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Kilroy posted:I don't get this post considering I just said that the vast majority of Trump supporters are too high off the smell of Bannon's farts for us to ever hope of reaching them. I don't have a problem giving up on them (and I've been flamed multiple times in USPOL for my suggestions to effect of burning rural America to the ground and salting the earth). And white working class voters abandoned the Dems a long time ago. Probably before you were born. You can't have both when one side is responding well to, "minorities? gently caress them!"
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Nov 9, 2016 17:47
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UV_Catastrophe posted:NYT breakdown of the exit polling: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/11/08/us/politics/election-exit-polls.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur  Look at that shift for "Something else"  . What happened there?I can't imagine Trump gained in the Muslim vote. So the first thing that comes to mind is maybe Indian Hindus swinging hard to Trump?
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Nov 9, 2016 17:48
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Kilroy posted:I don't get this post considering I just said that the vast majority of Trump supporters are too high off the smell of Bannon's farts for us to ever hope of reaching them. I don't have a problem giving up on them (and I've been flamed multiple times in USPOL for my suggestions to effect of burning rural America to the ground and salting the earth). And white working class voters abandoned the Dems a long time ago. Probably before you were born. I take back everything I said about white working people, we just had a poll showing Trump winning college educated white people too. My argument is that if we shift towards messaging explicitly race neutral class warfare (it has to be race neutral or white people won't care), racism and sexism issues will be pushed out and we'll lose minority voters. You're robbing Peter to pay Paul. In other words we're hosed, is what I'm saying. I'm saying there is no win scenario here.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:49
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HorseRenoir posted:President Pence would be worse, arguably At least he'd be more stable. My main concern is with the stability of the country as a whole because a president with 0 experience is not OK.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:49
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Donna Brazile wrote Clinton's speech
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Nov 9, 2016 17:49
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GOTV staff is going to go the way of travel agents, milkmen and switchboard operators. Soon after; pollster.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:50
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Oh man, I just thought about a Trump presidential library 
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Nov 9, 2016 17:50
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FCKGW posted:Any chance Trump U stuff becomes A Thing and Trumps gets bounced and we at least get Pence as prez? This might be worse. Trump is dumb, has said liberal stuff in the past, and can be manipulated. I'm clinging to my last threads of optimism and hope the John Stewart plan of getting a bunch of Hollywood stars to rub elbows with and influence Trump works. 
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Nov 9, 2016 17:50
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rudatron posted:you are part of the problem get out
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Nov 9, 2016 17:51
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Frankly all this triangulating talk is reminding me of why the Democrats lose elections in the first place so how about this: The end-game for leftism is socialism, if perhaps supported in part by some neutered market economy. So don't lose sight of that and don't try to hide it. At the same time American institutions are racist as poo poo so making triage of that also part of your messaging and then doing something about it if you're elected is also a Good Thing.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:50
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FCKGW posted:At least he'd be more stable. My main concern is with the stability of the country as a whole because a president with 0 experience is not OK. ....Mentally, maybe. But let's remember: His idea of mental stability was Jail for Gays and Instant Jail for Gays who applied for Marriage Licenses. His home state hated him.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:51
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Lightning Knight posted:I take back everything I said about white working people, we just had a poll showing Trump winning college educated white people too. When you can't win the game, change it.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:52
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Bushiz posted:Barack Obama was essentially an epinephrine shot into the democratic party that deluded the DNC into thinking that it was their policies, not Obama's once-in-a-lifetime charisma that people fell in love with. It wasn't sustainable. not totally accurate. people did love obama's proposed policies, but the dnc hosed him over before he could implement them and then the republicans took over and there was no hope.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:52
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FCKGW posted:Oh man, I just thought about a Trump presidential library Largest collection of penthouse, hustler, and jugs on the planet.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:51
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UV_Catastrophe posted:White college grads broke in favor of Trump 45%/49%. How. They want to be on top after all their hard work.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:51
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rudatron posted:you are part of the problem This is genuinely what white people in the country think about PoC.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:52
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Looking back at Obama's success, it's obvious that democrats need to run candidates that can successfully appeal to liberals on issues of both race and class. If dems can't deliver on both, they're truly sunk.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:52
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 ahahaha who are the assholes who voted for the candidate they thought would be the worse commander-in-chief
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Nov 9, 2016 17:52
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Lightning Knight posted:What do you think we could do to win them back? I frankly don't think Obama could win in 2020 even if he were allowed to run. i totally disagree. obama could easily win in 2020 if that was allowed.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:53
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Bushiz posted:Barack Obama was essentially an epinephrine shot into the democratic party that deluded the DNC into thinking that it was their policies, not Obama's once-in-a-lifetime charisma that people fell in love with. It wasn't sustainable. Yeah I think this is 100% the case. The arrogance from the DNC in terms of voters basically having to vote for them without really offering anything in return other than neo-liberalism was palpable. They've been bleeding seats in Congress and local governments for over a decade but they did little to correct this. Pakled posted:
The same idiots that thought she's be a better President but voted Trump anyway.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:53
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This is going to be the most regressive 4 years in history that I've ever lived through.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:53
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This is me being major dick, but as much as I fear the upcoming Trump presidency, I massively enjoy the shadenfreude I am getting right now, from posters who posted in USPol saying that the American system is better than the various european ones, because thanks to the power of winner takes all, the cheeto won't get any power... Well, according to CNN infographics, HRC is winning PV right now (admittably by really little), but got smoked in EC and the fascist cheeto will get ALL the power. 
