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Covok posted:Anyone want to talk about Bannon, a literal anti-semmite, being announced as Chief Strategist and Senior Counselor? Don't know if this is the scariest thing I've heard recently or not. And there are other serious contenders.
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Nov 13, 2016 23:59
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"It is incredibly tone-deaf to promote anti-racist policies now that we've voted a racist authoritarian into office who might threaten me, a white voter. You can still care about these issues of course, but for the love of God stop displaying minorities! We need to combat the actual danger, the one that threatens white people!"
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Nov 14, 2016 00:01
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Lightning Knight posted:I love that this is consistently the butthurt message you get out of this. "Please, white dudes, listen to minorities and help them gain leadership positions" Actually wasn't it more like "White dudes need to sit down and shut the gently caress up"? I'm not arguing your overall point, but when it was literally conveyed in a hostile way, you can't expect people to listen.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:02
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Mahoning posted:Actually wasn't it more like "White dudes need to sit down and shut the gently caress up"?
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Nov 14, 2016 00:04
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Mahoning posted:Hillary was literally bought and paid for by the very entity that is responsible for the rise in inequality the past 50 years. Nah.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:04
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Mahoning posted:Actually wasn't it more like "White dudes need to sit down and shut the gently caress up"? Alright. I lack the energy or will to argue with a group of white progressives about why they should embrace minority candidates. You win. I'm sorry I offended you. Please all fight over who gets to be Assistant Chair of the Democratic Party of Wyoming.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:05
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Mahoning posted:Actually wasn't it more like "White dudes need to sit down and shut the gently caress up"? What?? People don't seem to like it when you're hostile to them??
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Nov 14, 2016 00:05
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botany posted:"It is incredibly tone-deaf to promote anti-racist policies now that we've voted a racist authoritarian into office who might threaten me, a white voter. You can still care about these issues of course, but for the love of God stop displaying minorities! We need to combat the actual danger, the one that threatens white people!" Anti-racism's great. Treating anti-poverty as the inherent enemy is not. Treating tokenism as an inherent good is not. Commitment to fractious infighting is not. Edit: You don't think it's a problem to directly state that unless you're as-or-more committed to social justice than economic issues you need to get the gently caress out? That we need to stop any more white men from reaching positions of leadership? That's absolutely not the same thing as saying we should prioritize social justice over economic justice, and absolutely not the same thing as saying we need more minorities and women in positions of power.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:06
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Lightning Knight posted:I love that this is consistently the butthurt message you get out of this. "Please, white dudes, listen to minorities and help them gain leadership positions" has become "white straight men are banned from politics, you can never run for anything." We need hundreds of congresspeople, of course some of them are gonna be white dudes. We need thousands of leaders in the party, and some of them will be white dudes too. All I want is to not have another procession of fifty white dudes for President while we promise minorities we swear we care about you please vote for us. Why is that so much to ask? Because you didn't ask that. If what you meant to say was to ask white progressives to support progressives of all races and genders that is a great thing to ask! You would also get broad support and not get to feel as edgy as you do when you tell people to "sit down and shut up". If you let your need to feel like a Billy Badass compromise your message, don't blame people for responding to what you said rather than what you meant. Be a loving adult and articulate better. But if four years from now Bernie is still the right guy for the job (unlikely, but possible) then he should obviously run and progressives shouldn't withhold their support just because it's 2020 and Jewish people aren't minority enough anymore.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:06
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@lightning knight. Here's how it works. Yes we should have strong non white men in leadership. Note hoe I said strong. So Keith Ellison leading the DNC is fine, someone like Corey, no. What matters is can they animate all the potential supporters out there, or do we get another HRC. If this is to hard to understand I don't know what to tell you.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:06
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WTF is "chief strategist and senior counsel", Trump keeps inventing these positions to give to Bannon (like campaign CEO) and I have no idea why - is it to placate him without giving him too much authority, or the opposite where he has more power than people expect without the scrutiny associated with a more traditional post like chief of staff?
