Dwarf Fortress: The child punches the cave spider in the thorax, bruising the brain!

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Dwarf Fortress: The child punches the cave spider in the thorax, bruising the brain!

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RFC2324: Jun 7, 2012; http 418

Had autosaves on seasonal, and just learned about quicksave, but had thought I had likely corrupted the save(I realized this morning I have autobackups on too, so even that was just paranoia. Thanks tho!

Moridin920 posted:

I think you can force caravans to come from a certain part of the map by making everything except for where you want them to come in impassable by the caravan. The same principle applies to everything else (I am pretty sure) but the issue is making that whole edge of the map impassable (won't let you build walls right next to the edge for example).

But yeah I would do something about that because invaders can and will come in from any direction and it has pretty much no relation to the location of the sites on the world map.

I was able to make it happen without even walling off the whole side of the map, I just removed all of the ramps down from the mountain on that side(the embark area has 2 whole sides taken by mountains, with a brook running between them). Caravans are coming in from the direction I want now(any of the 3 but the one I built into).

counterfeitsaint posted:

Defending your base from all directions and not just one is kinda base defense 101.

And historically, you do this by building your fort with as many sides to a cliff as possible, or digging into a mountain so they have to come down a cliff/really steep slope to do it in order to limit approaches. Even now, having one side to a mountain helps since its hard to fly in a jet at a workable attack angle from that direction.

# ? Nov 21, 2016 22:11

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# ? May 26, 2024 02:03

Helical Nightmares: Apr 30, 2009

counterfeitsaint posted:

Defending your base from all directions and not just one is kinda base defense 101.

Legit.

I would not hire a Blackwater member or other mercenary unless they displayed fluency with Dwarf Fortress. :colbert:

# ? Nov 21, 2016 22:21

Moridin920: Nov 15, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

RFC2324 posted:

I was able to make it happen without even walling off the whole side of the map, I just removed all of the ramps down from the mountain on that side(the embark area has 2 whole sides taken by mountains, with a brook running between them). Caravans are coming in from the direction I want now(any of the 3 but the one I built into).

And historically, you do this by building your fort with as many sides to a cliff as possible, or digging into a mountain so they have to come down a cliff/really steep slope to do it in order to limit approaches. Even now, having one side to a mountain helps since its hard to fly in a jet at a workable attack angle from that direction.

Ah yeah, I always like to build mine into a mountain side but... yeah it isn't a mountain so much as it is a gentle sloping hill most of the time. I see where your issue lies.

De-ramping it will make sure the caravan spawns from the right direction, but be forewarned that invaders will still spawn up there regardless and then shoot arrows down into your courtyard area. They can even climb and jump now so if it is just 1 z level no ramp isn't going to stop them once they realize there is no direct path in. Even if they spawn on the flat ground area they still might try to climb around your walls like that.

Usually in this situation I shear off a chunk of mountain to turn it into a 50 z level or so cliff face instead but obv that's a pain in the butt and takes a while. In addition to that I like to make an obvious 'mountain path' down to the fort ground level (path still ends outside the walls though) which I can then build some defenses into since invaders will still prefer to not jump/climb if at all possible which means you can more or less funnel them in the direction you want.

For future forts/worlds I *believe* turning erosion off gets you some better cliff faces and defensible mountains to build into vs the gentle slopes.

e: oh alternately you can just roof over your whole courtyard area of course, then they have no choice but to go in the front way since even if they climb down the whole mountain they still can't get in from the top or shoot arrows in.

Moridin920 fucked around with this message at 22:26 on Nov 21, 2016

# ? Nov 21, 2016 22:23

RFC2324: Jun 7, 2012; http 418

Moridin920 posted:

Ah yeah, I always like to build mine into a mountain side but... yeah it isn't a mountain so much as it is a gentle sloping hill most of the time. I see where your issue lies.

De-ramping it will make sure the caravan spawns from the right direction, but be forewarned that invaders will still spawn up there regardless and then shoot arrows down into your courtyard area. They can even climb and jump now so if it is just 1 z level no ramp isn't going to stop them once they realize there is no direct path in. Even if they spawn on the flat ground area they still might try to climb around your walls like that.

Usually in this situation I shear off a chunk of mountain to turn it into a 50 z level or so cliff face instead but obv that's a pain in the butt and takes a while. In addition to that I like to make an obvious 'mountain path' down to the fort ground level (path still ends outside the walls though) which I can then build some defenses into since invaders will still prefer to not jump/climb if at all possible which means you can more or less funnel them in the direction you want.

