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I'm glad LF is dead and I hope it burns in hell.
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Nov 11, 2016 04:55
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JonathonSpectre posted:OK, so after digesting this for a few days, I'm not happy Trump won, but it's not the idea of Trump with the Presidency that disturbs me as much as the utter loving scum being put in his Cabinet. These are people so loathsome they were rejected as unsuitable by loving Republicans. Think about that a moment. Hmm, maybe this should tell you something about Trump's desire to "change" things, or maybe just about the actual things he and his voters wanted to change hint: it had to do with the dirty browns and also the readingatwork posted:I'm actually kind of happy Obamacare is going to die. It wasn't that great of a bill in the first place (it accomplished little while giving the false impression of fixing the healthcare crisis) and killing it opens the way for an actual single payer system. Single payer is dead in the United States. Whatever the Republicans pass is going to be colossally worse than anything we have now and even worse than anything we had before, and I cannot stress enough that accelerationism is bullshit and making things worse does not necessarily mean they will become magically better later. Anything that can be done down the line, after the damage done to the American healthcare situation, will be no more or less than what could have been done with the same governmental makeup, and will have the fun addition of millions of people losing their healthcare and/or dying first.
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Nov 11, 2016 04:56
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Odobenidae posted:Only time I would want to reach out to a literal Nazi is with my fist. Not sure what the liberal obsession is with converting nazis through Nice dnd. This is how we end up with echo chambers. Do you really trust mods to be always qualified to recognize the "good" ideologies. You realize that the nazis thought their ideology was awesome too right
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Nov 11, 2016 04:57
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logical arguments online.
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Crowsbeak posted:Do you know them? Know rural people?
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Nov 11, 2016 04:56
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Like all rural people simultaneously? I don't think that's possible.
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Nov 11, 2016 04:58
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readingatwork posted:I'm actually kind of happy Obamacare is going to die. It wasn't that great of a bill in the first place (it accomplished little while giving the false impression of fixing the healthcare crisis) and killing it opens the way for an actual single payer system. I'm sure the republican government will get right on passing that single payer system.
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Nov 11, 2016 04:56
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PKJC posted:Oh yeah that reminds me, in the midst of all this misery and grieving and soul searching let's not forget that our president elect literally advocated war crimes and 60 million people are a-ok with that. But Hillary was for sure the one baying for more blood. But emails!
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Nov 11, 2016 04:56
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PKJC posted:Oh yeah that reminds me, in the midst of all this misery and grieving and soul searching let's not forget that our president elect literally advocated war crimes and 60 million people are a-ok with that. But Hillary was for sure the one baying for more blood. Different party bases have different standards. Trump supporting war crimes does not suppress the deplorable vote. Hillary being a hawk probably did turn away at least a few Dems.
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Nov 11, 2016 04:58
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Rated PG-34 posted:Nice dnd. This is how we end up with echo chambers. Do you really trust mods to be always qualified to recognize the "good" ideologies. The only echo chamber here is what's between your ears, buddy. And yes, I would classify anyone who is a Nazi part of a "bad" ideology, sorry.
