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 See you later, fuckers!! Took a paltry 39 hours to launch. Time to start over. 
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Oct 20, 2016 07:45
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James The 1st posted:I've finally gotten into oil for the first time and holy cow, I can feel my brain melting. Flamer fuel to start, then when you have  enough tank them up until you get Advanced Oil Processing. Then you crack them both into Petrol until you need solid fuel (then crack heavy->light->fuel)
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Oct 20, 2016 08:10
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I'm trying to do a no-solar run so I went for Light->Fuel rather early on, but I'm weird.
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Oct 20, 2016 12:58
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i twitch when i see people building on ore RSO 4 lyfe
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Oct 20, 2016 13:29
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GenericOverusedName posted:I'm trying to do a no-solar run so I went for Light->Fuel rather early on, but I'm weird. Same, but I'm using an ungodly amount of coal to power my factory instead, and have had complete blackouts when the mine runs out.
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Oct 20, 2016 14:20
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So I created a mod to implement the new research packs the devs showed off for 0.15. God drat the new blue science is going to be iron-hungry. It's pretty much devouring a saturated belt and still only outputting a beaker every two seconds or so. Haven't even got to the production or high-tech stages yet (I mostly put them in as requirements where there used to be alien packs).
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Oct 20, 2016 14:28
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Tenebrais posted:So I created a mod to implement the new research packs the devs showed off for 0.15. God drat the new blue science is going to be iron-hungry. It's pretty much devouring a saturated belt and still only outputting a beaker every two seconds or so. Haven't even got to the production or high-tech stages yet (I mostly put them in as requirements where there used to be alien packs). Could you post it?
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Oct 20, 2016 15:07
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LtSmash posted:Could you post it? Sure - go wild. I haven't tested a full game with it or anything so some of the tech requirements might be quite weird.
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Oct 20, 2016 16:03
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Running a full Angel's/Bob's loadout is horrifying. I know I need to make a new base to balance out everything so I can fully automate my Science pack 4 production, but that means scaling up the awful ratnest that is my oil/natural gas refining setup. Why did I do this to myself? 
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Oct 20, 2016 21:41
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Embracing the zen of building a sprawling series of factories instead of just one megafactory is the true challenge of factorio. Your first factory, no matter how well intentioned and fastidiously planned, will basically just produce the basic metals and components required to set up the next factory PROPERLY FOR REALS THIS TIME. Demolishing the old stuff is optional. (Alternatively leave room for twenty busses of stuff and space your assembler branches out by a few hundred tiles so you can eventually put in the expansions you'll need. Hope you got a desert tileset because even with drones it's a pain cutting through that many trees.) Fluids will gently caress your poo poo up because something somewhere is going to back up and halt all production at some point; solid fuel doesn't become necessary until the end of the tech tree (where you'll suddenly want heaps of it) so it'll usually be light/heavy that cause stoppages until you get advanced oil processing and can crack that stuff into useful petroleum. Plastic, sulphur, and (rarely) lubricant suddenly stopping is a giant pain and absolutely makes it worth bee-lining that nominal amount of blue science. With Angel's/Bob's this can happen with basic materials, well before you get anywhere near fluids or advanced circuitry... Angel's is especially painful to deal with because nobody needs that much loving stone in the early game before you can reprocess it into something useful.
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Oct 20, 2016 22:11
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i don't remember how to do alluminum and i can't find alumninium ore and im a failure of a factorio architect where the gently caress is aluminum ore?!? (bobs mods)
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Oct 20, 2016 22:45
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Baloogan posted:i don't remember how to do alluminum and i can't find alumninium ore and im a failure of a factorio architect It's called Bauxite.
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Oct 20, 2016 22:50
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i am seriously freaking out becuse i canot for the life of me find any of it anywhere and its driving me completely insane what COLOR on the minimap is it?
