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I'll admit it, I expected things to be better because I'm an idealistic idiot who was way too hung up on Harper's bigoted petrostate to remind myself what libs are gonna do.
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Oct 27, 2016 18:41
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AlouetteNR posted:I voted for Andrew Cash, and am still kinda bummed he lost. That said, Trudeau won on a platform of 'Not Harper', and true to his promise, he isn't Harper, just impossibly close to him in terms of policy. At least we got the long form census back. I voted for Peggy Nash, because she was a good MP who did a lot of good work for Parkdale, I'm kinda bummed she lost because Arif Virani doesn't give a gently caress about the neighbourhood and seems to think his responsibility is to the yuppie home owners and Metcap. Remember how salty certain folks got here when it was suggested that the Libs were pretty much guaranteed to start Libbing the moment they got back into power, and lo, so they are.
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Oct 27, 2016 18:49
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EvilJoven posted:In Winnipeg our mayor took the proper stance for once and said he wanted to implement development fees for any further subdivisions to curb the impact urban sprawl is having on city budgets but our premier is taking the side of the developers who are currently screaming, crying and throwing their toys out of their crib. Huh. I thought Nanaimo was really late to the table instituting development fees. Meet Frank Ney (a.k.a. Black Frank), mayor and MLA for Nanaimo at various times between 1968 and 1990. Also the owner of Nanaimo Realty. See where this is going? The taxpayers paid for everything. I wouldn't be surprised to find out the city paid for BJs and coffee for the carpenters. I suspect Terry Pratchett used Frank Ney as the model for one of the characters in either Going Postal or Making Money - the pirate-costume-wearing corporate raider. After Ney and crew got the annual bathtub race between Nanaimo and Vancouver going he started wearing a pirate costume as part of the promotion (year round, not just during the race). Seriously, Nanaimo - the guy walked around town in a pirate costume. 
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Oct 27, 2016 18:52
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Jordan7hm posted:That's obviously possible, and maybe even likely, but I'm willing to wait more than a year to find out if these particular promises are broken (also it's not like I have a choice but to wait). Weed can be done later, but the election stuff really needs to be underway by now if 2015 was really going to be the last FPTP election. Elections Canada is going to need a lot of time to get everything sorted out. Right now all signs point to doing nothing, maybe calling a referendum where the options will be debated ad infinitum, and then they'll kick the can down the road to 2019-2020. And if they win that one, probably continue to do nothing.
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Oct 27, 2016 18:52
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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infernal machines posted:I voted for Peggy Nash, because she was a good MP who did a lot of good work for Parkdale, I'm kinda bummed she lost because Arif Virani doesn't give a gently caress about the neighbourhood and seems to think his responsibility is to the yuppie home owners and Metcap. I'm curious if you have more info about Nash vs Virani, even just where I could read more about it. I have family that live in the neighbourhood and I hang out there often so its always fun to talk about local politicians.
