|
I'd like to add I attempted to watch an episode of Full Frontal but I had to stop five minutes in. It is terrible and Samantha Bee is not funny and has non-insightful opinions.
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 03:31
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 02:29 |
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:I'd like to add I attempted to watch an episode of Full Frontal but I had to stop five minutes in. It is terrible and Samantha Bee is not funny and has non-insightful opinions. I like to call this the Larry Wilmore effect.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 04:11
|
|
|
I like Full Frontal but I feel exactly that way about Daily Show now. Trevor Noah seems like a good guy but holy hell his presentation is abysmal. Even the commercial they showed for tonight's episode was just so poor.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 04:16
|
|
|
Full Frontal is way loving better than current Daily Show
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 04:22
|
|
|
EL BROMANCE posted:I remember when I pointed out this could happen in this very thread, citing the reasons behind Brexit being just as applicable here and was immediately shut down. Turns out paying attention to relevant things that happen in other parts of the world is actually important, who could have guessed. You weren't the only one. But I have faith that I was still wrong somehow. Any minute now, Trump's shtick will stop resonating with the Republican voting base, and he'll lose the election retroactively. It's going to happen, I can feel it. Any minute now.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 05:18
|
|
|
tarlibone posted:You weren't the only one. This will happen when they realize they can't get free 'beetus medications anymore, and Medicare won't cover their replacement HoverRound and portable oxygen generator.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 10:01
|
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:I'd like to add I attempted to watch an episode of Full Frontal but I had to stop five minutes in. It is terrible and Samantha Bee is not funny and has non-insightful opinions. She's desperately trying to copy Jon's shtick down to his delivery so much it's painful to watch. As unfunny and bland as Trevor is at least he's just being himself.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 13:00
|
|
|
Trevor likely has greater appeal to people outside of America as he is not just another white person. I don't think anyone can't match Stewart's incredibly high bar it was always going to be an extremely tough act to follow. But his outsider status allows him to do things Stewart couldn't and to a greater extent than John Oliver. Trevor goes right to the line every time he pulls an Africa joke, it makes me laugh as it is funny and I like watching you guys squirm every time. Definitely not a fan of Bee though, she is trying way to hard and it has stripped her into product. BIG HEADLINE posted:This will happen when they realize they can't get free 'beetus medications anymore, and Medicare won't cover their replacement HoverRound and portable oxygen generator. I read Trump's 100 Days check sheet and hahaahaha you Rust Belt fuckers are so hosed. Enjoy dying from treatable illness. Those jobs aren't coming back. Just try to sell all that unpicked rotten fruit. Keep that Red Hat to throw up in from the poison that is going to taint the land. Great job.
|
|
#
?
Nov 10, 2016 13:19
|
|
|
Mulva posted:No it didn't, it's effectively the same strategy Trump used. It worked perfectly for him. Actually doubling down and saying "These people are monsters and we will make a list and murder them in their sleep" might have fired up the Democratic base more by that logic. Certainly no more combative than "All Mexicans are rapists and thieves and I will build a wall to keep them out". Christ, that line got 30% of Latinos to back him. It's not okay to dehumanize and hate someone that has hateful or regressive views, it doesn't solve anything, and as we can see with the election results, its made things worse.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2016 18:30
|
|
|
Wow, that's one of the smartest things I've ever seen in these dead gay forums.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2016 21:02
|
|
|
Ausmund posted:That's exactly the point. Hate is universally toxic. Social progress, human decency, and empathy are good things. But getting angry and hating people that you perceive to not share those values the way you want them to doesn't accomplish anything positive. It backfired. Hard. I don't think it's as simple as that though. For example, see Black Lives Matter whose message is mainly "stop stereotyping and killing black people over trivial poo poo" to which the response is that they're somehow "encouraging racism" and are "a terrorist hate group" that some people see fit to compare to the loving Klan. All for the audacity of not wanting to be treated as less than human. The most interesting example was one I saw today where, in comparing BLM to the KKK, referred to them instead as "Thug Lives Matter."
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2016 22:49
|
|
|
Solvent posted:Wow, that's one of the smartest things I've ever seen in these dead gay forums. It's also completely wrong. Hate is a useful emotion. It can be bad when overindulged in, and if you can't put it behind you.....but it can be a *profound* motivator for action. And action is a value neutral proposition. It can get bad people out to do bad things, or good people out to do good things. The pretense that there is something you can say, some kind step you can take, some olive branch you can offer to make terrible people better is profoundly dangerous. You can help a lot of people, but not everyone. And when that "not everyone" is millions of people who are absolutely willing to drag you and the rest of the world into an unloved grave with them? You still have to do something about it. If hate is what is needed to get people to oppose them, well, one side is pretty fine with funding the mental health services needed to deal with the aftermath. Mulva fucked around with this message at 23:18 on Nov 11, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2016 23:16
|
|
|
The thing is, letting horrible, horrible things and lies go by without calling them out can be a tacit agreement with them. If you don't call out these things in every instance, they can go by with a pass. That's why a couple of media outlets finally let it all bubble over and picked a side, all too late. That genie got out of the bottle, and it isn't going back in any time soon.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 01:55
|
|
|
Hate is a very strong tool to send people to polls. Fear is not. Trump used hate. Hillary used fear. While turnout was down for Republicans, it was obvious why as Trump was a radical who alienated humongous chunks of their base, but for Dems it free fell.
