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skeetied
Mar 10, 2011

Despite the trollish nature of that question...

Because my son is extremely introverted and it's his way of disconnecting when the world gets to be too much? It was a pretty sweet calorie burn pre-pregnancy too. We've been slowly weaning as he gets old enough to learn other coping mechanisms. He won't actually be 2 1/2 until late November and we'll probably be done by then.

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peanut
Sep 9, 2007


I can totally understand the calorie burn ( ;∀;) Minibug quit last month and it's difficult to taper down my snacking.
Otoh it is awesome to sleep on my stomach again.

54 40 or fuck
Jan 4, 2012

No Yanda's allowed
I was curious about this threads take on something I read on another site, I initially posted it in another post but edited out just in case so if this is too off topic let me know and I can edit this out.
Anyway, I saw some pregnant women ranting in a thread about posting pictures of their wine glasses on Facebook and family/friends got mad at them for drinking. They seemed pretty angry about other people being angry, that one glass of wine/one beer was fine but I work in the mental health/addictions field and I've never heard anything other than "no safe amount". Granted I have worked more with children who have already been identified as FAS/FASD diagnosed but it seemed so weird to me. I would never risk it anyway but has there been research or literature recently that actually contradicts the very present and reasonable advice to not drink at all during pregnancy?

Sharks Below
May 23, 2011

ty hc <3
I don't know about the science, apart from that it's extremely hard to research. How do you tell pregnant women to participate in a study where they drink a lot or even some? Anecdotally, I have had the odd small glass of wine throughout my pregnancy. Mostly for celebratory reasons, once for stress reasons. Over the pregnancy I might have had ... 3-4 small glasses? The liver does a pretty good job of processing the majority of alcohol before it reaches the placenta. I think most midwives and OBs (the ones I know, and I work iwth a tonne of them and have worked in the medical field for a long time) will tell you that the odd glass is fine but if the CDC or w/e started saying that, "the odd glass" would be interpreted pretttttttttttttttttttttttty differently by a lot of people. Bingeing is obviously extremely problematic - the liver can only keep up with so much, after all. I would imagine with the field you work in, "no amount is safe" is definitely the right point to reiterate.

It's for sure a hot topic. I don't blame women for being angry that they're being judged by judgy judgersons.

In NYC it's illegal for a licenced premise to refuse service of alcohol to a pregnant woman. Just some trivia.

54 40 or fuck
Jan 4, 2012

No Yanda's allowed
Ha, I wonder if any pregnant woman ever has gone full term with no judgement. No raised eyebrows, no concern-trolling but I doubt it. And yes, I bet even the suggestion of the research would receive enormous backlash, especially knowing how very profoundly difficult a child with FAS/FASD can be. I can usually tell by looking at a kid because unfortunately there is a disproportionately high amount of children where I live with it and the aggressive behaviour and cognitive delays can be pretty significant.
From some cursory looking most seem to be later term when the placenta is doing most of the work, I would posit that the majority of damage would be done if the mother was drinking in the first trimester, it probably retards the development pretty intensely.

Speaking of being judged. I'm already beyond over people asking how I feel, me responding with good but pretty tired and been given the old "OH JUST YOU WAIT YOU THINK YOURE TIRED NOW". Yeah yeah, I know that I'm not allowed to comment on how I feel ever without getting how much worse it's going to be in return. But if you say you're great, you get told how miserable you're going to be.

Sharks Below
May 23, 2011

ty hc <3

54 40 or gently caress posted:

Ha, I wonder if any pregnant woman ever has gone full term with no judgement. No raised eyebrows, no concern-trolling but I doubt it. And yes, I bet even the suggestion of the research would receive enormous backlash, especially knowing how very profoundly difficult a child with FAS/FASD can be. I can usually tell by looking at a kid because unfortunately there is a disproportionately high amount of children where I live with it and the aggressive behaviour and cognitive delays can be pretty significant.
From some cursory looking most seem to be later term when the placenta is doing most of the work, I would posit that the majority of damage would be done if the mother was drinking in the first trimester, it probably retards the development pretty intensely.