For future forts/worlds I *believe* turning erosion off gets you some better cliff faces and defensible mountains to build into vs the gentle slopes.

e: oh alternately you can just roof over your whole courtyard area of course, then they have no choice but to go in the front way since even if they climb down the whole mountain they still can't get in from the top or shoot arrows in.

I've been thinking about putting a wall around the top rim to help prevent that... Need to research doing walls that are 2-3 z-levels tall tho.

# ? Nov 21, 2016 22:59

scamtank: Feb 24, 2011; my desire to just be a FUCKING IDIOT all day long is rapidly overtaking my ability to FUNCTION

i suspect that means i'm MENTALLY ILL

RFC2324 posted:

Need to research doing walls that are 2-3 z-levels tall tho.

Scaffolds (i.e. big honkin' walls made of nothing but up/down staircases) made from something light and plentiful near the surface. Like logs.

# ? Nov 21, 2016 23:09

TheHoosier: Dec 30, 2004; The fuck, Graham?!

I know this is old hat to a lot of you veterans, but I just completed my first 26-floor pump stack for fresh water from an underground cavern! It's the first time I've messed with any of the mechanical stuff and I'm pretty proud of it. Only two dwarves nearly drowned when I blocked off floor 15's area in the wrong direction and trapped them in a room rapidly filling with water. Luckily I noticed and saved them... this time.

It took 15 loving windmills to generate the power necessary to run the drat thing. I may have wired it wrong, but hey, fresh water!

# ? Nov 22, 2016 00:35

RFC2324: Jun 7, 2012; http 418

TheHoosier posted:

I know this is old hat to a lot of you veterans, but I just completed my first 26-floor pump stack for fresh water from an underground cavern! It's the first time I've messed with any of the mechanical stuff and I'm pretty proud of it. Only two dwarves nearly drowned when I blocked off floor 15's area in the wrong direction and trapped them in a room rapidly filling with water. Luckily I noticed and saved them... this time.

It took 15 loving windmills to generate the power necessary to run the drat thing. I may have wired it wrong, but hey, fresh water!

I'm glad i discovered Dwarven reactors before i did this.

# ? Nov 22, 2016 01:06

Telsa Cola: Aug 19, 2011; No... this is all wrong... this whole operation has just gone completely sidewaysface

Y'all know you can just channel a hole straight to water and plop down a well on top of the shaft right? Well's will drop a bucket down to a water source no matter how far down it is. It takes a little longer but way less effort/resources/fps drain.

# ? Nov 22, 2016 01:08

TheHoosier: Dec 30, 2004; The fuck, Graham?!

Telsa Cola posted:

Y'all know you can just channel a hole straight to water and plop down a well on top of the shaft right? Well's will drop a bucket down to a water source no matter how far down it is. It takes a little longer but way less effort/resources/fps drain.

...... well I do now

# ? Nov 22, 2016 01:09

Moridin920: Nov 15, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

RFC2324 posted:

I'm glad i discovered Dwarven reactors before i did this.

Isn't this murder on your FPS though?

TheHoosier posted:

...... well I do now

A massive pump stack to bring the water to you is much more dwarfy though.

# ? Nov 22, 2016 01:13

Vengarr: Jun 17, 2010; Smashed before noon

TheHoosier posted:

...... well I do now

You need to master the pumpstack technique if you want magma forges/lava moats/fiery death traps, so the effort wasn't wasted.

TBH though, at this point I just cheat liquids to where they need to go. Pumps are a pain

# ? Nov 22, 2016 01:23

Captain Mediocre: Oct 14, 2005; Saving lives and money!

Do it the hard way once to prove you can, then spawn liquids in dfhack forever afterwards.

I've just started playing again after a year or so and I'm surprised at how well it seems to be running. Back then a fort would last 3-4 dwarfyears before FPS ground to an unplayable halt. Has something been done to address this or have I just been lucky so far?

# ? Nov 22, 2016 01:31

Eric the Mauve: May 8, 2012; Making you happy for a buck since 199X

Dumb question but it didn't have to do with catsplosions, did it?

# ? Nov 22, 2016 01:44

Captain Mediocre: Oct 14, 2005; Saving lives and money!

Eric the Mauve posted:

Dumb question but it didn't have to do with catsplosions, did it?

