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Faffel posted:I keep saying the joke was we'd look back on SF4 with fond memories because we're all a bunch of complainy poo poo-bitches, but the joke is that it actually did happen and it's actually b.c. SF5 is just terrible. 4 is a bad game but top level play was consistently entertaining at least 5 doesn't even have that
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Nov 21, 2016 20:13
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In what way was SF4 a bad game?
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Nov 21, 2016 20:16
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90% of the character models look like dogshit
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Nov 21, 2016 20:24
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Zand posted:4 is a bad game but top level play was consistently entertaining at least I've actually found recent top level play to be really fun to watch. There's definitely been some more diversity in cast and new styles in the last few premier events.
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Nov 21, 2016 20:27
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rip bhsman
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Nov 21, 2016 20:31
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Scent of Worf posted:In what way was SF4 a bad game? hard to pin a reason down, but maybe the meaty unlockables and heavy importance of option selects (like low tech) make it awful. also comeback mechanics and damage scaling zzzzzzzzzz. Elena, players could have play styles in that game though and there was large character variety. I liked being able to tell who was playing without a name plate on stream personally. also the less you know about sf4 the better it is to watch honestly. compare this to a game like gg that gets more interesting the more you know...
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Nov 21, 2016 20:40
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Zand posted:4 is a bad game but top level play was consistently entertaining at least 4 took a pretty long time for top level play to be any good though, and I think I'd still rather play SF5 (not that I do that either)
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Nov 21, 2016 20:41
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What will save Sf5. Include a massive singleplayer mode. Tower trials, story progression, dialog, etc. literally copy Mortal Kombats. Like completely. Ignore high level poo poo for tournaments. Worry about fixing that stuff later with patches. Add in wacky modes, like 2v2, 3v3. 1v6 as a boss beatdown, etc. Work on multiplayer once it's out the gate 100%. The idea is to retain these players now as people learn the game for tournaments and such. Basically what Maximilian is saying. Go back in time because lol, this poo poo is done. Capcom got lured into only thinking about the tournament scene AND making it too easy to work with for new players. It's a juxtapose of failure.
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Nov 21, 2016 20:50
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world tour and dramatic battles were thought up like twenty years ago and then abandoned by capcom and I can't comprehend why. sfv even has parts of world tour mode in survival mode ... but it's in sfv survival.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:25
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I played those modes as a kid because there was literally no other way to play anyone. I don't touch any single player content in fighting games anymore. I'm curious to know how many people still do, I remember looking at trophies for SFV on PS4 and the number of people who got to gold was pathetically low. It might have been as low as 1.5% I can't remember.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:28
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https://twitter.com/DNOpls/status/798433108634779648
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Nov 21, 2016 21:49
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Vega is able to propel himself with the pure power of handsomeness.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:53
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Yeah I guess that's true about the option selects, ultras and damage scaling. I didn't play much SF4 but I gotta admit that game felt much better put together than SF5. SF5 feels like it was stitched together from a bunch of outsourced assets.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:59
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HoboWithAShotgun posted:I played those modes as a kid because there was literally no other way to play anyone. Mortal Kombat sales were through the roof since the majority of people that play these games don't play them for multiplayer, oddly enough. It doesn't matter if Mortal Kombat's fighting scene isn't big if the game made money. See Smash Brothers and how it's a normal game that just so happens to have a dedicated scene to it(outside of Nintendo). The creators of Smash don't even seem to care about the fighting scene around it, just a solid fun game for all to play. Single player AND multiplayer.
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Nov 21, 2016 22:36
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99% of people that play these games play SP only. God, I've had the following conversation with FOUR different friends since they know I'm into FGs: "hey, dude, I was thinking about buying a fighting game, should I do X or Y?" "well, it depends, X has more characters and modes, but Y has better netcode and more people playing..." "don't worry about that, I'm not playing online ever" These aren't even people that don't touch any competitive game, these dudes play CS:GO and MOBAs and Hearthstone. They just want nothing to do with FGs online.
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Nov 21, 2016 22:42
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Yeah it's weird as hell. My guess would be it has something to do with the lingering feeling of going to an Arcade and the thrill of trying to make your quarter survive through 4 fights before the bullshit kicks in? The first arcade game I ever remember actually playing other people in was the xmen vs sf game. Before that it just seemed rude to jump into someones run lol.