Speaking of being judged. I'm already beyond over people asking how I feel, me responding with good but pretty tired and been given the old "OH JUST YOU WAIT YOU THINK YOURE TIRED NOW". Yeah yeah, I know that I'm not allowed to comment on how I feel ever without getting how much worse it's going to be in return. But if you say you're great, you get told how miserable you're going to be.

I am sure you're right about the trimester thing to an extent but man with the amount of women who dont know theyre pregnant til at least halfway through the first tri, wouldn't the incidence of FAS/FASD be ENORMOUSLY higher than it currently is?

Hahah holy poo poo there was a discussion a few pages back about the classic poo poo that people love to loving tell you about pregnancy/newborn stage comparisons wowee yes it is constant. I remember once saying to someone who had asked how I was doing, "oh constantly nauseated and tired beyond all measure" and she said "god, you poor thing. that first tri is a shocker!" or somesuch and I nearly cried with gratefulness :lol:

SquirrelFace
Dec 17, 2009
I was curious about this too after watching a show were the presenters had to eat like they lived in another time period for a week. There were some time periods where they drank almost exclusively alcohol, because the water was unsafe. That got me thinking, because everything I had been told about drinking during pregnancy had always been that if you drink a lot and often, the baby will 100% be born with FAS, but if that were the case, then all Elizabethan babies would be mentally handicapped and that obviously didn't happen.

After a little bit of Internet research, I came across some pretty interesting estimates. From what I found, alcoholic women who drank through out their pregnancy had about a 5% chance of having a child diagnosed with true FAS with the risk increasing when the woman engaged in binge drinking. It should be noted that that number did not take into account other milder forms of developmental and physical delays/ issues that can occur so if it seems really low, that's why. There is also thought to be a genetic component that makes some fetuses more susceptible to the effects of alcohol than others.

Obviously, that number is an estimate and hard to study because of the ethical issues already brought up, but it should at least reassure women (like myself) who may have had a few old fashion's the night before they found out they were pregnant, that they didn't do their baby any harm.

Since we don't really know how much is too much, most health organizations/doctors will say none is safe taking the better safe than sorry approach.

Personally, my grandmother was a terrible alcoholic who died from liver failure in her 40s. She drank heavily throughout all four of her pregnancies, but two of her children were born without any issues while the other two were later diagnosed as having FAS.

All that is to say, it's really a personal choice the level of risk you are willing to take on. Because of my family history, I haven't had a drink since I found out I was pregnant, but I have done other things you're not suppose to do (sushi and coffee!)

In my opinion it's about managing risks, not preventing all risk. I think we have a tendency as a society to tell women that the only acceptable level of risk is 0 when you're pregnant and that's just an unfair standard that we don't apply to anyone else. I get in a car everyday and that's a lot more likely to hurt the baby than sushi, but people will chide me for having a nice diner with a little raw fish once or twice in the past 8 months, but see no issue with me driving to work everyday.

TLDR: it's probably fine to have a few drinks while pregnant, but that's a risk you need to assess for yourself.

* also for those who crave beer like I do, but don't want to drink, the best NA beer I found is Kaliber. Made by Guinness and tastes almost like the real thing

Eponymous Bosch
Aug 11, 2010
The research is spotty, but there is a general thinking that alcohol is okay in moderation during pregnancy and it is very hard to determine the level that it is harmful. The easiest thing to say to patients is "never, not even one drop" and then go on to say a glass of wine here and there is fine winkwink. The US is very reactionary when it comes to pregnant women and the culture feels a pretty strong pull to police women's choices, so there is considerable controversy when it comes to alcohol and pregnancy. I did not drink during pregnancy, but some friend's had a glass of wine or beer later in pregnancy to help relax or celebrate. Now I get some odd looks/comments when I will publicly nurse while drinking a beer.

Oh my those newborn v. pregnant comparisons will never end. I also indulge in it, but more in the silent looking around the OB/Gyn waiting room going "I wish my pelvic floor was as nice as theirs!" This pregnancy poo poo will gently caress you up.

SquirrelFace
Dec 17, 2009
Seriously sick of hearing people tell me to get sleep now since I won't get any when the baby comes!