Nope, I've played for a very long time and know about most of the ways to soothe FPS trouble (turning off temperature/weather, keeping population low, small map sites, not messing with liquids, killing all trees immediately, culling animals, cleaning everything with dfhack, destroying unwanted items) but with every update over the years it just got worse and worse until no fort would last more than a few years. This time round everything seems much better and I can't see anything that would explain it after a cursory look through patchnotes :confused:

I'm assuming the game still doesn't make use of multiple cores?

# ? Nov 22, 2016 16:46

RFC2324: Jun 7, 2012; http 418

I'm running 43.03 and my fort is at 200 dwarves. No real lag encountered, tho i will admit it's not going at 100% the speed it was when i embarked.

# ? Nov 22, 2016 17:17

Moridin920: Nov 15, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

Captain Mediocre posted:

Nope, I've played for a very long time and know about most of the ways to soothe FPS trouble (turning off temperature/weather, keeping population low, small map sites, not messing with liquids, killing all trees immediately, culling animals, cleaning everything with dfhack, destroying unwanted items) but with every update over the years it just got worse and worse until no fort would last more than a few years. This time round everything seems much better and I can't see anything that would explain it after a cursory look through patchnotes

I'm assuming the game still doesn't make use of multiple cores?

It is 64 bit as of a couple updates ago but idk if that would affect FPS at all.

I seem to remember something about general optimization stuff a few patches ago as well but I could very well just be making that up in my head.

# ? Nov 22, 2016 17:54

pixaal: Jan 8, 2004; All ice cream is now for all beings, no matter how many legs.

Moridin920 posted:

It is 64 bit as of a couple updates ago but idk if that would affect FPS at all.

I seem to remember something about general optimization stuff a few patches ago as well but I could very well just be making that up in my head.

So you are telling me that I can now take up all 32GB of my RAM with Dwarf Fortress? Time to embark on a massive site. Maybe one day some parts of the game can be broken down into threads, one day. I know multithreading is a giant pain in the rear end, especially adding it to something. It's just DF is a prime example of something that could be run threaded extremely well. Imagine the embark size a 32core server could run!

# ? Nov 22, 2016 18:21

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

RFC2324 posted:

I'm running 43.03 and my fort is at 200 dwarves. No real lag encountered, tho i will admit it's not going at 100% the speed it was when i embarked.

that's what lag means

also the base game starts at a rather low 100 FPS limit, 150-200 lets you spend a lot less time waiting around for dwarves to get things done

# ? Nov 22, 2016 18:23

Moridin920: Nov 15, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

pixaal posted:

So you are telling me that I can now take up all 32GB of my RAM with Dwarf Fortress? Time to embark on a massive site. Maybe one day some parts of the game can be broken down into threads, one day. I know multithreading is a giant pain in the rear end, especially adding it to something. It's just DF is a prime example of something that could be run threaded extremely well. Imagine the embark size a 32core server could run!

Yeah but I think CPU is still the biggest limiting factor with DF. Multithreading would be awesome.

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

that's what lag means

also the base game starts at a rather low 100 FPS limit, 150-200 lets you spend a lot less time waiting around for dwarves to get things done

There is playable lag and unplayable lag though. Below 30 is when I start to bow out but if I can keep it 30-50 that's good enough.

Seconding the suggestion to raise the FPS limit to make the early game go faster (I usually do 150).

# ? Nov 22, 2016 18:26

aphid_licker: Jan 7, 2009

Attacking my beautiful fortress from the wrong side is bad form imo.

# ? Nov 22, 2016 18:33

Playstation 4: Apr 25, 2014; Unlockable Ben

I'd play the new 64bit release, but I'm pretty much at the point where I refuse to play without therapist and we're almost 5 months in with no sign of an x64 version.

I'll come back when that's a thing, the x86 ones just keep crashing now.

# ? Nov 23, 2016 10:40

IAmTheRad: Dec 11, 2009; Goddammit this Cello is way out of tune!

DFHack 0.43.05 alpha-2 has been released.

# ? Nov 23, 2016 12:20

neogeo0823: Jul 4, 2007; NO THAT'S NOT ME!!

I had a wierd thing happen yesterday. The game was running a solid 100FPS since I started my fort. Then I read about upping it to 150FPS here and decided to try it. I restarted LNP, set the FPS at 150, and ran the game. It took twice as long to load to the start screen, and then the fort ran at 50fps consistently, instead of the previously locked/reported 100FPS. What gives?

