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felled by the bern 2016
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Nov 11, 2016 10:35
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Larry Parrish posted:What kind of moron watches network news and actually listens in 2016. Know the enemy.
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Nov 11, 2016 10:51
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Deimus posted:Then maybe people should stop supporting democrats and the system that perpetuates this vicious cycle ah yes, its time to tell all 60 million people who did vote democrat to not vote democrat next election or vote at all
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Nov 11, 2016 10:54
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what countries have the best rural and semi-rural quality of life look at them. steal their ideas.
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Nov 11, 2016 10:55
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Aw I missed out on DNC chairman Elliott Smith chat  Overall I'm just really skeptical that Donna is just going to hand Bernie the keys without a fight. It seems like she and the other leaders really believe they did nothing wrong based on what has come out so far, even in the face of Zach.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:03
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Phobophilia posted:ah yes, its time to tell all 60 million people who did vote democrat to not vote democrat next election We could never abandon the Whigs!
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Nov 11, 2016 11:05
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Battle Royale Baby posted:Aw I missed out on DNC chairman Elliott Smith chat That's some last days of the Fuhrer Bunker poo poo.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:06
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Kempo Yellow Belt posted:felled by the bern 2016 return chubby dogge
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Nov 11, 2016 11:06
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Battle Royale Baby posted:Aw I missed out on DNC chairman Elliott Smith chat Donna is done she's toxic now. What they are doing now is trying to pretend Howie Dean is a progressive.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:07
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Zythrst posted:Donna is done she's toxic now. What they are doing now is trying to pretend Howie Dean is a progressive. how is the democratic chair chosen and how can we have an effect, if indeed we can at all? if we are to have a progressive populist takeover, which we will need to win in 2020, we should prolly start figuring out what we can do for poo poo like this.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:14
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About the only positive you can swing for Dean is that he WAS the one with the 50 state strategy for the DNC 10 years ago, right? The one the DNC threw in the garbage? I mean....that's about it.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:15
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hailthefish posted:
context: bout 100 person chatroom that yospos hangs out in, so lots of tech pros, some working class, allllllll democrat. in the past 72 hours we have gone from our past forever's status quo of "melt em downnnnnnnnn guns are only tools of murder" to having a brand new channel where like eight of us are discussing going to ranges to rent different guns to try, doing research, purchasing weapons and getting familiar with them. Some of us are strictly thinking personal protection/CCW due to minority status. some of us just quite frankly have always been fine with guns and have ached to go blow some cans away for like 8 years, but have had to toe the 'melt em down' party line lest people start calling us potential mass shooters. The immediate fragging of past-30-years D/R politics this week has blown so many doors and paradigms to smithereens. Yeah. Perfect world, no guns. This world, this year, I'd rather both sides be on equal footing.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:17
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Cubey posted:how is the democratic chair chosen and how can we have an effect, if indeed we can at all? if we are to have a progressive populist takeover, which we will need to win in 2020, we should prolly start figuring out what we can do for poo poo like this. Start with this https://go.berniesanders.com/page/s/keith-ellison-dnc?source=em161110. Also some kind soul is putting together a list of phone numbers. (very sorry I didn't remember the username )Shinjobi posted:About the only positive you can swing for Dean is that he WAS the one with the 50 state strategy for the DNC 10 years ago, right? The one the DNC threw in the garbage? Lest we forgett https://twitter.com/GovHowardDean/status/706219827535462401?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
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Nov 11, 2016 11:19
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anime was right posted:what countries have the best rural and semi-rural quality of life France, probably? You'd have to base your whole political system around funneling money to small farmers but the food would be superb and the countryside would be transformed from dystopian industrial factory farms to cool little villages and green fields and poo poo.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:23
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It might be easier to abandon the Democratic Party and start again than it is to completely reorganize the rules in a more fair and democratic manner
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Nov 11, 2016 11:24
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https://a.pomf.cat/pawwxv.mp4
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Nov 11, 2016 11:33
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Lol, didn't Dean spend the whole primaries making GBS threads on Bernie? Good luck rebuilding your trash party with him in charge.