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Oct 27, 2016 18:55
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Hey, we got some new senators http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/politics/trudeau-new-senators-1.3823650 quote:Thursday's appointees are: Good Atlantic Canada picks, imo
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Oct 27, 2016 18:57
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The fact that weed legalization is even being talked about makes me furious because a billion single issue idiots voted red because of it.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:01
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Weed is dumb imo
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Oct 27, 2016 19:03
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Weed prohibition is very bad even if I don't smoke weed anymore. Also those Senate picks look pretty solid.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:09
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get  out of the court system everydayyyy. Waste of time/resources
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Oct 27, 2016 19:14
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legalize every drug except weed, death penalty for weed
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Oct 27, 2016 19:17
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Three Hole Punk posted:The fact that weed legalization is even being talked about makes me furious because a billion single issue idiots voted red because of it. I look forward to the NDP running on a platform of weed inequality in the next election.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:22
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Legalize weed. Death penalty for "weed culture"
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Oct 27, 2016 19:24
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Nocturtle posted:A few thoughts on the mincome discussion: The point isn't that it won't achieve redistribution -- that goes without saying -- the point is that any plausible scenario where it gets implemented is going to be premised on scaling back other forms of government aid. Finland has a new conservative leaning government and they are implementing a basic income as a way to phase out more generous welfare state provisions. It's actually an overall cut in spending designed to shrink the government. This, by the way, is the same reason Milton Friedman and various other economic conservatives have spoken favorably of a basic income. It's going to be a massively expensive program that will allow the government to reduce other forms of aid while also likely putting inflationary pressure on other parts of the economy. And it's likely to be set at a low enough level that there's a good chance it'll end up just channeling huge numbers of NEETs into dead end suburbs where they'll eke out just enough money to subsist on mountain dew, cheetos and their Steam library. Honestly, it just sounds loving dystopian to me. The proper way to implement it would be to have actual organized pressure. Good policies don't just fall out of the sky. There has to be somebody with real political power pressing for a policy. If you spend all your time and energy just talking up how great the policy is then all you're going to do is have some Liberal government come along and co-opt your idea without ever implementing it properly. That's exactly what happened to the progressive checklist of stuff that Trudeau promised and it'll keep happening as long as progressive ideas are unmoored from any kind of institutional backing. quote:-modern capitalism destroyed organized labour, I think it's more likely than not it can handle the Trumpists and disorganized poor. I realize this is a very 1930s Weimaresque point, but modern western societies have gotten very good at papering over their flaws (look how the Eurozone continues to limp along, or Bank of America somehow still solvent post-2008). Modern capitalism is such a vague term. If you just mean "a world dominated by contractual relationships and commodity production" then yeah, capitalism is likely to stick around. If you mean the particular form of liberal capitalism that the US has been advocating since the Cold War then I'm not so sure. There's still an underlying physical reality that cannot be ignored indefinitely. The Soviet Union was really great at papering over its internal conflicts up until the moment it wasn't. The Iraq War was going really well for the Bush administration up until the moment that it wasn't. The pre-2007 American economy was widely celebrated by the Davos jet-set right up until it crashed. The world economy looks extremely precarious, the environment is looking worse and worse, and our political class doesn't show much interest or ability to change course. I think there's a lot of room for things to get dramatically worse. And if other tensions flare up then I wouldn't expect the current sunny-ways to last. People will seek out an Other and even formerly progressive politicians will abandon a lot of their progressive and liberal rhetoric if they sense that the only way to stay in power is to start channeling ugly nativist sentiments. The political system is far more fragile than most people anticipate. I mean really, this ultiamtely is one of the silliest arguments I see and its really widespread. There's this assumption -- which can be either pessimistic, or optimistic, depending on who articulates it -- that the world, and Canada, will basically remain the same, that the future will continue to closely reassemble the recent past, with only minor and incrementalist changes. I would be careful to assume that reflexively, though. quote:-Canada's old age security is basically mincome for the elderly, and it's plausible that it has contributed to the significant reduction in elderly poverty since the late 70s (note ~5% elderly poverty rate in Canada vs ~20% in the US). It's fine to point out that OAS isn't enough and isn't challenging the existing social order, but it measurably reduced suffering and should be supported. A basic mincome (even an inadequate one) sets the stage for future discussions on why it can't be significantly increased, although that's speculation. Elderly people vote and are well represented by various political institutions. Unemployed people, precarious workers, the mentally ill and the truly poor are not. Further, elderly people are basically superfluous to the economy and there's no incentive to maintain their dependence on private employers. quote:Society pays for the unemployed one way or another. Providing explicit support likely reduces the overall cost. So what? We have the physical resources and skills to feed every homeless person caviar three times a day on golden plates without actually diminishing the living standards of the average Canadian, but we never will. Poverty fighting programs have almost nothing to do with the cost to society one way or the other. Slipping into this trap of trying to prove that poverty fighting is cost effective is just misunderstanding why we continue to have poverty in the 21st century. The real obstacles have nothing to do with resource constraints or costs. Risky Bisquick posted:get Legalizing weed isn't guaranteed to end weed related court cases. It's still going to be heavily regulated.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:27