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Nov 21, 2016 22:49
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Intel&Sebastian posted:Yeah it's weird as hell. My guess would be it has something to do with the lingering feeling of going to an Arcade and the thrill of trying to make your quarter survive through 4 fights before the bullshit kicks in? The first arcade game I ever remember actually playing other people in was the xmen vs sf game. Before that it just seemed rude to jump into someones run lol. Hah yeah I remember that too. Very few of my friends played fighting games against each other, only to save ourselves from when the CPU was about to kill us. I think only recently Fighting games became a thing when things were ported over to the home systems like Marvel 2. They never got big competitively aside from maybe huge flashes in the pan like the original SF2 cabinets when fighting games first got huge.
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Nov 21, 2016 23:05
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Scent of Worf posted:In what way was SF4 a bad game? Slow walk walk speed, low damage, emphasis on comeback mechanic, powerful option selects, basic+b&b combos requiring tight links, game strongly favors defensive play outside of vortex characters.
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Nov 21, 2016 23:18
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I would like to talk about dashes in sfv: Do you find them too fast? I always find myself eating dash-in throws without being able to react to them, it's like every character is loving Makoto from third strike. Ryu's dash in sfv is 16 frames, how fast were dashes in third strike to compare?
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Nov 21, 2016 23:19
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I feel like the lag kind of negates the concept of reacting to dash in throws when the other person is smart about them, it's more about predicting them than anything else. I played M.Bison for a month just because of how fun that and his V-Skill are.
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Nov 21, 2016 23:23
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It's about the same speed as 3S IIRC, it's just harder to react to them for SFV reasons, your pokes are slower and some people like Nash hide most of their startup under an idle animation. It's yet another thing that makes SFV a super guessy game. Buckwheat Sings posted:Hah yeah I remember that too. Very few of my friends played fighting games against each other, only to save ourselves from when the CPU was about to kill us. I think only recently Fighting games became a thing when things were ported over to the home systems like Marvel 2. They never got big competitively aside from maybe huge flashes in the pan like the original SF2 cabinets when fighting games first got huge. Like, during the arcade days people played each other, but it was still between friends and unless you had a hook-up you were as good as your best friend figured out how to be. Nowadays people are even more scared of going online because they see someone doing combo and they think "oh no this guy does combo he's a pro" and just quit on the spot.
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Nov 21, 2016 23:28
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otoh I remember playing people in MK fairly regularly because we wanted to uppercut eachother and tear peoples heads off lol
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Nov 21, 2016 23:36
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Dias posted:99% of people that play these games play SP only. God, I've had the following conversation with FOUR different friends since they know I'm into FGs: My guess is that since you can "beat" FGs (arcade, story mode) and you don't get or "finish" anything by playing online, most people will just prefer to play the mode that they will get something interesting (a character ending, cool overpowered boss fight, plot) rather than the more abstract feeling of fighting someone online just to win or lose, and it makes single-player feel like the main or more important part of the game. Since MOBAs, CS:GO, Hearthstone and the like have never had a single-player mode and just focused on multiplayer to begin with no one is really bothered by them lacking in that department. What I mean is that if Street Fighter and fighting games never had arcade mode everyone would play multiplayer and this divide would have never happened. ...But that's just a theory. A GAME THEORY. Thanks for watching
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Nov 21, 2016 23:37
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Big Scary Owl posted:Since MOBAs, CS:GO, Hearthstone and the like have never had a single-player mode and just focused on multiplayer to begin with no one is really bothered by them lacking in that department. In the opposite direction there's Titanfall which may or may not have doomed it's entire series by trying to go MP only on it's first outing, despite being a pretty cool MP game in and of itself. I think being a Tourney junkie is a major requirement for wanting to play FG's online, at least at first.