punk rebel ecks fucked around with this message at 03:46 on Nov 12, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 03:44
|
|
|
Just going to leave this here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCSMyFWTjRc
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 06:14
|
|
|
What fear did Hillary use to get people voting out of interest? I didn't pay nearly as much attention to her side of things, since Trump was so entertaining and I'm not part of the vote so it wasn't important to me. Just fear of Trump himself?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 15:15
|
|
|
tsob posted:What fear did Hillary use to get people voting out of interest? I didn't pay nearly as much attention to her side of things, since Trump was so entertaining and I'm not part of the vote so it wasn't important to me. Just fear of Trump himself? Fear of Trump, fear of trump supporters "the deplorables".
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 16:01
|
|
|
tsob posted:What fear did Hillary use to get people voting out of interest? I didn't pay nearly as much attention to her side of things, since Trump was so entertaining and I'm not part of the vote so it wasn't important to me. Just fear of Trump himself? Pretty much.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 16:01
|
|
|
tsob posted:What fear did Hillary use to get people voting out of interest? I didn't pay nearly as much attention to her side of things, since Trump was so entertaining and I'm not part of the vote so it wasn't important to me. Just fear of Trump himself? "Trump is a monster Hitler who's views on women are from 1950s and wants to put minorities in concentration camps."
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 16:03
|
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:"Trump is a monster Hitler who's views on women are from 1950s and wants to put minorities in concentration camps." Also surprisingly fear doesn't work on people who don't quite have as much a stake in the fear. Its easy to just not vote when while you know its bad to vote for trump because of these 'fear' reasons, its not a personal motivator.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 17:04
|
|
|
Cerepol posted:Also surprisingly fear doesn't work on people who don't quite have as much a stake in the fear. Even when you do have a stake it doesn't matter much. See the drop off in minority votes, including Latinos. I seem to remember way back in the Venezuela elections thread about how Venezuelans kept complaining how MUD kept using losing strategies against the PSUV which involved fear of Chavez and his crew rather than campaigning on hope and how they will change the country. Despite those fears being justified, not enough people went to the polls to vote for MUD. Whether it is left or right, poor or rich, fear doesn't bring people to the polls.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 17:30
|
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:"Trump is a monster Hitler...." OK... this made me giggle, and then I started having bad thoughts. I mean, "monster Hitler." Is there a different kind of Hitler? And then... well, wouldn't that be a good Goldmine or Phriday? The many different flavors of Hitler! We all know Monster Hitler, but most of us don't acknowledge Vegetarian Hitler, and I'd like to see Artist Hitler dealt with in a way other than ridicule. And if there's Vegetarian Hitler, well, imagine how annoying Vegan Hitler would be, pork pie hat and all. Then there's Runner Hitler, who runs for fun and you know this because the moment you added him as a Facebook friend, your timeline exploded with notices about 5K's, 10K's, half-marathons, marathons, charity races, and fancy sock advertisements. What about Vegan Runner Hitler? Which thing would he tell you about first?? There's probably an I Don't Even Own A TV Hitler out there somewhere, and who knows, maybe a Reads To Little Kids At The Library On Saturdays Hitler. Or Ironic Jewish Hitler?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 18:24
|
|
|
Monster Hitler better have a bitchin' breath weapon. I'm thinking at least two elements at once
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 18:45
|
|
|
Would Hitler gain his powers by various items like Mario, or by consuming his enemies whole like Kirby?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 19:52
|
|
|
raditts posted:Would Hitler gain his powers by various items like Mario, or by consuming his enemies whole like Kirby? I have a feeling it would be mostly accidental. Like, if he bumps into a douchebag hipster at a party, he becomes Douche Hipster Hitler. A trilby appears out of nowhere and lowers itself to his head, his mustache stays the same but a pair of ridiculous mutton chops instantly grows, and his uniform morphs into a tweed jacket with a plaid pattern and patches on the elbows. Corduroy pants and thrift store loafers complete the metamorphosis. Then, he can't stop talking about IPAs and crochet bombs until he bumps into another person.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 20:39
|
|
|
Has there been anything from John Oliver since election day?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 20:57
|
|
|
Ausmund posted:That's exactly the point. Hate is universally toxic. Social progress, human decency, and empathy are good things. But getting angry and hating people that you perceive to not share those values the way you want them to doesn't accomplish anything positive. It backfired. Hard. Not for Donald Trump and the minority of the American electorate who voted for him, it didn't. Quit being an apologist wimp.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 21:18