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Nov 11, 2016 04:58
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deplorables do not know what war crimes are
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Nov 11, 2016 04:59
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Hollismason posted:I'm glad LF is dead and I hope it burns in hell. Ron Paul kill you are father
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Nov 11, 2016 04:59
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I seen what happened in North Carolina though, you don't want that replicated in every state where republicans control the state majority. I don't know if we'll ever see true hard numbers but some of those lines around charlotte were drat near criminal for both early voting and the actual election day. It's effective and it works and its awful, and it's going to take concentrated effort and resources to combat.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:00
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Boon posted:No, but apparently my response is, or maybe it's too complicated for you, I don't know. Go tell that to these minorities then. https://twitter.com/i/moments/796417517157830656 Because it sure does look like it was THE factor.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:00
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Racism is a factor, it's not the factor
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chumbler posted:I'm sure the republican government will get right on passing that single payer system. I wouldn't mind a candidate who would actually fight for single payer instead of going "well we'll make our current lovely system a bit better"
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Nov 11, 2016 05:01
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Quorum posted:They've already got plenty of model bills drafted for them by ALEC or Heritage or whoever; they've been fake-passing them in the House for six years now. The only thing that changes from here on out is that many, if not most, if not all of those bills are now going to start making it to President Trump's desk. Also, they're going to nuke the filibuster because they don't want any opposition to anything. The 2012 party of "no mandate because GOP retained control of the senate," is suddenly in 2017 going to be talking about what a mandate Trump's EC victory gave them to repeal Obamacare, appoint SCOTUS justices with majority vote while employing ideological litmus tests like "do you think Roe v. Wade should be overturned?," and claw back all executive branch advancements in gay rights that are broadly popular with the American electorate. People pretending the GOP are going to be able to control themselves or aren't going to act like pricks are deluding themselves. They'll say "Democrats did these things too," while doing unprecedented thing after unprecedented thing. Gonna be hilarious if they gently caress up and lose the senate in 2018 and real bad for them if there's a recession in 2019. I also want a countdown clock until Trump blames Obama for something his administration is at fault for. I think it'll happen January 22nd. ErIog fucked around with this message at 05:04 on Nov 11, 2016 |
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Nov 11, 2016 05:00
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Monaghan posted:I wouldn't mind a candidate who would actually fight for single payer instead of going "well we'll make our current lovely system a bit better" Before I'd have noted that any such candidate would have to explain how they'd pay for it, which polls suggest would cause the American people to throw spontaneous fits, but this election indicates that maybe that' isn't so and all you need to do is just shout at the TV that you'll make sure every American has great healthcare, the best, people are saying it'll be the greatest healthcare ever.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:02
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Deadly Ham Sandwich posted:I am honestly curious if the Republicans can do anything. Not legally. I mean can a congress that did nothing even when Republicans controlled the senate and house actually accomplish anything? It is easy to be against Obama and just be a sour piss baby about everything, but actually planning and doing poo poo is a lot harder. I don't think Republicans can create a big infrastructure project or build a giant wall. That poo poo is not easy. Strong sense of "what's the point if Obama's just gonna veto it"
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Nov 11, 2016 05:02
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Quorum posted:Single payer is dead in the United States. Whatever the Republicans pass is going to be colossally worse than anything we have now and even worse than anything we had before, and I cannot stress enough that accelerationism is bullshit and making things worse does not necessarily mean they will become magically better later. Anything that can be done down the line, after the damage done to the American healthcare situation, will be no more or less than what could have been done with the same governmental makeup, and will have the fun addition of millions of people losing their healthcare and/or dying first. But Obamacare didn't stop health care costs from rising! poo poo is still expensive!. But health care costs was rising with or without Obamacare anyways. Obama gave millions health care they desperately needed. People with chronic conditions finally had a chance to get health care. And now that can is probably going away.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:01
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They won't nuke the fillibuster.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:02
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Sharkopath posted:Do you think you can campaign against voter suppression without alienating rural white voters you are simultaneously attempting to curry? sure, talk about improving their economic situation with your excellent policies and how by making it easier for everyone to vote then that plan will get more support! its basic poo poo!
