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So like, hypothetically, where is the best place to be while this all goes down from now to like 150 years from now? Also tfr goons: where are your compounds located, what kind of guns should i be stocking up on and stuff?
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Nov 14, 2016 08:32
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Feral Integral posted:So like, hypothetically, where is the best place to be while this all goes down from now to like 150 years from now? Canada.
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Nov 14, 2016 11:49
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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Hello Sailor posted:Yeah, I think he's off the mark. The NSIDC graphs for arctic and antarctic sea ice don't match his at all. The comparable graph on the NSIDC site says its data is from Cryoshpere Today, but their site does not appear to have that chart (though there is one that shows the same data but non-overlaid), and their data seem to stop updating early this year. I can't tell from any of the sites, but it does look like the source of the chart in question uses a different definition of "sea ice extent", such as "25% sea ice" rather than "15% sea ice", for example.
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Nov 14, 2016 11:59
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What exactly is this apocalypse supposed to look like? People keep loosing their poo poo in this thread and you wonder if they're invisaging zombies or locusts or 25/7/365 rain but there's never anything specific. I've read stuff from weather and climate getting more extreme and sea levels rising so farming and living in the same places gets harder to someone saying the composition of the atmosphere could suddenly change and we'll all suffocate. Can someone go over what the various results of the worst case scenario are likely to be, if there's any certainty?
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Nov 14, 2016 12:17
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The biggest impact that I, a stupid lay person, can think of is the overwhelming inland migration that'll result from sea level rise. It'll be a slow motion disaster unfolding over the next two decades (or less, depending on how the next few years go...) as people's homes are inevitably subsumed by the rising tides. Barring the odd rich enclave that manages to Venice their way out of it, most coastal communities are completely loving doomed. If it doesn't go down in history as The Great Migration, I'll be pretty surprised.
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Nov 14, 2016 12:24
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Surprise Giraffe posted:What exactly is this apocalypse supposed to look like? People keep loosing their poo poo in this thread and you wonder if they're invisaging zombies or locusts or 25/7/365 rain but there's never anything specific. I've read stuff from weather and climate getting more extreme and sea levels rising so farming and living in the same places gets harder to someone saying the composition of the atmosphere could suddenly change and we'll all suffocate. Can someone go over what the various results of the worst case scenario are likely to be, if there's any certainty? regrettably, the apocalypse that we signed on for is a slow burn. no glorious firestorm of nuclear destruction here, just a snowballing, gradual degradation of what makes civilization function. we'll start off mild with more extreme weather like hurricanes and heat waves. susceptible areas to these meteorological events will become less and less inhabitable without serious engineering efforts. people will realize that actually we can't live in those places anymore, and as detailed earlier, we got a whole lot of people seeking higher, cooler ground. this part is kind of exciting because the ensuing wars and civil unrest might just put us out of our misery if they escalate enough. if not, sea levels continue to rise, agriculture becomes ridiculously difficult because of less arable land and rising temperatures, starvation ensues on a global scale, and whoever is left gets to live out their anarcho-primitivist fantasies in a world that is post-industrial in the most final sense. existentially, there's not that much to worry about. the species will continue, and adapt to new conditions, which is a lot more than we can say for, well, most other life in earth's biosphere right now. standard of living will plummet, of course, and whatever highflying dreams of space exploration and colonization we had effectively died in 2015. billions of people will die, too, but it's not like our monkey brains can really process that anyway. as end of the world scenarios go, it's honestly quite mundane, and to make it even better, we have a few decades to emotionally prepare ourselves or maybe put together a sweet survival bunker in the backyard. yeah it kind of sucks that it could have been avoided if greed was not the overriding motivation of human activity but at least it's not like a global epidemic of mega-ebola. that would just be undignified.
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Nov 14, 2016 12:53
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Feral Integral posted:So like, hypothetically, where is the best place to be while this all goes down from now to like 150 years from now? Learn the ins and outs of your friend the ak pattern rifle.
