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I like that they don't even post their changes anymore. https://www.reddit.com/r/Vermintide/comments/5aq4sn/new_loot_tables_introduced_with_version_143/?st=iv1bhcg8&sh=ad0f0f34 It's true. It's a step in the right direction, for sure.
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Nov 2, 2016 20:30
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if someone can reliably beat nightmare and above they should probably get at the absolute least a blue, so it's pretty cool. kinda sucks to go through all that and manage to get super unlucky with no successes at all and get the white at the bottom somehow, despite all the odds.
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Nov 2, 2016 20:32
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Commoners posted:Apparently they made the nightmare/cataclysm loot tables super exotic heavy now too with this patch. It seems like Fatshark are finally loosening up on the artificial scarcity that's plagued this game for so long. Really good change that will help its lifetime. I do hope we see some new content soon, though...
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Nov 2, 2016 20:34
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in b4 they hotfix it and say it was a mistake
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Nov 2, 2016 20:38
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Lunethex posted:in b4 they hotfix it and say it was a mistake Apparently it's the existing loot table on the console release, so 99% likely intended.
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Nov 2, 2016 20:40
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The bolt staff turbo guy mentioned on that post that the blunderbuss is armor penetrating on consoles? Whaaaaa? What other changes does the console version have that the PC version needs?
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Nov 2, 2016 20:44
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Digirat posted:The bolt staff turbo guy mentioned on that post that the blunderbuss is armor penetrating on consoles? Whaaaaa? What other changes does the console version have that the PC version needs?  That's potent as hell! A good change, imo. Hopefully we see the 1h Sword and 1h Axe (among others) brought up to snuff. I want to use my Hakk Az  e; just rolled a blue mace and shield. killing blow and regrowth... on the normal attack 
brocretin fucked around with this message at 21:47 on Nov 2, 2016 |
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Nov 2, 2016 21:06
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Honestly this loot table discussion is kinda just pissing me off cause it's reminding me how much I HATE the difficulty in this game, and how loot is tied to it, especially how you only get one piece of loot in a mission(whoever is the rear end in a top hat who decided that Whites can be on the loot table for Easy and Normal is someone I hope dies young in a painful and humiliating manner)
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Nov 2, 2016 22:23
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drrockso20 posted:Honestly this loot table discussion is kinda just pissing me off cause it's reminding me how much I HATE the difficulty in this game, and how loot is tied to it, especially how you only get one piece of loot in a mission(whoever is the rear end in a top hat who decided that Whites can be on the loot table for Easy and Normal is someone I hope dies young in a painful and humiliating manner) Are you actually complaining that it is possible to get a white item when playing on the easiest difficulty Are you doing that
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Nov 2, 2016 22:29
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He probably misspoke. What I thought was dumb was how there was a green item on the Cataclysm loot ladder.
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Nov 2, 2016 22:33
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Digirat posted:Are you actually complaining that it is possible to get a white item when playing on the easiest difficulty Hey now a white item is 1/125 an orange, that's a lot of responsibility.
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Nov 2, 2016 22:51
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Lunethex posted:He probably misspoke. What I thought was dumb was how there was a green item on the Cataclysm loot ladder. Yeah, you should be guaranteed a blue at worst if you can beat cataclysm at all. I would probably not have more than 1 green, maaaybe 2 on nightmare either. And definitely no whites on nightmare. Nightmare is where you can no longer win if you are bad, as long as you aren't getting carried.
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Nov 2, 2016 22:56
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Digirat posted:Are you actually complaining that it is possible to get a white item when playing on the easiest difficulty Yes I am, getting a White just makes it feel like you wasted a bunch of time, as even an Easy mission usually takes at least half an hour to finish
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Nov 2, 2016 22:59
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under what circumstances should white stuff be dispensed then like i don't get it, if you're playing on the lowest tier you should reasonably expect to have a good chance of getting lowest tier gear
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Nov 2, 2016 23:05
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drrockso20 posted:Yes I am, getting a White just makes it feel like you wasted a bunch of time, as even an Easy mission usually takes at least half an hour to finish Personally, I don't do Cataclysm, but I definitely play on Nightmare. Sometimes just Hard if I'm feeling lazy. Below that, it's just not engaging as you barely have to play to succeed.