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Nov 11, 2016 05:02
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PKJC posted:When there are posters telling minorities/women/LGBT people to put off their concerns in the interest of purely focusing on the economic issues because that's what the Trumpsters want to hear, yes, that is in fact bigoted. People in this and the election thread were doing as much. Egalitarian economic reform is good but telling marginalized groups they need to sit down and wait their turn before we listen to other issues is both not progressive and also probably not great in terms of turning out the base you have currently. This. And every now and then someone's still coming in to do it in these threads, then people come along with this strawman that if you care about social issues you don't care about economic ones, ignoring both that these are often the same issues, and that literally no one is saying economic issues for everyone aren't important.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:02
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Sharkopath posted:If you got data to that effect thats good to hear. Sure, I'm glad to deliver (slightly) good news: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/11/09/how-trump-won-the-revenge-of-working-class-whites/ Most didn't vote for Trump because of his hate. Some voted for him in spite of it.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:02
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Quorum posted:Before I'd have noted that any such candidate would have to explain how they'd pay for it, which polls suggest would cause the American people to throw spontaneous fits, but this election indicates that maybe that' isn't so and all you need to do is just shout at the TV that you'll make sure every American has great healthcare, the best, people are saying it'll be the greatest healthcare ever. Bingo. When people kept saying that sanders or leftist ideals won't pass congress, they are not thinking like a typical voter. People vote for candidates that get them excited and inspired. Most people don't delve into the political feasibility of proposals.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:04
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Mantis42 posted:Different party bases have different standards. Trump supporting war crimes does not suppress the deplorable vote. Hillary being a hawk probably did turn away at least a few Dems. Oh for sure the standards are different, and her Iraq vote deffo was a dealbreaker for at least a few people. Was just saying I felt it important not to forget the time he advocated killing innocent women and children because they happened to be family of ~terrorists~ (but only Muslim terrorists, obviously). And his base was like yessirree I am all about spilling the blood of people who have never done a drat thing to me or anyone I know and to our knowledge haven't harmed a soul in their lives, MAGA!
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Nov 11, 2016 05:03
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Bernie email: Goon, The declining middle class is sick and tired of establishment economics, establishment politics, and the establishment media. People are tired of working longer hours for lower wages, of seeing decent paying jobs go to China and other low-wage countries, of billionaires not paying any federal income taxes, and of not being able to afford a college education for their kids - all while the very rich become much richer. Voters know these problems — yet they chose Donald Trump as their next president. That means the Democratic Party needs to look itself in the mirror and work tirelessly to become once again the party that working people know will work for their interests. That's why I believe that Rep. Keith Ellison is the right person to lead the Democratic National Committee. Keith is one of the most progressive members of Congress, and he was an early supporter of our political revolution. He is a co-chair of the House Progressive Caucus, a strong believer in grassroots politics, and someone who would be enormously effective in leading the Democratic Party against President Donald Trump. If you agree that Keith Ellison should be the next Chair of the Democratic National Committee, add your name to mine. We'll deliver a letter to DNC members to show the tremendous support for Keith. You cannot be a party which on one hand says we're in favor of working people, we're in favor of the needs of young people but we don't quite have the courage to take on Wall Street and the billionaire class. People do not believe that. You've got to decide which side you're on. Keith Ellison knows the importance of rejecting the policies of the political establishment and wealthy campaign contributors. He is prepared to take on the billionaire class and all forms of bigotry. He vigorously supports a $15 minimum wage, opposes fracking and dangerous oil pipelines, and he wants to get big money out of politics. I don't think the political establishment and the billionaire class would like Keith Ellison as the DNC chair. Good. Keith also understands the stakes of what might happen under the Trump Administration. He knows just how dangerous it will be for Muslims, people of color, immigrants, our LGBT sisters and brothers, and so many others. His experience and perspective would be key to leading the fight against Trump. I'm sure a lot of you have some feelings about the Democratic National Committee. The truth is that it is an important entity to build, support, and maintain if we are to have the chance to organize and win in the coming elections while Trump is president. We must also do everything we can to elect Democrats to Congress in 2018, and to take back the White House in 2020. We need a Democratic National Committee led by a progressive who understand the dire need to listen to working families, not the political establishment or the billionaire class. That is why I support Keith Ellison to be the next Chair of the Democratic National Committee, and why I hope you'll join me in advocating for him to lead the DNC. Add your name to mine and tell the DNC you want to see Keith Ellison as the next chair of the Democratic Party. We have a lot of work ahead of us. Thank you for being a part of our political revolution. In solidarity, Bernie Sanders
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Nov 11, 2016 05:05
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Fojar38 posted:They won't nuke the fillibuster. Why?