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Nov 14, 2016 13:09
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Feral Integral posted:So like, hypothetically, where is the best place to be while this all goes down from now to like 150 years from now? The entire great lakes region will do relatively well, assuming they stop building housing developments over all the best farmland (they won't). Chicago and Toronto may well become North America's dominant cities.
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Nov 14, 2016 13:30
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Hello Sailor posted:Yeah, I think he's off the mark. The NSIDC graphs for arctic and antarctic sea ice don't match his at all. Seriously? They are measuring two different things. It is even in most of the simple FAQs! http://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/faq/#area_extent Fansy posted:Can we talk about denialists on the other side for a moment, "NTHE" facebook support groups and 2030 doomsday quacks like Guy McPherson - who does a lot of self promotion for a guy who only has a decade or so to live. I think people who rip into people who are 'doomsday' really need to understand better the physical processes, difficulties in making RCP predictions, and even simple things like how much energy is accumulating in the Earth. People who think Paris is good or MoUs are some progress really need to read actual studies (not just graphs) and try a few modeling exercises to understand how bad the situation is. Probably McPherson sends the wrong message but my own feeling is that generally activities are on the wrong side of optimism here.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:11
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I've been in borderline hysterics for a while now and it only seems to be getting worse. Please, can people spread this info around, especially to celebrities and people with a lot of followers? Not just the arctic ice thing but the consequences and how the govt won't withstand it. Nobody I've seen is discussing this and I don't think anyone realizes how dire things are right now, if it became part of the conversation maybe we could take more drastic action. This needs a big loving news story to get people motivated.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:22
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Uncle Jam posted:I think people who rip into people who are 'doomsday' really need to understand better the physical processes, difficulties in making RCP predictions, and even simple things like how much energy is accumulating in the Earth. People who think Paris is good or MoUs are some progress really need to read actual studies (not just graphs) and try a few modeling exercises to understand how bad the situation is. I understand how dire the problem is. That's precisely why the doomsdayers are cowards. This is a fight over every tenth of a degree, because the impacts of each cumulative one are enormous and unspeakably horrendous. You don't get to unplug and and refuse responsibility to future generations, to the developing world, and to the rest of life on this planet because it requires a little hard work. Imagine looking your friends and family in the eye 50 years from now and trying to explain that you were too cynical or too lazy to do anything. If Paris spares the world of even a tenth of a degree, it needs your vocal and unwavering support (while you then go back to working even harder on the next thing that will matter even more). Because even a tenth of a degree is progress. Even a tenth of a degree is a win.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:23
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So to sum up the future - "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold". Dazzling Addar described a very likely scenario with a long descent, in which human cultures shaed many layers of complexity and unfortunately also many citizens during several centuries. What to do now? I'm personally a big fan of John Michael Greer, who wrote several books about this stuff. I think that of his books - "green wizardry" - is especiylly interesting for those of us asking how to prepare themelves. What is a Green Wizard? "One of the things the soon-to-be-deindustrializing world most needs just now is green wizards. By this I mean individuals who are willing to take on the responsibility to learn, practice, and thoroughly master a set of unpopular but valuable skills – the skills of the old appropriate tech movement – and share them with their neighbors when the day comes that their neighbors are willing to learn. This is not a subject where armchair theorizing counts for much – as every wizard’s apprentice learns sooner rather than later, what you really know is measured by what you’ve actually done – and it’s probably not going to earn anyone a living any time soon, either, though it can help almost anyone make whatever living they earn go a great deal further than it might otherwise go. Nor, again, will it prevent the unraveling of the industrial age and the coming of a harsh new world; what it can do, if enough people seize the opportunity, is make the rough road to