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counterfeitsaint posted:I've been pretty happy lately, I might rewatch White Christmas to make sure my soul is appropriately bruised and battered for this next season. Looks like they're airing them all at once, on October 21st, yeah. Netflix outbid Channel 4 for the continuing rights.
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Oct 18, 2016 04:06
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Just started binging this and I can agree, White Bear is an absolutely intense episode and so far my favorite of the series.
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Oct 18, 2016 04:43
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What time does stuff usually go up on Netflix?
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Oct 18, 2016 05:55
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Vitamin P posted:It's always horrible. The stories are good and there are lovely moments in some episodes, but they all end either on a horrible twist or just the gut wrenchingly unpleasant logical conclusion of the narrative. They are absolutely morality plays though, there's almost always scope to reflect on what human behaviours are responsible for the tragedy. The android one with General Hux was the only episode I feel like didn't end on an absolutely crushing note.
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Oct 18, 2016 06:03
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Chairman Capone posted:The android one with General Hux was the only episode I feel like didn't end on an absolutely crushing note. I thought that was one pretty drat crushing. She can't bear the sight of this drat android anymore and has just about managed to get it out of her life when she makes the Twilight Zone mistake of trying to explain why it was so wrong in a way that just ensures she can't get rid of it anymore. And so this incomplete picture of her husband that she can barely stand to look at remains in the house for all time, stuffed in a corner in the attic like a bunch of old pictures.
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Oct 18, 2016 06:14
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Can't wait for another round of Facebook, But EvilTgent posted:What time does stuff usually go up on Netflix? 8am UK time.
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Oct 18, 2016 06:20
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thefncrow posted:I thought that was one pretty drat crushing. She can't bear the sight of this drat android anymore and has just about managed to get it out of her life when she makes the Twilight Zone mistake of trying to explain why it was so wrong in a way that just ensures she can't get rid of it anymore. And so this incomplete picture of her husband that she can barely stand to look at remains in the house for all time, stuffed in a corner in the attic like a bunch of old pictures. It's the perfect Twilight Zone for today, where the soul-sucking punch isn't the twist, it's the seemingly endless denouement for each story in which we have to [/i]live[/i] with the twist. That's what I love about it. It's not "What has technology wrought?" It's "How has loss, and our frustration with politics, and our need to connect, and our jealousy, and everything else human become intensified by the tools we've invented?"
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Oct 18, 2016 06:25
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White Bear is probably the goon favourite but the message fell flat for me. I would never go and spectate at a Justice Park myself but ultimately the main character very much deserves whatever harsh treatment they get. Fifteen Million Merits on the other hand, makes me want to cry each time I've watched it.
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Oct 18, 2016 10:28
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buckets of buckets posted:White Bear is probably the goon favourite but the message fell flat for me. I would never go and spectate at a Justice Park myself but ultimately the main character very much deserves whatever harsh treatment they get Jesus Christ.
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Oct 18, 2016 11:00
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buckets of buckets posted:White Bear is probably the goon favourite but the message fell flat for me. I would never go and spectate at a Justice Park myself but ultimately the main character very much deserves whatever harsh treatment they get. Fifteen Million Merits on the other hand, makes me want to cry each time I've watched it. It's not as much like you missed the point as actively saw it coming and ran away
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Oct 18, 2016 12:03
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Bicyclops posted:"Wow, look at that cool technology!" followed by "Oh no! Look what mankind has done with it!!" 
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Oct 18, 2016 14:14
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I'm pretty sure Fifteen Million Merits is the goon favourite. That's one incredible sixty minutes of fiction. My favourite part is the Scottish woman in the queue. "I can sin-guh! I'm a sin-gah!"
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Oct 18, 2016 14:15
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Mameluke posted:I'm pretty sure Fifteen Million Merits is the goon favourite. That's one incredible sixty minutes of fiction. My favourite part is the Scottish woman in the queue. If it's the blonde girl who gets shirty about never getting picked, she's from Liverpool, not Scotland. Does a very good job of caricaturing every fame-hungry egotist you see on those shows though for sure.
