|
I'm going to repost this video, of economist Mark Blyth and political scientist Wendy Schiller discussing their professional opinions on what happened in this election and what will happen in the future. A lot of it is similar to what we've discussed. Some of it isn't. It's worth watching despite being an hour and a half, and takes the form of a college lecture. (Thank you Phone)
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 10:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 16:35 |
|
|
citybeatnik posted:
Not dead yet; vote's been delayed until early 2017 because republicans were self aware enough to realize how bad it'd look to do it immediately
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 10:08
|
|
|
Wellwinds posted:Not dead yet; vote's been delayed until early 2017 because republicans were self aware enough to realize how bad it'd look to do it immediately Well that's something at least. I'm all for pork barrel spending as long as it gets the drat wheels of government to spin. I've been out of the loop for a day or so - Ryan still pushing to touch the third rail on social security or has there been actual backlash against that?
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 10:14
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Well that's something at least. I'm all for pork barrel spending as long as it gets the drat wheels of government to spin. He's going after Medicare first it seems like. Trump is backing his play. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 10:25
|
|
|
i like all the idiot dems saying to relocate rural people to the city it's not like these people or their families live in areas with low costs of living, and so almost certainly do not have the financial underpinings to live in more expensive cities
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 10:55
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Well that's something at least. I'm all for pork barrel spending as long as it gets the drat wheels of government to spin. a trump stimulus could be a nightmare for democrats. it would probably end up lining the pockets of Trump's cronies in construction firms, produce poor-quality infrastructure and a shitload of debt, and create a short-term economic boom that might help Trump and Republicans electorally. if senate Dems line up to help pass such a bill they're beyond worthless
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:00
|
|
|
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/nov/17/hillary-clinton-first-public-appearance-bernie-sandersquote:“I will admit coming here tonight wasn’t the easiest thing for me,” Clinton told the audience in Washington DC. “There have been a few times this past week when all I’ve wanted to do was just to curl up with a good book or our dogs and never leave the house ever again.” good. i hope you stay in your house forever and i never have to see you again
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:08
|
|
|
Man, whenever anyone I know fails at something, I wish they would vanish into thin air too.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:10
|
|
|
For those who don't want to watch that long video, here is the choice quote from the economist: "The last one I want to talk about, the domestic one, is that both Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump have been equally dishonest on this: there is no renaissance of American manufacturing in the United States. It's not gonna happen. At the end of the day manufacturing works in a very simple way: capital substitutes for labor at the margins. And the more capital you have, the less labor you need. Look at German [manufacturing]: employment is going like this [motions a downward slope], productivity is going like this [motions an upward slope]. We live in a world where literally 10% of the global population could provide superabundance for everyone. We have a distributional problem and political problem. We do not have a problem of where you're gonna make your stuff in factories. The notion that we're gonna rebuild all these factories, the plant suppliers, equipment manufacturers - what, so people can get lung disease and asbestosis again? Is that actually the plan? I think that this is tremendously dishonest, to say that's gonna happen." He says before that among other things that globalization is inevitable, he doesn't see how the Democrats will connect with people when they've grown so complacent and arrogant in their D.C. social circles, and that across the Western World center left parties are largely dying or dead. Later he says that we're going to fall into a period of intense nationalism to try and replace neoliberalism, the implication being that this is a stupid idea. The left is going to try and go nationalist like the right and it's going to go down dark, awful places. I don't have a lot of optimism about the future of politics right now.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:11
|
|
|
Star Man posted:Man, whenever anyone I know fails at something, I wish they would vanish into thin air too. her arrogance brought us trump, it's only natural to be angry at her Condiv fucked around with this message at 11:23 on Nov 17, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:20
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:a trump stimulus could be a nightmare for democrats. it would probably end up lining the pockets of Trump's cronies in construction firms, produce poor-quality infrastructure and a shitload of debt, and create a short-term economic boom that might help Trump and Republicans electorally. if senate Dems line up to help pass such a bill they're beyond worthless I'm not talking about pork barrel spending during a trump stimulus. I mean in general. But yeah, the fucker's billing the secret service for rides on his jets like hell money's not going to go in to his pocket.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:23
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:I'm going to repost this video, of economist Mark Blyth and political scientist Wendy Schiller discussing their professional opinions on what happened in this election and what will happen in the future. Wendy Schiller is awfully optimistic. Comparing Trump to Reagan and indirectly to Nixon (in a positive way) with "Madman theory" just... ugh. And some of her rationale for optimism is already gone ("if you see Chris Christie getting shut out, only then is it bad for civil rights... lol  ).