that new world more bearable than it will otherwise be." -- John Michael Greer, The Archdruid Report So 1)search a few skills and trades which will be useful in a deindisutrializing world and practice them - without expecting to earn a living with them 2)at the same time, deindustrialize yourself: Learn to live with less energy, less media stimulation and (useless)stuff 3) that should give you more money and time to assess the viability of your current home/region. Will you need to move to a place less affected by [insert various environmental results of climate change like droughts]? or will your home region be more or less ok? 4) Then - if your ressources permit - you can think about your home. can you make it more energy-efficient, using simple technologies (from the toolkit of the appropriate technologies handbooks of the 70s - or from the books uploaded on the greenwizards-forum http://teresamcguffey.com/greenwizards.org/index.php)? Can you get a garden or keep a few chickens? 5) If you keep doing these things, you will have a headstart and a good chance of being in position to support yourself and your family in the days to come. Also, when things get worse and worse for those expecting the old system to keep working, you will see more and more of your neighbours looking for solutions out of the box. And you'll be there, hopefully being able to lead by example, help them learning skills and form a working community. As I said I'm a fan of the model because it's very pragmatic. Its tools are cheap and easy to come by and it scales very well on a small level. Even if you live in a flat and can't get our own garden, you could still take 2 hours every week to learn baking/sewing, etc. and gain valuable skills which will be helpful when consumerism shits the bed. Also, it works with humans in an age of decline. It doesn't expect people to have a lot of money lying around for building super high-tech solutions, instead it relies on salvaging the remains of todays consumerism for long-term use. Edit: Greer does not really advocate 'green wizards' to become vocal climate change activists during the next decade, due to 1) the self-affriming logic of global capitalism in its last stages 2) the strengh of our current paradigm. Many people will need to see the system really break infront of their eyes before they are willing to actively head into a direction that forces them to say goodbye to their currebnt standard of life SavageGentleman fucked around with this message at 14:29 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 14:24
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yellowyams posted:I've been in borderline hysterics for a while now and it only seems to be getting worse. Please, can people spread this info around, especially to celebrities and people with a lot of followers? Not just the arctic ice thing but the consequences and how the govt won't withstand it. Nobody I've seen is discussing this and I don't think anyone realizes how dire things are right now, if it became part of the conversation maybe we could take more drastic action. This needs a big loving news story to get people motivated. It's been a "big loving news story" for close to forty years now. Nothing's going to change until there are severe localized impacts to a majority of the population.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:26
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NewForumSoftware posted:It's been a "big loving news story" for close to forty years now. Nothing's going to change until there are severe localized impacts to a majority of the population. If it was then why didn't I know about it until now? We live in an age where communicating things to the masses in a timely manner is much easier, we need to use that. There are not enough people that know about this, if there were then there would be a lot more panic and call for change. We need to put this somewhere much more visible.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:30
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NewForumSoftware posted:It's been a "big loving news story" for close to forty years now. Nothing's going to change until there are severe localized impacts to a majority of the population. I thought we've already experienced these, what with Sandy and that other one that smacked the US in 2015? yellowyams posted:If it was then why didn't I know about it until now? We live in an age where communicating things to the masses in a timely manner is much easier, we need to use that. There are not enough people that know about this, if there were then there would be a lot more panic and call for change. We need to put this somewhere much more visible. There's a strong contingent of the media and government that refuse to accept the reality of this, and do all they can to obfuscate the issue and marginalize it wherever possible. Think of how phillip morris handled the findings about the detrimental health effects of cigarettes, but instead of reducing lifespans and causing cancers for greed's sake, they're abetting natural disaster based genocides for greed's sake.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:34