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Nov 11, 2016 11:37
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fuckin lol
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Nov 11, 2016 12:02
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hailthefish posted:This has been said already and it was poorly received but holy gently caress it is time to give the hell up on gun control. Pro-2A single issue voters, unlike the hardcore pro-lifers, are otherwise pretty loving diverse. Stop treating them like criminals/crazies/loving incomprehensible space aliens from another dimension. While the climate of fear in the aftermath of the election of Donald loving Trump might be a little hyperbolic, it should at least demonstrate that it's not completely insane that normal, reasonable people might be concerned about someday needing to fear for their safety and their civil liberties and wanting to be prepared for that eventuality. I think everything else you said has tons of merit but this is something more debatable. At least in my experience there's a fair few minority voters who largely vote Democrat primarily because they're pro-gun control. Asians from my experience are pretty much that, since their two ties to the Democratic party tend to be 1. Gun control; 2. Immigration. And there's lots of Asian-Americans in battleground states like NV. If you gain gun control single issue voters but lose Asians that might be a tossup or a net loss. I think suburban soccer moms too, who are also a pretty useful voting bloc to have. The trick is to find a position where you can address the concerns of both. Going "THE SECOND AMENDMENT IS NOT AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT" doesn't do that. Even if there is valid legal rationale to say that (and there is) it is very bad optics for the white working class and gives free ammo to the Republicans. So I think I'd partially agree on some of that, but disagree on what should be done. What I think should be done is twofold. First, the Assault Weapons Ban is a meaningless symbolic victory that doesn't actually do much of anything. It's time to give up on that. It's a meaningless symbolic victory. It looks nice. It makes your base feel better. But it doesn't help people, and it creates a boogeyman of your opposition. Second, the Second Amendment is really irrelevant. I have a legalist wish to have Heller defeated because from all the research on Second Amendment viewpoints I've read it's basically the ur-example of politicized judicial activism. But that's a discussion to have after the conservatives have been crushed and it's the liberals and progressives and socialists all facing each other down with knives drawn. The functional inconvenience of Heller is pretty much nonexistent. The liberal courts are interpreting it narrowly, the conservative courts are interpreting it broadly, the net effect is pretty minimal. The Second Amendment is basically irrelevant. Unless you want a categorical near-total federal gun ban (not something most gun control advocates want) you can work on reducing gun deaths and gun violence without Heller being an issue. Finally, to tie back to #2, there are tons of 'gun control' proposals which can reduce gun violence significantly and do not involve categorical bans of anything, which do not involve shoulder things that go up, and which do not involve anything scary like mass confiscation. Keeping guns away from domestic abusers and felons isn't 'gun control' in the sense that these guys are afraid of. So I think you can change the messaging on this. It's not about taking away guns. (AFAIK the three most effective ones are basically permit-to-purchase, firearms restraints on misdemeanor DV convictions, and regular audits of gun stores, none of which require categorical bans of firearms ownership). This is the sort of 'smart gun law' we should be advocating for. It's not about keeping you, Mr. Law Abiding Citizen, from buying a gun. It's about keeping That Shithead Who Beats His Wife from keeping a gun to shoot his wife with. It's about getting Those Motherfuckers Who Sell Guns To Gang Members And Nobody Cares out of business so gun stores which don't do that poo poo can compete. Permit to Purchase is probably the only one that needs some work to be sold. If you can keep people from being shot to death in greater numbers with a law that doesn't inconvenience gun owners much, why shouldn't we be advocating that? You can win over the gun control demos with the results. And sell it to them via people who actually have lots of experience with guns. The AWB was sold to the public on the backs of a lot of hunters and other gun owners who backed it. Learn from the strategies used on it, but don't get monofocused on trying to make the 1990s happen again. It's probably not going to make them more inclined to vote for you the same way going full on pro-NRA would, but the idea here is that you want to have something which keeps your pro-gun control base on side while not losing support from gun owners.
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Nov 11, 2016 12:03
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I"m Just Chillin...In Cedar Rapids HAHAHAHAHA
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Nov 11, 2016 12:09
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Bear Retrieval Unit posted:I just wanna say that seeing a bunch of the most hardcore Clinton posters admitting they were wrong is giving me some hope that the future can somehow get unfucked. Not many people can go above digging in their heels and have an honest change oh heart. Good on you guys and welcome back. this also, venom snake, if you ever have the time i'd like it if you went and worked a part time job in the poorer areas of d.c. doing that in oklahoma and texas formed a lot of the reason I was so anti-hillary this campaign, cause I saw these people working their asses off every day and trying to do their best and getting poo poo on endlessly because they didn't have the right parents, connections, or genes. we didn't do the basics we needed to to attract these people who should be able to look to us for relief, and it cost us the election.
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Nov 11, 2016 12:46
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Now that the whole world is turned upside down, this is as good a time as any to talk about nationalizing the banks and bringing finance capital under public control. Because the Trump administration sure isn't going to be able to deal with the impending economic recession - nobody wants to bail out the banks again, and breaking them up into smaller banks like Bernie wanted to do is at best a holding action until they eventually reconsolidate and start the whole process over again.
