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steinrokkan posted:I want a candidate who can explain why those positions are ineffective, and who can also precisely name and describe the issues paining people in terms that resonate with them, while rhetorically leading into a progressive policy solution (that's what Sanders was doing). A candidate who can't communicate is worse than useless, and Clinton is a terrible communicator. Sanders was anti-trade and had at points been anti-immigrant so I disagree with this assessment. People aren't smart enough in the aggregate for that poo poo. It's way easier to give them dumb racist bullshit.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:07
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I have a dim, vain hope that the sheer backlash from a ruinous four years of the Trump administration will bring a wave election in 2020 that will allow democrats a shot at favorable redistricting.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:09
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rudatron posted:It's what i think about you, dipshit. GET OUT
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Nov 9, 2016 18:08
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rudatron posted:Do you believe your actions are in a vacuum? Do you think other people do not listen when you speak? Look at this election, and then tell me that that rhetoric meant nothing, did nothing, had no possible effect. You're right, I simply didn't listen to white nationalists well enough. Mhm
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Nov 9, 2016 18:09
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corn in the bible posted:julian castro is on the cabinet thanks to a nod from hillary. poo poo I forgot. Kamala Harris? Lightning Knight posted:Sanders was anti-trade and had at points been anti-immigrant so I disagree with this assessment. 
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Nov 9, 2016 18:09
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Black people and other minorities asking for equal rights (and sometimes just not to be killed in the street by police) isn't saying "all white people are bigoted and we are smarter than you." That's what white people who vote Trump hear and that's not the fault of people asking to be treated equally that they have a persecution complex.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:09
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FourLeaf posted:The liberal focus on loving stupid celebrity crap instead of real policies that affect people is why we are here today. Am I being whooshed? Celebrity candidate just beat policy candidate.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:09
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double nine posted:I'm seeing a lot of scared people worrying that the ACA and other progressive achievements will be wiped out in the next 4 years. My question: can't the democrats filibuster that type of legislation? Much of the ACA was passed via reconciliation, so the bill wouldn't be subject to a filibuster. A repeal of much of it can be accomplished the same way. The GOP tried to get it through that way already, and the only thing standing in the way was Obama's veto.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:10
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UV_Catastrophe posted:I have a dim, vain hope that the sheer backlash from a ruinous four years of the Trump administration will bring a wave election in 2020 that will allow democrats a shot at favorable redistricting. I do think the Democrats could win 2020 if they run someone charismatic. I can't imagine Trump's popularity will be better after actually having to govern, especially since the GOP is probably going to basically turbofuck the poor.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:10
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But really, I was expecting white men to be awful--that's this country's history. I am shocked that white women are so determined to prove they're just as bad. That's the real takeaway from the election: you can treat white women like poo poo so long as you defend their white privilege.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:09
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Sylink posted:Try empathy, it might get votes. People ultimately subscribe to the heirarchy of needs and when thats not met they start to lash out. Exactly how depends. Lmao this is still such a dumbshit talking point. WE HAD poo poo IN THE PLATFORM FOR THESE PEOPLE. We had increased minimum wage, free college, infrastructure funding. We can debate whether that is enough but we had poo poo that would help people left behind by globalization. They want racism and anti-immigrant rhetoric. That doesn't deserve empathy.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:10
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Eugene V. Dabs posted:Well, it's been proven to be unequivocally true so Identity politics is a winning battlefield for the GOP as the election has just proven, you are never going to have equality for all if you make the melanin levels and breeding history of people the government's business, at best you scare the racists into believing that when they're the minority they're going to be hosed so they'll fight progress at every turn. I do not suggest an economic revolution, for those considering my words, I suggest the key to hope and long term progressive victory is institutions that are immune to bigotry through systems resistant to corruption. We can salvage the country if we hold nothing sacred that perpetuates human suffering. Lightning Knight posted:Lmao this is still such a dumbshit talking point. I know you're hurting and maybe even scared but minimum wage won big last night. The message should be clear. RuanGacho fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Nov 9, 2016 |
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Nov 9, 2016 18:11
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Martha Stewart Undying posted:But really, I was expecting white men to be awful--that's this country's history. I am shocked that white women are so determined to prove they're just as bad. That's the real takeaway from the election: you can treat white women like poo poo so long as you defend their white privilege. I'm curious what's going to happen when they try and roll out making abortion illegal nationwide.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:11
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i predicted a while ago that rudatron would go hard reactionary, and im glad to see him making good progress along that path
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Nov 9, 2016 18:12
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Lightning Knight posted:Lmao this is still such a dumbshit talking point. If we expect people to have to read we have already lost. Kanye 2020!