|
|
|
Our political commentator here said that that a lot of the Trump voters were "Normal" people but forgot to mention ignorance being the "Normal" state. One statement that stood out was "The messenger isn't perfect but the message is". What an absurd statement to make. makes my head hurt trying to think like that. gently caress these people, go get angry.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 21:42
|
|
|
SlothfulCobra posted:The thing is, letting horrible, horrible things and lies go by without calling them out can be a tacit agreement with them. If you don't call out these things in every instance, they can go by with a pass. That's why a couple of media outlets finally let it all bubble over and picked a side, all too late. This video I think is relevant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLG9g7BcjKs There is a difference between calling out something/debating about it, and actively shaming the person behind the thought or reducing him to a brainless caricature. One of the most loving incredible things I remember about Sanders for example was him actively debating any point or view in a subject. When in the end the other person had enough, Sanders used to say.."ok, we disagree. But go vote! Vote for what you believe in!". I remember witnessing that, with him going to Liberty University, and talking there amid a crowd of people that would never, ever support him or even aknowledge him. I don't think that he won any voters from that crowd that day, but the image was powerful enough to move a lot of others. I mean, read this. This is how the left should react and engage people that have diametrically different views about life and the world. Using fear and hate against them is not the correct way. And that was profoundly evident in this election. quote:Thank you, President Falwell and David. Thank you very much for inviting my wife, Jane, and me to be with you even this morning. We appreciate the invitation very much. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/09/14/bernie-sanders-liberty-university-speech-annotated/ Dante80 fucked around with this message at 21:56 on Nov 12, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 21:45
|
|
|
Sander's message is great, if you "Think" about. But it doesn't sound bite unless you are like Obama and spam "Hope". Also could have adopted more of Sanders platform or brought him in as VP. Hillary's ability to get it done matched with the fire of Sanders. If Sanders could work with her, so can you. It would have stopped the massive amount of friendly fire and help bring in the mistaken third party voters which were through the roof this year.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 22:31
|
|
|
Grouchio posted:Has there been anything from John Oliver since election day?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2016 22:33
|
|
|
Dante80 posted:This video I think is relevant. That's a very good video, but I'd argue that to some degree, "rising above" being dirty is disengaging from the debate. The media, out of courtesy, barely ever mentioned how Trump's business career was a series of horrible failures, and it humored so many of his outright lies. I would absolutely agree though that the onus for losing the election is on the democrats, because they hosed up their whole strategy and approach.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 01:14
|
|
|
oohhboy posted:Sander's message is great, if you "Think" about. But it doesn't sound bite unless you are like Obama and spam "Hope". Also could have adopted more of Sanders platform or brought him in as VP. Hillary's ability to get it done matched with the fire of Sanders. If Sanders could work with her, so can you. It would have stopped the massive amount of friendly fire and help bring in the mistaken third party voters which were through the roof this year. Picking either Sanders or Warren for VP would have been a bad choice. If you actually care about the policy goals of either of them you want them in the Senate, not in a glorified do nothing position like VP. However, she definitely should have found someone from the Progressive wing of the party that she could both get along with for 8 years and was a big enough name that it meant something. Perez would have been a good choice, since it would not only give a nod toward the Progressive wing but also reassure Labor that Clinton had their back. It would have been using the symbolic nature of the position to the full effect without doing anything to the Democratic Bench other than making you find a new AG/Labor Secretary/Whatever job Perez would have had in Hillary's administration. SlothfulCobra posted:That's a very good video, but I'd argue that to some degree, "rising above" being dirty is disengaging from the debate. The media, out of courtesy, barely ever mentioned how Trump's business career was a series of horrible failures, and it humored so many of his outright lies. The basket of deplorables comment was a decent start down this path, but then they never followed up on it. They let the media and Trump run with it being a condemnation of all of Trump's voters until it died down and was forgotten. It should have been a center point of the attack strategy. It lets you pump up the fear and anger that they seem to have wanted while also letting you immediately pivot into a conciliatory and positive argument for the vote of the other half of Trump's base. It lets you call out all the racism, bigotry, hate and disgusting acts of Trump's side while simultaneously telling Trump's voters "But, I know that's not YOU. That's those other guys. You're reasonable and I want to listen to you."