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Nov 11, 2016 13:02
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The thing about 'common sense gun laws' is it's a) a slogan that gets thrown around a lot by politicians who have repeatedly said melt 'em down melt 'em down Australia is a good example ban these military weapons of death that are killing our children and b) the common-sense things proposed are almost always things that are already super illegal. It is ALREADY against the law for a felon to possess a gun, for a felon to buy a gun, to knowingly sell a gun to a felon, to knowingly buy a gun on a felon's behalf. Domestic violence convictions, even non-felony ones, already make someone a prohibited possessor. This is where getting candidates up to speed is an important step, because when a democrat goes on TV and talks about how they wanna stop felons! from buying guns! on the internet! their base laps it up but their base was going to vote for them anyway, and the pro-2A people who MIGHT otherwise vote for them immediately know they're full of crap. So what you're left with in the 'common sense gun law' camp is stuff like safe storage and trigger locks, which are either unenforceable, or come with super odious poo poo like 'mandatory random warrantless home inspections' which is just.. wow. Add to that the poo poo that's happened in California and Massachusetts, where every time more restrictive firearms laws get passed categorically banning a new category, people actually obey the new laws and build and buy guns that follow them, leading to an EVEN MORE restrictive set of firearms laws. Yeah, Heller was a real weird decision, and the fear about what gets done with it next is what brought 2A people to the polls holding their nose for Trump this election because Hillary's been making her stance clear for 20 years. The other thing that gets proposed a lot is 'closing the gun show loophole' which in reality means 'forbidding private sales', typically with over-broad language that makes a lot of really dumb things Technically A Felony. The well has been so poisoned for so long by incremental steps toward registration and confiscation plans that per-firearm permit-to-purchase is going to be a drat hard sell for a long drat time. Especially when so many people looking to get their concealed handgun licenses face months-long waits to get the paperwork process and sheriffs departments only open to do fingerprinting two days a week and similar other bureaucratic obstructions erected either deliberately by politicians who want to kill gun ownership administratively, or simply as the result of a lack of funding. In the mean time, the BATF is already tasked with conducting inspections of FFL holders every 6 years (and every 3 years if you're near the mexican border lol) which includes an audit of their Acquisition and Disposition records. Making sure they have the funds to actually do this is important. Continuing to get stolen guns off the streets is important, because otherwise they will continue to circulate. Another important step that would go a long way and that would be palatable to the 2A crowd is making some form of NICS check available to the general public and encouraging them to use it when conducting private sales (in places where those are still legal). If I had a magic wand I could wave to make policy come true without any regard for funding and be carried out in good faith forever, I would add mandatory gun safety education as a requirement for purchase without hesitation. way too many super serious words about guns in the demwelp thread, oh well hailthefish has issued a correction as of 13:14 on Nov 11, 2016 |
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Nov 11, 2016 13:12
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Now that the whole world is turned upside down, this is as good a time as any to talk about nationalizing the banks and bringing finance capital under public control. Because the Trump administration sure isn't going to be able to deal with the impending economic recession - nobody wants to bail out the banks again, and breaking them up into smaller banks like Bernie wanted to do is at best a holding action until they eventually reconsolidate and start the whole process over again. Government control of Health, Banking and Energy full stop. Those are the first three imo.
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Nov 11, 2016 13:16
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As long as we're pitching simplified narratives: The young, educated tech and media workers in coastal cities with huge college debts wanted Bernie. Their managers decided on Hillary, then whiffed it. Back in the Midwest, their working class relatives stayed home or voted Trump. Now the investing class are gonna loot the gently caress out of everything while the ~brick through the window~ rubber stamps it all so long as someone tells him how great he is. mrmcd has issued a correction as of 13:24 on Nov 11, 2016 |
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Nov 11, 2016 13:21
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Zythrst posted:Government control of Health, Banking and Energy full stop. Those are the first three imo. The "commanding heights," if you will.
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Nov 11, 2016 13:29
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Personally I live in the midwest, in a metro area with half a million people. I have a bachelors, but in a liberal arts degree. The ACA is the only reason I have insurance for medical conditions that would have been "pre-existing conditions" before 2008. After University and returning to my hometown, it took me about 2 years to find a full-time job, but even then it was minimum wage with intense physical labor and rough conditions. I had injuries on the job send me to the ER twice during the two years I worked there. Sanders went right to the heart of a lot of the economic trouble in the US and working people, Clinton not so much. Iowa broke really hard for trump despite being solidly Obama is 2008 and 2012. I don't like it, but I understand why. We've actually done a lot of the things post-industrial and farm states are supposed to do: as a state we have invested more per capita in wind energy than anyone else, des moines attracted a lot of insurance industry jobs and has become a major hub for information tech, there was an ethanol boom in 2008-2010. All of it created some jobs, but everywhere outside of Des Moines job growth seems limited to the healthcare industry to take care of the state's aging populace. We have a very educated workforce, but not enough jobs for them. But Trump won't help. I expect some bad years if the EPA is gutted since we already have a problem with farm runoff contaminating rivers with too much pig poo poo and fertilizer that corporate farms just can't be assed to properly take care of. And God help all of our workers employed in the many plants rendering animals, where safety regulations are already very lax.