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Nov 9, 2016 18:11
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Glazier posted:poo poo I forgot. Kamala Harris? deliberately defended false confessions in court and got into a fight with the innocence project
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Nov 9, 2016 18:12
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Gorelab posted:I do think the Democrats could win 2020 if they run someone charismatic. I can't imagine Trump's popularity will be better after actually having to govern, especially since the GOP is probably going to basically turbofuck the poor. Counterpoint: Kansas is an unredeemable shithole that's cut their education and infrastructure maintenance to the bone, then started breaking and removing bones. Brownback and his cronies still get reelected comfortably. GOP voters would rather die than vote otherwise. Even if it's what's killing them.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:12
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corn in the bible posted:deliberately defended false confessions in court and got into a fight with the innocence project Kanye West/Kendrick Lamar?
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Nov 9, 2016 18:13
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Benevolent AI-1/Benevolent AI-2 2020
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Nov 9, 2016 18:14
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Radish posted:I'm curious what's going to happen when they try and roll out making abortion illegal nationwide. it'll be piece by piece via allowing states to fully ban
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Nov 9, 2016 18:13
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The very last votes came in for New Hampshire. Maggie Hassan (D) has beaten Kelly Ayotte (R) by 716 votes to be the next Senator. Dems hold onto the two House seats. Republicans win the Governorship. Republicans win the State House I think. Edit: I find it very interesting how the votes split Federal/Local. Democrats winning the federal elections. Republicans wins the local elections.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:13
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Tatsuta Age posted:Benevolent AI-1/Benevolent AI-2 2020 i've heard ai-1 is hosted on a private email server
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Nov 9, 2016 18:14
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OhFunny posted:The very last votes came in for New Hampshire. So what's the Senate at now? 49-51?
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Nov 9, 2016 18:14
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rudatron posted:maybe people got antagonized by poo poo like this Boo-loving-hoo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Nov 9, 2016 18:16
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OAquinas posted:Counterpoint: Kansas is an unredeemable shithole that's cut their education and infrastructure maintenance to the bone, then started breaking and removing bones. Brownback and his cronies still get reelected comfortably. Yeah GOP voters are totally lost and crossing the aisle is a stupid waste of time. There are voters willing to go Democrat but you have to get them to the polls and nerdy policy stuff isn't going to do it. I'm not sure if they can do it by 2020 but they better loving try.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:15
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UV_Catastrophe posted:I have a dim, vain hope that the sheer backlash from a ruinous four years of the Trump administration will bring a wave election in 2020 that will allow democrats a shot at favorable redistricting. Do you really think that after 2 years (probably 4, let's be honest) with all three branches of government that the GOP won't have created the most oppressive voter suppression system since Jim Crow to keep Hispanics and other minorities away from the ballot box? That's not loving happening.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:16
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Just because it's stupid for white people to feel marginalized more than minorities does not make their perception of reality any less real. Like try one single session of therapy, guys. People's feelings are valid and they have the agency to act on them. When you ignore them or invalidate them because "they're wrong," you make the problem worse. Would you tell a depressed person that they shouldn't be sad and they're wrong for being so? That a guy grieving over a dead child should stop feeling what he feels because it's not helping him? That a girlfriend upset over someone telling her to "cheer up!" is overreacting to an innocuous comment? Even if you were right (debatable in those examples), that's not how you address someone feeling a loving feeling unless you have zero loving emotional intelligence. Be an adult: listen, understand, find common ground. You can't claim intellectual and moral superiority on one hand and act like a spooked guard dog every time someone disagrees with you on the other.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:16
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rudatron posted:This is a reckoning. Trump would not have won without your incredible support for him, which you created through antagonization. No. gently caress that. You're either too ignorant or too young to have grown up under 8 loving years of the Bush administration being a liberal and being called anti-american and communist for just having different opinions. They never once tried to win anyone over, and we all suffered for it. Coddling diseased conservative brains just gives them way too much loving time to justify all the regressive bullshit they're going to pull anyway. gently caress them.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:16
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parasyte posted:Much of the ACA was passed via reconciliation, so the bill wouldn't be subject to a filibuster. A repeal of much of it can be accomplished the same way. The GOP tried to get it through that way already, and the only thing standing in the way was Obama's veto. Yeah that's what I'm most worried about. My mom was buying steroid shots from Canada before the ACA allowed her to get two total hip replacements because she couldn't get coverage due to a pre-existing condition. She's a psychologist and runs her own practice so she didn't have access to employer provided coverage. Trump's plan is to repeal the ACA and replace it with health savings accounts. Let that sink in. e: ^ that's not directed at you, more of a broad statement.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:17
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Hope it will work out better for you guys, for everyone's sake: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/oct/20/donald-trump-silvio-berlusconi-italy-prime-ministerThe Guardian posted:We keep being told that the Donald Trump phenomenon means we have entered the era of post-fact politics. Yet, I would argue, post-fact politics has been tarnishing democracy for some time. Twenty-two years ago a successful businessman sent a VHS tape to Italy’s news channels. It showed him sitting in a (fake) office. He read a pre-prepared statement via an autocue.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:16
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corn in the bible posted:i've heard ai-1 is hosted on a private email server Guess that's 0 1 0 0 more years for Trump!
