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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. Hi, I lived on minimum wage and went to school for several years alone. I also grew up in rural Vermont 
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Nov 11, 2016 17:13
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mcmagic posted:How many of the Obama-Trump voters knew they were voting for the Ryan budget? lol Justin Trudeau.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:13
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Condiv posted:nope, both up front. trump promised economic aid, push for it and raise hell if he's not doing it or screwing blue colllar workers over. we need to both defend racial and social justice, but economic justice too or we're ceding part of the discussion to trump  Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. Also this, so much this. Confounding Factor posted:But these "racial divisions" are being used as a tool of the ruling class to cover over issues of class. The rural poor "white trash" have a lot in common with blacks. Like I said if you address the ideology that gives rise to these racial divisions by ending the underlying economic disparity, then issues of race will fall away. You don't change ideology within ideology without first seeing what supports it.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:14
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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. I still don't have a job paying real money because I work in the humanities. Incidentally, the job I was supposed to start this spring involves federal grants for archaeology and historic preservation in the face of impending climate change, which  are totally sure to continue under the wise and far-sighted new administration.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:16
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Condiv posted:nope, both up front. trump promised economic aid, push for it and raise hell if he's not doing it or screwing blue colllar workers over. we need to both defend racial and social justice, but economic justice too or we're ceding part of the discussion to trump I'm willing to agree, but god drat do we need to be careful about it. People are getting literally physically hurt out there right now and I as an individual would rather devote my energy 100% to stopping that right now than work on an economic message that resonates in the future. And Trump's economic message is going to collapse under its own weight. He's hamstrung by conservative ideologues in the House and Senate and will end up doing nothing but loving over those he won with his working class rhetoric. Democrats should obviously exploit that and work on communicating proposals that make working class families better.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:16
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Does anyone have any links to the crazy poo poo house Budget that Paul Ryan was pushing? I can't find a good dissection of it. I know it was super bad.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:17
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disjoe posted:But come 2020 (I'm not counting 2018 cause lol we're turbofucked) we need to amp up the economic message while not abandoning the minority community that we've been working with for years. If everyone who voted for Hillary Clinton votes in 2018 we will take back the senate and the house. That should be Chairman Ellison's mantra.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:18
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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. I agree. It doesn't help when that Dem base calls them uneducated unevolved neanderthals. Or basket of deplorables. The thing with working rural folk is that they are always loyal and vote.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:18
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One of my strongest continuing motivators to keep working with Bernie / OurRevolution is the loving utter abandonment of rural america we see under the rule of red legislatures. In my eyes, the vote of good people is co-opted on moral (abortion /gay) litmus issues then subsequently ignored once red legislators and governors rise to state power. I do not see it as a coincidence that the states with the hardest challenges concerning revenue, education, and infrastructure are overwhelmingly Republican.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:18
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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. It's because the right wing is convinced class war is a liberal dog whistle for race war.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:19
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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. I was born in rural Mississippi and now I live in one of the country's largest cities working on an advanced degree. My heart hurts for those people but it is really hard to reach out when both sides are at each other's throats and unable/unwilling to listen to the other side.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:19
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Crowsbeak posted:
Also said to not advocate waiting for social change because waiting only leads to being left behind again but whatever. Race is so deeply ingrained into the reality of american living that if you decide only class matters what is going to happen is these deep racial divisions and scars are going to effect the unity of this new coalition, like they always do.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:19
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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. There's a good article about it here. Basically, the New Dealers aged out and were replaced by the urban, college educated "Watergate Babies" who were closer to finance and big business. http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/10/how-democrats-killed-their-populist-soul/504710/ How Democrats Killed Their Populist Soul quote:The result today is a paradox. At the same time that the nation has achieved perhaps the most tolerant culture in U.S. history, the destruction of the anti-monopoly and anti-bank tradition in the Democratic Party has also cleared the way for the greatest concentration of economic power in a century. This is not what the Watergate Babies intended when they dethroned Patman as chairman of the Banking Committee. But it helped lead them down that path. The story of Patman’s ousting is part of the larger story of how the Democratic Party helped to create today’s shockingly disillusioned and sullen public, a large chunk of whom is now marching for Donald Trump.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:20
