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Agrajag posted:Tell that to the people he has oppressed for decades and the family members of the people he has had tortured/killed, get off your drat pedestal. I didn't watch a video of them getting tortured, so I don't care about them.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:51
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Ask someone from the Dark Enlightenment thread whether you should engage Cingulate or not. Ask me if you like.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:51
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Paradoxish posted:Pew seems to think it was closer to 75%, but the actual numbers don't matter too much. The point is that there was sufficient bipartisan support that Democrats felt compelled to support the war. They were just doing what their constituents wanted. That might make them cowards and it certainly makes them culpable in part for what happened, but it doesn't make them hawks and it doesn't mean Clinton is chomping at the bit to start a war. on March 18th 2003, McCaine posted:How long will it take to capture Baghdad? 3 Weeks at most. i was gonna post the somewhat infamous grover version of this, but i found the one the McCaine did, to give an idea of how the left thought the war was going to go. people vastly underestimated how long the occupation was going to take.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:51
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I have a bunch of friends who've been using Facebook to "check in" at Standing Rock, saying that they're trying to confuse the Bad Guys who are tracking protesters via facebook. Is this just good ol' slacktivism or is there anything to it, anyone know?
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Oct 31, 2016 23:51
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Lemming posted:I didn't watch a video of them getting tortured, so I don't care about them.  What sick gently caress watches snuf films?
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Oct 31, 2016 23:52
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I really don't think that slate story has legs. Trump's server is communicating with a Russian bank, it would be different if it was a Russian government building, and he has business in Russia. Could be harmless.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:53
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smug n stuff posted:I have a bunch of friends who've been using Facebook to "check in" at Standing Rock, saying that they're trying to confuse the Bad Guys who are tracking protesters via facebook.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:53
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smug n stuff posted:I have a bunch of friends who've been using Facebook to "check in" at Standing Rock, saying that they're trying to confuse the Bad Guys who are tracking protesters via facebook. ehhhhh, pretty much just slacktivism
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Oct 31, 2016 23:53
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A Winner is Jew posted:
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Oct 31, 2016 23:53
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Instant Sunrise posted:i was gonna post the somewhat infamous grover version of this, but i found the one the McCaine did, to give an idea of how the left thought the war was going to go. people vastly underestimated how long the occupation was going to take. How long will the US be occupying Iraq? As long as Afghanistan. Come on that's hilarious. Or whatever the German word for cry laughing is.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:53
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Agrajag posted:Tell that to the people he has oppressed for decades and the family members of the people he has had tortured/killed, get off your drat pedestal. Deified Data posted:Ask someone from the Dark Enlightenment thread whether you should engage Cingulate or not. Ask me if you like.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:54
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Northjayhawk posted:I really don't think that slate story has legs. Trump's server is communicating with a Russian bank, it would be different if it was a Russian government building, and he has business in Russia. Could be harmless.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:54
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smug n stuff posted:I have a bunch of friends who've been using Facebook to "check in" at Standing Rock, saying that they're trying to confuse the Bad Guys who are tracking protesters via facebook. Snopes looked into it, and so far hasn't found that 1) police were using facebook to track down people, and 2) it's working at confusing the people. Regardless of points 1 and 2, it has become slacktivism, and more of a "yeah I support those protesting the pipeline" which to me is alright.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:54
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CapnAndy posted:Apparently Trump had a server dedicated to nothing but communicating with a Russian bank and it would be super cool if that could get some play, maybe, but I'm not hoping. I've swung back to Nothing Matters unless we get video of Trump loving that server or yelling something racist at it. Instant Sunrise posted:i was gonna post the somewhat infamous grover version of this, but i found the one the McCaine did, to give an idea of how the left thought the war was going to go. people vastly underestimated how long the occupation was going to take. There were plenty of people in the military and in military history circles disagreeing but Rumsfield just yelled shock and awe until they gave up.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:54
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Lovin' this election. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qVtNudSZLo
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Oct 31, 2016 23:55
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smug n stuff posted:I have a bunch of friends who've been using Facebook to "check in" at Standing Rock, saying that they're trying to confuse the Bad Guys who are tracking protesters via facebook. I know cops in the US have developed a habit of scouring social media so I wouldn't put it past them to use it as a tool to disrupt the protesters, but yeah probably slacktivism since it's facebook.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:55
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farraday posted:How long will the US be occupying Iraq? As long as Afghanistan. now compare that to grover's predictions in the same thread: quote:How long will it take to capture Baghdad? 2 days
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Oct 31, 2016 23:57
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FuzzySlippers posted:There were plenty of people in the military and in military history circles disagreeing but Rumsfield just yelled shock and awe until they gave up. poo poo man, all you had to do was watch Princess Bride to know that invading Afghanistan would be a bad idea. 
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Oct 31, 2016 23:58
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seiferguy posted:Snopes looked into it, and so far hasn't found that 1) police were using facebook to track down people, and 2) it's working at confusing the people. Cool, makes sense. I mean, there's nothing inherently wrong with slacktivism, I guess. Maybe it'd be more honest to just say "I support the protesters" without trying make it look like you're Making A Difference but I guess it's facebook, can't expect too much.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:58
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smug n stuff posted:Cool, makes sense. I mean, there's nothing inherently wrong with slacktivism, I guess. gimmicky protests are more effective than just statements of support - look at the ice bucket challenge, or tinting your facebook avatar to show solidarity with france
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Oct 31, 2016 23:59
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Agrajag posted:Tell that to the people he has oppressed for decades and the family members of the people he has had tortured/killed, get off your drat pedestal. There are people in this thread defending the iraq war.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:00
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mcmagic posted:There are people in this thread defending the iraq war. no there aren't. your reading comprehension is dogshit
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Nov 1, 2016 00:01
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Nov 1, 2016 00:01
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My new neighbor just swung by to offer a housewarming present of two T-shirts that read "Truck Fump." 