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Nov 11, 2016 05:04
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Quorum posted:Single payer is dead in the United States. Whatever the Republicans pass is going to be colossally worse than anything we have now and even worse than anything we had before, and I cannot stress enough that accelerationism is bullshit and making things worse does not necessarily mean they will become magically better later. Anything that can be done down the line, after the damage done to the American healthcare situation, will be no more or less than what could have been done with the same governmental makeup, and will have the fun addition of millions of people losing their healthcare and/or dying first. Yeah it's dead for now but in 8 years with Elizabeth Warren as the president, who knows? My biggest gripe with Obamacare is that it killed any chance of further progress by fixing things just enough to let dipshit neoliberals act like the problem was fixed and that only small tweaks were needed. Once the whole thing is toast we're back where we started pre-Obama, which everyone agreed was unacceptable. And if the GOP replacement is as terrible as I suspect it will be the Dems will be in a good position to argue for some sort of Medicare for all plan at some point. Not a good thing per se but a silver lining none the less. EDIT: They are totally going to nuke the filibusterer. The only reason the Democrats didn't is because they're huge pussies. readingatwork fucked around with this message at 05:10 on Nov 11, 2016 |
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Nov 11, 2016 05:05
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Fojar38 posted:They won't nuke the fillibuster. Of course not. Republicans need an excuse for not passing stupid poo poo their voters want. God I can't remember what bill it was, but at one point Republicans put up a bill to defund something really helpful like food aid for mothers, and Democrat congress members didn't show up to vote against it. Republicans realized the bill will pass without opposition, so half of the Republicans voted against their own bill. Of course McConnell told reporters the same day that the bill would have passed if it wasn't for the Democrats.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:07
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readingatwork posted:Yeah it's dead for now but in 8 years with Elizabeth Warren as the president, who knows? To be fair, some relatively small tweaks to Obamacare would have improved it a whole ton. Most legislation needs changes over time. Obviously, single-payer would be better.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:07
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Odobenidae posted:The only echo chamber here is what's between your ears, buddy. And yes, I would classify anyone who is a Nazi part of a "bad" ideology, sorry. I never said that this was an echo chamber. I'm saying that if you purge merely on ideology, you will end up with one. If you read the internal nazi memos, they all thought their ideology was double plus good too. Echo chambers are bad news.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:06
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readingatwork posted:Yeah it's dead for now but in 8 years with Elizabeth Warren as the president, who knows? Don't worry, Ryan is already planning on destroying medicare entirely and replacing it with private carriers lmao.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:06
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Potato Salad posted:Bernie email:
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Nov 11, 2016 05:07
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Rated PG-34 posted:I never said that this was an echo chamber. I'm saying that if you purge merely on ideology, you will end up with one. If you read the internal nazi memos, they all thought their ideology was double plus good too. Echo chambers are bad news. code:
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Nov 11, 2016 05:07
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Well if he thinks killing his voter base is a good strategy
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Nov 11, 2016 05:09
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God remember when Ben Nelson and Joe Lieberman nearly hosed Obamacare to death
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Nov 11, 2016 05:09
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ErIog posted:Why? Unless they plan on literally winning forever it is a risky move that could boomerang back to hurt them. pocket pool fucked around with this message at 05:13 on Nov 11, 2016 |
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Nov 11, 2016 05:09
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greatn posted:Well if he thinks killing his voter base is a good strategy For additional information on this topic, please see also: BEVIN, MATT; KENTUCKY, HEALTHCARE IN; KYNECT.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:11
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Deadly Ham Sandwich posted:Where is this from? https://go.berniesanders.com/page/s/keith-ellison-dnc?source=em161110 Guessing the email text is from the link after signing for passing it along to others.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:11
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Deadly Ham Sandwich posted:Where is this from? https://go.berniesanders.com/page/s/keith-ellison-dnc e:FB
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Nov 11, 2016 05:11
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ErIog posted:Why? Because they need it and even if they did nuke it it wouldn't stop the Democrats from having influence in the senate. All it takes is one GOP representative to say "no" and their simple majority is gone and they suddenly need Dem support.
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Nov 11, 2016 05:12
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