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yellowyams posted:If it was then why didn't I know about it until now? Because you live in Texas. quote:We live in an age where communicating things to the masses in a timely manner is much easier, we need to use that. There are not enough people that know about this, if there were then there would be a lot more panic and call for change. We need to put this somewhere much more visible. If you look at the world and call it crazy the world is going to look right back at you and call you crazy. I've been down that road before, it doesn't help. zxqv8 posted:I thought we've already experienced these, what with Sandy and that other one that smacked the US in 2015? Clearly it hasn't gotten bad enough as we just went through a presidential campaign without it barely being mentioned. Food prices will most likely be the indicator to watch/ NewForumSoftware fucked around with this message at 14:38 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 14:35
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The arctic ice melting so fast that it might not be here in a year is a way bigger story than "we might be pretty hosed in 100 years if we don't do something" which is what I think most people have heard about it. We need to get this message out now. Saying "no one will listen" doesn't help, that's giving up, we need to be as loud as possible. If celebrities and people in high places spread the news then a lot more people will be aware, don't tell me we can't loving do anything but wait.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:41
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Communication to masses requires listeners. Please consider listening to the following in full. https://youtu.be/0iC9xpDSXyI Watch the above then read the spoiler below. Facebook no longer requires that trending stories have a basis in reality. In the last election, half of America was informed per their desire, not per truth.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:44
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that's the magnitude of the problem.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:44
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yellowyams posted:The arctic ice melting so fast that it might not be here in a year is a way bigger story than "we might be pretty hosed in 100 years if we don't do something" which is what I think most people have heard about it. We need to get this message out now. Saying "no one will listen" doesn't help, that's giving up, we need to be as loud as possible. If celebrities and people in high places spread the news then a lot more people will be aware, don't tell me we can't loving do anything but wait. We can't refreeze the arctic in any kind of time frame that will help anyone alive today. Relax a little, yeah the sky is falling, but you weren't immortal before you read this.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:46
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yellowyams posted:I've been in borderline hysterics for a while now and it only seems to be getting worse. Please, can people spread this info around, especially to celebrities and people with a lot of followers? Not just the arctic ice thing but the consequences and how the govt won't withstand it. Nobody I've seen is discussing this and I don't think anyone realizes how dire things are right now, if it became part of the conversation maybe we could take more drastic action. This needs a big loving news story to get people motivated. Look up the "bike-shed effect" or Parkinson's Law of Triviality. Climate change isn't discussed in popular culture because it's complex and the outcome of any sort of discussion is generally "it's an unavoidable global catastrophe". Even if our media wasn't an endless stream of venal chatting at the sub-6th grade level, that kind of foregone conclusion just doesn't get good ratings. As other's have pointed out our monkey brains aren't well suited to thinking about civilization-scale problems and what it really means to gamble with billions of lives. We don't like talking about it, there's always some better distraction. NewForumSoftware posted:It's been a "big loving news story" for close to forty years now. Nothing's going to change until there are severe localized impacts to a majority of the population. This as well. If there's one cause for (extremely faint) hope, it's that our society can actually respond very quickly to clear and direct threats. If modern economies could be retooled to combat global warming in the same manner they were directed to blow people up during WWII we could drastically reduce emissions within several years. Just replacing every single coal plant with nuclear power generation would likely buy a couple of extra decades to figure out the remaining issues. The tragedy is that global warming isn't a clear and direct threat at present, and by the time it becomes one it's too late to stop it. Maybe we get lucky and a few coastal cities get swamped in the near future, provoking the necessary response while there's still time to prevent civilization-ending climate change. I feel pretty stupid typing that out while living in NYC. Good luck everyone!