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:26
|
|
|
Wouldn't it just be easier for Democrats to double down on corporatism? I mean, I've been laboring under the assumption that large corporations, especially multnational ones, crave that sweet sweet globalization, and need political allies that aren't riding Trump's nationalism funwagon.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:26
|
|
|
Kilroy posted:Watched this today. I didn't interpret the madman theory comparison as being flattering. Just that it could hypothetically work to his advantage. I think she was offering a counterpoint to Blyth's "the Russians are going to invade the Baltics, what will Trump do then?" notion. Remember that was the day after. She didn't know for sure how the advisors situation would shake out. I also think that Trump's kids will have more sway than Pence. Pence might crowd out others but that doesn't mean Trump will care about what he has to say. Regardless, we all knew civil liberties were going to take big hits. Edit: ^ it's possible. Corporations don't vote, however. That's why it's not necessarily a good strategy for Democrats. There's no guarantee they won't be preposterously stupid and do it anyway though. Lightning Knight fucked around with this message at 11:37 on Nov 17, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:30
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:Edit: ^ it's possible. Corporations don't vote, however. That's why it's not necessarily a good strategy for Democrats. There's no guarantee they won't be preposterously stupid and do it anyway though. Give it a bit of time. We're getting closer and closer to Shadowrun every drat day.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:35
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Give it a bit of time. We're getting closer and closer to Shadowrun every drat day. Doesn't matter anyway, (rich) corporations get something even better than voting - lobbying and disinformation strategies. But if corporations are also 'people' in this great country, aren't we disenfranchising them? Can't wait for people to cling on to that bullshit. You know they loving will
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:45
|
|
|
Feral Integral posted:Doesn't matter anyway, (rich) corporations get something even better than voting - lobbying and disinformation strategies. Corporations: the only people it's ok to commit genocide against. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:49
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Give it a bit of time. We're getting closer and closer to Shadowrun every drat day. We're gonna get Netrunner minus all the cool gizmos and with a lovely internet.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:52
|
|
|
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...ocid=spartanntp So the Trump administration is going to try to ban lobbyists apparently. Anybody know anything about this? To my untrained eye it seems like an attempt to cripple any establishment GOP member that's not a loyalist. I really can't imagine it being too successful though.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:57
|
|
|
Clip-On Fedora posted:http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...ocid=spartanntp His original cabinet list was stuffed to the gills with them so... There's also the argument that, at the very least, lobbyists can function as experts in certain aspects of things that a representative has absolutely no idea about. Or as an advocate for a group - it's not just someone showing up with bags of swag marked "BIG BUSINESS MONEY". It's poo poo like the ACLU and the like.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 11:58
|
|
|
Yeah why does he need more lobbyists if he's already hired all the good ones to his staff?
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:17
|
|
|
So judging from the usual total incompetence and arrogance, what is the likelihood that anyone Republicans remaining would grow a pair and impeach the orange bastard before he totally destroyed the nation?