Also, how much do you guys exploit the manager orders screen? I see that I can pretty effortlessly use it to set up production chains and industries that run on more or less autopilot, as well as set large work orders for, say, a whole new batch of bedroom furniture for a new wing of living space. I guess what I'm wondering is if there's any downside to completely exploiting this system as much as I can?

# ? Nov 23, 2016 16:32

IAmTheRad: Dec 11, 2009; Goddammit this Cello is way out of tune!

neogeo0823 posted:

I had a wierd thing happen yesterday. The game was running a solid 100FPS since I started my fort. Then I read about upping it to 150FPS here and decided to try it. I restarted LNP, set the FPS at 150, and ran the game. It took twice as long to load to the start screen, and then the fort ran at 50fps consistently, instead of the previously locked/reported 100FPS. What gives?

Also, how much do you guys exploit the manager orders screen? I see that I can pretty effortlessly use it to set up production chains and industries that run on more or less autopilot, as well as set large work orders for, say, a whole new batch of bedroom furniture for a new wing of living space. I guess what I'm wondering is if there's any downside to completely exploiting this system as much as I can?

there is almost no downside for running huge production orders.
The only thing that might be a downside is when you need to build something like a sword NOW but your queues are all filled up with making coins to fill in your armor training root.

# ? Nov 23, 2016 16:47

neogeo0823: Jul 4, 2007; NO THAT'S NOT ME!!

IAmTheRad posted:

there is almost no downside for running huge production orders.
The only thing that might be a downside is when you need to build something like a sword NOW but your queues are all filled up with making coins to fill in your armor training root.

I think if you wanna make something "manually" and the shop's busy withother orders, as long as the task queue isn't completely full, you can queue the task, set it to max priority, and then hit the Do It Now button and it'll get done.

How do you guys manage gem cutting? I know about the DFHack option through the orders menu, but it's producing constant job cancellation notices, which are annoying. The manager only seems to deal in cutting each individual gem, which is tedious as gently caress. Should I use the method that the wiki mentions, where you set a work task and then modify it with the any material parameter? Or would that cancel out once I run out of gems and need to be set up again?

# ? Nov 23, 2016 19:54

IAmTheRad: Dec 11, 2009; Goddammit this Cello is way out of tune!

neogeo0823 posted:

I think if you wanna make something "manually" and the shop's busy withother orders, as long as the task queue isn't completely full, you can queue the task, set it to max priority, and then hit the Do It Now button and it'll get done.

How do you guys manage gem cutting? I know about the DFHack option through the orders menu, but it's producing constant job cancellation notices, which are annoying. The manager only seems to deal in cutting each individual gem, which is tedious as gently caress. Should I use the method that the wiki mentions, where you set a work task and then modify it with the any material parameter? Or would that cancel out once I run out of gems and need to be set up again?

I think if you add a condition for an endless order, it will just queue a new gem when it's ready. I don't know how it works as I just use autogems in dfhack.

# ? Nov 23, 2016 21:16

Decrepus: May 21, 2008; In the end, his dominion did not touch a single poster.

When I am looking for Dwarf Fortress embarks I am looking for peril. Although not too much peril.

# ? Nov 23, 2016 22:36

Neurion: Jun 3, 2013; The musical fruit
The more you eat
The more you hoot

Decrepus posted:

When I am looking for Dwarf Fortress embarks I am looking for peril. Although not too much peril.

I tend to embark near a castle with eight score blondes and brunettes, all between 16 and 19-and-a-half.

# ? Nov 25, 2016 11:37

neogeo0823: Jul 4, 2007; NO THAT'S NOT ME!!

what's the best way to construct a wall that's invader resistant? Does it matter if it's raw stone, or should it be blocks? Does that apply if I make an overhang 1 zlevel up off the ground? What about if I carve fortifications into the overhang?

# ? Nov 26, 2016 02:09

Crimson Harvest: Jul 14, 2004; I'm a GENERAL, not some opera floozy!

Blocks can't be scaled but raw stone can be. Also make sure to cut down nearby trees and ideally pave the exterior to prevent new trees.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 02:24

DeathSandwich: Apr 24, 2008; I fucking hate puzzles.

neogeo0823 posted:

what's the best way to construct a wall that's invader resistant? Does it matter if it's raw stone, or should it be blocks? Does that apply if I make an overhang 1 zlevel up off the ground? What about if I carve fortifications into the overhang?

For your outside walls a moat+drawbridge is basically sufficient to stop most anything ground basedfrom getting in if you don't want it. I don't think there's a whole lot that will tunnel through walls to get to you.

