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I need to do more studies to become less crappy at digital art. So in honor of the person who made some excellent posts that brought the thread together, have this rough movie study and/or horrible abomination.  Kraken, have you seen the self taught artist thread? the first post has lots of links of different exercises and things to try. Could always just try a bunch of techniques and see what sticks. Sometimes just exploring multiple things works better than drilling too hard in one thing at the start imo. Though as others have said, there is nothing wrong with taking a break from studies to do something fun either. JuniperCake fucked around with this message at 05:32 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 05:26
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JuniperCake posted:Kraken, have you seen the self taught artist thread? the first post has lots of links of different exercises and things to try. Could always just try a bunch of techniques and see what sticks. Sometimes just exploring multiple things works better than drilling too hard in one thing at the start imo. Though as others have said, there is nothing wrong with taking a break from studies to do something fun either. Also there's nothing wrong with just fuckin drawing. This is wildly underrated. Just start drawing poo poo that sucks, know it sucks, and keep doing it until it starts to suck less.
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Oct 7, 2016 05:42
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InevitableCheese posted:I have realized that my whole problem is my brush settings. I end up with crap when I sit down to draw without anything specific in mind. My best practice is when I'm invested in the thing I'm working on. It's also when I make the most progress. Drawing for the sake of drawing in general is a motivational dead end. It should be goal-oriented, and for a reason. Inspired, I guess. Do whatever you think is the next thing that would benefit your pixel art.
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Oct 7, 2016 06:22
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windex posted:Also there's nothing wrong with just fuckin drawing. This is wildly underrated. Just start drawing poo poo that sucks, know it sucks, and keep doing it until it starts to suck less. Like the brain won't be getting the amount of exercise needed. It's pretty hellish to know you are capable of learning something new, but can't get your hooks into anything.
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Oct 7, 2016 06:23
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Internet Kraken posted:I guess this would be a good opportunity to ask what kind of exercises you guys would recommend for a very rough artist? I've been getting random poses from this site and doing rough sketches of them. I've tried to do at least an hour of that every day, though lately I've been slacking off and drawing other stuff I enjoy because frankly its insanely boring. I figured it was a good way to build a better understanding of anatomy though, which is something I'm struggling with. You could try to incorporate the poses into other art endeavors that you have a blast with. It not only it will be a much enjoyable experience, but also you improve at the same time. That's how I learn to improved my art skills personally.
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Oct 7, 2016 06:38
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Kiki's Delivery Service happens to be about exactly this.
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Oct 7, 2016 06:44
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Internet Kraken posted:I guess this would be a good opportunity to ask what kind of exercises you guys would recommend for a very rough artist? I've been getting random poses from this site and doing rough sketches of them. I've tried to do at least an hour of that every day, though lately I've been slacking off and drawing other stuff I enjoy because frankly its insanely boring. I figured it was a good way to build a better understanding of anatomy though, which is something I'm struggling with. Posemaniacs isn't as useful as a lot of people think, you only have that one body type and the fact that it's a 3D model means that the muscle deformation and weight balance isn't really 100% accurate. When I was doing a lot of anatomy studies I liked to draw poses from http://www.characterdesigns.com or http://mjranum-stock.deviantart.com. Lots of variety in costumes and poses, although the variety in body types is still a bit lacking. You've also probably heard this 100s of times already, but if there's a life drawing group in your area drawing from a live model will get you a lot more experience than drawing from a photo. Maybe you could try to incorporate the poses you're practicing into a bigger piece? Placing clothing or costumes on the reference poses and turning it into something other than just a Thing You Have To Do could help with the boredom.
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Oct 7, 2016 08:46
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Scribblehatch posted:It can start to feel pretty mindless. Yeah but its not like you live in a box. If you're into art it's for sure you're paying attention to other art and learning from it continuously? Like for me I've spent a ton of time working on fabric fall recently and it wasn't really a problem with shapes I had but in determining appropriate line conservation while preserving fabric fall, and I mostly solved that by looking at other artists draw clothes on YouTube until I had a composite idea of what I wanted then kept refining it. Most of my sketches are design portfolio for something I want to sell one day (though maybe not with my art), so maybe on Sunday I'll draw something unrelated since I haven't contributed to thread recently.
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Oct 7, 2016 09:10
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Here's a portrait I made for shitpostmodern. I'm not so good with kawaii, but I've tried my best. Very much. Recently I've been trying to get back into the grove of working on webcomics, so I've decided to take baby steps and try to draw characters and backgrounds together. It's currently WIP, because I need to fix the rails, one of the buildings and getting rid of the braid, because my friend suggested that it doesn't suit his character.  I've went back to the original character concept file and changed his hair. 