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Nov 9, 2016 17:53
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Pakled posted:
Hopefully assholes with sons and daughters in the military.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:53
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Martha Stewart Undying posted:You can't have both when one side is responding well to, "minorities? gently caress them!" You seem to suggest the approach from the Left should be dictating by whatever the Right happens to be doing. We know how that works out now.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:54
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Lightning Knight posted:I take back everything I said about white working people, we just had a poll showing Trump winning college educated white people too. There's no surprise here. College educated people traditionally vote Republican in order to protect their precious dollars. People like me who are all like, "but what about the cartoonishly evil social policies" are definitely in the minority.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:55
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ThePeavstenator posted:This might be worse. Trump is dumb, has said liberal stuff in the past, and can be manipulated. Hey what if loving John Stewart ran for president?
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Nov 9, 2016 17:54
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Doctor Butts posted:This is going to be the most regressive 4 years in history that I've ever lived through. I'm hoping old people save my social security again since we dodged a bullet with Bush II. and his attempt to privatize it riiiiight before the stock market collapsed.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:54
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The media is so clueless its incredible. CNN could have called Wisconsin or Michigan way earlier when it was clear Hilary had no counties left with democrat votes. They just extended the shitshow longer.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:54
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Lightning Knight posted:The Trump coalition is built on racism. His platform was literally "gently caress immigrants and foreigners." White working class people abandoned the Dems for that platform. It was a platform of "Put our interests ahead of non-Americans, we can't waste our money abroad if our own people are doing poorly." Clinton wasn't able to explain what those interests mean, and how they could be best served through cooperation, instead she tacitly conceded the point that her own legacy as a SoS would impoverish more Americans via her flip flopping on the TPP. She also failed to make a positive impression in all matters relating to war and foreign policy.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:54
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I'm proud of my generation for resoundingly voting for Clinton over Trump. the dream won't die so long as 18-30 continue to move to the left. The DNC needs to restructure itself and make our voices the primary voices, along with those Rust Belt voters that made up the firewall. will that happen without a charismatic face to the party? I don't know, but surely some good will come out of a Trump presidency in that his successor will be more representative of the marginalized similar to Obama. am I being overly optimistic? yeah, but gently caress if there's anything else to do other than organize and hope for the best
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Nov 9, 2016 17:56
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ThePeavstenator posted:This might be worse. Trump is dumb, has said liberal stuff in the past, and can be manipulated. The liberal focus on loving stupid celebrity crap instead of real policies that affect people is why we are here today.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:56
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Pakled posted:
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Nov 9, 2016 17:56
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Ulio posted:The media is so clueless its incredible. CNN could have called Wisconsin or Michigan way earlier when it was clear Hilary had no counties left with democrat votes. They just extended the shitshow longer. I think MI was called at the right time, Trump won by a verrrry narrow margin and Hillary was gaining on him til the very end since the last places to be counted were urban Detroit. WI should have been called much earlier, though.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:57
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RasperFat posted:gently caress that noise. "From the sounds of things Berniebros one again foiled my obviously awesome candidate". Sorry to quote from a while back, but this is on point. Bernie was the only reason a large number of young left-wing voters got involved in the election in the first place, and it's frankly a shameful kind of scapegoating to try to lay this thing at his feet. The party railroaded in an establishment politician and managed to screw up the biggest electoral slam dunk in recent history, full stop.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:57
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Doctor Butts posted:This is going to be the most regressive 4 years in history that I've ever lived through. Eight years.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:57
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Kilroy posted:Why not? The problem is that you're forgetting why American labor failed in the first place. If you push class identity you will lose because the Right will push racism and win because race > class. Remember the Southern Strategy? If you push identity politics you'll lose because "  wah, white people are so persecuted now, you don't focus on us anymore, no I don't care your platform would be amazing for me too, you're not sucking my dick while you say it."
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Nov 9, 2016 17:57
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FourLeaf posted:The liberal focus on loving stupid celebrity crap instead of real policies that affect people is why we are here today. ah yes, as opposed to the Republican focus on policies such as "I hate Obama, also Mexicans. Make America great again"
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Nov 9, 2016 17:58
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FCKGW posted:Any chance Trump U stuff becomes A Thing and Trumps gets bounced and we at least get Pence as prez? Lol. I honestly don't get the media blaming like at all. Even the Clinton campaign went wtf over the emails, and the media completely ignoring it would have massively backfired. Their coverage of it was almost entirely "this is nothing " when they did cover it. People are angry and lashing out incoherently imo. Clinton ran a real lovely campaign is the real story, she easily had the most advantages of any modern candidate.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:58
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FCKGW posted:Any chance Trump U stuff becomes A Thing and Trumps gets bounced and we at least get Pence as prez? Trump is an idiot frat boy rapist, Pence is legitimately a considered form of evil. He's potentially a whole lot worse, because he'd actively try to take a lot of terrible steps that Trump may ignore because Trump finds work boring.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:57
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Mister Macys posted:Eight years. Doubt it. There's almost certainly going to be another recession within the next four years and the party in power is the one that tends to get blamed.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:57
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