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I rejected my ballot because I live in Kellie Leitch's riding and she will probably be our next Prime Minister 
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Oct 27, 2016 19:29
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Lumius posted:I'm curious if you have more info about Nash vs Virani, even just where I could read more about it. I have family that live in the neighbourhood and I hang out there often so its always fun to talk about local politicians. Mostly just in person conversations with the candidates when they were campaigning, Nash doesn't have her MP site online any more, but Wikipedia has a pretty good summary of her accomplishments and the causes she backed while in office. There's not much to go on for Virani, mostly because he's brand new and isn't making any headlines in parliament, this might give you some idea of the kind of guy he is though. I moved out of the neighbourhood in the spring, so I'm less connected to it now.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:30
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i voted green because the "ugh fine whatever" factor was most tolerable compared to the other three. aint voting lib and i wasnt gonna reward the ndp for their loving atrocious campaign
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Oct 27, 2016 19:40
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Ambrose Burnside posted:i voted green because the "ugh fine whatever" factor was most tolerable compared to the other three. aint voting lib and i wasnt gonna reward the ndp for their loving atrocious campaign I agree, vaccines are dumb and pointless and wifi is murdering us all slowly and painfully.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:41
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Powershift posted:Legalize weed. Death penalty for "
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Oct 27, 2016 19:44
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Under an NDP government, weed would have been decriminalised by now 
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Oct 27, 2016 19:45
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Pinterest Mom posted:Under an NDP government, weed would have been decriminalised by
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Oct 27, 2016 19:47
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CLAM DOWN posted:I agree, vaccines are dumb and pointless and wifi is murdering us all slowly and painfully.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:48
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Powershift posted:Legalize weed. Death penalty for "weed culture" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0WjnA5JKFY CustomGrow420
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Oct 27, 2016 19:56
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CLAM DOWN posted:I agree, vaccines are dumb and pointless and wifi is murdering us all slowly and painfully. I would rather have a government running on the Green's platform, along with the naturalist homeopathic fringe, than a government running on the Liberal platform, along with the disguised conservative lying sack of poo poo fringe.
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Oct 27, 2016 19:58
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Legalize weed 364 days a year but not on April 20th. On April 20th, death penalty for weed. Also February 29th, smartass.
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Oct 27, 2016 20:00
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Pinterest Mom posted:Under an NDP government, weed would have been decriminalised by now There are so many things that we would be better for even under a useless beard like Mulcair.  How the fhell did the narrative that the Liberals were running to the left of the NDP even start? Their entire platform was nothing but vague promises to consider looking into changing things. Maybe. With no timelines.
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Oct 27, 2016 20:12
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Furnaceface posted:There are so many things that we would be better for even under a useless beard like Mulcair. "How can NDP possibly deliver progressive things when they also promised to balance the budget it's simply not mathematically possible now vote for us you retards who don't understand tax brackets."
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Oct 27, 2016 20:23
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Furnaceface posted:There are so many things that we would be better for even under a useless beard like Mulcair. liberals had a way slicker platform and trudeau is better at media?
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Oct 27, 2016 20:23
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Furnaceface posted:There are so many things that we would be better for even under a useless beard like Mulcair. The NDP wanted affordable childcare for everyone, the Liberals wanted it to be means tested.
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Oct 27, 2016 20:24
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Because the NDP stupidly played into that narrative. They thought they could quietly keep their left-leaning base quiet by having all these good things in the platform that they barely talked about while aggressively signalling to the media that they'd be extremely moderate and middle-of-the-road. In the end they came off as disingenuous to everyone. Then on top of that Mulcair came off as arrogant and high-handed by backing out of debates and attacking Trudeau for being young and inexperienced rather than substantively talking about policy. The NDP used to be viewed as having a lot of integrity, even by many people who rarely voted NDP. Under Jack Layton they started to talk more like a typical political party but there was still a big reserve of good will. After Mulcair took over I think a lot of people were shocked by just how cynical the NDP was behaving. In my opinion it inflicted lasting damage to the party -- far more so than the NDP brain trust at the time appreciated -- and helps explain why the NDP's numbers are so low. They didn't just throw the election, they did lasting damage to the perception that the NDP, while a bit screwy, is more upright and ethical than the Liberals or Conservatives. I think the idea that the NDP is the conscience of parliament would be treated as a joke after Mulcair. Now they are correctly perceived as just another lovely centrist party, but one that is unlikely to ever form government.