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Oct 20, 2016 22:55
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Nullkigan posted:Embracing the zen of building a sprawling series of factories instead of just one megafactory is the true challenge of factorio. Your first factory, no matter how well intentioned and fastidiously planned, will basically just produce the basic metals and components required to set up the next factory PROPERLY FOR REALS THIS TIME. As time goes on I've outsourced various parts of my factory to expansion factories and just removed that part from my main factories. First it was my green circuit outpost with 80 Assembler 3s and 364 electric furnaces (I have five of those now). Then it was a Steel Foundry with 640 electric furnaces (320 smelting iron feeding into 320 smelting steel). I have 3 of those now. I've also got a single copper plate foundry with 320 electric furnaces to feed my base alone. The only basic material I'm making at my main base now is taking iron ore and turning it into iron plate and gears. The only base materials used in rocket production that's made at my base is the plastics and red and blue circuits, and solid fuel, everything else is trained in basically. But fluid mechanics suck and it's really hard to scale fluid up, so I'm trying to scale out and build plastic outposts. Ideally I'd like to remove a majority of oil production away from my main factory because it's too squished, but I'm just not sure how to coordinate balancing turning light oil into solid fuel or gas depending on how much solid fuel I need if that production is split across multiple sites.
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Oct 20, 2016 22:59
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Keep 1 refinery as a jack of all trades for small variable requirements of lube, plastic, or flamer fuel, and then make satellite rocket factory refineries that are ratioed to make plastic and fuel in the ratios that rocket parts take it?
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Oct 20, 2016 23:09
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zedprime posted:satellite rocket factory I see what you did there.
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Oct 20, 2016 23:13
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When it comes to oil, it's worth remembering that petroleum is processed into plastic and sulphur, and light oil into solid fuel, all of which are solid items that can be shipped by train. The only thing that actually needs a pipeline from your refineries to your factory is lubricant. Which is a massive pain in the arse but once you've set up your preferred way of getting lubricant into your production centres the demands on it are so small that you're pretty much set forever unless you're planning to pave the world with blue belts or something. On a different note, my current playthrough (with the research mod) is my first time playing with the new flamethrower mechanics and holy poo poo it's amazing. Weapon of choice for clearing biter bases, easily. Tenebrais fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Oct 20, 2016 |
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Oct 20, 2016 23:47
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Tenebrais posted:When it comes to oil, it's worth remembering that petroleum is processed into plastic and sulphur, and light oil into solid fuel, all of which are solid items that can be shipped by train. The only thing that actually needs a pipeline from your refineries to your factory is lubricant. Which is a massive pain in the arse but once you've set up your preferred way of getting lubricant into your production centres the demands on it are so small that you're pretty much set forever unless you're planning to pave the world with blue belts or something. Tanker trains will be so nice for resolving this; throwing even a few dozen barrels' worth of lubricant would be enough to set up most purposes for an hour. One current solution would be to barrel some crude, train it over, then make lubricant on-site and convert the rest into solid fuel. Throw that on the train you get your oil from and deposit it wherever you make rocket fuel.
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Oct 20, 2016 23:59
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Baloogan posted:i am seriously freaking out becuse i canot for the life of me find any of it anywhere and its driving me completely insane  standing on some bauxite, next to some gold
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Oct 21, 2016 09:04
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Continued adventures with the new science: God drat, high-tech science packs. You need three processing unit assemblers to keep up with one science pack assembler. If you want to do the typical one-pack-per-second balance, that's forty-five processing unit assemblers, all fully supplied with green and red circuits, plus fifteen speed module assemblers, plus an additional 30 copper cables a second. It'd probably save a lot of space to use assember 3's for the extra speed - I think that'd only require 27 processing unit assemblers - but you still need to keep them well supplied. I wouldn't be surprised if the devs reduce the number of high-tech packs required for various technologies sharply. 200 high-tech science packs is much, much harder than 200 alien science packs. On the plus side, production packs are easier to make than you might at first think - electric engines require all the same resources as pumpjacks, plus lubricant, and take the same length of time to create, so you can produce both of those inputs together and it's easy to scale them. All those plus the electric furnaces are very steel-hungry though.
