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Cuntpunch posted:Upset dems screaming about the electoral college being unfair, based on the idea that the majority should rule. Women are a majority of the country and I'd rather see another female candidate than a second Bernie run. Minorities are also a much larger part of the Democratic Party, and it makes sense for them to lead the Democratic Party. If you want to be ruled by straight white people forever, that's your choice. readingatwork posted:The saddest part is that the boring middle of the road candidate could have won if she wasn't such an obvious corporate phony. Yes, agree with the Trump supporter. This will help our legitimacy with minorities. Lightning Knight fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Nov 13, 2016 |
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Nov 13, 2016 23:11
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Covok posted:Then, who stands to take up America's reigns, serious question? I can't see America keeping the power and influence it has now with a government fighting itself and pushing for more isolationist policies. They both explicitly want to lock us off and they can't efficiently manage power abroad. Inexperience in foreign dealings means that almost every nation will get one up on us in dealings. Nobody. If the US drops out hard like you're predicting it'll go back to strong regional powers bucking for influence over other nations in their sphere of influence. With climate change expect poo poo to get real bad as regional production centers shift around while people starve to death.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:12
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Covok posted:Then, who stands to take up America's reigns, serious question? I can't see America keeping the power and influence it has now with a government fighting itself and pushing for more isolationist policies. They both explicitly want to lock us off and they can't efficiently manage power abroad. Inexperience in foreign dealings means that almost every nation will get one up on us in dealings. I think it just depends on where we are four years from now. The damage from Trump is going to be huge but potentially reversible if the people reject him. Otherwise I'm not really sure what the next superpower will be. I think the US will still be the world's biggest power after China's economy tanks and fucks over most of the world, but in a weaker form than it used to be pre-Trump
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Nov 13, 2016 23:13
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Fojar38 posted:lol way to buy into the "China Rising" myth. China's facing a much more dire crisis than the US is. It's very hard to maintain power when your entire government is fighting itself. Maintaining governance over a landmass as big as the US is hard as it is, keeping foreign ties strong while suffering internal strife seems a serious limitation.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:13
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Covok posted:Then, who stands to take up America's reigns, serious question? No one. Global growth is almost certainly going to remain slow for the foreseeable future, but the US is going to stay on top of the pile no matter how badly we gently caress up our government or how many of our citizens are excluded from the benefits of our economic strength.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:13
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Hollismason posted:With China its probably going to be business as usual.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:14
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Lightning Knight posted:Yes, agree with the Trump supporter. This will help our legitimacy with minorities. Hillary was literally bought and paid for by the very entity that is responsible for the rise in inequality the past 50 years.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:15
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E: Misread.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:15
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Covok posted:It's very hard to maintain power when your entire government is fighting itself. Maintaining governance over a landmass as big as the US is hard as it is, keeping foreign ties strong while suffering internal strife seems a serious limitation. Remember when the USSR won the Cold War because of the Civil Rights movement causing so much strife?
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Nov 13, 2016 23:15
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Mahoning posted:Hillary was literally bought and paid for by the very entity that is responsible for the rise in inequality the past 50 years. Ok? She still didn't steal the primary and it still isn't a good idea to sit here and nod your head sagely at rear end in a top hat Trump supporters scoring sick burns on progressives and liberals. They aren't our friends.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:16
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Covok posted:Rational prediction for the next 8 years in response to likely inefficiency in government, foreign policy, and domestic issues: America falls out of superpower status and loses almost all foreign influence to China, falling into irrelevancy and eventually bending a knee to China. China becomes the new "America" for the foreseeable future. Good luck when their government is more hosed than ours.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:16
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Covok posted:It's very hard to maintain power when your entire government is fighting itself. Maintaining governance over a landmass as big as the US is hard as it is, keeping foreign ties strong while suffering internal strife seems a serious limitation. What makes you think that China is any more apt to rule over an equally large landmass? Just the fact that their internal strife is hidden?
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Nov 13, 2016 23:16
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Covok posted:Then, who stands to take up America's reigns, serious question? Multipolarity is the future.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:16
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As long as we don't default on our debt we will almost certainly remain a global superpower. And with Republicans in power they'll miraculously stop caring about debt now anyway.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:17
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Accretionist posted:Multipolarity is the future. No it isn't. Trump or no Trump there is no other country even close to challenging the US in any sphere of power or influence.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:17
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Lightning Knight posted:Ok? She still didn't steal the primary and it still isn't a good idea to sit here and nod your head sagely at rear end in a top hat Trump supporters scoring sick burns on progressives and liberals. They aren't our friends. Many of the Trump supporters who (fairly) lobbed those criticisms at Hillary voted for Obama twice. 