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Oct 7, 2016 09:40
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gmc9987 posted:if there's a life drawing group in your area drawing from a live model will get you a lot more experience than drawing from a photo. As corny as this sounds, the real lesson is looking at the picture and just 'feeling' it out. For me it helps if I imagine every photo as having an idle gif version of itself.   Because it's never about just duplicating everything you see to scale. Also. gmc9987 posted:You sure about that? I'm very, very sure. Start off giving people that benefit of the doubt, for the love of god. Scribblehatch fucked around with this message at 09:48 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 09:44
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95% of my formal anatomy study has been from photos or books, but I still think life drawing is pretty clearly a better way to study if you can find it. Interpreting an actual 3D object in front of your face into the 2D space of your paper is much more challenging than copying reference that is already fixed in 2D, where half the work is done for you. You can lean around and the shifting of perspective will tell you a lot about the form of what you're looking at, information that a picture just can't give you. Hell you can even get up and walk around the model if you want to really see what's up. Personally I find it a lot more fun than drawing from pictures as well. You're right that slavish, rote copying of reference is not good, and there's certainly a lot that you can learn just from images. I can't speak to how much life drawing you did or why you felt it wasn't helpful, but I recommend it without hesitation to anyone trying to study anatomy, with the one caveat that they should have a firm grip on basic observational drawing first.
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Oct 7, 2016 11:11
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Okay fixed the hammer, did some shading. feeling good.
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Oct 7, 2016 11:57
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OmanyteJackson posted:Okay fixed the hammer, did some shading. feeling good. Looks really good so far. Can't wait to see the final image.
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Oct 7, 2016 12:41
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JuniperCake posted:I need to do more studies to become less crappy at digital art. So in honor of the person who made some excellent posts that brought the thread together, have this rough movie study and/or horrible abomination. TeaMaestro posted:Here's a portrait I made for shitpostmodern. I'm not so good with kawaii, but I've tried my best. Very much. I still have no idea how this happened, but now I also feel compelled to draw kawaii Bela Lugosi as Dracula because my avatar is something I whipped up in about 30 seconds with the help of google image search and photoshop's pencil tool. Y'all are great.  Edit: I spent way more time on this than it deserved. At least it let me slack off for a little bit. 
shitpostmodern fucked around with this message at 16:34 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 14:26
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Scribblehatch posted:Having done this, after having heard it many times, I have to say 'not necessarily.' I was surprised by how little it helped. Not as surprised as I was though, when I learned which of my friends had never been to a life drawing thing before in their lives. Really good artists who had only ever studied photos. your anatomy is not great my dude you would probably benefit from some life drawing
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Oct 7, 2016 15:20
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Troposphere posted:your anatomy is not great my dude you would probably benefit from some life drawing Some locations just aren't so lucky for their art scene. In my case, this drawing group meets about a city away, once a week, 3 weeks out of any given month, for about an hour. Whereas California you can't swing a dead cat without hitting another life drawing class. Scribblehatch fucked around with this message at 17:07 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 16:45
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you write like an rear end
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Oct 7, 2016 16:49
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Scribblehatch posted:If you mean that sincerely and not just ideologically, I'm sure you could get more specific. I have told you many times what is wrong with it you would gently benefit drawing from life and not anime
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Oct 7, 2016 17:08
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Scribblehatch posted:If you mean that sincerely and not just ideologically, I'm sure you could get more specific. life drawing classes are good. I moved away from Los Angeles where there was a life drawing / figure drawing group whose "thing" was using suicide girls or something. I'll be happy with life drawing classes at all here. I hope I'm not going to miss out on life drawing classes after moving away from Los Angeles for important reasons. That would suck.
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Oct 7, 2016 17:12
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We were just talking about photos, silly. And you haven't said anything about my art recently. You say many times, but you really mean the one time.