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PerniciousKnid posted:It's because the right wing is convinced class war is a liberal dog whistle for race war. Gosh, well they should read this thread, where good progressive goons can reassure them that, actually, race war is a distraction from class war Yes I know most people in here aren't saying that, but the fact that anyone is saying it at all dumbfounds me
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Nov 11, 2016 17:20
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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. Potato Salad posted:One of my strongest continuing motivators to keep working with Bernie / OurRevolution is the loving utter abandonment of rural america we see under the rule of red legislatures. Can you appreciate my frustration with red states at all? I have a brother in Kansas now, and since starting to follow their politics...  Education in trouble? Revenue down? Everyone, vote republican! We're going to cut education, destroy our revenue sources, fail to maintain our infrastructure, and to cap it off kill our state court and administrative bodies' abilities to protect consumers. That'll drive business. [Glances at coming $1/3 B deficit, hideous public education, and crippled infrastructure in Kansas four years later] 
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Nov 11, 2016 17:24
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How does this video make everyone here feel?  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XqEddipbpkw
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Nov 11, 2016 17:28
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People with press experience: are we just going to be completely in the dark once Trump throws the press out of the White House? He already banned reporters from covering large parts of his meeting with Obama. I'd toxx myself 100 times that any truthful media will have no access to the Trump administration. What on earth will this feel like? My guess is it will be Russia style, with Breitbart as the country's number one source of information and journalists that try to expose truth getting disappeared.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:28
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So I just read up on the "Path to Progress" and holy poo poo if Republicans push through their budget shits going to go south really fast.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:27
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CommieGIR posted:Poster in question donated to RAINN per the realigned toxx. Doesn't matter. Lowtax overruled the mod decision and said the Toxxers have to eat it no matter who they donate to.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:28
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Rakosi posted:How does this video make everyone here feel? We are all idiots.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:29
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Sharkopath posted:Also said to not advocate waiting for social change because waiting only leads to being left behind again but whatever. Obama managed to square this circle by talking economics while having a black skin. Other minority candidates can do the same.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:30
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Butch Cassidy posted:Because a large part of the Democratic base - particularly on this forum - went to university, moved to the city, got a job paying real money, and won't give those rural trailer dwellers the time of day. Sure. And middle-class Republicans just LOVE hanging out with unwashed yokels and their mangy dogs. They give them so much respect and treat them absolutely as equals. No, wait, they call them "white trash" and despise them.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:31
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Obama managed to square this circle by talking economics while having a black skin. Other minority candidates can do the same. Yeah I'm not saying its impossible or even unlikely to do both, I'm just describing why no war but class war is a flawed and kind of pithy statement. I want both and hope both but I just want to keep reiterating that this anxeity and fear of being left behind is a real concern for a lot of people and dudes posting that straight up its time to ignore you because you ~lost~ isn't really helping.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:31
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Rakosi posted:How does this video make everyone here feel? hubris.mov
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Nov 11, 2016 17:32
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mcmagic posted:We are all idiots. again, i say that i hate all you fuckers and you are all morons
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Nov 11, 2016 17:34
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Confounding Factor posted:I agree. It doesn't help when that Dem base calls them uneducated unevolved neanderthals. Or basket of deplorables. The thing with working rural folk is that they are always loyal and vote.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:34
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BarbarianElephant posted:Sure. And middle-class Republicans just LOVE hanging out with unwashed yokels and their mangy dogs. They give them so much respect and treat them absolutely as equals. No, wait, they call them "white trash" and despise them. you people really don't understand a drat thing do you how the gently caress are people like you who can't understand the poor the great hope of the left in this country
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Nov 11, 2016 17:35
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DACK FAYDEN posted:I really don't understand how everyone latched onto the phrase "basket of deplorables" and yet forgot the sentence immediately afterwards where she says it's half his supporters, not all, and the other half so on and so forth. When Trump speaks his mind bluntly and insults vast swathes of people, he's a straight talker. When Clinton does the same, she's beyond the pale. Funny that. Could it be because Clinton insulted white racists, and Trump insulted everyone else?