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Nov 11, 2016 13:30
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Venom Snake posted:He has made everyone in D.C. poo poo their pants in terror. People who I thought would never get their head out of the sand are begging progressives for salvation. Everyone with a D should be making GBS threads their pants. The Clinton/Cuomo/Tech axis hosed this up so badly there isn't going to be a party if we don't get our poo poo together and kick them out of the driver seat. Everyone with a R is fine, because Trump doesn't give a poo poo about governing or reform as long he gets attention and gets to rub it in the face of people who "wronged" him. That's why he basically told Mike "electroshock the gay away" Pence he could be shadow president, and why he already looks bored as gently caress two days in.
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Nov 11, 2016 13:36
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I got curious and decided to compare Presidential election results for my rural TN hometown: 2000 Gore: 4135, 53% Bush: 3525, 45% 2004 Kerry: 4147, 44% Bush: 5269, 55% 2008 Obama: 3372, 35% McCain: 6103, 64% 2012 Obama: 2765, 30% Romney: 6197, 69% 2016 Clinton: 1842, 19% Trump: 7657, 81%
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Nov 11, 2016 13:55
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Pathos posted:Venom Snake -- I posted this ages ago but I really really want as close to a definitive answer as possible: Why did Hillary pick Tim Kaine? Of all people? I get that he's a nice guy but... why? Just why? It was so safe and establishment and loving why? I talked to an acquaintance who worked on Hillary's campaign (which they also say was a disorganized mess that ignored communication and did not communicate. So now we have too inside sources who say the campaign was a sham and a mess.) And they say the general belief was that people like Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren, who would have really stirred people up, were active senators and popular incumbents and they did not want to remove them from office and risk their seats. Tim Kaine wasn't doing anything and he was boring but popular so... yeah. Double down on the boring to protect the few seats in the Senate they still hold. Whether this is just a cover and Hillary just loving hated the idea of socialists or near socialists being involved is probably not worth debating since she took 90% of Bernie's platform and made it her own. Maybe this was still crooked Hillary trying to do what she could to win but I am so tired of speculation and conspiracies and I'm willing to just believe my friend. Also thank you everyone for liking and quoting my long rear end effort post. I'm touched and honored. 
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Nov 11, 2016 14:04
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Criss post but holy poo poo Chuck Schumer is a fan of Son of Sam https://twitter.com/gdebenedetti/status/797054454201806848
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Nov 11, 2016 14:17
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Battle Royale Baby posted:Criss post but holy poo poo Chuck Schumer is a fan of Son of Sam chuck schumer is a rat, he knows when to bail to another ship
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Nov 11, 2016 14:20
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Terror Sweat posted:chuck schumer is a rat, he knows when to bail to another ship
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Nov 11, 2016 14:23
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anime was right posted:what countries have the best rural and semi-rural quality of life it's probably new Zealand. so uh bring back farms
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Nov 11, 2016 14:26
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Terror Sweat posted:chuck schumer is a rat, he knows when to bail to another ship I still want the head of Cuomo and all his shitstain allies. Tell me where to show up so we can start finding candidates.
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Nov 11, 2016 14:27
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Terror Sweat posted:chuck schumer is a rat, he knows when to bail to another ship I don't know much about him, but Seems like a good sign, if that's the way he thinks the wind is blowing
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Nov 11, 2016 14:26
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the more news about Hillary's campaign the better. I'm hearing it was full of kids of rich donors and paid little or nothing because none of the scions of wealth wanted for money. and the few paid positions paid way more to men than women
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Nov 11, 2016 14:28
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Jenner posted:Whether this is just a cover and Hillary just loving hated the idea of socialists or near socialists being involved is probably not worth debating since she took 90% of Bernie's platform and made it her own. Maybe this was still crooked Hillary trying to do what she could to win but I am so tired of speculation and conspiracies and I'm willing to just believe my friend. In order to make a platform your own, you have to actually campaign on it. Hillary didn't even campaign on her own original platform.
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Nov 11, 2016 14:32
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Bass Bottles posted:I don't know much about him, but The man's DNA is 75% weathervane. He'll be around forever because $NY_REASONS but probably useful as long as you keep the wind blowing in the right direction.
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Nov 11, 2016 14:33
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mastershakeman posted:the more news about Hillary's campaign the better. I'm hearing it was full of kids of rich donors and paid little or nothing because none of the scions of wealth wanted for money. and the few paid positions paid way more to men than women Wouldn't be surprised if this is how they staff the Clinton Foundation.
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Nov 11, 2016 14:34
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