That would be great if I wasn't waking up 2-3 times a night to pee/ turn cause my hips hurt/ cry because my heartburn is so bad. AND then I still have to go to work in the morning...

Honestly, I'm starting think I'll get more sleep once she's born since I won't have anywhere to be at 730 and can nap whenever she is napping....pipe dream probably.

Dogfish
Nov 4, 2009
Alcohol and pregnancy is such a tricky topic because it's nearly impossible to get good data. Here is what we do know.

1. Alcohol is a powerful teratogen (causes birth defects, from the Greek meaning literally "monster-maker!") and it affects everyone differently because everyone metabolizes it at different rates. That's where "no safe amount" comes from: what might be totally harmless for Alex might give Taylor's baby FASD. There is no way to know what the threshold for a particular pregnant person is, short of giving them measured doses of alcohol in different pregnancies and seeing which of their kids are affected worse. We know that the teratogenicity is dose-dependent: more is worse. We just don't know at what point we start to see noticeable effects in a given pregnancy.

2. Alcohol use is really hard to study because people dramatically under-report their consumption because of the stigma associated with drinking while pregnant. That means that we probably have lots of people in the "no alcohol" group who are in fact drinking some alcohol, and we probably also have way more alcohol consumption than we know about in the "drinks alcohol" group. That makes it really difficult to isolate risk factors.

3. Alcohol use, because it's not a socially accepted behaviour in pregnancy, is usually comorbid with other factors that increase the risk of bad pregnancy outcomes, like smoking and poverty. That makes it really difficult to tease out which effects are a result of the alcohol, and which results are caused by other issues.

4. All the studies that have been done are based on reported consumption, which, as discussed in (2), isn't great data, but also means that we get better data from countries like France where alcohol consumption is less stigmatized. Of the large-scale studies that have been done, the best conclusion we've been able to reach is that a small amount of alcohol (1-3 drinks per week) is PROBABLY not associated with a significant statistical increase in FASD or other pregnancy complications, but a moderate or large amount probably is.

5. FASD is in some cases very difficult to diagnose, so it's possible that there are lots of babies who are affected and we just don't know it. Severe FASD is associated with a characteristic facial appearance as well as severe behavioural problems, but mild FASD can be really subtle and can present as ADHD, learning difficulties, or simply a "difficult" child. That makes it very hard to track.

So that's the bottom line in terms of risk: alcohol definitely has the potential to case harm, but we don't know how much alcohol it takes for an individual person. How an individual proceeds is going to depend on their own risk assessment from there.

There's another major issue when it comes to alcohol in pregnancy, and that's the idea that pregnant women should be constantly policed by their communities. That's a huge problem, and we all deal with it because our culture has a poisonous view of women. Nothing makes me want to swig publicly from a bottle of tequila more than hearing people's judgmental nonsense all the drat time. Pregnancy advice books are the worst; I had to read all the major ones so I could with good conscience make recommendations to my patients, and by the end of it, I was so sick of reading "Ask yourself: is every bite of food you take the best bite you could give your baby?" that I wanted to scream! And I wasn't even pregnant yet. My current diet consists primarily of Jello and my own tears, and that's awful enough without feeling guilty that I'm not giving my baby organic vitamins or whatever.

So, my conclusion is that we should all support the individual choices that pregnant people make and trust them to make compassionate and safe decisions for themselves and their families unless there's a compelling reason to do otherwise. In cases of obvious uncontrolled harm like alcoholism or other judgment-impairing illness, we should treat those pregnancies as high-risk and provide as much support as possible to the person affected.

ArmadilloConspiracy
Jan 15, 2010

54 40 or gently caress posted:

Ha, I wonder if any pregnant woman ever has gone full term with no judgement. No raised eyebrows, no concern-trolling but I doubt it. And yes, I bet even the suggestion of the research would receive enormous backlash, especially knowing how very profoundly difficult a child with FAS/FASD can be. I can usually tell by looking at a kid because unfortunately there is a disproportionately high amount of children where I live with it and the aggressive behaviour and cognitive delays can be pretty significant.
From some cursory looking most seem to be later term when the placenta is doing most of the work, I would posit that the majority of damage would be done if the mother was drinking in the first trimester, it probably retards the development pretty intensely.