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Oct 7, 2016 17:13
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don't you just love it when you can tell someone has made up their mind to drop the issue at hand but then hunt you for the rest of their life
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Oct 7, 2016 17:22
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Scribblehatch posted:We were just talking about photos, silly. And you haven't said anything about my art recently. You say many times, but you really mean the one time. here is a small collection i have curated for you Troposphere posted:all your female anatomy looks like barbie dolls. if you're going to draw such blatant fap material at least change up the body types once in a while. that is My Opinion. Troposphere posted:I'm sorry, here let me rephrase: Troposphere posted:I really have no interest in being nice to men who constantly objectify women in their art. if you guys drew anything at all besides unrealistically sexy fetishized women in painful looking sexy poses constantly and had any interest whatsoever in drawing things that don't get you hot and bothered maybe I'd be kinder but as it stands, nah. Troposphere posted:so I'll repeat: please look at real women when you draw. cheesecake is fine and good but have a tiny shred of self awareness. there are so many male artists that flood the field with stuff like this and it's exhausting and depressing. Troposphere posted:my original complaint was that all of scribs women look like Barbie dolls, which I stand by. Troposphere posted:as long as the women in the art don't look like realdolls I'm usually fine with it Troposphere posted:my main qualm with you is, like I said, all your women have the same exact body type and it's not a realistic one. their waists are tiny and probably couldn't hold any of their vital organs, their torsos are super elongated (influence from the one piece guy probably?) and their boobs are huge and perpetually perky even when they aren't wearing bras. the angles you use usually shove boobs or rear end in the viewer's face. these are all things you can fix, and your art would be better for it.
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Oct 7, 2016 17:26
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Scribblehatch you dumbass now you've given them everything they need to absolutely destroy you!
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Oct 7, 2016 17:50
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C'mon we just got things back on track Scribble stop with the snide comments. I used to have alot of trouble understanding posing and volume in my drawings, but then i thought of it as 3D modelling and went 'hey, I can just start one axis at a time!' and then started doing a thing where I draw a flat plane and stretch it to fit perspective. with that I can draw just about anything and it makes good sense. I'm still real bad about just free-handing poo poo though. I think waaaay more about shape dynamics with the dumb robots, and then put alot of effort into anatomy when I draw people. (I'm still not very good at faces tbh it's a work in progress.)
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Oct 7, 2016 17:53
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Crap posted:here is a small collection i have curated for you
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Oct 7, 2016 17:55
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Is it just me or does Mei's animations resemble Kung Fu Panda
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Oct 7, 2016 18:07
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shitpostmodern posted:
Ignoring the shitstorm that just happened now, that was some good stuff regardless. Edit: I'll post one more picture before bed, trying to contribute more to the thread via images. This one is a few months old, so it's kinda rusty. I've made as a reference to a project I've been working on for quite a while now. 
TeaMaestro fucked around with this message at 18:18 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 18:14
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Scribblehatch posted:Having done this, after having heard it many times, I have to say 'not necessarily.' I was surprised by how little it helped. Not as surprised as I was though, when I learned which of my friends had never been to a life drawing thing before in their lives. Really good artists who had only ever studied photos. Certainly a lot of good artists haven't done much life drawing, and a lot of people don't have access to it. If you're at a point in your art journey where you don't thnk you'll get any benefit out of drawing from non-ideal body types with other artists in the room that's cool, but when a relative beginner says "Hey, I'm struggling with anatomy and my main drawing tool is a CGI poser model with no skin and also I get really bored sitting in front of the computer doing anatomy studies" I think discouraging them to get out and draw from life isn't really doing them any favors. Maybe you had some bad experiences or a bad group or something, but my personal anecdote is that my work improved immensely when I started doing figure drawing 2 to 3 times a month, about 8 years ago. I may not use all the lessons and techniques I learned from them when I'm drawing cartoon penguin concept art for an exercise DVD for 3 year olds but I definitely don't regret any of the time I spent there, either. EDIT: have some penguin concept art. 
gmc9987 fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 18:24
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gmc9987 posted:I think discouraging them to get out and draw from life isn't really doing them any favors. Maybe you had some bad experiences or a bad group or something, but my personal anecdote is that my work improved immensely when I started doing figure drawing 2 to 3 times a month, about 8 years ago. We're just talking about the options that remain when life drawing isn't really an option, due to location or what have you. Nothing bad ever happened. It just wasn't a significant enough jump from studying photos to be worth driving to another city once a week, 3 weeks of the month, for about an hour.
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Oct 7, 2016 18:32
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Well, using images for reference is fine, but there's a reason why many people recommend to go out and get references from real life. Sometimes an image is not enough, you have see the subject for yourself if you can, if you want to nail down the details. I'm not just talking about human figures, I'm also talking about other things too. Such as the environment, especially if you're going do work that sets in reality. And also the action and the movement. From my personal experience, I'm having actual trouble nailing down the environment, since at the time I was working on a section where the setting takes place in NYC. I've tried to use countless of image references, but even then I had a strange nagging feeling that I wasn't accurate enough. And the action, especially martial arts. Again, personally I can't rely just images, because if I don't know how that person actually swings and blocks with their blade, my final artwork will suffer from the lack of natural flow. Bottomline, use both if you can. If you still prefer to use images, fair enough. Just don't tell the other person on how to approach their own work. Everyone has different methodologies with their own art sessions. Each to their own at the end of the day.
