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Are you a This poll is closed. |
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| homeowner |
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39 | 22.41% |
| renter |
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69 | 39.66% |
| stupid peace of poo poo |
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66 | 37.93% |
| Total: | 174 votes | ||
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i wish the green party would stop breaking my heart like this
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Oct 16, 2016 04:49
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Somfin posted:On average an immigrant or refugee makes us far, far more money than it costs for us to bring them in NOW approaching that as "WE NEED TO CUT IMMIGRATION" instead of "we need to better regulate immigration (and employment law) so that people arriving in this country can't be ripped off by predatory employers because hey, the immigrants are victims there too" is a bit lovely, but it's a bloody hard thing to fit into a single soundbite. A lot of anti-immigration rhetoric is rooted in racism and fear of the other, but the neoliberal right have pulled off a quiet masterstroke in managing to frame all of it as racist. The John Keys of the world aren't letting people in because they're so tolerant and accepting: they're doing it because there's a steady flow of cheap employees who don't know the lay of the land, and are thus easier to rip off. I personally feel like it's more of an employment than an immigration issue; we need to be making sure that immigrants are being looked after - it'll improve the labour situation for everybody (except employers: death to capitalism, Tovarisch). That said, I see how people can look at the situation and think it's about immigration rather than the place of immigrants in the workforce. SurreptitiousMuffin fucked around with this message at 05:29 on Oct 16, 2016 |
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Oct 16, 2016 05:10
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Rapid population growth isn't without its issues, particularly if the country isn't prepared to meet the needs of new people. Doubly so if the growth is concentrated the way it is in NZ at the moment. In the absence of other measures to cater to the expected rate of growth (like a vision for regional development, stepped up infrastructure development, intensification of housing in urban centers, etc) then I kinda agree we need to cap immigration. AFAIK the Greens talk about those other issues too, so I don't see much wrong with this proposal tbh
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Oct 16, 2016 05:29
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Somfin posted:On average an immigrant or refugee makes us far, far more money than it costs for us to bring them in Because we have a massive deficit of infrastructure which is leading to worse standards of living for the majority of the existing population as well as those coming in. A pause or a slowdown would help alleviate this. Watch this get turned into dogwhistling despite the fact I'm only saying it's a contributing factor and along with all the other contributing factors until the situation improves.
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Oct 16, 2016 05:39
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I am happy to restrict immigration, because those people are sorted if they can afford to move countries. Except for refugees, I think we should take thousands of them.
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Oct 16, 2016 06:30
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klen dool posted:I am happy to restrict immigration, because those people are sorted if they can afford to move countries. Except for refugees, I think we should take thousands of them.
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Oct 16, 2016 06:50
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focal ischemia posted:i wish the green party would stop breaking my heart like this What did they do now?
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Oct 16, 2016 07:08
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Displeased Moo Cow posted:What did they do now? WE B Boo-ourgeois posted:http://www.newshub.co.nz/politics/greens-govt-immigration-curbs-not-enough-2016101512 i just want a nz political party that doubles down on proletarian internationalism, is that too much to ask? Kathleen fucked around with this message at 07:49 on Oct 16, 2016 |
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Oct 16, 2016 07:41
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:The speed of population increase in New Zealand is demonstrably the cause of some current pretty loving serious issues. There isn't enough accommodation, which is directly causing extreme child poverty AND loving the economy. suddenly immigration became a problem when it started being yellow people #yesracist
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Oct 16, 2016 07:50
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Nude Bog Lurker posted:suddenly immigration became a problem when it started being yellow people No it was a problem back in the 70s when it was brown people overstaying too... For real though the racism that drives so much of the anti immigration talk needs to be addressed openly by the Greens/Labour if it's going to be an election issue.
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Oct 16, 2016 08:42
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Nude Bog Lurker posted:suddenly immigration became a problem when it started being yellow people You are straight up retarded, have no understanding of your own countries history, and are the exact type of label fearing idiot that's causing children to sleep in cars
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Oct 16, 2016 09:14
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Like, do you think the first Chinese immigrants to NZ arrived in 1998?
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Oct 16, 2016 09:15
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focal ischemia posted:i just want a nz political party that doubles down on proletarian internationalism, is that too much to ask? Oh I thought there was new stuff
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Oct 16, 2016 09:16
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:You are straight up retarded, have no understanding of your own countries history, and are the exact type of label fearing idiot that's causing children to sleep in cars Left-wing racists are always the most repulsive, somehow. I think its the sanctimony and the pearl-clutching shock that anybody saw through the dogwhistle. The fact that you picked 1998 as your Chinese immigration cut-off (as opposed to, say 1987) says a lot more about you than I think you realise.