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Oct 21, 2016 13:07
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Tenebrais posted:Continued adventures with the new science: God drat, high-tech science packs. You need three processing unit assemblers to keep up with one science pack assembler. If you want to do the typical one-pack-per-second balance, that's forty-five processing unit assemblers, all fully supplied with green and red circuits, plus fifteen speed module assemblers, plus an additional 30 copper cables a second. That's your one huh? Research 15? I saw that this morning and thought "Why'd they bother, someone already did that two weeks ago". Did you not notice the other one? We've been running it on the MP server for a week. Anyhow, I think the devs are trying to slow things down with the higher requirements. People who insist on having a ton of labs and 1 pack per second on everything are going to need a vast amount of resources. My biggest concern is they've made the whole thing very iron heavy. Either they need to swap copper into some recipes or change the items to balance the basic cost more between the two. Kraven Moorhed posted:Running a full Angel's/Bob's loadout is horrifying. I know I need to make a new base to balance out everything so I can fully automate my Science pack 4 production, but that means scaling up the awful ratnest that is my oil/natural gas refining setup. I've taken a break from mine for two reasons. First I've spent nearly 3 days on it and still don't produce all the plates and I've barely touched the new petrochem. Second the dev is hinting on more major changes coming soon and I CBA trying to redo the factory again (he broke it from processing to smelting already). I have 9 rail heads feeding warehouses/tanks, factorissimos getting the ores out and 18 more warehouses taking the produce (belt sorters actually work now btw). Those feed yet more factorissimo blocks with the smelting stuff in them to produce plates. If your base is a mess, find a new spot and start fresh. Use the old one to make parts and cannibalise it rather than try to fix it.
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Oct 21, 2016 16:07
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Running my modded game and I have a couple questions. RSO made biters a non-issue; haven't been attacked in forever since they keep a huge distance from my base and outposts. I actually like having to build walls and defenses and artifact hunting isn't a problem with the reactors mod (and the flamethrower tank). Can I edit something to make them more aggressive? Re.: the reactors mod, I'm drowning in enriched fuel barrels and the starter uranium deposit still has tens of thousands of ore to mine. My base currently only needs three reactors, but so far nuclear power seems far too easy/good. Also, how much of a impact does keeping your pumps and reactors in different grids have? Which leads me to my last question: what's the go-to mod to terraform? I have landfill, but I'm looking for the opposite i.e. create water tiles.
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Oct 21, 2016 16:41
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Ratzap posted:That's your one huh? Research 15? I saw that this morning and thought "Why'd they bother, someone already did that two weeks ago". Did you not notice the other one? We've been running it on the MP server for a week. Yeah, I made it while I was on holiday without internet connection. I only put it up cause someone asked.
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Oct 21, 2016 16:51
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Nullkigan posted:Hope you got a desert tileset because even with drones it's a pain cutting through that many trees. 
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Oct 21, 2016 17:10
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Tenebrais posted:Yeah, I made it while I was on holiday without internet connection. I only put it up cause someone asked. Fair enough, so no functional difference. We'll just keep using the one we have then. Collateral Damage posted:That's what cluster grenades are for. Or if that's too much effort you can use Exploration Vehicles. The car gets an effect like the FARL and trees/rocks in front of it fall apart as it zooms through. Definitely on the cheaty end of the scale but it's very nice from the QoL view. seravid posted:Running my modded game and I have a couple questions. RSO made biters a non-issue; haven't been attacked in forever since they keep a huge distance from my base and outposts. I actually like having to build walls and defenses and artifact hunting isn't a problem with the reactors mod (and the flamethrower tank). Can I edit something to make them more aggressive? Did you generate your game with a very big start area? Did you edit the RSO config at all? You can change the RSO config and call a function to respawn biters. You could also add Rampant AI - we've got it on the MP server and while we haven't experimented much yet, it is a lot more aggressive. If you move around to uncover fogged areas and there are biters in the bit you uncover, they 'smell' you and come at you. If you shoot one, the rest run away to fetch more and they avoid places where many have died.