Speaking of being judged. I'm already beyond over people asking how I feel, me responding with good but pretty tired and been given the old "OH JUST YOU WAIT YOU THINK YOURE TIRED NOW". Yeah yeah, I know that I'm not allowed to comment on how I feel ever without getting how much worse it's going to be in return. But if you say you're great, you get told how miserable you're going to be.

In my experience, most men gratefully shut up if you give them the joke responses "Ask me when it's [month you're due]" or "Being pregnant sucks and you should never do it."

Conversely, the majority of women I've encountered ABSOLUTELY MUST share their opinions, regardless of whether or not they've ever had children, how many times they have shared those opinions before, or how much of a murderous bitch face you're giving them.

I'm now 39 weeks and everyone wants to know if I am SO EXCITED. :suicide:

New Weave Wendy
Mar 11, 2007

SquirrelFace posted:

Seriously sick of hearing people tell me to get sleep now since I won't get any when the baby comes!

That would be great if I wasn't waking up 2-3 times a night to pee/ turn cause my hips hurt/ cry because my heartburn is so bad. AND then I still have to go to work in the morning...

Honestly, I'm starting think I'll get more sleep once she's born since I won't have anywhere to be at 730 and can nap whenever she is napping....pipe dream probably.

I'll reiterate that pregnancy insomnia sucks. I'll take newborn sleep over pregnancy sleep any day. Plus you have a cute baby to cuddle with the former.

54 40 or fuck
Jan 4, 2012

No Yanda's allowed
I learned a lot today! Thanks for sharing what you all know :)

SquirrelFace posted:

Seriously sick of hearing people tell me to get sleep now since I won't get any when the baby comes!

That would be great if I wasn't waking up 2-3 times a night to pee/ turn cause my hips hurt/ cry because my heartburn is so bad. AND then I still have to go to work in the morning...

Honestly, I'm starting think I'll get more sleep once she's born since I won't have anywhere to be at 730 and can nap whenever she is napping....pipe dream probably.
I feel you. Sometimes my eyes just pop open at 2 in the morning and I'm wide awake. My one headache was so bad that I took a gravol to get some sleep and I woke up the moment it wore off in the middle of the night.
Heartburn was pretty bad last night for me, I hope the old wives tale about baby will have lots of hair if you have lots of heartburn is true.

ArmadilloConspiracy
Jan 15, 2010
So if I'm coming up on my due date this Friday, it's normal to feel like my pelvis is trying to violently secede from itself, correct?

Edit: It's not "take as much tyelnol as possible" bad, but it's definitely "bitch and moan when I roll over in bed or get out of my chair" bad.

ArmadilloConspiracy fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Oct 11, 2016

Eponymous Bosch
Aug 11, 2010
Yes, your pelvis is trying to violently secede. The best thing, besides the obvious 'get the baby out,' that I found (I went to 41 wk 5 days, so I hear you!) is restorative yoga poses with an instructor who is good with prenatal issues. That and a good prenatal massage. Supposedly they might get things going, but they didn't work for me. At least I felt physically better for a bit.

Also, due dates gently caress with your head- schedule something else to do on that day. Don't be like me and 'plan to have a baby that day!' and end of bouncing on your birth ball while crying and eating a whole pineapple because nothing was happening.

Dogfish
Nov 4, 2009
One thing that can really help with late-pregnancy pelvic instability is paying close attention to your positioning. Your ligaments are especially loose this late in pregnancy, which means your pelvis has a ton of flexibility. That's great for getting a baby through there - not so good for things like "walking upright" and "not being in pain all the time." Anything that destabilizes your pelvis is going to make that worse by putting strain on the ligaments unevenly and tightening up the muscles in response. Don't cross your legs or ankles, and try to move your legs together when you're rolling over in bed or changing position. You basically want to keep each side of your pelvis even and level with the other. I assume you're sleeping with a pillow(s) between your knees but if you're not, start.

Also I think due dates are one of the cruellest things we do in obstetrics. We should really give pregnant people a "baby window" that ranges from 37 to 42 weeks because anything in there is normal.