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Nov 9, 2016 18:17
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Radish posted:I think their plan was to get Hillary elected then hope another Obama (Booker?) surfaces by 2024. Now they really have nobody since the DNC is rightfully done and anyone tied to Clinton can't be counted on to win. They needed to start grooming new blood yesterday but nope. We were saying this exact same thing about Republicans and W. Bush back in 2008? The GOP seems to have bounced back well enough from that crushing defeat then. The Democrats will bounce back in time.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:17
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Doctor Butts posted:No. gently caress that. You're either too ignorant or too young to have grown up under 8 loving years of the Bush administration being a liberal and being called anti-american and communist for just having different opinions. They never once tried to win anyone over, and we all suffered for it.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:18
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Captain Magic posted:Just because it's stupid for white people to feel marginalized more than minorities does not make their perception of reality any less real. How the gently caress are you supposed to listen, understand, and convincingly retort when they're just screaming at you about immigrants?
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Nov 9, 2016 18:18
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What did we get last night that was better? I know weed got legalized in a lot of states, but... I got sexually assaulted when I was younger. This morning is really, really loving hard for me, and the only real thing I can think to do right now is focus on the smaller victories. Is there like a master list, or...?
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Nov 9, 2016 18:18
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Submarine Sandpaper posted:it'll be piece by piece via allowing states to fully ban I actually think the Republican base is really going to hold the party's feet the the fire on all the social issues they've been dangling in front of them for years. There's no longer an excuse for holding off and Obama doing something previously isn't going to cut it when there's always some nut willing to primary.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:17
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Eugene V. Dabs posted:So what's the Senate at now? 49-51? We'd still obviously lose the ACA, which will be terrible, but it would be nice if there were two R senators who went "gently caress no we're not gonna try to build a wall."
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Nov 9, 2016 18:19
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Yvonmukluk posted:Do you really think that after 2 years (probably 4, let's be honest) with all three branches of government that the GOP won't have created the most oppressive voter suppression system since Jim Crow to keep Hispanics and other minorities away from the ballot box? That's not loving happening. Excuse me, but we have to stop illegals from committing vote fraud in historic amounts. Or do you want a rigged system!?!
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Nov 9, 2016 18:19
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Lightning Knight posted:Lmao this is still such a dumbshit talking point. They don't mostly, the message is wrong. They aren't going to jerk off over policy, you have to phrase and market to them in terms they understand. Blue collar workers/rust belt/whatever you think these people are, were raised to believe in a company town and company environment, on the backs of the spirit of WW2. Now yes that was all a big scam, but it was a patriotic point of pride for them, and they on the whole, weren't taught or raised to think critically. And they suffer from the same confirmation bias bubble as the rest of us, you can't start trying to rationalize people out of a situation they didn't rationalize themselves into. Its like coaxing an injured animal out of a crawl space. Bumwillickers Smith the 4th isn't going to college at 36 after the auto plant shut down, ok.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:19
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Eugene V. Dabs posted:So what's the Senate at now? 49-51? If there's a small ray of light, it means that two defectors - whether a moderate who's not in favor of the "kill all Mexicans" bill or a Freedom Caucuser who doesn't think it goes far enough - would be enough to stall in the Senate.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:18
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