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Oct 21, 2016 17:18
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Ratzap posted:If your base is a mess, find a new spot and start fresh. Use the old one to make parts and cannibalise it rather than try to fix it. This is essentially what brought me to my conclusion of a fully-researched game. The initial base was there for the basic factory parts and the balanced science production. Once I had enough rails I found a nice empty space to unpack into a central depot that first serviced merely coal and plates because that was nearby. Once those basic resources were trained in, I looked to exploit a big oil patch and had it as a separate factory, bringing in coal and iron plates and returning with sulfur, plastic and flamer fuel. Once that was connected, it was relatively simple to lay down another factory somewhere along the rail lines to build all three types of circuits because I could rely on the basic resources coming in with sufficient quantities. Once there I could start building electrical engines and up that product line, as well as inserters so those sections from the beginning could be shut down entirely. Lubricant was the last tricky bit and once I laid out the factory to handle blue conveyances, all but the science production was cut from the beginning factory. Eventually even the science was handled by a better scaling factory elsewhere, but I kept the initial one going because I already set up a station to drop off the requisite materials and finishing research was my focus. At this point it remains built as a sort of historical indicator of where I started from.
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Oct 21, 2016 17:22
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seravid posted:Re.: the reactors mod, I'm drowning in enriched fuel barrels and the starter uranium deposit still has tens of thousands of ore to mine. My base currently only needs three reactors, but so far nuclear power seems far too easy/good. Also, how much of a impact does keeping your pumps and reactors in different grids have? Which leads me to my last question: what's the go-to mod to terraform? I have landfill, but I'm looking for the opposite i.e. create water tiles. Well, if you've got enough fuel you could... stop processing? It's not meant to just be green-tinted coal that you have to mine constantly in huge quantities. As far as amounts in deposits goes, I gave up using a custom ore for Crafted Artifacts mostly because I couldn't figure out a way to make RSO not generate absurdly rich and large deposits. If your pumps and reactors are only powered by the turbines, then a brownout will result in a drop in output (slower pumps mean less hot water getting to the turbines), leading to an extremely rapid total loss of all power. If you want to poke the odd hole in the landscape for, say, water pumps, then I've got a mod for you: https://mods.factorio.com/mods/GotLag/Explosive%20Excavation Note that the damage radius is enough to hurt an unarmoured player when placing by hand.
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Oct 21, 2016 17:31
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Ratzap posted:Did you generate your game with a very big start area? Did you edit the RSO config at all? You can change the RSO config and call a function to respawn biters. You could also add Rampant AI - we've got it on the MP server and while we haven't experimented much yet, it is a lot more aggressive. If you move around to uncover fogged areas and there are biters in the bit you uncover, they 'smell' you and come at you. If you shoot one, the rest run away to fetch more and they avoid places where many have died. No, I figured I'd go with everything on default settings for now. I'll look into the config and the mod, thanks. GotLag posted:Well, if you've got enough fuel you could... stop processing? It's not meant to just be green-tinted coal that you have to mine constantly in huge quantities. Ah, yeah, I was using the coal mindset. Stopping should work, but that's hardly in keeping with the Factorio spirit... Guess I'll just have to make the demand meet the supply  I meant grid as in the map tiles in the debug menu. You wrote in the mod's thread that pumps should ideally stay in the same tile as the reactor and was wondering how much of a difference it actually makes. With the TNT terraforming this won't be an issue anymore, though.