ArmadilloConspiracy
Jan 15, 2010

Eponymous Bosch posted:

Yes, your pelvis is trying to violently secede. The best thing, besides the obvious 'get the baby out,' that I found (I went to 41 wk 5 days, so I hear you!) is restorative yoga poses with an instructor who is good with prenatal issues. That and a good prenatal massage. Supposedly they might get things going, but they didn't work for me. At least I felt physically better for a bit.

Also, due dates gently caress with your head- schedule something else to do on that day. Don't be like me and 'plan to have a baby that day!' and end of bouncing on your birth ball while crying and eating a whole pineapple because nothing was happening.

I mostly included the due date because it feels somehow more relevant than saying "39 weeks". In reality, my husband's family is always late for everything, so I just kind of figure that instead of the due date, the little guy is either going to pick the 22nd to mess with our Anniversary, or just decide to stick around until evicted.

Edit: Also yeah, the pillow started toward the end of my second trimester when my hips started to get angry about everything.

silvergoose
Mar 18, 2006

IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS




Dogfish posted:

One thing that can really help with late-pregnancy pelvic instability is paying close attention to your positioning. Your ligaments are especially loose this late in pregnancy, which means your pelvis has a ton of flexibility. That's great for getting a baby through there - not so good for things like "walking upright" and "not being in pain all the time." Anything that destabilizes your pelvis is going to make that worse by putting strain on the ligaments unevenly and tightening up the muscles in response. Don't cross your legs or ankles, and try to move your legs together when you're rolling over in bed or changing position. You basically want to keep each side of your pelvis even and level with the other. I assume you're sleeping with a pillow(s) between your knees but if you're not, start.

Also I think due dates are one of the cruellest things we do in obstetrics. We should really give pregnant people a "baby window" that ranges from 37 to 42 weeks because anything in there is normal.

It really really hosed with us, yeah. Due estimate, due window, "Hey your baby might come around this time".

Due date implies "if it's past this, something's wrong".

SquirrelFace
Dec 17, 2009

ArmadilloConspiracy posted:

So if I'm coming up on my due date this Friday, it's normal to feel like my pelvis is trying to violently secede from itself, correct?

Edit: It's not "take as much tyelnol as possible" bad, but it's definitely "bitch and moan when I roll over in bed or get out of my chair" bad.

I'm only 36 weeks and already have sharp hip and back pain when I roll over in bed or try to get up to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night. It also feels like my pubic bone is bruised and babies head is pressing into it every time I walk. Midwife said yesterday that it's all a normal part of things getting loosened up for labor. So enjoy!

I really hate the idea of this for another 4 weeks, but they are concerned I might be developing preeclampsia so I might only have a few more days of this :gonk:. My normally sub-average BP has shot up 20 points in the last 3 weeks and yesterday they found protein in my urine. I have to go back Thursday to see if my BP and protein levels are still rising.

Anyone have any experience with pre-e late in pregnancy? Everything I read says that for even mild cases they look to induce starting at 37 weeks.

I am simultaneously angry, scared and secretly a little relieved that it might soon be over. I know we'll both most likely be fine no matter what we have to do to get her out, but I really wanted a natural birth and am super terrified of an induction and the resulting interventions... I'm not so crazy that I'll risk the baby's or my health to have the birth I want, but I was looking forward to the birth and now I'm just dreading being poked and prodded and tied to a bed with monitors and needles and having hands and tools jammed into my lady bits for hours on end.

Sharks Below
May 23, 2011

ty hc <3
I hear you, I have those same fears. But from what I've been told, the induction itself doesn't have to significantly change the birth! Maybe your BP will be fine and protein less on Thurs. I'll be thinking of you!

54 40 or fuck
Jan 4, 2012

No Yanda's allowed
My midwife told me straight up what my "due date" is but also told me to be mindful and basically be prepared add or subtract 10 days to it.

ElScorcho
May 8, 2008

Horse.

SquirrelFace posted:

I'm only 36 weeks and already have sharp hip and back pain when I roll over in bed or try to get up to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night. It also feels like my pubic bone is bruised and babies head is pressing into it every time I walk. Midwife said yesterday that it's all a normal part of things getting loosened up for labor. So enjoy!