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Nov 14, 2016 14:48
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That doesn't mean we should give up. We have to fight every step of the way and get louder. There are definitely people in higher places that would lend a voice if they knew, like I can't stress that even if people know the climate is hosed, they don't realize it will be in their lifetime and if they did we would see way more action. We have to get the message out as soon as possible.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:48
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yellowyams posted:The arctic ice melting so fast that it might not be here in a year is a way bigger story than "we might be pretty hosed in 100 years if we don't do something" which is what I think most people have heard about it. We need to get this message out now. Saying "no one will listen" doesn't help, that's giving up, we need to be as loud as possible. If celebrities and people in high places spread the news then a lot more people will be aware, don't tell me we can't loving do anything but wait. Nobody is saying "no one will listen" it's "the systems of governance in use on planet earth are incapable of addressing climate change in any sort of coordinated manner that would reverse the trends we see today". I mean, if this was 1994 maybe you'd have a point but the ship has sailed at this point. I don't know how to tell you this without sounding like an rear end in a top hat but the fact that you're just finding out about this now is a big part of the problem. This has been a huge news story for literally decades. Everywhere you're talking about getting the message out already has the message. And if you're understanding it now you'll understand it's too late to stop an ice-free arctic, the western antarctic ice sheet from collapsing, or bangladesh's rice production being decimated. We're well into "unintended consequences" phases of our actions. We aren't in control any more (well, we never were if you want to take the real cynical look) and the only thing to do at this point is adapt. Migrating away from places like Texas before poo poo really escalates would be a good idea. yellowyams posted:That doesn't mean we should give up. We have to fight every step of the way and get louder. There are definitely people in higher places that would lend a voice if they knew, like I can't stress that even if people know the climate is hosed, they don't realize it will be in their lifetime and if they did we would see way more action. We have to get the message out as soon as possible. I see this over and over again but accepting that there won't be coordinated global action on the issue of climate change isn't "giving up", it's "being realistic". There are other things we can do in our lives to buffer ourselves from the coming storm that don't involve deluding yourself about the impacts of what little coordinated action we see today. NewForumSoftware fucked around with this message at 14:51 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 14:49
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You are underestimating the amount of people who don't know this story and also lumping the very real event of the arctic sheet melting completely right loving now with the over-all climate change narrative which I'm aware people know. If enough people spoke out the govt would pay attention and it would at least bring more attention to the subject, it doesn't matter if most people know because things have just escalated tremendously and no one is discussing. Saying no one will listen does nothing, if even one more person knows about this it will help.NewForumSoftware posted:
There is no reason we can't do both, we need to minimize this as much as possible. yellowyams fucked around with this message at 14:58 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 14:56
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Potato Salad posted:Communication to masses requires listeners. I thought this political cartoon was very astute:  The mass-media model had a lot of drawbacks, but at least you could be reasonably certain most people were aware of the major issues of the day. edit: ok maybe it's a little preachy.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:58
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yellowyams posted:You are underestimating the amount of people who don't know this story and also lumping the very real event of the arctic sheet melting completely right loving now with the over-all climate change narrative which I'm aware people know. http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/16/weather/arctic-sea-ice-shrinking/ http://www.foxnews.com/science/2016/08/19/low-amount-arctic-sea-ice-is-new-normal-nasa-says.html http://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/nasa-oceanographer-carlos-del-castillo-arctic-melting-impacts-us-all-n547501 I mean, where do you want to get the message out? Who isn't being told right now that should be? quote:If enough people spoke out the govt would pay attention and it would at least bring more attention to the subject, it doesn't matter if most people know because things have just escalated tremendously and no one is discussing. Saying no one will listen does nothing, if even one more person knows about this it will help. I never said nobody will listen and just repeating that over and over again isn't going to get you much of anywhere.