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Nov 11, 2016 17:34
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So, what do the people look like now? What does the majority of the country think? Are they angry and ready to push for change, or indulging in right-wing power and celebrating this development? What are we, now?
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Nov 11, 2016 17:36
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Confounding Factor posted:I get the protests over the racism, bigotry, sexism, etc. But when the gently caress are people going to wake up to the reality of class? There's been a class war brewing for sometime now and we are seeing the fruits of that with Trump winning the election. Why is talk of class so taboo in this country? When class has been brought up on this forum it's been shouted down as a distraction from, or mischaracterization of, racial injustice. Bernie got a bunch of poo poo for framing racial struggle in terms of class struggle. It doesn't satisfy people who are focused on racial justice.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:35
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disjoe posted:I'm willing to agree, but god drat do we need to be careful about it. People are getting literally physically hurt out there right now and I as an individual would rather devote my energy 100% to stopping that right now than work on an economic message that resonates in the future. It will collapse but then we better have someone to say,we have the message you want. Rather then no one. We need to both appeal to Patriotism, anti nazism, and peoples self interest. Sharkopath posted:Also said to not advocate waiting for social change because waiting only leads to being left behind again but whatever. Hey the DREAM act should be the cornerstone of the Dems it plays to patriotism. We should also take police brutality to cover all areas police are no different then the mob. Investigate corruption, every time someone no matter their race is shot without any justification by the thugs, call them out.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:36
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DACK FAYDEN posted:I really don't understand how everyone latched onto the phrase "basket of deplorables" and yet forgot the sentence immediately afterwards where she says it's half his supporters, not all, and the other half so on and so forth. The electorate, which includes most goons, has the collective memory, attention span, and reasoning capacity of a particularly concussed goldfish. That's why, apparently, it's all about the pathos.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:36
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mcmagic posted:We are all idiots. First they ignore you. Then they laugh at you. Then they fight you. Then you win. - Gandhi
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Nov 11, 2016 17:36
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Fitzy Fitz posted:When class has been brought up on this forum it's been shouted down as a distraction from, or mischaracterization of, racial injustice. Bernie got a bunch of poo poo for framing racial struggle in terms of class struggle. It doesn't satisfy people who are focused on racial justice. This is the tragedy here. Racial struggle and class struggle are intertwined, now and forever. We've only now been forcefully taught this question.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:36
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corn in the bible posted:you people really don't understand a drat thing do you Your point? My point was that middle class conservatives treat the white poor like poo poo. Middle class liberals treat them like poo poo. Yet, they love the former and despise the latter. I wonder why? At least the liberals offer to help them, even if they don't to hang out with them socially. Conservatives are happy to see them die of preventable diseases.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:37
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Punk Music and Horror Films are going to be really great at least for the next 4 years 
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Nov 11, 2016 17:37
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I'm stepping back for a second and taking a top-down view of the sheer volume of acrobatics and justifications and blaming being flung around for what was ultimately the selection of a party whose platform includes the revocation of human rights.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:37
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Chaos Personified posted:Except doing that has led to the democrats having literally zero power to fix those issues of racism and inequality. Just because black people are just as dumb as white people doesn't mean working towards social progress should be abandoned in favor of feeling good about yourself at those who disagree. If not openly courting the African American vote can get the Democrats into power where they can then put those policies promoting equality into action, black people would still be better off. Silent action is better than screaming inaction and the dems need to take a serious look at how they have been messaging themselves into oblivion. The right and correct thing to do is simply to continue to advocate for racial justice and civil rights, and start paying attention to economic justice and class issues beyond paying lip service to it just enough to get the working and middle class to vote for you in enough numbers to squeak out a win. The next time Wall St bankers overleverage and torpedo the economy we need to throw them in jail, seize all their assets, and use the proceeds to pay off everyone's mortgage. Like we should have done in 2009.
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Nov 11, 2016 17:39
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remember how jimmy carter got elected on the labor vote and then abandoned them
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Nov 11, 2016 17:39
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BarbarianElephant posted:Your point? Describe to me, with examples and detail in policy, the poo poo treatment given. E- im retarded and misread your post. Potato Salad fucked around with this message at 17:40 on Nov 11, 2016 |
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Nov 11, 2016 17:38
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