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Oct 16, 2016 09:54
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I was going to address wealth inequality but someone might call me the r word so I guess gently caress the poor boo hoo hoo
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Oct 16, 2016 10:04
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:I was going to address wealth inequality but someone might call me the r word so I guess gently caress the poor boo hoo hoo Go to bed, Chris Trotter.
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Oct 16, 2016 10:11
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:You are straight up retarded, have no understanding of your own countries history, and are the exact type of label fearing idiot that's causing children to sleep in cars Ooh, 'Label-fearing idiot,' nice work there. What you're actually trying to say is "I truly believe that the Chinese are to blame for New Zealand's overinflated and dangerous housing market but when I say that I get called a racist! That hurts my sensitive straight white cis male feelings!" We could put through a couple of reforms that would hurt oligarch property owners but would also reduce the housing market back to sensible levels before it collapses entirely. Or we could blame the Chinese and reduce our immigration allowance. One of those solutions is racist! Guess which one it is! whiter than a Wilco show posted:Because we have a massive deficit of infrastructure which is leading to worse standards of living for the majority of the existing population as well as those coming in. A pause or a slowdown would help alleviate this. Watch this get turned into dogwhistling despite the fact I'm only saying it's a contributing factor and along with all the other contributing factors until the situation improves. So what you're saying is we need a temporary solution rather than a permanent one? Great, that's an excellent way to run a loving nation! E: whiter than a Wilco show posted:I was going to address wealth inequality but someone might call me the r word so I guess gently caress the poor boo hoo hoo Except you are actually really scared of being called out for being a racist. E2: Which is what you loving are. E3: You scum.
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Oct 16, 2016 10:14
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"Oh heavens, if I don't present the correct and official opinion at all times regardless of actual reality and what words mean, I might lose some of my social standing. Sorry little Sione, you're going to have to live in a car if I want to make Jacinda fall in love with me" *galavants away from a whole bunch of suffering poor people, who are statistically unlikely to be European. "At least I'm not....racist" *masturbates while reading the daily blog.
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Oct 16, 2016 10:16
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Immigration reform is not race targeted you idiot. E: referring to somfin, who believes only Chinese people immigrate to New Zealand, despite not even being the most prominent group of immigrants.
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Oct 16, 2016 10:17
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"We should have less overall population increase until infrastructure catches up to a point where half of Auckland is not living in tent cities. This will be helped by less new residents. For the last 5 years the top two sources of new residents have been India and the UK" "You sir, are a racist, against the Chinese".
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Oct 16, 2016 10:25
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:"We should have less overall population increase until infrastructure catches up to a point where half of Auckland is not living in tent cities. This will be helped by less new residents. For the last 5 years the top two sources of new residents have been India and the UK" And your response to this charge appears to be incoherent spluttering about how you're just being realistic and you know history and it's everyone else who's really afraid of labels. E: "If you weren't so afraid of being labelled as racist you'd agree with me that it's never white people's fault if it could possibly be anyone else's fault!" Somfin fucked around with this message at 10:33 on Oct 16, 2016 |
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Oct 16, 2016 10:31
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Somfin posted:And your response to this charge appears to be incoherent spluttering about how you're just being realistic and you know history and it's everyone else who's really afraid of labels. Which is both accurate and more than what it deserves. E to reflect your e: you may not realise this, but people from the UK, who are the top country for new residents for two of the last five years, are often...white. whiter than a Wilco show fucked around with this message at 10:37 on Oct 16, 2016 |
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Oct 16, 2016 10:32
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:Which is both accurate and more than what it deserves. Yeah, you're just being realistic. Race realistic.
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Oct 16, 2016 10:36
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Somfin posted:Yeah, you're just being realistic. I don't know, one of us thinks that bringing down total numbers of new migrants will only effect people from China despite them not being the top source of migrants in 13 years.
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Oct 16, 2016 10:40
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bike tory posted:No it was a problem back in the 70s when it was brown people overstaying too... It was also a problem in the 50s when it was the Dutch.