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Nov 14, 2016 00:06
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loving buy avatars. It's impossible to follow all these anonymous hillarailures.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:07
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Roman Reigns posted:Don't know if this is the scariest thing I've heard recently or not. And there are other serious contenders. The scariest thing is the fact that the Republicans need to gain control of 5 more state legislatures to get a 3/4 majority, which would allow them to pass constitutional amendments without legal resistance. There are currently 5 states with legislative bodies split between the upper and lower house.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:08
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Covok posted:Anyone want to talk about Bannon, a literal anti-semmite, being announced as Chief Strategist and Senior Counselor? It's getting traction on mainstream Twitter, it's pretty loving terrifying. https://twitter.com/igorvolsky/status/797913826746171392 https://twitter.com/Hadas_Gold/status/797926726617567232 https://twitter.com/Hadas_Gold/status/797929444270714880 https://twitter.com/speechboy71/status/797927588530421761
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Nov 14, 2016 00:08
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Lightning Knight posted:Alright. I lack the energy or will to argue with a group of white progressives about why they should embrace minority candidates. You win. I'm sorry I offended you. Please all fight over who gets to be Assistant Chair of the Democratic Party of Wyoming. How big a backhoe did it take to uproot those goal posts and move them? For your sake I hope the driver was a PoC.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:08
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zegermans posted:WTF is "chief strategist and senior counsel", Trump keeps inventing these positions to give to Bannon (like campaign CEO) and I have no idea why - is it to placate him without giving him too much authority, or the opposite where he has more power than people expect without the scrutiny associated with a more traditional post like chief of staff? it's the second most powerful position in the white house behind chief of staff
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Nov 14, 2016 00:08
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Coheed and Camembert posted:It's getting traction on mainstream Twitter.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:08
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Mr. Belding posted:Because you didn't ask that. If what you meant to say was to ask white progressives to support progressives of all races and genders that is a great thing to ask! You would also get broad support and not get to feel as edgy as you do when you tell people to "sit down and shut up". If you let your need to feel like a Billy Badass compromise your message, don't blame people for responding to what you said rather than what you meant. Be a loving adult and articulate better. Accuses me of not being enough of an adult, is offended because I swore at a generic you that you've decided meant personally you and only you. Good job bro. Bernie won't be the right guy for the job in four years because he's going to be hella old as gently caress. I'd be amazed if he wants to go through this poo poo again. Crowsbeak posted:@lightning knight. Here's how it works. Yes we should have strong non white men in leadership. Note hoe I said strong. So Keith Ellison leading the DNC is fine, someone like Corey, no. What matters is can they animate all the potential supporters out there, or do we get another HRC. If this is to hard to understand I don't know what to tell you. I'm not sure why you think this is a point that was necessary to inform me of considering I've already brought up Cory Booker as "a dude we probably shouldn't run." Though frankly I bet Cory Booker could mop the floor with Donald Trump. Man has charisma.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:08
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Trump isn't going to enact any legislature that keeps him from making more money.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:08
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zegermans posted:WTF is "chief strategist and senior counsel", Trump keeps inventing these positions to give to Bannon (like campaign CEO) and I have no idea why - is it to placate him without giving him too much authority, or the opposite where he has more power than people expect without the scrutiny associated with a more traditional post like chief of staff? I think it's a traditional position? Or at least analogous to one. Anyway the amount of power some of these posts wield probably varies from administration to administration, but the dude ran his campaign. It's a loving horror show.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:09
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zegermans posted:WTF is "chief strategist and senior counsel", Trump keeps inventing these positions to give to Bannon (like campaign CEO) and I have no idea why - is it to placate him without giving him too much authority, or the opposite where he has more power than people expect without the scrutiny associated with a more traditional post like chief of staff? Expect a lot more like that so all his campaign buddies get a nice title and a steady paycheck. Trump will probably have two cabinets, the "real" one filled with establishment types like Pubis and the real one filled with campaign buddies and sycophants like Bannon. Republicans fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 00:10
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Zikan posted:it's the second most powerful position in the white house behind chief of staff In any other administration than Trumps that would be about a 100% sure bet. But this is Trump's administration. Everyone is prob going to be out for themselves and Bannon could get sidelined easily.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:10
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Lightning Knight posted:So run a straight white male, or we won't sweep the elections. Got it. Who is Barack Obama again? This isn't what I said. I'm just criticizing you for acting like displays of gender and racial equality matter to most people. Its a gamble and it can backfire if you aren't careful. I'm not against a minority candidate at all but the left needs to be careful of the very real prejudices America still has. The left tends to be very egalitarian in their worldview and that's good but it does prevent them from properly analyzing their candidate. I'm advocating for caution, to not say "we need a minority candidate", because you aren't used to seeing in a prejudiced way. That's all.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:11
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:This will surely be the end of Trump's campaign. I know, and nothing matters. It's just infinitely depressing to me, I can only hope someone's feet are held to the fire or it enrages Dems or independents to do something. https://twitter.com/sparksjls/status/797921796796403720
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Nov 14, 2016 00:11
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Telephones posted:This isn't what I said. I'm just criticizing you for acting like displays of gender and racial equality matter to most people. Its a gamble and it can backfire if you aren't careful. I'm not against a minority candidate at all but the left needs to be careful of the very real prejudices America still has. The left tends to be very egalitarian in their worldview and that's good but it does prevent them from properly analyzing their candidate. I'm advocating for caution, to not say "we need a minority candidate", because you aren't used to seeing in a prejudiced way. That's all. I mean I comprehend this. I think more than anything the lesson of this election is "if your candidate is the best at bullshitting he will win." Obama was a master class bullshitter. If we run a minority candidate and they have the charisma and public speaking ability, they will win, assuming they also have a good record to run on or at least not a bad one to hobble them.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:12
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botany posted:"It is incredibly tone-deaf to promote anti-racist policies now that we've voted a racist authoritarian into office who might threaten me, a white voter. You can still care about these issues of course, but for the love of God stop displaying minorities! We need to combat the actual danger, the one that threatens white people!" I don't even have the energy anymore. Why would you even think that simply putting a minority in a position of power will be enough to fight racist policies? Hell, why would you think an establishment democrat would be enough to achieve this?