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Nov 2, 2016 23:06
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drrockso20 posted:Honestly this loot table discussion is kinda just pissing me off cause it's reminding me how much I HATE the difficulty in this game, and how loot is tied to it, especially how you only get one piece of loot in a mission(whoever is the rear end in a top hat who decided that Whites can be on the loot table for Easy and Normal is someone I hope dies young in a painful and humiliating manner) it doesnt sound like you are very good at this game
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Nov 2, 2016 23:31
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4 blues, 3 oranges and 1 red on the board on nightmare. These new loot tables aren't joking around.brocretin posted:e; just rolled a blue mace and shield. killing blow and regrowth... on the normal attack The charge attack on the mace and shield is so much slower than on the sword and shield, while the normal attack has solid enough CC power of its own, that those traits are actually pretty good for that weapon. That thing should definitely keep your sgt competitive on nightmare until you can get an orange version of quite honestly any of his melee weapons, or a blue version of one of his top 3 melee weapons. Kruber is the only character who has no outright stinkers for melee weapons, even though the basic sword noticeably lags behind the pack e: I guess the wizard's mace is not exactly a stinker either but it's a lot harder to defend it compared to kruber's worst option. kruber's worst melee weapon is sienna's best melee weapon. Owl Inspector fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Nov 3, 2016 |
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Nov 3, 2016 00:47
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Improved loot tables have caused a migration of players to Nightmare who clearly don't know what they are doing. I'm seeing level 4-15 players on Nightmare and they are terrible.
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Nov 3, 2016 00:48
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Coolguye posted:under what circumstances should white stuff be dispensed then Honestly you should just start the game with all White gear unlocked Safety Factor posted:Sounds like a personal problem and not the game's. Play on higher difficulties, that's part of what makes Vermintide fun. Might be a difference between playing on console versus PC like most people in this thread, cause Hard just isn't very enjoyable, can't even imagine how much of a slog Nightmare or Cataclysm are Vladimir Putt-Putt posted:it doesnt sound like you are very good at this game My skills are decent enough in most regards(I will admit I suck at dodging though), main problem is that the game has multiple kinds of artificial difficulty that can suck the fun right out of the game above Normal(and on Normal too for the following missions: Wheat & Chaff, White Rat, Summoner's Peak); Everything to do with Gutter Rats and Pack Masters Rat Ogres having too much health and/or damage Skaven in general having way too much reach in comparison to your own with most weapons Barrels exploding if you get hit while carrying them Game sometimes being too aggressive with spawning waves of enemies(White Rat and Wheat & Chaff are especially guilty of this one)
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Nov 3, 2016 01:02
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I hope nothing good is on the quests because I can't connect with my internet half on the fritz
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Nov 3, 2016 03:08
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drrockso20 posted:
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Nov 3, 2016 03:26
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Coolguye posted:[*]roger if anything has TOO LITTLE health because a team that's on top of him can turn him inside out in under 20 seconds on nightmare (ask digirat and nanomashoes how many times they've done this it's a lot) Coolguye posted:[*]only storms have a substantial reach advantage over you, this is confirmed in code Rats have weird hitboxes when hitting up or down at you, but other than that yeah they're fine.
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Nov 3, 2016 03:37
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drrockso20 posted:Honestly you should just start the game with all White gear unlocked This is a very sensible opinion. You should at least be able to choose the non-upgraded weapons you want from the beginning rather than have to wait for random drops. People are giving you a hard time about your skill at the game but people should be allowed to play on whatever difficulty they want and you shouldn't need to roll magical dice to get a bog standard non magic weapon that there should be millions of lying around during the end times anyway.