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Nov 13, 2016 23:17
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Accretionist posted:Multipolarity is the future. This is highly unlikely barring an attempt at California or New England secession. We're still 50% of the world's military spending and the only ones with a credible navy and power projection. The Russians are a paper tiger militarily and the Chinese are riding the razor thin line of economic collapse, while the European Union crumbles to fascist nativism.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:18
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Fojar38 posted:No it isn't. Trump or no Trump there is no other country even close to challenging the US in any sphere of power or influence. It's really hard to overstate what a massive structural economic advantage the US has over the rest of the world. The economy of the entire EU is now smaller than the US economy despite the US only having around 2/3 of the EU's population.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:18
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Fojar38 posted:Remember when the USSR won the Cold War because of the Civil Rights movement causing so much strife? Well, I wasn't even sperm yet when that happened. Though, half of my genetic code was an egg...nah, sorry, I don't remember. HorseRenoir posted:I think it just depends on where we are four years from now. The damage from Trump is going to be huge but potentially reversible if the people reject him. Otherwise I'm not really sure what the next superpower will be. I think the US will still be the world's biggest power after China's economy tanks and fucks over most of the world, but in a weaker form than it used to be pre-Trump Paradoxish posted:No one. Global growth is almost certainly going to remain slow for the foreseeable future, but the US is going to stay on top of the pile no matter how badly we gently caress up our government or how many of our citizens are excluded from the benefits of our economic strength. I guess this is probably the most rational prediction of where we stand in 4 to 8 years, but I can't help but feel its optimistic. When the strongest nation on the world puts an idiot in charge and surrounds himself with idiots that elect other idiots then all the idiots hate each other and fight each other, it's hard not to think that someone takes advantage of this weakness. But, I suppose that requires the other countries to be in a place to capitalize on it.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:19
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Lightning Knight posted:Yes, agree with the Trump supporter. This will help our legitimacy with minorities. A lot of Dems didn't turn out to vote for Hillary, wonder if it was because they didn't think Hillary would do anything for them... Meanwhile trump was promising every one their blue collar jobs back I can't imagine why trump won.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:19
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steinrokkan posted:What makes you think that China is any more apt to rule over an equally large landmass? Just the fact that their internal strife is hidden? To be honest, the fact I don't know what internal strife you're all referring to probably has a lot to do with it. I frankly know very little of Chinese politics other than the occasional story of a person being silenced for subversive dialogue/actions.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:20
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Fojar38 posted:No it isn't. Trump or no Trump there is no other country even close to challenging the US in any sphere of power or influence. Yeah, I don't expect Trump or Bannon or whatever scumfucking weaseldick they get to oppose a powerful US military/trade position. Trump isn't gonna shut TPP or any other absurdly unbalanced trade agreement down because it benefits US interests to a huge degree.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:20
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Lightning Knight posted:European Union crumbles to fascist nativism. You know we did kinda just elect a fascist nativist
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Nov 13, 2016 23:20
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My Linux Rig posted:A lot of Dems didn't turn out to vote for Hillary, wonder if it was because they didn't think Hillary would do anything for them... He also ran on hatred of immigrants and national stop and frisk and was endorsed by the KKK. Please, educate me on why he won.  You're going to be sorely disappointed when your orange god doesn't give a drat about anything he campaigned on. He's already appointing bank CEOs to Cabinet positions. Hillary would've been better at this poo poo than him and she made speeches to banks for a living.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:20
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Covok posted:To be honest, the fact I don't know what internal strife you're all referring to probably has a lot to do with it. I frankly know very little of Chinese politics other than the occasional story of a person being silenced for subversive dialogue/actions. The media has been hyping up China since like 2006 so I don't blame you. But it's a paper tiger who is currently in economic freefall. The "Chinese Century" is a myth.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:22
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Night10194 posted:You know we did kinda just elect a fascist nativist Yeah but there's a whole government behind him that will maintain American military superiority for their own power and profit. The European Union doesn't have the structural integrity to deal with the wave of populist fascism hitting it right now unless they do something drastic.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:22
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Lightning Knight posted:Yes, agree with the Trump supporter. This will help our legitimacy with minorities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
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Nov 13, 2016 23:22
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My Linux Rig posted:A lot of Dems didn't turn out to vote for Hillary, wonder if it was because they didn't think Hillary would do anything for them... I haven't seen any proof to suggest that traditional Dem voters went for Trump in any significant numbers. Trump's numbers were lower than both Romney's and McCain's, it just turned out that Clinton's numbers were even lower still. What I suspect happened is that Dem turnout was suppressed by a combination of apathy over the candidate, systematic voter suppression, and feelings that Trump's campaign was already toast. Enough people protested by staying home when they thought that Trump was for-sure going to lose, and then Trump won.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:22
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Multipolarity won't happen as long as Europe is happy to keep herself attached to America. Even the CSFP with its distant aim of an European army is aimed squarely at creating a partner for the US in the NATO, not as an independent pole in geopolitics. At most there will be a more explicit shift to Atlanticism as compared to a sole US dominance. Economically the Atlantic system is also as strong as it ever was.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:22
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Also what kind of Chief of Staff is Reince Preibus probably going to be?