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Oct 18, 2016 14:26
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I'm in the White Bear has been the best so far camp. My rankings: 1. White Bear 2. Fifteen Million Merits 3. White Christmas 4. The National Anthem 5. The Entire History of You 6. Be Right Back 7. The Waldo Moment
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Oct 18, 2016 14:29
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yo other than maybe swapping merits and christmas that's my exact order, nice
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Oct 18, 2016 14:30
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I really don't like White Christmas. The twist with the child is kinda overwraught, as is the twist in the first act. I know the show is built around have nasty or depressing endings, but they a few of them felt really contrived here. Also the three separate acts are grafted together in ways that are obtrusive. The whole thing sort of just lurches from story to story in ways that don't quite work, but rather because authorial fiat requires information to come together in a certain way at a certain time. I guess I also fundamentally didn't believe in the way the blocking technology worked, or how it interacted with the plot.
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Oct 18, 2016 15:32
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Any ranking of the episodes is defensible as long as The Waldo Moment is last.
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Oct 18, 2016 15:44
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Rarity posted:It's not as much like you missed the point as actively saw it coming and ran away The point isn't that its a hypocritically cruel punishment? What is it then?
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Oct 18, 2016 15:55
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thefncrow posted:I thought that was one pretty drat crushing. She can't bear the sight of this drat android anymore and has just about managed to get it out of her life when she makes the Twilight Zone mistake of trying to explain why it was so wrong in a way that just ensures she can't get rid of it anymore. And so this incomplete picture of her husband that she can barely stand to look at remains in the house for all time, stuffed in a corner in the attic like a bunch of old pictures. That's a downright happy ending on this show. I feel like the most normal treatment for a Black Mirror character in that situation is disposal in some kind of terribly painful or dehumanizing ongoing manner, like if the robot was turned, still conscious, into a walking archive from the online logs some kind of child porn operation, or emulation of pet videos of someone's cat or something equally absurd yet terrible to actually experience.
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Oct 18, 2016 16:05
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Pablo Bluth posted:Any ranking of the episodes is defensible as long as The Waldo Moment is last. Truth.
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Oct 18, 2016 16:41
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buckets of buckets posted:White Bear is probably the goon favourite but the message fell flat for me. I would never go and spectate at a Justice Park myself but ultimately the main character very much deserves whatever harsh treatment they get. Out of curiosity are you from the UK? White Bear evokes a really specific hysterical public outrage over here, usually towards high profile criminals accused of harming children in some way. Particularly mid-way through New Labour the government was getting crazy authoritarian and the right-wing press were constantly stoking this almost animalistic rage in the public, it was all very sinister and White Bear always felt like a statement on that to me. People going to a Justice Park to help torture the hate figures feels completely believable to me. buckets of buckets posted:Fifteen Million Merits on the other hand, makes me want to cry each time I've watched it. Fifteen Million Merits is definitely the most pure sci-fi and the most emotive episode I think. It's also the most utterly hopeless feeling one for me at least.
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Oct 18, 2016 17:56
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Pablo Bluth posted:Any ranking of the episodes is defensible as long as The Waldo Moment is last. The Waldo Moment while definitely the weakest Black Mirror, does make much more sense viewed as an out of place Nathan Barley episode.
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Oct 18, 2016 18:03
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Waldo was the worst and I want to say Fifteen Million Merits was the best but I watched White Christmas on Christmas day and it bummed me out in the best way I loved it and it holds a special place for me. Good marketing. As though the US would ever release something on Christmas Day.
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Oct 18, 2016 18:22
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Vitamin P posted:Out of curiosity are you from the UK? White Bear evokes a really specific hysterical public outrage over here, usually towards high profile criminals accused of harming children in some way. Particularly mid-way through New Labour the government was getting crazy authoritarian and the right-wing press were constantly stoking this almost animalistic rage in the public, it was all very sinister and White Bear always felt like a statement on that to me. People going to a Justice Park to help torture the hate figures feels completely believable to me. I am from the UK yes, and I appreciate what Charlie was going for with the Sun reader paedo witchhunt aspect, but for the fact the main character was proven guilty. That's why it fell a bit flat for me, maybe I'm infected with a bit of that animalistic rage myself or something. If it had been vigilantes torturing someone suspected of such a crime, yeah, horrifying. But throughout the final act of the show it just felt like just desserts to me, as horribly tacky and indicting as it was of the spectators and people running the 'justice park' I think part of what I enjoy so much about 15 Million Merits is how similar it is to Brave New World, the last sane man on earth feeling, Bing's experience being quite similar to the Savage's imo
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Oct 18, 2016 18:54
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Congrats on owning that you're a terrible person, and not shying away from it I guess.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:28
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Anyway... I'm probably the only person that rates The Entire History of You so highly.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:32
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if you think lacking sympathy for a fictional child killer makes someone a terrible person you're probably incredibly naive
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Oct 18, 2016 19:34
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I would probably have a higher opinion of Fifteen Million Merits if it wasn't just a rehash of Network with some generic dystopia set decoration thrown in.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:38
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Dugong posted:Anyway...