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Nov 3, 2016 03:38
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drrockso20 posted:My skills are decent enough in most regards(I will admit I suck at dodging though), main problem is that the game has multiple kinds of artificial difficulty that can suck the fun right out of the game above Normal(and on Normal too for the following missions: Wheat & Chaff, White Rat, Summoner's Peak); Your definition of "artificial difficulty" must be virtually indistinguishable from your definition of "difficulty." Your last point is debatable because there is definitely a huge degree of randomness in what the game decides to spawn, but your complaint is with waves and not the real problem, which is the huge variation in the number of specials. (Like the time the game spawned 2 gutter runners and 2 hook rats at the same time during the escape at the end of nightmare dungeons, effectively ending the game in the span of 5 seconds.) However, clan rats and slave rats on level ground can be killed without taking damage with 100% consistency in a lag-free environment. Fight waves in choke points whenever possible and bring 1-2 high CC weapons like shields. Your first point is the other one I can kind of agree on, but only on packmasters, and only because their design is poo poo compared to the L4D2 jockey. (I probably whine about them more than anyone else here.) Their purpose is to force the team to stick together and punish morons who go rambo way off by themselves. You will find special enemies designed to do the exact same thing in the L4D and payday games. If someone gets gutter runnered right next to you, you can shove the gutter runner off in less than half a second. If someone gets gutter runnered around a corner, you done hosed up. All your other points are not faults of the game. This is how you kill rat ogres. Normal rats can only hit you when you can't hit them if you are retreating and trying to swing at the same time--This tactic does not fly by design, so that you can't just blitz past all the enemies like you can in in L4D. If you're getting hit while carrying a barrel that is entirely your fault for not only running with the barrel instead of throwing it in front of you, but also trying to carry it next to rats. Rabelais D posted:This is a very sensible opinion. You should at least be able to choose the non-upgraded weapons you want from the beginning rather than have to wait for random drops. You are allowed to play on whatever difficulty you want. You can experience every level and weapon in the game by just playing on easy. An orange weapon handles identically to a white one with the same animations and everything, and does comparable damage on nightmare to a white weapon on easy. If a difficulty is too hard for you then play on a lower difficulty for christ's sake. There's just no reason you should be averaging the same quality items as someone who's winning on cataclysm. The only exception here is the weapons that only drop as blue or above, but to my knowledge those weapons only include the drakefire pistols and the volley crossbow (admittedly, it is lame that there isn't a white version of these).
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Nov 3, 2016 05:23
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i do feel like the game should just start you out with a white copy of every applicable weapon and give out chunks of white crafting mats instead of duplicates on lower difficulties, but beyond that it's possible to go through an entire easy or normal mission and only use a single healing item at most and none at the least (even without bloodlust/regrowth) and those difficulties even start you with one. hard is pretty much the baseline for actual challenge in the game, and even then it doesn't even have friendly fire. i take more damage on average than i probably should, but i can pretty consistently do nightmare-level missions and contribute due to being a team player more than anything else. for all i know the game controls like absolute poo poo on controller, so i can't really speak for any console players. the loot table should probably give out less whites, though
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Nov 3, 2016 05:40
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console life must be pretty painful, but honestly, you should try to tough it out and play some of the harder difficulties; having a full loadout of orange weapons make a lot of difference. they don't just get more slots for bonuses, they also just have a flat increase in damage. the big thing about playing harder difficulties is to just not get hit, especially when it comes to stormvermin (really, the best test for not getting hit is dueling stormvermin; you ought to be able to kill two by yourself without getting hit by blocking and dodging back from their highly, highly telegraphed blows. Don't try being greedy about it; get in safe hits, then step back. If you get hit by one when 1v1, you are doing something wrong (most pubs get hit a lot)). part of the problem with playing the lower difficulties is that you can get away with trading hits, which is a bad habit to get into. when you block, you block back attacks as well, btw; if you find yourself cut off, dont' be afraid to just turtle and try to retreat to your teammates. also i dont think there is much terrible with packmasters. They're very loud and easy to detect audibly, and the few times they are dangerous (running through a thick mob), they're only bullshit by virtue of bad player habits: the most broken powerful weapons not that good in that particular situation: homing stuff can't hit them, people don't bring crowd sweeping guns that could grant enough space to hit the packmaster, people would rather watch teammates die than use bombs/potions for anything other than killing rat ogres, and the most populer publord weapons lack enough stamina to push back the rat mosh pit (and pubs seem to dislike shoving as well as a whole). Outside of those idealized situations, they tend to get spotted and killed very quickly by homing poo poo or rifles. I only suffer against them once in a great while; gutter runners and their ability to actually deal damage alone while your pub buddies ignore you and gas rats ability to be HUGE ASSHOLES tends to be more often responsible for bad things happening. unrelated, because i wanna talk about broken weapons: Berserk/Regrowth Normal Glaive is some hosed UP poo poo Bloodlust/Channeling/Stability bolt staff is also gross. Bloodlust/Diversion/Knockback conflag staff is not broken but being able to keep an ally alive indefinetly is cool poo poo Bloodlust/Perfect Balance/Off Balance Rapier is not really broken at all but still fun because i get to be pseudo-shield saltzpyre Tiler Kiwi fucked around with this message at 06:17 on Nov 3, 2016 |
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Nov 3, 2016 06:06
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Actually jockeys were supposed to gently caress up bunched up players by pulling one out of position. The charger is also supposed to mess with players holding up in a choke or corner. Globadier fills the same roll as the charger. The real problem is it's too hard to free someone from the pack master. The jockey is on top of someone over the whole wave. The pack master uses his victim as a human shield.
