedicated servers. With 20/30 min map rotations. And maybe a ctf map or two tossed in. And custom maps, jump maps, walkway.  I don't care if it's a giant clusterfuck. I want to blow up 15 people with a DVA bomb
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Sep 27, 2016 13:04
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junan_paalla posted:I want to try overwatch with 24/32 player dedicated servers. With 20/30 min map rotations. And maybe a ctf map or two tossed in. And custom maps, jump maps, walkway. Chaos like that is exactly what I want from weekly brawls instead of "now you can just pick McCree, Reaper and 76".
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Sep 27, 2016 14:22
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I'm a support main and Lucio is by far my least favorite. Yes, he has a low skill floor and a high skill ceiling. Yes, knowing when to switch from Speed to Heal is nuanced, knowing how to wall ride is important, and landing shots consistently is the difference between a good Lucio and an excellent Lucio. And yet despite all of that, he either bores me to tears or annoys me with how clunky his kit is. Wall riding is unintuitive with the way Blizzard can't decide what decorative doodads actually have hitboxes and which ones don't. His gun feels terrible to use, and the reward for learning how to use the most difficult gun in the game is... garbage DPS. But hey, at least the alternate fire is fun. I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep if they decided to completely gut his speed boost and ult. Ruby Prism fucked around with this message at 14:49 on Sep 27, 2016 |
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Sep 27, 2016 14:41
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Or you could just murder everything that moves with him and help your team close out kills that they otherwise wouldn't be able to by both speed boosting them to pursue or chasing them down yourself. If people successfully withdraw or overextend and survive while you're playing Lucio, you aren't doing your job. No other supports can punish people like that.
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Sep 27, 2016 15:22
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Lucio as a support has the best "we are going to do stuff now" abilities with speed boost and drop the beat. No other support really forces your team to do what you say like a giant health bar and fast movespeed
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Sep 27, 2016 15:34
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Commoners posted:Or you could just murder everything that moves with him and help your team close out kills that they otherwise wouldn't be able to by both speed boosting them to pursue or chasing them down yourself. If people successfully withdraw or overextend and survive while you're playing Lucio, you aren't doing your job. No other supports can punish people like that. So what you're saying is that you enjoy playing him. That's cool. No one's saying he's a bad character. Just that someone disliking playing him doesn't necessarily mean they don't understand the character. Ruby Prism fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Sep 27, 2016 |
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Sep 27, 2016 15:35
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Kai Tave posted:The cards Blizzard gives at the end aren't worth much more than medals a lot of the time in terms of "this is a valuable metric to gain useful feedback on your gameplay." Ask any Zarya player how many times they've gotten a Barriers Applied card despite having much more impressive accomplishments that round. Same thing with Zen's transcendence healing, it's kind of a garbage award that doesn't tell the whole story. Blizzard knows best, forget about my 3 gold medals as hook pig, the world needs to know about my 67% hook accuracy!
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Sep 27, 2016 15:51
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ColHannibal posted:Blizzard knows best, forget about my 3 gold medals as hook pig, the world needs to know about my 67% hook accuracy! More than any other thing Roadhog can do, his ability to reliably and consistently and frequently hook targets is beneficial to the team. Be it hooking Pharah out of the air, an ulting genji out of your flank, a riptire out of the air, or just instagibbing the tracer harassing your healer. Hook accuracy is a measure of how well you're able to keep your team safe with the tools at hand.
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Sep 27, 2016 15:58
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ColHannibal posted:Blizzard knows best, forget about my 3 gold medals as hook pig, the world needs to know about my 67% hook accuracy! This happened the only time I ever got 5 gold medals 
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Sep 27, 2016 15:58
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Healer fun rating official: ana > zen >>>>> mercy > getting gold as roadhog/reaper/mei bc it's qp and you don't have a healer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lucio hth
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Sep 27, 2016 16:00
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