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Oct 27, 2016 20:24
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Helsing posted:Then on top of that Mulcair came off as arrogant and high-handed by backing out of debates and attacking Trudeau for being young and inexperienced rather than substantively talking about policy. Liberals played that so well though I can hardly blame Mulcair. The last of the 5 debates was Oct 2 and Libs released their platform on Oct 5th.
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Oct 27, 2016 20:30
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Furnaceface posted:There are so many things that we would be better for even under a useless beard like Mulcair. style over substance not that the NDP made it difficult on either count.
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Oct 27, 2016 20:47
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Postess with the Mostest posted:Liberals played that so well though I can hardly blame Mulcair. The last of the 5 debates was Oct 2 and Libs released their platform on Oct 5th. The NDP should never be the party backing out of additional debates because of a perceived lead in the polls. I admit at the time I didn't think it would be a huge deal but in retrospect I think it added to the overall perception that Mulcair stood for nothing and that the NDP was no longer a party of principles or ideas.
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Oct 27, 2016 21:12
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WHATS YOUR NUMBER MR. TRUDEAU! WHATS YOUR NUMBER!
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Oct 27, 2016 21:13
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The really remarkable thing about Mulcair, though, was that this apparently wasn't an act. He went and gave the exact same kind of performance at the NDP convention, apparently not recognizing how precarious his own position was. So in light of those events I guess we need to accept that in addition to be a cynic Mulcair and the people around him were clearly just outright incompetent, even at being political hacks. So the party sold out for a Thatcherite who couldn't even deliver the one thing he promised. Edit -- Just looked it up and it was "Mr Trudeau". But Mulcair not even giving Trudeau one or two sentences to answer, before he started hectoring him, was seriously not a good look. I want to argue that my mis-remembering it kinda speaks to what the tone of the exchange was though.
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Oct 27, 2016 21:18
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Stop. Stop talking about city planning. Every time it comes up, it makes me consider moving to Europe and leaving this mess of a country behind. dad French so what
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Oct 27, 2016 21:19
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Assuming you would fit in there and have a decent social circle and economic prospects why would you ever not prefer to live in western Europe rather than Canada? That's madness. God live in France dude, this country sucks.
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Oct 27, 2016 21:21
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Helsing posted:As I recall it, he said "Justin", not "Mr Trudeau", presumably to emphasize how much older and wiser he was than the young Liberal neophyte. Because what people really wanted from the NDP leader was cynicism, condescension and character assassination. I keep forgetting Mulcair came from the Quebec Liberals. We are going to see the left split (again) arent we? I cant see the NDP staying in its current state for long before people start to bail, either to create the centrist party of their dreams or run on an actual leftist platform. Which means decades of CPC/LPC governing is in our future. 
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Oct 27, 2016 21:22
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Furnaceface posted:We are going to see the left split (again) arent we? I cant see the NDP staying in its current state for long before people start to bail, either to create the centrist party of their dreams or run on an actual leftist platform. Why would they? The NDP centrists will just flock back to the LPC and the NDP will revert to fringe party status.
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Oct 27, 2016 21:22
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Helsing posted:Assuming you would fit in there and have a decent social circle and economic prospects why would you ever not prefer to live in western Europe rather than Canada? That's madness. God live in France dude, this country sucks. Agreed. Find out if you can get a passport and leave if you are able too. I have my Irish passport for a reason.
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Oct 27, 2016 21:25
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