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Oct 21, 2016 17:39
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I have a quite successful demo setup that only separates uranium slurry when a buffer chest falls below a certain amount of depleted uranium: The red wire connects the DU buffer chest to the belt sensor. If the chest drops below the trigger value, the belt allows movement, which in turn lets the separation of uranium slurry run another few batches. As this is only feeding a breeder reactor it runs a steady plutonium surplus (if this were a working factory and not a demo setup I'd be using the Pu for other stuff, like making artifacts). In regards to pumps and grids, it's to do with the order in which entities in the pipe network get updated. Within a chunk the order is dependent on build order, but when it overlaps a chunk boundary, everything in one chunk will be evaluated before the other, regardless of when each entity is built. The effect on reactors is to determine if your output pipes/pumps get water at 100 degrees, or at 97-99 (depending on power draw). GotLag fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Oct 21, 2016 |
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Oct 21, 2016 18:11
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Your "green-tinted coal" caught me off guard - I laughed so hard my cat looked at me funny. The setup I have going uses a separate electric network to contain the reactors and pumps with a dedicated 6MW of power which I should make solar + accumulators at some point for full redundancy. But it means I can overload the main network as much as I like and it won't affect the reactor output.
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Oct 21, 2016 22:58
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Ratzap posted:Look in the saves folder and see how big the zip file is. Or if you think it's your logistics area you can try the debug/diagnostics - F5. Your screen will show a whole load of numbers which include timings for a lot of the internal workings. If there's something wrong, it will be in there somewhere. Good luck. My save game (without replay) is about 79mb. None of these numbers seem all too bad or am I missing something? 
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Oct 22, 2016 13:09
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Remember all the little detail sprites on the ground that are only there for visual detail and don't block building placement? They also disappear visually when you concrete over them? The game still tracks every single one of them regardless of their state, which makes saved games balloon once you've explored a larger portion of the map. They posted about this in an FF a couple weeks ago and I'm fairly certain they haven't pushed out a patch to remedy this yet.
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Oct 22, 2016 14:42
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I ran that uncluttermod bud it didn't help much. Now I've just disabled autosaving and go take a break if I need to save/load, it takes close to 6 minutes now.
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Oct 22, 2016 15:51
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Sage Grimm posted:Remember all the little detail sprites on the ground that are only there for visual detail and don't block building placement? They also disappear visually when you concrete over them? The game still tracks every single one of them regardless of their state, which makes saved games balloon once you've explored a larger portion of the map. They posted about this in an FF a couple weeks ago and I'm fairly certain they haven't pushed out a patch to remedy this yet. They did actually in 0.14.10 "Temporary decrease of decorative entities counts." but if the undecorator isn't helping then it's not that. 6 minutes to save 79MB is pretty piss poor (220KB per second). Is your disk full or damaged maybe? Are you saving to a network device? Klonan posted a new mod - Flammable Oils: Pipes and storage tanks and stuff will catch fire and explode The mod portal entry only this as the information text: "I don't know why you want to install it."
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Oct 22, 2016 17:58
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Is there any documentation on advanced train management? "Full load or wait X seconds / empty or wait X seconds" works fine for now, but it will soon become inadequate as the train network expands; I can't have a bunch of trains sit forever at the depot unable to empty their cargo or at a nearly depleted outpost waiting to load, but I can't have them going back and forth for no reason either.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:31
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If your trains start going back and forth for no reason based on 'unloaded or X seconds' settings, the simplest solution seems like you should probably expand your factory so more resources are used. For low volume stuff, someone up thread had a really good recommendation that you set the logistics net condition at the unload station to "good of interest < threshold" and the train leaves to fetch more when the station is running low.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:41
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The factory is ever-expanding, but at the moment I do have more resources coming in than necessary. Seems preferable to the alternative since I don't know how to maintain an equilibrium between supply and demand (hence my question!). In any case, I'm looking for the most efficient solution, not the simplest, and you can't get more efficient than having trains sent only when needed. I'm not currently transporting low volume items, though, just basic resources that are consumed very fast. I'll give it a try and see how it goes. Thanks.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:07