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Nov 14, 2016 14:58
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Nocturtle posted:I thought this political cartoon was very astute: It isn't preachy in the slightest. Post-Information Age.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:06
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NewForumSoftware posted:
Stuff about Trump on twitter from celebrities have thousands of retweets and those are super important but no one is discussing that the govt won't matter in a few years because we'll all be loving dying. People are apathetic about climate change because it's been described as a very slow process that probably won't happen in our lifetimes but now we have an event that is going to lead to the collapse of everything very very soon, well within our lifetime, and people don't know about it. I keep coming back to celebrities because they have many followers and would be able to spread the word more effectively. You can say that the climate is hosed but what people need to hear is the consequences of that and how much sooner it is going to happen than we realized now that the arctic sheet is going down.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:08
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yellowyams posted:Stuff about Trump on twitter from celebrities have thousands of retweets and those are super important but no one is discussing that the govt won't matter in a few years because we'll all be loving dying. People are apathetic about climate change because it's been described as a very slow process that probably won't happen in our lifetimes but now we have an event that is going to lead to the collapse of everything very very soon, well within our lifetime, and people don't know about it. I keep coming back to celebrities because they have many followers and would be able to spread the word more effectively. You can say that the climate is hosed but what people need to hear is the consequences of that and how much sooner it is going to happen than we realized now that the arctic sheet is going down. You mean like Leonardo DiCaprio making documentary after documentary in order to "get the word out"? People hear what they want to hear, scary facts will just entrench their positions.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:09
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Nocturtle posted:This as well. If there's one cause for (extremely faint) hope, it's that our society can actually respond very quickly to clear and direct threats. If modern economies could be retooled to combat global warming in the same manner they were directed to blow people up during WWII we could drastically reduce emissions within several years. Just replacing every single coal plant with nuclear power generation would likely buy a couple of extra decades to figure out the remaining issues. The tragedy is that global warming isn't a clear and direct threat at present, and by the time it becomes one it's too late to stop it. Maybe we get lucky and a few coastal cities get swamped in the near future, provoking the necessary response while there's still time to prevent civilization-ending climate change. Your solution is a good one, but waiting isn't going to make it happen. There's no Pearl Harbor of global warming. No singular event to galvanize a population. To me, the arguments in favor thumb-twiddling really smack of the Fundamental Attribution Error: "nobody is doing anything because they are comfortable idiots, but I personally am not doing anything because the situation needs to be different for me to reasonably act and I can't control the situation." Like, I agree that probably a president Trump isn't going to be particularly amenable to a "Green New Deal". But that's not the end of what you can do. For example, you live in NYC. It is absolutely essential that our local city governments enact planning policy geared towards a zero-carbon future. We need cities that are walkable, that incorporate green design, that infill low-density sprawl with low-carbon development. I guarantee that while Trump isn't going to give you the time of day, even the slightest public scrutiny and vocal pressure terrifies your city planning departments and zoning boards. They aren't used to it, it makes them uncomfortable, and it forces them to listen. Same for all the boards managing various pension funds and endowments: it's a problem that nearly every person in the country has a direct financial interest in the success of the fossil fuel industry, and we need to cut that incentive as fast as possible if we want anything done. You think your city pension funds have ever gotten a dozen emails in an afternoon about their investment policy, much less a hundred, or a thousand? Disconnecting from the sense of shared destiny is exactly what was so hosed up about the tea party a few years ago. Don't be like the tea party.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:13
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NewForumSoftware posted:You mean like Leonardo DiCaprio making documentary after documentary in order to "get the word out"? Everyone is looking to twitter and social media right now because of the fear we are all experiencing for our new govt, this is a better time than any to get people's attention. And if celebrities are so aware then why don't I hear about donations to environmental organizations as much? By the way, if we truly are hosed, would Colorado be one of the good places to take refuge in? This is what I wanted to say, thank you. Every single voice helps and we need to reach out to people in power and our fellow citizens regardless of if they'll listen or not. yellowyams fucked around with this message at 15:22 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 15:19
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yellowyams posted:Everyone is looking to twitter and social media right now because of the fear we are all experiencing for our new govt, this is a better time than any to get people's attention. And if celebrities are so aware then why don't I hear about donations to environmental organizations as much? Because you don't listen? poo poo happens all the time. quote:By the way, if we truly are hosed, would Colorado be one of the good places to take refuge in? Better than Texas but a pretty dought prone area to be honest. PNW is probably the best area in the US as far as the data shows now but there's tons of uncertainty. Also, http://imgur.com/I8vURNH