I really hate the idea of this for another 4 weeks, but they are concerned I might be developing preeclampsia so I might only have a few more days of this :gonk:. My normally sub-average BP has shot up 20 points in the last 3 weeks and yesterday they found protein in my urine. I have to go back Thursday to see if my BP and protein levels are still rising.

Anyone have any experience with pre-e late in pregnancy? Everything I read says that for even mild cases they look to induce starting at 37 weeks.

I am simultaneously angry, scared and secretly a little relieved that it might soon be over. I know we'll both most likely be fine no matter what we have to do to get her out, but I really wanted a natural birth and am super terrified of an induction and the resulting interventions... I'm not so crazy that I'll risk the baby's or my health to have the birth I want, but I was looking forward to the birth and now I'm just dreading being poked and prodded and tied to a bed with monitors and needles and having hands and tools jammed into my lady bits for hours on end.

That was me! High blood pressure for the last trimester, I was induced at 37wk 7d. Definitely not how I planned things but it was what was best for me and the baby. I didn't have to get magnesium but I would have ended up on it if I hadn't gotten an epidural, which I ended up getting to speed things along and keep my blood pressure from getting any higher. I started out with the cervical ripening agent and after three doses of that they started the pitocin. I had my water broken about ten hours later and after two hours of labor I got the epidural. Five hours after that I started pushing and an hour and a half after that Nathaniel was born. I still got to have the vaginal delivery I wanted even though almost nothing about the actual labor went as I imagined. Until the epidural I was able and allowed to walk around with my IVs and do everything as I would have if I had gone into labor myself. Even though my birthing experience really wasn't what I wanted it was all worth it to have this little guy at the end of it :3:
https://imgur.com/a/OyaUR

New Weave Wendy
Mar 11, 2007
I had to be induced with pitocin for my second, as my water broke but I didn't have any contractions start. I was nervous but it went extremely smoothly once they got the pitocin going. My daughter was born 3.5 hours after they started pitocin with no epidural or interventions needed. I didn't find the contractions to be any worse than the spontaneous ones I had with my first. I think the natural/unmedicated birth people tell a lot of induction horror stories but it can go really well too.

Edited to add that they took all our applicable birth preferences into account too. It ended up being a great labor and delivery!

New Weave Wendy fucked around with this message at 23:50 on Oct 11, 2016

Dogfish
Nov 4, 2009

SquirrelFace posted:

I'm only 36 weeks and already have sharp hip and back pain when I roll over in bed or try to get up to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night. It also feels like my pubic bone is bruised and babies head is pressing into it every time I walk. Midwife said yesterday that it's all a normal part of things getting loosened up for labor. So enjoy!

I really hate the idea of this for another 4 weeks, but they are concerned I might be developing preeclampsia so I might only have a few more days of this :gonk:. My normally sub-average BP has shot up 20 points in the last 3 weeks and yesterday they found protein in my urine. I have to go back Thursday to see if my BP and protein levels are still rising.

Anyone have any experience with pre-e late in pregnancy? Everything I read says that for even mild cases they look to induce starting at 37 weeks.

I am simultaneously angry, scared and secretly a little relieved that it might soon be over. I know we'll both most likely be fine no matter what we have to do to get her out, but I really wanted a natural birth and am super terrified of an induction and the resulting interventions... I'm not so crazy that I'll risk the baby's or my health to have the birth I want, but I was looking forward to the birth and now I'm just dreading being poked and prodded and tied to a bed with monitors and needles and having hands and tools jammed into my lady bits for hours on end.

You can definitely have a version of the birth you want if you have an induction. I have lots and lots of gals who need inductions for whatever reason and we still stick pretty close to the birth plan. If your blood pressure gets really high, you might need to make some changes for medical reasons (sometimes, for example, we recommend an epidural to bring down blood pressure, and for really bad pre-eclampsia we sometimes give a medication that means you can't walk around during labour) but the vast majority of the time you can get up and walk around, be in the tub or shower, do whatever. People will tell you horror stories about inductions but I can't even tell you how many inductions I've run with no epidural, no directed pushing, low light, lots of skin-to-skin, all the usual accoutrements of natural birth.