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Nov 14, 2016 00:13
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Internet Kraken posted:Trump isn't going to enact any legislature that keeps him from making more money. What's good for Trump is good for the country. Is there any more room on the Jill Stein bony boat? I feel like sailing off the edge of the map.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:13
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Covok posted:Anyone want to talk about Bannon, a literal anti-semmite, being announced as Chief Strategist and Senior Counselor? Bannon also has is very friendly with the European far-right. I think Trump is trying to balance his staff between his Russophilic/far-right inter-circle (Bannon/Flynn) and the rest of the GOP (Priebus). I think Trump's administration may actually be one of the most far-right (maybe the most) in the West since Franco/Pinochet.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:13
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Zikan posted:it's the second most powerful position in the white house behind chief of staff Oh, my bad. I had never really heard of it.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:14
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the popes toes posted:What's good for Trump is good for the country. Watch Trump appoint Stein as head of the FCC.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:14
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The left needs to re-invent the position of Advocatus Diaboli to get anything done. Without it people will just get bogged down in moral arguments over purely technocratic proposals.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:15
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Judakel posted:I don't even have the energy anymore. Why would you even think that simply putting a minority in a position of power will be enough to fight racist policies? Hell, why would you think an establishment democrat would be enough to achieve this? That's never been the argument. The argument - and there was a reason for choosing minority candidates besides inclusiveness, if you had read - was that minority candidates project an image that we care about minority issues and just because we're talking about class doesn't mean we won't care about race too. Or LGBT issues or women or what have you. Obama wasn't a great candidate on race issues, but that projection is important because part of Bernie's problem was a difficult appealing broadly to older minorities who rightfully distrust white progressives.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:15
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why don't you run a cuban guy
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Nov 14, 2016 00:15
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haha gently caress do you remember when julian castro was a rising star
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Nov 14, 2016 00:16
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corn in the bible posted:haha gently caress do you remember when julian castro was a rising star rip career...? What happened to him? I could probably get behind the candidacy of that guy who was Obama's Secretary of Labor whose name I cannot recall. He'd have mad cred with unions.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:17
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Mahoning posted:So you're willing to say that the people who predicted this would happen, and why it would happen, are full of poo poo and you know better because you don't believe that the people of a certain region might have a completely different life experience and world view than the rest of the Democratic Party? Nope. Go back and re-read what I wrote I'm not saying that they're definitely wrong. I'm saying that we don't currently have enough information to know either way. All of the speculation that I have seen so far, including yours, is based on comparing total turnout (by district or by state) without actually looking at who was voting for whom, which is the actual question that needs answering. An appeal to authority doesn't change that.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:17
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Lightning Knight posted:That's never been the argument. The argument - and there was a reason for choosing minority candidates besides inclusiveness, if you had read - was that minority candidates project an image that we care about minority issues and just because we're talking about class doesn't mean we won't care about race too. Or LGBT issues or women or what have you. Obama wasn't a great candidate on race issues, but that projection is important because part of Bernie's problem was a difficult appealing broadly to older minorities who rightfully distrust white progressives. Isn't running on image alone what we've been criticizing Trump for? What is needed is a convinced minority activist, with a touch for general administration. Without it, the Democrats will lose all their credibility AGAIN.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:17
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Lightning Knight posted:That's never been the argument. The argument - and there was a reason for choosing minority candidates besides inclusiveness, if you had read - was that minority candidates project an image that we care about minority issues and just because we're talking about class doesn't mean we won't care about race too. Or LGBT issues or women or what have you. Obama wasn't a great candidate on race issues, but that projection is important because part of Bernie's problem was a difficult appealing broadly to older minorities who rightfully distrust white progressives. I did miss that part. My apologies. I will seize on this moment to point out how stupid it is to think we have to worry about minorities not turning out for democrats based on image rather than substance. Thank you for this opportunity.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:18
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Apropos nothing, this is how CNN introduced John loving Yoo into a story:quote:John Yoo, a Berkeley Law professor and scholar at the conservative American Enterprise Institute, got a warm reception from the crowd by cracking about the closeness.
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Nov 14, 2016 00:18
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https://twitter.com/random_eddie/status/797884737800970240
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Nov 14, 2016 00:20
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