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Oct 7, 2016 18:43
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TeaMaestro posted:Just don't tell the other person on how to approach their own work. What is this? No one did that! These are just the options. Consider them all at your own leisure, everybody.
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Oct 7, 2016 18:46
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I think the main benefit of life drawing is developing an eye for what a thing really looks like. There's that classic case of beginning artists drawing anime eyes on life drawing subjects, for example. To complete the learning experience you need someone to tell you THAT'S NOT WHAT THE loving EYE LOOKS LIKE, and then SHOW you how you can better place the graphite since you're working in a visual media and you have the tools to convey your thoughts in a VISUAL way. I was lucky enough to have a professor at a community college who told me my poo poo was poo poo, in a very nice way. And then she would touch a pencil to my paper and un-gently caress my drawing right before my eyes. Voila two weeks later I wasn't drawing anime eyes. I went from anime faces to this in half a semester under her instruction.  Talk-critique is relatively poo poo. You have to put your stylus to the canvas and show someone what you mean, and prove what you mean. Edit their image if they post it. You have the tools, you're an artist and this is what you do, is it not.
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Oct 7, 2016 18:49
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Scribblehatch posted:8D ... I've never said outright you discourage it, but you weren't clear enough that it was own preference to use images and you didn't impose it on everyone. edit: One more image, because I felt bad if I just talk and not adding pictures 
TeaMaestro fucked around with this message at 18:52 on Oct 7, 2016 |
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Oct 7, 2016 18:49
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Crap posted:here is a small collection i have curated for you  Wow you guys have been at this for over a year? That's an impressive goon grudge!gmc9987 posted:Certainly a lot of good artists haven't done much life drawing, and a lot of people don't have access to it. If you're at a point in your art journey where you don't thnk you'll get any benefit out of drawing from non-ideal body types with other artists in the room that's cool, but when a relative beginner says "Hey, I'm struggling with anatomy and my main drawing tool is a CGI poser model with no skin and also I get really bored sitting in front of the computer doing anatomy studies" I think discouraging them to get out and draw from life isn't really doing them any favors. Maybe you had some bad experiences or a bad group or something, but my personal anecdote is that my work improved immensely when I started doing figure drawing 2 to 3 times a month, about 8 years ago. I may not use all the lessons and techniques I learned from them when I'm drawing cartoon penguin concept art for an exercise DVD for 3 year olds but I definitely don't regret any of the time I spent there, either. My main reserve about doing this, and I know it probably sounds awful, is that I hate working with traditional mediums. My hands are twitchy and I often make stupid mistakes. My control has gotten better over time but I still made a lot long marks by accident and had to erase them, which always resulted in my drawings looking like murky messes. Its the main reason I quit drawing years ago. I couldn't stand how bad everything looked due to my constant erasing. Being able to draw digitally has really rekindled my love for art since my pictures might suck but at least now I can easily clean them up so they don't look like a blasted mess. Though I guess that doesn't really matter for rough practice sketching anyways. I'm not sure how refined life drawing is. I know pretty much nothing about this stuff 
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Oct 7, 2016 19:32
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Internet Kraken posted:Wow you guys have been at this for over a year? That's an impressive goon grudge! Before you could play as Cockney Cyborg Airforce Barbie and Cerulean Arachno-Scope Barbie, she clearly hated Barbies.
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Oct 7, 2016 19:49
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TeaMaestro posted:Ignoring the shitstorm that just happened now, that was some good stuff regardless. I have to ask--when you did your initial sketch for this, did you draw the naked form under the clothes and then draw the clothes once the anatomy was settled? Or did you just go straight to the clothes without constructing the figure first? I ask because the clothing feels less drawn around an existing figure and more like a paper doll outfit resting on top of it. If you're just going straight to clothing, the obvious solution is to do construction before that, but if you are doing construction, it's less of a simple additional step that needs work. I'd be interested to see the sketch before it was inked, I guess.
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Oct 7, 2016 19:51
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it's not really a grudge, it's more like talking to a brick wall, it's been made super obvious recently that he'd rather double down on his bullshit rather than listen to anyone else about anything that's why this dumb little event has been going on for days, and also why he still draws all his women the same
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Oct 7, 2016 19:51
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Crap posted:and also why he still draws all his women the same
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Oct 7, 2016 19:55
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if drawn images of women or representations of women distress you to the point of trying to change someone's mind about it, you should maybe not keep subjecting yourself to emotional distress. Because what I'm picking up is this is a source of emotional distress for people irl right now.
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Oct 7, 2016 20:31
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If it's within the rules of the thread and it bothers you, that kind of means you're subjecting yourself to it.
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Oct 7, 2016 20:35
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