Remember, too, that your medical team is there to explain things, offer suggestions, and make recommendations. Nobody "lets" you do anything. You're in charge, unless one of them is willing to give birth to your baby for you. You can say no to hands and tools in any part of your body at any time, and your team should respect that. If it's an emergency and they absolutely need to do something for your or your baby's health, they'll tell you.

54 40 or fuck
Jan 4, 2012

No Yanda's allowed
Perineal massages. Are they helpful and how early?

54 40 or fuck fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Oct 11, 2016

SquirrelFace
Dec 17, 2009
Thanks for all the love and stories of inductions going well. I'm naturally a worrier so I always go straight to worse case scenario in my head. It really helps to hear that other people had inductions that didn't require all-out medicalized births.

sheri
Dec 30, 2002

54 40 or gently caress posted:

Perineal massages. Are they helpful and how early?

From what I remember, during pregnancy it doesn't make any difference, if you have a L&d nurse that knows what he or she is doing it can help while in labor

Dogfish
Nov 4, 2009

54 40 or gently caress posted:

Perineal massages. Are they helpful and how early?

There is no evidence that indicates that perineal massage during pregnancy makes any difference to the incidence of tears, so like all things to do with your vagina you may do it if you like at any time you like. There is one large-scale trial called the Hands Off Or Poised (HOOP) trial that examined whether care providers could make a difference to the incidence of tears by supporting/massaging/using warm compresses for the perineum in labour, and it concluded that it made no difference either way. Some people like warm compresses during the last bit of the pushing stage because they find it comfortable; I usually offer it but don't actively recommend it.

There is one small study that indicates that using a perineal trainer like the Epi-No MIGHT reduce the risk of tears but guess who sponsored that study!

54 40 or fuck
Jan 4, 2012

No Yanda's allowed
That's exactly what I was figuring. Similarly, I asked my mom, mother of three, if things like breathing classes actually help and she basically shrugged it off and said that in the moment you aren't exactly in a state of mind to go over things you learned in a class, so many things can happen etc. That said I'll have my midwife, mom and partner in the delivery room and hopefully the support from the three will help get me through. I actually dreamt about giving birth last night and it was weird.

Dogfish
Nov 4, 2009
You know what? I just did a quick literature search in case someone had done a study since I last checked, and they had! A RCT of about 500 women who've never had babies before was done in Québec and they found about a 9% absolute decrease in risk with perineal massage starting at 34 weeks. So if you want to start massaging at the end of pregnancy you may in fact reduce your chance of tearing by 10% or so.

Prenatal classes are mainly useful to give you a foundation of knowledge about the whole process so you have a structure already in place in your mind that helps you contextualize what's happening in labour as it happens. Like, for example, it's really helpful to know that the most intense part of labour (transition) is also the shortest part, because when you're in it someone can remind you, "Remember, this is really intense but it's the shortest part of labour before you can start to push your baby out." But direct labour support is definitely the most helpful thing.

Your midwife will also go over a lot of stuff with you. We talk about labour so much in the third trimester my clients get sick of it.

cailleask
May 6, 2007





I did a series of prenatal classes with my doula. I found them useful because we practiced the techniques in class with exactly the same people who were actually in the room when I was in labor. The continuity of care was nice! It gave me a lot of time to get to know her and for her to get to know me so that we could work out strategies together.

Rondette
Nov 4, 2009

Your friendly neighbourhood Postie.



Grimey Drawer
I've been lubing and massaging myself down there most nights before I go to bed for the last few weeks (on week 37 atm) with olive oil on the initial recommendation of a friend, and then my midwife ok'd it too.

I also started drinking cups of raspberry leaf tea which is 'supposed' to help shorten labor and strengthen the uterus wall. It's not recommended to start drinking it before week 34/35, start with one cup a day and build up. I'm making a jug with 3 bags each day and putting it in the fridge so I can keep track and have some whenever I feel like it. It's all a bit Woo but if it helps in any then I'm all for it.

devmd01
Mar 7, 2006

Elektronik
Supersonik
So apparently everything was raring to go on our try for a second kid (first one is two years old), and we just learned at the ultrasound that it's non-identical twins. :stare:

Someone please tell me that the first three months with twin infants are survivable, it was bad enough the first time around. I'm pretty sure my mother in law is going to come live with us for a while.