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 01:51
|
|
|
raditts posted:I don't think it's as simple as that though. For example, see Black Lives Matter whose message is mainly "stop stereotyping and killing black people over trivial poo poo" to which the response is that they're somehow "encouraging racism" and are "a terrorist hate group" that some people see fit to compare to the loving Klan. All for the audacity of not wanting to be treated as less than human. Mulva posted:It's also completely wrong. Hate is a useful emotion. It can be bad when overindulged in, and if you can't put it behind you.....but it can be a *profound* motivator for action. And action is a value neutral proposition. It can get bad people out to do bad things, or good people out to do good things. The pretense that there is something you can say, some kind step you can take, some olive branch you can offer to make terrible people better is profoundly dangerous. You can help a lot of people, but not everyone. And when that "not everyone" is millions of people who are absolutely willing to drag you and the rest of the world into an unloved grave with them? You still have to do something about it. If hate is what is needed to get people to oppose them, well, one side is pretty fine with funding the mental health services needed to deal with the aftermath. SlothfulCobra posted:The thing is, letting horrible, horrible things and lies go by without calling them out can be a tacit agreement with them. If you don't call out these things in every instance, they can go by with a pass. That's why a couple of media outlets finally let it all bubble over and picked a side, all too late. wizard on a water slide posted:Not for Donald Trump and the minority of the American electorate who voted for him, it didn't. Also no need for name calling, friend. punk rebel ecks posted:Hate is a very strong tool to send people to polls. Fear is not. Trump used hate. Hillary used fear. While turnout was down for Republicans, it was obvious why as Trump was a radical who alienated humongous chunks of their base, but for Dems it free fell.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 06:00
|
|
|
Washington DC, the city you think so little about less than a half of you even bothered to vote last Tuesday.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 10:22
|
|
|
James Comey, or the neighbor's kid who plays with matches next to a pile of dry leaves on a windy day. Put down the matches Jimmy! I want to believe you that you're not intentionally trying to set the neighborhood on fire but you keep playing with them next to the dry leaves and... oh, now the entire neighborhood is on fire. Well done Jimmy.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 10:25
|
|
|
I do kind of hope that John brings up the people who are trying to convince-by-protest enough liberal-leaning electors to 'install' Hillary. I despise Trump, and even *I* think these people need to shut the gently caress up and take their medicine, because even if they persuaded them, she'd have *no* authority or mandate whatsoever. None. Part of being an American means eating poo poo once in a while, if only to keep your immune system busy.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 10:28
|
|
|
Would McMuffin be better or worse than Trump?
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 10:32
|
|
|
BIG HEADLINE posted:I do kind of hope that John brings up the people who are trying to convince-by-protest enough liberal-leaning electors to 'install' Hillary. I despise Trump, and even *I* think these people need to shut the gently caress up and take their medicine, because even if they persuaded them, she'd have *no* authority or mandate whatsoever. None. Part of being an American means eating poo poo once in a while, if only to keep your immune system busy. No, the protests are playing a vital role in setting the tone for the next 2 years of policy before the mid-term election. At face value they're an impotent gesture but they do have a political meaning much more important than simply, 'no lol Hillary should have won'.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 10:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 02:29 |
|
|
MiddleOne posted:No, the protests are playing a vital role in setting the tone for the next 2 years of policy before the mid-term election. At face value they're an impotent gesture but they do have a political meaning much more important than simply, 'no lol Hillary should have won'. I realize this, but it's getting things started on the wrong foot. I'm tired of seeing 'the opposition' tire themselves out on something that has no hope of succeeding, then letting apathy set in. As it stands they'll be howling about a never-going-to-happen Hail Mary until December 19th, and they'll tucker themselves out and get all butthurt and discouraged when they 'fail.' For all the horrible the right wing did in 2008 and 2012, I do not remember them ever advocating this. The right wing has coalitions and megachurches. The left has, what, MSNBC? That needs to change - the 'cathedrals' of the left cannot be rallies held every four years. This is as much our fault as it is Hillary's campaign just assuming she was going to win - Obama got elected and most of liberal America reacted with "cool, you got this, bro?" and hosed off into ambivalence for eight years. The ACA would have been unassailable if even 1-5% of his voters personally advocated and called Congress in favor of it, but we didn't. Left-wing white America liked a black guy doing all their work, and then had the audacity to call him a "lame duck" when he didn't have the mandate that they themselves could have given him. It's not "the liberal left" anymore, it's "the *lazy* left," and that poo poo needs to change. Say what you want about the right wing, their platform might be abhorrent, but they have *focus*. The left has millions upon millions of 'pet issues' that consistently spoil the overarching narrative. You don't beat them by joining them, which is what I'm afraid the Democrats will do, because it's what they've been doing by inching further and further to the right since Billy ~embarrassed~ them and 9/11 cowed them all into abandoning their ideals and voting against civil liberties lest they be seen as being soft on terror and 'responsible' for a follow-up attack. poo poo's burning/burned down, but the energy doesn't need to be focused on impractical and impossible measures. Every iota of it needs to be harnessed towards rebuilding something starting *now*. BIG HEADLINE fucked around with this message at 11:14 on Nov 13, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2016 11:10
|
|