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Oct 18, 2016 20:02
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buckets of buckets posted:I am from the UK yes, and I appreciate what Charlie was going for with the Sun reader paedo witchhunt aspect, but for the fact the main character was proven guilty. That's why it fell a bit flat for me, maybe I'm infected with a bit of that animalistic rage myself or something. If it had been vigilantes torturing someone suspected of such a crime, yeah, horrifying. But throughout the final act of the show it just felt like just desserts to me, as horribly tacky and indicting as it was of the spectators and people running the 'justice park' My problem with the episode wasn't so much that as it was the I just despaired too much, even for Black Mirror. Like listening to her scream horribly in pain makes me awful, what she did makes me feel awful, and the way people are enjoying her suffering makes me feel awful, and it just continues for so long after the twist. It makes its point well, but after the point has been made, it just keeps going. I don't think it's a bad episode, I just think it's too long. The Waldo episode feels a bit like a different show until the very end, which is just too heavy-handed. I love every other episode.
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Oct 18, 2016 20:11
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buckets of buckets posted:if you think lacking sympathy for a fictional child killer makes someone a terrible person you're probably incredibly naive Sorry about your stunted sense of morality I guess
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Oct 18, 2016 20:20
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buckets of buckets posted:if you think lacking sympathy for a fictional child killer makes someone a terrible person you're probably incredibly naive If you think endlessly torturing someone in the name of revenge is justifiable you're probably kind of a jerk.
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Oct 18, 2016 22:12
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Vengeance is awesome and good, and only good things result from it.
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Oct 18, 2016 22:14
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Murmur Twin posted:If you think endlessly torturing someone in the name of revenge is justifiable you're probably kind of a jerk. I know goons have trouble distinguishing tv/reality but this is ridiculous
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Oct 18, 2016 22:51
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buckets of buckets posted:I know goons have trouble distinguishing tv/reality but this is ridiculous Ouch, guys, he got us good with that one. Like, it stings even over here.
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Oct 18, 2016 22:57
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buckets of buckets posted:I know goons have trouble distinguishing tv/reality but this is ridiculous I just don't think there are too many people who feel that fictional criminals "deserve" torture, but would never, ever have such thoughts about real people.
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Oct 18, 2016 23:05
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buckets of buckets posted:I know goons have trouble distinguishing tv/reality but this is ridiculous  You complained about disliking an episode because you disagreed with its moral message, man, you can't fall back on "It's just a TV show!"
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Oct 18, 2016 23:25
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What I find to be interesting about White Bear (and to be honest all the episodes) is the ethical quotations it raises. For instance if an individual didn't know about/remember the crime at what point does the punishment stop and excessive torture begin? Obviously different people come to different conclusions evident by the current argument in this thread.
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Oct 19, 2016 00:47
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lifts cats over head posted:What I find to be interesting about White Bear (and to be honest all the episodes) is the ethical quotations it raises. For instance if an individual didn't know about/remember the crime at what point does the punishment stop and excessive torture begin? Obviously different people come to different conclusions evident by the current argument in this thread. I think it is quite clear that only had it been simply been spiteful torture for a while, but also it had perpetuated because it had become a money making operation. As for White Christmas, I kind many of its elements but it did feel disjointed if only because most of the episode was spent on two elaborate backstories. I thought the strongest part of Fifteen Million Credits was its world-building and the thought that went into creating that ultra-claustrophobic society.
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Oct 19, 2016 01:21
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Ardennes posted:I think it is quite clear that only had it been simply been spiteful torture for a while, but also it had perpetuated because it had become a money making operation. Yeah, the episode doesn't exactly shy away from condemning it as a ghoulish spectacle that allows people to get riled up for a controlled witch hunt.
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Oct 19, 2016 02:27
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