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Nov 13, 2016 23:23
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My Linux Rig posted:A lot of Dems didn't turn out to vote for Hillary, wonder if it was because they didn't think Hillary would do anything for them... Ding ding ding! Honestly everyone should tape an Electoral College map to their monitors and look at it before every post. A lot of people ITT talking about a lot of the same big picture nonsense that lost this election. How about we focus on the big picture AFTER there's a Democrat back in the White House and not before.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:23
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"Poster is smug about supporting and voting for a racist" is material to the discussion, not a deflection, hth.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:23
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Fojar38 posted:The media has been hyping up China since like 2006 so I don't blame you. But it's a paper tiger who is currently in economic freefall. The "Chinese Century" is a myth. What nations are even doing well then, currently? It sounds like everyone is in deep poo poo.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:25
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Covok posted:I guess this is probably the most rational prediction of where we stand in 4 to 8 years, but I can't help but feel its optimistic. When the strongest nation on the world puts an idiot in charge and surrounds himself with idiots that elect other idiots then all the idiots hate each other and fight each other, it's hard not to think that someone takes advantage of this weakness. But, I suppose that requires the other countries to be in a place to capitalize on it. The thing is that you're starting from the fundamentally flawed assumption that countries have complete control over their economic fortunes. The US has natural advantages and economic inertia on its side. If we continue to actively gently caress things up for the next century then yeah, sure, eventually someone else will step in. This isn't something that's going to happen within our lifetimes barring some real catastrophic poo poo, though. edit- quote:What nations are even doing well then, currently? It sounds like everyone is in deep poo poo. We are. The US is literally considered the golden child of the world economy at the moment because our economy is at least functioning.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:25
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Grouchio posted:Also what kind of Chief of Staff is Reince Preibus probably going to be? Not a sober one.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:25
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QuarkJets posted:I haven't seen any proof to suggest that traditional Dem voters went for Trump in any significant numbers. Trump's numbers were lower than both Romney's and McCain's, it just turned out that Clinton's numbers were even lower still. It only happened in like 3 or 4 states. Stop looking at nationwide exit polls. Jesus Christ.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:26
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Mahoning posted:Ding ding ding! You're quoting a poster who sunk a ton of money into the already-known-to-be-bankrupt Mt Gox bitcoin exchange while they were in the processing of closing their doors completely, and he still clings to this as being a good decision. Let that sink in for a moment
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Nov 13, 2016 23:26
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Paradoxish posted:The thing is that you're starting from the fundamentally flawed assumption that countries have complete control over their economic fortunes. The US has natural advantages and economic inertia on its side. If we continue to actively gently caress things up for the next century then yeah, sure, eventually someone else will step in. This isn't something that's going to happen within our lifetimes barring some real catastrophic poo poo, though. Okay, at the risk of annoying y'all with questions, why is everyone else doing so bad and we're doing so good?
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Nov 13, 2016 23:27
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Covok posted:What nations are even doing well then, currently? It sounds like everyone is in deep poo poo. Right now? Us. In a year? Nobody. You should be afraid. We hosed up big time.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:27
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Grouchio posted:Also what kind of Chief of Staff is Reince Preibus probably going to be? One having constant gladiatorial combats with the white nationalist chief strategist while an orange golem cackles about making them fight.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:27
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