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Nov 14, 2016 15:22
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yellowyams posted:You are underestimating the amount of people who don't know this story and also lumping the very real event of the arctic sheet melting completely right loving now with the over-all climate change narrative which I'm aware people know. If enough people spoke out the govt would pay attention and it would at least bring more attention to the subject, it doesn't matter if most people know because things have just escalated tremendously and no one is discussing. Saying no one will listen does nothing, if even one more person knows about this it will help. People have already pointed out that the information has been publicized for a while now. I'd just like to point out something that's been posted before in this thread but is crucial to understand, not only is climate change in the popular consciousness but it's been thoroughly processed by our political system with progressives supporting action and conservatives denying the problem even exists. See this plot:  This is a huge tragedy for any hope that we could address global warming proactively. By becoming a partisan political issue, facts matter much less as people feel comfortable dismissing scientific evidence as politically motivated distortions. What's interesting is that this is a relatively recent phenomena, even in 2000 Bush Jr felt constrained to at least acknowledge the seriousness of global warming even if he had no intention of doing anything about it. Now Donald Trump is picking climate change deniers for his cabinet. There was a real shift in attitudes over the past 16 years and it's clear progressives lost. I don't have similar studies for other countries but I can assure you there's been a similarly polarization of public opinion along political lines in Canada.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:22
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yellowyams posted:By the way, if we truly are hosed, would Colorado be one of the good places to take refuge in? No because anywhere that will be shielded somewhat will be flooded with migrants escaping places that aren't. You'd just be trading severe weather for mass starvation and disease outbreaks. There is nowhere to hide from this.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:25
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Here's some good news, yellowyams. Canada is mostly empty right now. Permafrost being the main reason people don't live much further north than the US-CA border. When Texas/Arizona/New Mexico gets swallowed by the Sonoran, at the same time this land will open up for new farmland. So we won't starve for a good while. Also, Canada has more freshwater than any other country. It will be a good time to be Canadian! Also, agreeing with others, Colorado is not a good future home. Heck already the past few years there have been insane wildfires tearing it up.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:27
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Nocturtle posted:People have already pointed out that the information has been publicized for a while now. I'd just like to point out something that's been posted before in this thread but is crucial to understand, not only is climate change in the popular consciousness but it's been thoroughly processed by our political system with progressives supporting action and conservatives denying the problem even exists. See this plot: I'm not talking about climate change in general, I'm talking about the melting of the ice sheet within the next year which is going to accelerate things considerably faster than the estimates so far. I talked to several of my friends last night (none from Texas so it's not that) and they hadn't heard about this either, it is not getting the attention it needs and supposing that it's out there so people must have heard and wouldn't do anything even if they did is not helping. Every bit of resistance helps.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:29
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yellowyams posted:I'm not talking about climate change in general, I'm talking about the melting of the ice sheet within the next year which is going to accelerate things considerably faster than the estimates so far. I talked to several of my friends last night (none from Texas so it's not that) and they hadn't heard about this either, it is not getting the attention it needs and supposing that it's out there so people must have heard and wouldn't do anything even if they did is not helping. Every bit of resistance helps. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUO23Y179pU https://sites.google.com/site/arcticseaicegraphs/ There you go, spread the word. But don't be shocked when nobody cares.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:31
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NewForumSoftware posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUO23Y179pU  The dip in 2016 is significantly more dramatic, something that happens over such a long time that you can barely feel the impact isn't what people worry about, a big sudden change is, I think this will motivate people more than vague ideas of the future and more people need to know that everything falling apart is a lot sooner than we thought.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:38
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Polio Vax Scene posted:Here's some good news, yellowyams. Canada is mostly empty right now. Permafrost being the main reason people don't live much further north than the US-CA border. There's this thing called the "Canadian shield", good luck farming on former perma-frost. Water-issues alone make the great lakes and southern Ontario/Quebec probably the best places to live through a climate change catastrophe.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:38
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yellowyams posted:
That chart is combined arctic and antarctic ice so it's not really that good.  Much better view of things and I mean, it's true if the sea ice doesn't "recover" this year to it's normal winter levels we're probably in for an ice free arctic in the next few years.
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Nov 14, 2016 15:42
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