Alternatively tell me fun twin stories to get me more exited!

E-Money
Nov 12, 2005


Got Out.

devmd01 posted:

So apparently everything was raring to go on our try for a second kid (first one is two years old), and we just learned at the ultrasound that it's non-identical twins. :stare:

Someone please tell me that the first three months with twin infants are survivable, it was bad enough the first time around. I'm pretty sure my mother in law is going to come live with us for a while.

Alternatively tell me fun twin stories to get me more exited!

I'll let you know know in 2 months and 3 weeks!

Edit: my mother in law is also living with us (on our brooklyn one bedroom apartment.) it feels like three is the magic number with twins. Each baby is held and someone can get poo poo done.

Why do you think you have 'non-identical' (think you mean fraternal) twins? If it's boy and girl, absolutely. But if you have two of the same, then they actually can't tell you that.

They will be able to tell you if you have one or two placentas, and if you have one or two amniotic sacs. If you have just one of each, then they are identical. If you have two of each, they MAY be fraternal but it's not guaranteed. It's possible that your single fertilized egg split in two during the first three days (think that timing is right). The identical twins would then develop with their own placenta and amniotic sac.

Two placentas and two amniotic sacs is referred to as di/di twins. Something like 30-40% of di/di twins are identical.

Once they are born, you can get a DNA swab and send it in to a lab and they can give you a definitive answer. Google 'twin zygosity test.'

This is something that a huge number of people don't get, or understand, INCLUDING people in the medical profession!

That said, our boys look so different that we're certain they are fraternal.

Let me know if you have questions. My wife had a pretty great pregnancy, a pretty bad delivery, and an absolutely horrible recovery thus far so we've got lots of different experiences. That said, we should be discharged today (been here 6 days, 5 post delivery) so so might be a bit busy for a while.

E-Money fucked around with this message at 13:18 on Oct 12, 2016

ArmadilloConspiracy
Jan 15, 2010
:siren:Contractions!:siren:

Still not steady enough to merit a trip to the hospital (anywhere from 5-8 minutes apart, but mostly about 6 and a half minutes apart), but in case anyone was wondering back labor sucks and can go straight to hell.

Rondette
Nov 4, 2009

Your friendly neighbourhood Postie.



Grimey Drawer

ArmadilloConspiracy posted:

:siren:Contractions!:siren:

Still not steady enough to merit a trip to the hospital (anywhere from 5-8 minutes apart, but mostly about 6 and a half minutes apart), but in case anyone was wondering back labor sucks and can go straight to hell.

Good luck and Goon Speed!!

54 40 or fuck
Jan 4, 2012

No Yanda's allowed
my midwife told me I believe saline injections or sterile water injections help a ton for back labour so just a thought! But only back labour because otherwise the pain of the shots might be worse than the Labour.

Sharks Below
May 23, 2011

ty hc <3

ArmadilloConspiracy posted:

:siren:Contractions!:siren:

Still not steady enough to merit a trip to the hospital (anywhere from 5-8 minutes apart, but mostly about 6 and a half minutes apart), but in case anyone was wondering back labor sucks and can go straight to hell.

Eeeeee! Thinking of you! Good luck and goon speed!

Dogfish
Nov 4, 2009

ArmadilloConspiracy posted:

:siren:Contractions!:siren:

Still not steady enough to merit a trip to the hospital (anywhere from 5-8 minutes apart, but mostly about 6 and a half minutes apart), but in case anyone was wondering back labor sucks and can go straight to hell.

Good luck!!

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cailleask
May 6, 2007





IV fluids are the goddamn best thing ever when the constant horror of morning sickness gets to be too much. The vitamin bag is amazing.

Get the fluids. You will feel better.

Last time around I tried to tough it out and be like 'oh but other people have it worse'. No. It's enough that I feel like poo poo. I'm not making myself suffer needlessly this time around.

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