If you're dealing with dragons/demons, invest in fire safe materials for your walls.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 02:38

PublicOpinion: Oct 21, 2010; Her style is new but the face is the same as it was so long ago...

DeathSandwich posted:

For your outside walls a moat+drawbridge is basically sufficient to stop most anything ground basedfrom getting in if you don't want it. I don't think there's a whole lot that will tunnel through walls to get to you.

If you're dealing with dragons/demons, invest in fire safe materials for your walls.

Without DFHack wizardry (and I'm just hedging my bets, I don't know if there's actually a plugin), constructions cannot be damaged/burned. You can block lava with a log wall. I'm not sure if anything can actually hang off the underside of a wall; I always build mine 2 levels high with the upper level hanging over.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 03:00

IAmTheRad: Dec 11, 2009; Goddammit this Cello is way out of tune!

A featherweight log which is basically lighter than balsa wood can support an entire fortress.

Physics has no power in Dwarf Fortress.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 03:14

Captain Mediocre: Oct 14, 2005; Saving lives and money!

I think I remember reading on the wiki that the overhang has to be an actual floor. If you overhang with a fortification or another wall it can still be climbed apparently. Not sure if this is up to date info though.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 04:05

Pickled Tink: Apr 28, 2012; Have you heard about First Dog? It's a very good comic I just love.

Also, wear your bike helmets kids. I copped several blows to the head but my helmet left me totally unscathed.

Finally you should check out First Dog as it's a good comic I like it very much.; Fun Shoe

You should put the overhang atop at least two levels of wall. Blocks are harder to scale, rough stone walls are easier. Plus you get multiple blocks from a single stone so it saves resources to use blocks.

I have built a lava containment device on the surface out of ice. Constructions cannot be damaged unless you collapse them.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 10:43

PublicOpinion: Oct 21, 2010; Her style is new but the face is the same as it was so long ago...

Captain Mediocre posted:

I think I remember reading on the wiki that the overhang has to be an actual floor. If you overhang with a fortification or another wall it can still be climbed apparently. Not sure if this is up to date info though.

Some testing with building walls in adventure mode bears this out. Could somehow ninja-climb from underneath an overhanging wall, could not do the same with an extended floor.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 10:50

neogeo0823: Jul 4, 2007; NO THAT'S NOT ME!!

Captain Mediocre posted:

I think I remember reading on the wiki that the overhang has to be an actual floor. If you overhang with a fortification or another wall it can still be climbed apparently. Not sure if this is up to date info though.

Pickled Tink posted:

You should put the overhang atop at least two levels of wall. Blocks are harder to scale, rough stone walls are easier. Plus you get multiple blocks from a single stone so it saves resources to use blocks.

I have built a lava containment device on the surface out of ice. Constructions cannot be damaged unless you collapse them.

Ok, so it should go like this?:

code:

W=wall 
F=fortification, with constructed floor underneath
G=ground
_=open space

____
___F
_WW
_WW
GGGG

# ? Nov 26, 2016 16:25

John Lee: Mar 2, 2013; A time traveling adventure everyone can enjoy

Did the confusing and buggy military management screen ever get fixed? I remember being excited when it was introduced, only to be disappointed when I found that it was unintuitive as hell and also had special unlisted requirements with regards to weapon, armor, and ammo placement, so that my military dwarves would almost never be wearing what I wanted them to.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 16:58

IAmTheRad: Dec 11, 2009; Goddammit this Cello is way out of tune!

John Lee posted:

Did the confusing and buggy military management screen ever get fixed? I remember being excited when it was introduced, only to be disappointed when I found that it was unintuitive as hell and also had special unlisted requirements with regards to weapon, armor, and ammo placement, so that my military dwarves would almost never be wearing what I wanted them to.

Haha, a intuitive military screen.
It's still garbage.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 19:27

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# ? May 26, 2024 02:03

Tars Tarkas: Apr 13, 2003; Rock the Mok

A nasty woman, I think you should try is, Jess.

If you set the uniforms to replace clothing and then assign them to the squad, eventually they'll wear what they are supposed to wear (make sure you have enough of all the items and it helps to then station the squad right after assigning so they'll start grabbing their uniform)

But it still sucks and I get occasional morons who don't grab clothes even when I got plenty of stuff their size

# ? Nov 26, 2016 19:41

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Dwarf Fortress: The child punches the cave spider in the thorax, bruising the brain!

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