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Nov 21, 2016 23:57
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Hearthstone has way more, and better, single player content than SFV.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:00
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Intel&Sebastian posted:In the opposite direction there's Titanfall which may or may not have doomed it's entire series by trying to go MP only on it's first outing, despite being a pretty cool MP game in and of itself. titanfall 2 is real real good. i haven't played any fighters since i got it.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:03
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Same except this morning where my Urien got tooled a few times and then I slayed two different silver players as FANG, including my demon Zangief but he never protected his legs so it was kinda easy.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:15
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Dias posted:It's about the same speed as 3S IIRC, it's just harder to react to them for SFV reasons, your pokes are slower and some people like Nash hide most of their startup under an idle animation. dangerously close to calling people pussies
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Nov 22, 2016 00:22
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Big Scary Owl posted:My guess is that since you can "beat" FGs (arcade, story mode) and you don't get or "finish" anything by playing online, most people will just prefer to play the mode that they will get something interesting (a character ending, cool overpowered boss fight, plot) rather than the more abstract feeling of fighting someone online just to win or lose, and it makes single-player feel like the main or more important part of the game. Since MOBAs, CS:GO, Hearthstone and the like have never had a single-player mode and just focused on multiplayer to begin with no one is really bothered by them lacking in that department. I mentioned them playing other games competitively just to say it's not an innate hatred of versus MP, but otherwise I agree. It's just meant as anecdotal evidence that a lot of people only care about SP, even though most people here don't. As to why, we've talked about it at length multiple times.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:29
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I spent a lot of time growing up playing single-player FG content but I also play and appreciate them competitively. ¯\{o_º}/¯
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Nov 22, 2016 00:34
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idk, there's something uniquely salty about getting dunked on in FG's in a way that doesn't seem to exist elsewhere and I really do believe a lot of people get turned off when they have to play people who know what they're doing when they're first starting out, and feel the burn of losing 20 times in a row until they finally get that win that makes them feel like the one doing the dunking. I spent a long rear end time eating poo poo in USF4 until I found my niche (match-up unfamiliarity, butter churning and armor abuse with Hugo).
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Nov 22, 2016 00:46
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Brosnan posted:I spent a lot of time growing up playing single-player FG content but I also play and appreciate them competitively. ¯\{o_º}/¯ Oh no for sure. Everyone here is gathering and telling stories of their history and time spent together over the dying corpse that is the Street Fighter series. It's also fun to think of ways for Capcom to turn this whole thing around but that table is already flipped. It's sad since the world of Street Fighter is rich and engrossing despite Capcom doing it's best to suicide itself. We all grew up with Street Fighter, heck Third Strike is such a beautiful game, it inspired me to get into animation.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:48
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Option selects objectively made SF4 a better game. Imagine how much worse that game would've been if you couldn't option select wake up backdash or vs throw/Rufus divekick.
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Nov 22, 2016 01:13
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Hyper competitive people dislike the losing part of fighters. I care more about what happens before the victory screen personally. if I won playing like dog poo poo, usually neither of us is having a great time. Like people who give advice on fg always speak as if its always possible to punish that move with 4 frame recovery while the person is having a hard time putting in srk inputs. They end up feeling stupid then not playing the game again. SF4 wise, I never played high level so casual level (casual like played online, not optimizing combos but generally having a good time and putting up a decent fight against some better players) I didn't get anywhere with viper really until late vanilla after people started to see that she was good. Funny enough viper is why I even picked up and got into sf4 to begin with. I'd say i cut my teeth with sc4 ivy though, drat I miss her.
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Nov 22, 2016 01:18
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Intel&Sebastian posted:XrdRev confuses the gently caress out of me but Ramlethal has my heart sort of like FANG does in this game. If it wasn't for her/him and some fun mechanics they have I wouldn't be playing Rev/SFV. Bedman is the best, so gently caress ram and fang.
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Nov 22, 2016 01:21
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Bedman feels great when you get on a roll, I agree. And his design is cool too.
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Nov 22, 2016 01:31
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Wow I just realized the new pro tour starts in about three months. So the S2 patch has to come out between now and then. That's an awfully short amount of time.. I sure hope they've been working on it a while already 
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Nov 22, 2016 01:48
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I'm terrified of the rebalance patch. I think it's just gonna kill anything slightly interesting from the top tier while not buffing the few bad characters enough for them to leave the hole. But we'll see.
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Nov 22, 2016 02:18
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they're gonna nerf ryus c.mk recovery by 1 frame
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Nov 22, 2016 02:19
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It's so asinine of them to never balance anything for a year because of thir stupid marketing plan
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Nov 22, 2016 02:22
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