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I think the most popular final level rail unloading handling is the logistics sorter. You have one or two rail stations where everything comes in, and its on its own separate logistics net. Cargo unloads into an active provider chest, robots take it to requester or storage chest. You can float immense inventories in times of overproduction by simply adding extra storage chests. Requester chests stick inventory on belts to go where it needs to go. An ounce of prevention goes a long way and you can just do some manual ratio calcs though. The order of magnitude calc is 1.09 miners per steel/electric furnace plus one, with modules obviously modifying that. Trains don't change that fact unless you are dealing with some huge distances. There's ways to get rate of change from circuit networked inventory or loginets, which might be a clever logic condition for a train station but I think that's relatively untreaded ground with the simplicity of the above tricks to either soak massive overproduction or align miners to furnaces.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:34
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seravid posted:Is there any documentation on advanced train management? "Full load or wait X seconds / empty or wait X seconds" works fine for now, but it will soon become inadequate as the train network expands; I can't have a bunch of trains sit forever at the depot unable to empty their cargo or at a nearly depleted outpost waiting to load, but I can't have them going back and forth for no reason either. My advanced train management: (Might be able to update this with pictures later today?) For this I use FLAN and Warehousing mods, but you can do it in vanilla by running wires the whole way, have fun doing that without FARL though. Somewhere in the great outdoors lies a rich iron deposit, one of many you've uncovered. You set up the mining drills and route all the ore to the station, where its loaded into warehouses. Balanced warehouse loading can be done with a fairly simple wire setup. All the warehouses (or chests) are wired together to the input of an arithmetic combinator. The combinator is set to to divide EACH by the negative total of the number of containers, and output EACH. Since I use six car trains loaded by six warehouses the value for me is -6. This means the combinator outputs the negative average of the contents. The output of the combinator is wired in a chain to every inserter on red wire. The Red wire linking the warehouses and the Red wire linking the inserters is a separate network with the combinator in between them. Each inserter is wired to its warehouse with a green wire. What this does is each inserter is adding its Green ore signal with the negative average that is coming over red, so you set it to enable if less than 0 (Meaning that warehouse is below the average, so its positive value is smaller than the averages negative value). I also set one inserter to operate if equal to 0 to break the occasional stalemate. The other use for the arithmetic combinator is to control access to the station. I build robot omni-depots so I don't care what train is carrying what ore. You can use whatever you want, but I name every ore station "Ore". Wire your arithmetic combinator output to a decider combinator near the signal at the entrance to the station. Set it to out 1 signal A if Iron Ore < -4k. Now wire its output to the station entrance signal and set it to block if A < 1. Now when the station is ready to load a train it unblocks the signal allowing that station. Configure the signal to output signal B when green. Wire this over the separate wire network to the FLAN tower, which at your depot have trains waiting for signal condition B. To prevent multiple trains from being dispatched you build a simple latch, which once B is sent reblocks the station input signal and removes B from FLAN and only clears when the signal directly before the blocked signal reads yellow, meaning the train is arriving. I also incorporate a timed latch into this to prevent another dispatch signal from being sent while the blocking signal switches from forced red to yellow because it might go green for one or two ticks. Other things I've added are latches that reset on pulses from the belts coming to the station, functionally a watchdog timer. If there hasn't been enough pulses to reset the timer then the latches flip as if the depot is full and I also send a signal to indicators at my main base that the field is running dry (Which is redundant since I use YARM too, but circuits!) Also combine with a circuit condition at your unloading depots to prevent dispatch if you have too much ore waiting to be smelted.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:53
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| # ? May 11, 2024 07:27 |
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For someone who hasn't used combinators yet and who didn't even think to condition stations to let trains go only when 'item < threshold', this is pretty hardcore. I think I'm gonna need those pictures Multi-use, single-track, robot-managed stations sound awesome, but that would mean giving up on my beloved maze of belts. Aren't robots noticeably inferior at moving large quantities of stuff, anyway? Or do you brute-force the problem with thousands of them?
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Oct 22, 2016 20:09
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