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:26
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:The left is going to try and go nationalist like the right and it's going to go down dark, awful places. I don't have a lot of optimism about the future of politics right now. no it's not. it's either going to go neo-trotskyist like Corbyn or Tsipras, and lose, or continue with third way social democracy like Clinton, and eventually win again
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:27
|
|
|
Geostomp posted:So judging from the usual total incompetence and arrogance, what is the likelihood that anyone Republicans remaining would grow a pair and impeach the orange bastard before he totally destroyed the nation? I think it's actually fairly likely if he's a total disaster and especially if he refuses to cooperate with Paul Ryan's Ayn Rand death cult stuff
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:29
|
|
|
Geostomp posted:So judging from the usual total incompetence and arrogance, what is the likelihood that anyone Republicans remaining would grow a pair and impeach the orange bastard before he totally destroyed the nation? You saw the primary and campaign. Also, the executive branch is a motherfucker. The only real check on it is court proceedings that lag behavior by years. Look at what happened when it turned out American surveillance proponent Diane Feinstein was being surveilled herself. Nothing happened. Nobody cared. Trump will never be impeached. At most he will be stonewalled by congress while stomping the gently caress out of every civil liberty. At the end of it, conservatives will reassure the public that they never considered him a true conservative. 60% of the country will respect them for having the courage to say that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:31
|
|
|
fits my needs posted:Okay, but Donald Trump is president.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:35
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:third way social democracy like Clinton
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:35
|
|
|
Chomskyan posted:Maybe that's because Clinton was a terrible candidate who failed to mobilize her base, rather than her being mildly criticized for her connections to big finance during the primaries Thanks for the recap. I had no idea Clinton could possibly be at fault for anything. You should get in your time machine and let everybody know that and then hang yourself back in 2008 while masturbating to Obama girl on YouTube Kilroy posted:what the gently caress are you talking about Listen, I'm not sure you got the memo, but we're all super woke here. What this means is that we need to put Clinton on a NASA mission to the sun over an e-mail server, and then also we need to like.. send even more loving journalists to Iowa to talk to white supremacists about their feel feels. ErIog fucked around with this message at 12:40 on Nov 17, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:36
|
|
|
Geostomp posted:So judging from the usual total incompetence and arrogance, what is the likelihood that anyone Republicans remaining would grow a pair and impeach the orange bastard before he totally destroyed the nation? Less than the likelihood of the Browns winning the super bowl.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:37
|
|
|
Kilroy posted:what the gently caress are you talking about
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:37
|
|
|
Geostomp posted:So judging from the usual total incompetence and arrogance, what is the likelihood that anyone Republicans remaining would grow a pair and impeach the orange bastard before he totally destroyed the nation?
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:39
|
|
|
Tight Booty Shorts posted:Ugh lol I wasn't kidding about city liberals being all about hating those country rubes 'there still exist some poor people in inner cities, how dare you care that almost everyone outside them is poor' A Wizard of Goatse fucked around with this message at 12:49 on Nov 17, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:40
|
|
|
Kilroy posted:what the gently caress are you talking about I think he was talking about Bill Clinton
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:40
|
|
|
fits my needs posted:Okay, but Donald Trump is president. And us pretending Clinton was not a deeply flawed candidate, instead gushing about her white pantsuit, is part of how that came to pass.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:40
|
|
|
ErIog posted:You saw the primary and campaign. Also, the executive branch is a motherfucker. The only real check on it is court proceedings that lag behavior by years. Look at what happened when it turned out American surveillance proponent Diane Feinstein was being surveilled herself. So the only hope is waiting for the conservative base to die of old age before voter suppression gets even worse?
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:43
|
|
|
icantfindaname posted:I think it's actually fairly likely if he's a total disaster and especially if he refuses to cooperate with Paul Ryan's Ayn Rand death cult stuff like trump is literally the avatar of the frothing mob and they are super pissed, but yeah leader of the ayn rand death cult and right-wing policy alleged turbonerd paul ryan is going to hand him his rear end lofl you know, maybe it was that I wasn't thinking as clearly in between dry heaves then, but this forum did seem to confront this election with some pretty sober and thoughtful analysis good to see the old order reasserting itself
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:43
|
|
|
8 years. For 8 years things were getting better. Damage being undone. And then y'all decided to blow it up again.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:43
|
|
|
like you literally think that this dude: is going to be the one to finally stump the trump time to take stock icantfindaname, something's wrong
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:45
|
|
|
A Wizard of Goatse posted:lol I wasn't kidding about city liberals being all about hating those country rubes and country rubes are all about hating those city liberals* *mostly minorities Geostomp posted:So the only hope is waiting for the conservative base to die of old age before voter suppression gets even worse? Looks like there's enough white-identifying latinos to shore up the white base of the Republican party. We thought Texas might go blue next cycle. It might be a few cycles longer. Turns out partisanship has been a real motherfucker, and self-identification is a real thing. I don't blame them. Being able to pass as white is a hell of a boon. They're just taking what's theirs, but I just wish it wasn't so FYGM. You could say the same thing about descendants of Irish or Italian immigrants. ErIog fucked around with this message at 12:52 on Nov 17, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 16:35 |
|
|
double post
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2016 12:51
|
|