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Nov 1, 2016 00:01
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boner confessor posted:gimmicky protests are more effective than just statements of support - look at the ice bucket challenge, or tinting your facebook avatar to show solidarity with france I guess I meant in this particular case--the Ice bucket challenge actually resulted in cash donations, right? I sort of feel like this is being done like in lieu of more effective efforts. Although here I am talking about it I guess, so maybe there is something to it.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:01
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I honestly haven't found any substantive news stories on the Dakota prospects.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:01
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mcmagic posted:There are people in this thread defending the iraq war. is your sight impaired?
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Nov 1, 2016 00:02
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boner confessor posted:no there aren't. your reading comprehension is dogshit No but there's the stupid idea that it was impossible to know it was a bad idea at the time.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:03
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smug n stuff posted:I guess I meant in this particular case--the Ice bucket challenge actually resulted in cash donations, right? i mean it wasn't a protest, but yeah. ice bucket challenge was phenomenonally successful as fundraisers go. people love stupid fads Monaghan posted:No but there's the stupid idea that it was impossible to know it was a bad idea at the time. there's a difference between what you're saying and what most people including me are saying, which is that in 2003 the context of the vote was actually diifferent than it is now, in 2016, in hindsight there were reasons to vote for the AUMF in 2003 aside from hawkishness
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Nov 1, 2016 00:03
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A Winner is Jew posted:poo poo man, all you had to do was watch Princess Bride to know that invading Afghanistan would be a bad idea. 
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Nov 1, 2016 00:04
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boner confessor posted:i mean it wasn't a protest, but yeah. ice bucket challenge was phenomenonally successful as fundraisers go. people love stupid fads Patrick Stewart did the best Ice Bucket. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkO4NIqAMss
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Nov 1, 2016 00:05
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+1 for Dread Abuela in MN. Also got to vote for Keith Ellison again. My ballot was kinda boring. MN goons, did I vote stupidly for not wanting an amendment re: who sets legislative pay? Seemed like it could just make it harder to keep people accountable, so status quo seemed fair to me?
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Nov 1, 2016 00:05
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FuzzySlippers posted:I've swung back to Nothing Matters unless we get video of Trump loving that server or yelling something racist at it. Grab it by the PSU
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Nov 1, 2016 00:06
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Night10194 posted:Patrick Stewart did the best Ice Bucket. He also had the best cameo on extras. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fg_cwI1Xj4M
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Nov 1, 2016 00:07
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Instant Sunrise posted:i was gonna post the somewhat infamous grover version of this, but i found the one the McCaine did, to give an idea of how the left thought the war was going to go. people vastly underestimated how long the occupation was going to take. You might be right, but I really wouldn't call McCaine a useful barometer for the American left in the early 00s.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:09
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The "Laissez's Fair" forum perfectly encapsulated the attitudes of American progressives in the late '00s.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:11
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Hollismason posted:I honestly haven't found any substantive news stories on the Dakota prospects. I see them every couple of days in the LA Times
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Nov 1, 2016 00:13
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boner confessor posted:iraq war opposition was definitely stronger out of the gate, it took a while for vietnam to heat up. but i think opposition to vietnam peaked higher, largely because of the draft. americans didn't really care about vietnam at all when the war technically started, before iraq even happened there were massive protests. but that's a question of timing, not the overall strength of opposition - there was a lot more widespread artistic opposition to vietnam, so much it defined music of the era, whereas artistic opposition to iraq was... dixie chicks? not like a whole cultural thing I think that's a weird standard, as musical culture was vastly different, and the point is pretty stark - there was negligible opposition to Vietnam, and it took years with a draft for it to pick up. Before the Iraq War even began there was a robust anti-war movement. People were literally being jailed or having their lives ruined stateside, and US casualties were far higher. I think it even had more of an effect, as Vietnam largely ended because of perceptions the war was unwinnable by leadership. Iraq War opposition forced the administration's hand in overpromising the supposed no-brainer success of Iraq, which made putting pressure on them to withdraw much more effective. It's a little apples to oranges, neither movement actually stopped the war, but it's a good sign of increasing civility in our society IMO, and bodes well for future wars (relatively speaking of course). Cingulate posted:I'm not disagreeing with your overall point, but on quantitative statements, I'd trust Chomsky about as far as the man has traveled to study languages other than English, which is literally nowhere. Imagine I'm doing a jerking off motion and rolling my eyes, because that's about what that statement deserves.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:13
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I mean, in 2003 a good amount of the US voting public was high off our own farts, we hadn't come down from the early victories in Afghanistan, 9/11 was constantly being talked about or invoked, and the assumption that was would now be quick and easy after our experience with Operation Desert Storm. A large portion of the US voting public absolutely believed that we would roll into Iraq and be "greeted as liberators." Democratic congressmen already had been shellacked in the 2002 midterms because of the rally 'round the flag effect following 9/11, and ran to the right to avoid getting primary'd.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:17
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Why does "shellacking" live on like some kind of horrid conversational revenant as a term used purely to describe electoral losses for a political party? It's not a good look!
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Nov 1, 2016 00:18
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