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Oct 16, 2016 10:56
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:I don't know, one of us thinks that bringing down total numbers of new migrants will only effect people from China despite them not being the top source of migrants in 13 years. I'm picking on you for that specifically because you started this wee freakout when someone suggested that the recent yellow peril bullshit that has hit every loving political party in the last couple years was due to recent immigration trends, rather than something longer term. I'm sure you have a very good working knowledge of when different racial groups started migrating to New Zealand. I'm not going to question it or why you have such knowledge. Instead I'm going to explain why this hurts people, since you're arguing this in the abstract and I'm arguing it in the real. I've got a couple co-workers, currently here on temporary work visas, who are really worried by the news that the government is going to cut down on immigration. One of them has a house, a wife, and a child on the way, and if his visa is one of the 5,000 that is no longer going to be accepted he's going to lose the life he's built here over the last year and a half. Immigration is famously difficult to work with in New Zealand if you're not at a government job, so it is entirely possible that his visa might not be processed until the tighter restrictions come in. They are both stressed about this at work. They want to stay. They're not causing Auckland's housing market bubble. But their lives are being made perceptably worse by the simple risk that, despite everything they've done, they might not be allowed to live here anymore. If you seriously believe that we need a temporary reduction in immigration in order to allow infrastructure to catch up- you think it would be effective, efficient, moral, and ethical- I expect that you would support a much firmer reduction? How about 45,000? How about 90,000? Cut all immigration until Auckland improves? Send all foreigners currently on temporary visas home since they're obviously making the problem worse? And I think I was wrong to call you racist. You're just a xenophobe. Classic Somfin blunder! Somfin fucked around with this message at 11:09 on Oct 16, 2016 |
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Oct 16, 2016 11:06
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I'm trying to understand how cutting 5000 visas is going to make a difference to a housing shortage in a city of ~1.5 million and a country of 4.5 million. Even if you cut all 90,000 I don't see how it would make any difference whatsoever. Makes no sense.
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Oct 16, 2016 18:51
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Oct 16, 2016 22:19
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Slavvy posted:I'm trying to understand how cutting 5000 visas is going to make a difference to a housing shortage in a city of ~1.5 million and a country of 4.5 million. Even if you cut all 90,000 I don't see how it would make any difference whatsoever. Makes no sense. That's kinda the point, its a token gesture that they can point to as calls to cut immigration pick up steam into the election year
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Oct 16, 2016 23:43
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Nude Bog Lurker posted:Left-wing racists are always the most repulsive, somehow. I think its the sanctimony and the pearl-clutching shock that anybody saw through the dogwhistle. You should print this off to hand round to all the Maori and Pacifica families that have been stuffed into overcrowded garages to prop up John's GDP numbers.
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Oct 17, 2016 02:05
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I've changed my mind, I don't think there is a legitimate reason to restrict immigration, so let's open the borders. If immigration stops us taking refugees then we should restrict it but I can't see how it would. Immigration would have to be insanely high to make a significant difference (good or bad) in the economy surely. Like maybe immigration could keep the economy ticking along in lieu of births but it's not like nz is gonna become little China tomorrow. And even if it did, who cares? Chinese food is really good.
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Oct 17, 2016 02:54
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Xik posted:Adam John HOLLAND He DOES however have something to say about the drink driving limits: quote:Only a lightweight can't handle 400. I blew 1054 and felt fine - the crash wasn't even my fault and if I could relive the events, I'd have acted in exactly the same way http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11730507 He rammed a car that had two kids inside, and drove off. He sounds wonderful 
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Oct 17, 2016 03:07
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klen dool posted:And even if it did, who cares? Chinese food is really good. Maybe Mexican as well, a taco truck on every corner actually sounds kind of tempting.
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Oct 17, 2016 03:26
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Varkk posted:If we are basing it on food I vote for more North Africa and Middle Eastern immigrants. Excellent point. Besides we have plenty of Indian and Malaysian and Chinese already
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Oct 17, 2016 04:33
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I think it pays to remember that as with most Green policies, it's designed to work as a part of a much larger plan. Assuming a Green government, they are suggesting that immigration numbers is one of many dials they will be tweaking to get NZ back on track; I personally don't see how racial bias comes into it.
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Oct 17, 2016 04:43
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NZAmoeba posted:He DOES however have something to say about the drink driving limits:
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Oct 17, 2016 05:06
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Ratios and Tendency posted:You should print this off to hand round to all the Maori and Pacifica families that have been stuffed into overcrowded garages to prop up John's GDP numbers. Go round to some Pasifika families and tell them the problem is too many immigrants. Bring a brush and shovel for your teeth.
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Oct 17, 2016 05:58
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"If we pause residence applications for two years we could end the housing crisis immediately (90,0000 apps a year, shortfall for the next 20 years is 200,000 homes), and you can live in a house instead of a van" Yep, definitely gonna get punched. This is some fundamentalist Pavlovian poo poo with you two, who I'm willing to bet a thousand dollars, don't live in Auckland.
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Oct 17, 2016 06:11
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Ghostlight posted:You felt fine because you were drunk you loving idiot.
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Oct 17, 2016 06:16
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| # ? May 25, 2024 18:09 |
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whiter than a Wilco show posted:"If we pause residence applications for two years we could end the housing crisis immediately (90,0000 apps a year, shortfall for the next 20 years is 200,000 homes), and you can live in a house instead of a van" I'm pretty sure I can guess your ethnicity, somehow.
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Oct 17, 2016 06:17
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