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Nov 3, 2016 07:08
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Jockey also only ever had something like 80% control, PM has 100%. Jockey with a mark is slower than players, PM is same speed. He also has near immunity to shotguns because I have no idea why. All of this would be fine if the PM had to work his way around other rats because he would get hung up in a crowd, but he does not and will phase through, which is the real problem.
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Nov 3, 2016 07:18
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as someone who played versus way too goddamn much in l4d2, survivor control was there mostly as a placebo to make players feel like they were doing something productive. e: you can also dodge away from packmaster hooks if youre mlg enough; its real hard timing, though, but they have a pretty large cooldown after they miss. Tiler Kiwi fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Nov 3, 2016 |
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Nov 3, 2016 07:26
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on top of that, the packmaster will drag you right through the horde they just snagged you from and most of the time your allies will be unable to get a good shot without thinning the rats first. all the while it'll be dragging you further and further away. the jockey works a hell of a lot better as a way to distance allies due to being dangerous but also not being annoying in basically every way.
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Nov 3, 2016 07:27
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finally made a orange brace of pistols last night was going for targeteer/skullcracker/hail or rupture but ended up with targeteer/bloodlust/more ammo should be awesome for nightmare
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Nov 3, 2016 09:48
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i'm not sure braces can have hail of doom, could be wrong but i don't remember seeing one targeteer/bloodlust/ammo holder is fuckin' legit though
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Nov 3, 2016 16:23
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I got a blue grudge raker with extra ammo and double magazine capacity. Doom dwarf away!
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Nov 3, 2016 16:30
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Targeteer is a must have and rupture is a close second on the brace for me. After you use the repeater handgun for awhile, a weapon that has equal damage but only hits 1 target by default just can't compete (the brace should maybe have a bit more base ammo to compensate for that).
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Nov 3, 2016 16:32
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Arcsquad12 posted:I got a blue grudge raker with extra ammo and double magazine capacity. Doom dwarf away! i'm actually kind of curious what benefits the grudgeraker offers me over the drakefires. with the drakefires all it takes is a second to delete a cloud of rats and i don't even have to worry about ammo or reloading really, and it's armor piercing on top of that.
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Nov 3, 2016 16:42
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Not much. The blunderbuss and grudge raker have potential value but are basically gimmicks for people with orange weapons who are tired of using handguns all the time, and have the ore to waste on getting good traits for them. Having one or even both on your team is fine and won't kill you as long as other players have special killers, but you sure aren't going to provide the same value as the soldier/dwarf who brought a handgun. Fatshark needs to make them armor piercing like on consoles. You can annihilate stormvermin patrols with a blunderbuss if you just have a strength potion to make it armor piercing. Let it do that without the potion and get rid of the idiotic "resistant" distinction on hook rats and rat ogre. Bam, now the shotguns have a solid and useful niche that lets them contribute to something that your melee weapons can't already do.
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Nov 3, 2016 16:52
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Modifying Gas Rats, Ratlings, and Gutters to have the Ogre/PM armor and about 700 health each was funny as hell.
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Nov 3, 2016 16:52
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Grudge rakers have surprisingly decent range, making them really good for handling packs. The blunderbuss is still awful.
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Nov 3, 2016 16:57
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i'd used a grudgeraker for a little while and the only reason i carried it was because it was the only thing i had with a healing trait on it, and it was hilarious how worthless it was against specials. then i got drakefires, which handle crowds much better anyways and can actually hit poo poo at a distance and do real damage to stormvermin/gunners. i really wish everything in the game had some sort of concrete use.
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Nov 3, 2016 17:21
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Grudge raker is good against gas rats and gutter runners I guess.
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Nov 3, 2016 17:28
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