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Arsenic Lupin posted:Well, he had Alzheimer's, so she wasn't resigning to have quality time, she was resigning to be with a very sick man who she'd vowed to love, honor, and so on.
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Nov 22, 2016 13:48
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FlamingLiberal posted:He also left her for another woman if I recall Ironically, it was him having the trouble recalling.
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Nov 22, 2016 15:17
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e:f
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Nov 22, 2016 15:46
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Evil Fluffy posted:Both already have 4 liberals plus Kennedy to defend them. The crazy thing is that if the GOP actually catches the car they've been chasing re: abortion, it's going to seriously damage one of their most successful local level campaign strategies in every election for decades, at least in states where they have a shot at winning. Furthermore, it's going to give Democrats a shiny new campaign issue in areas where they're currently on the outs (Wisconsin, Michigan, etc) but not solidly so. If Obergfell is reversed, I think it will give the Democrats a fire they haven't had since 2008 (since it will be harder for younger idealistic Democrats to muse about both sides being the same) Not to say any of this is good, it's the ultimate broken window fallacy to say that destroying everything we've fought for in order to break the apathy preventing us from fighting for stuff is a good thing. But it may end up being a bad thing for the GOP override367 fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 15:54
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override367 posted:If Obergfell is reversed, I think it will give the Democrats a fire they haven't had since 2008 (since it will be harder for younger idealistic Democrats to muse about both sides being the same) Yes, gay marriage can go back to being the winning electoral issue it was pre-Obergfell, truly a boon for the Democrats.
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Nov 22, 2016 16:28
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override367 posted:Not to say any of this is good, it's the ultimate broken window fallacy to say that destroying everything we've fought for in order to break the apathy preventing us from fighting for stuff is a good thing. But it may end up being a bad thing for the GOP Yeah, "Things are great" and "nothing matters both are the same" infected several of my acquaintances who are otherwise pro-marriage-equality and pro-choice. As much as the whole "summer children" thing is overused, these loving summer children don't seem to get at their core that as much as 40% of the populace actively wants these not to be rights in the states. It is difficult to see the broken window leading to diminished apathy bit as a silver lining when the subject matter is human rights :\ Potato Salad fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 16:59
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Potato Salad posted:Yeah, "Things are great" and "nothing matters both are the same" infected several of my acquaintances who are otherwise pro-marriage-equality and pro-choice. As much as the whole "summer children" thing is overused, these loving summer children don't seem to get at their core that as much as 40% of the populace actively wants these not to be rights in the states. What were their identities and classes?
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Nov 22, 2016 17:01
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Pollyanna posted:What were their identities and classes? White, well-off or believes they are entitled to be well off by their education (and not the fact that they keep losing jobs due to being repeatedly late / lazy), male, and progressively radicalized by Reddit and pol. One bought a gun, no poo poo, out of fear that Black Lives Matter rioting was going to march down the street and steal his stuff / kill whitey (him). Layer in incremental acceptance of political conspiracy theory du jour. Potato Salad fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 17:03
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Basically people who are becoming steaming heaps of trash that I'm distancing myself from 
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Nov 22, 2016 17:04
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Potato Salad posted:White, well-off or believes they are entitled to be well off by their education (and not the fact that they keep losing jobs due to being repeatedly late / lazy), male, and progressively radicalized by Reddit and pol. Sounds like Trump voters to me.
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Nov 22, 2016 17:05
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Pollyanna posted:Sounds like Trump voters to me. ding ding ding edit -- aaaand enough of the vent on my personal life and radicalized ex-friends. Sorry to do this in the scotus thread.
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Nov 22, 2016 17:05
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Enh, we're past due for a new thread at this point. General tip for radicalized friends: if you can get to them in the process, source denigration helps a lot. Conspiracy theories around the election are almost always directly or indirectly coming from Russian propaganda sources. Make direct comparison between the method and form of the source of the conspiracy theory and fringe theories on the Right.
Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 17:21 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 17:18
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Antti posted:drat, I had already managed to forget there was already that one voting lawsuit against NC, I was already thinking about the pending second lawsuit that'll probably happen when the NC legislature installs McCrory for a second term even though he got thousands of votes less. I can't wait to watch him outright steal the election and have it upheld along party lines by the SCOTUS. Then when he puts down the subsequent riots you'll have the Trumpists crowing about violent blacks/liberals and other poo poo. If the state GOP helps him steal the election I hope they all burn, both figuratively and literally. Discendo Vox posted:Enh, we're past due for a new thread at this point. General tip for radicalized friends: if you can get to them in the process, source denigration helps a lot. Conspiracy theories around the election are almost always directly or indirectly coming from Russian propaganda sources. Make direct comparison between the method and form of the source of the conspiracy theory and fringe theories on the Right. Pointing out the Russian sources of conspiracies and propaganda just makes them dig in harder because "blaming Russia is a Clinton misinformation tactic" is heavily entrenched thought in those circles. You aren't going to dislodge conspiracies by pointing out facts that are a major pillar of the conspiracies misinformation. You'll only reinforce it.
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Nov 22, 2016 17:55
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Evil Fluffy posted:Pointing out the Russian sources of conspiracies and propaganda just makes them dig in harder because "blaming Russia is a Clinton misinformation tactic" is heavily entrenched thought in those circles. You aren't going to dislodge conspiracies by pointing out facts that are a major pillar of the conspiracies misinformation. You'll only reinforce it. Hence "in the process" - by the point that they're relying on Russian sources for source selection and believe there's a "Clinton misinformation machine", they're gone and I don't know what can bring them back based purely on interpersonal communication. It takes a major realignment once they're into the source selection part. My experience is there's a variably lengthy period of initial exposure to the messages where they can be brought back through source denigration.
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Nov 22, 2016 18:15
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Discendo Vox posted:Enh, we're past due for a new thread at this point. General tip for radicalized friends: if you can get to them in the process, source denigration helps a lot. Conspiracy theories around the election are almost always directly or indirectly coming from Russian propaganda sources. Make direct comparison between the method and form of the source of the conspiracy theory and fringe theories on the Right. This got me thinking that we could use a rhetoric thread in DND. Call it Advanced Debate and Discussion if need be, and ruthlessly moderate it.
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Nov 22, 2016 18:51
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So several of the GOP's more visible voter suppression tactics are currently being litigated. Are there any grounds to litigate some of the more subtlety heinous tactics like poll site consolidation, or are "budgetary concerns" enough of a bullshit shield that a suit would go nowhere?
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Nov 22, 2016 19:11
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Stickman posted:So several of the GOP's more visible voter suppression tactics are currently being litigated. Are there any grounds to litigate some of the more subtlety heinous tactics like poll site consolidation, or are "budgetary concerns" enough of a bullshit shield that a suit would go nowhere? All those suits are pretty much guaranteed to die at the SCOTUS. The only one I have any hope for is NC's simply because the NC GOP didn't even try to hide the fact that they were tragetting minorities and others who vote Democratic. Even then I'm wary of any conservative justice seeing it as more than "they targeted Democrats specifically, not minorities specifically, so it's ok" even though it's some of the most oppressive bullshit imaginable. e: Let's not forget that the NC GOP, in response to a conservative state supreme court member losing to a liberal, is looking at simply packing the court as well, which they could easily do before McCrory's term ends if they don't just steal the election outright. There's absolutely zero chance of Trump's DoJ giving the slightest gently caress about any of this either. I think NC's a prime example of what we're going to see if/when the Democrats make any sort of inroads in future national election for the White House or Congress. Evil Fluffy fucked around with this message at 19:28 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 19:23
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Evil Fluffy posted:All those suits are pretty much guaranteed to die at the SCOTUS. The only one I have any hope for is NC's simply because the NC GOP didn't even try to hide the fact that they were tragetting minorities and others who vote Democratic. Even then I'm wary of any conservative justice seeing it as more than "they targeted Democrats specifically, not minorities specifically, so it's ok" even though it's some of the most oppressive bullshit imaginable. Yeah, I'm sadly aware that they're probably dead in the water, I'm just curious if there is legitimate existing legal grounds for fighting limitation of poll access beyond trying to prove that it disproportionately affected minorities. Even if it disproportionately affected non-minorities, it seems like it could be argued as violating a fundamental right to vote, but is there precedent equating "right to vote" with ease of voting access beyond oppressed groups? E: I mean, I guess if the suits get shot down, the answer will be "no and not for minorities either" from now on, so it will be moot 
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Nov 22, 2016 19:31
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So there has been a situation at UNC-CH where this professor who is basically a freeper has been going on racist and homophobic rants directed at specific students for years, he's basically been trying to bait them into firing him as he has already successfully sued the school before. https://www.buzzfeed.com/tasneemnashrulla/uncw-professor-free-speech-debate?utm_term=.ownx42JKZx#.ekE25gOLR2 Where is the limit here? Could a professor have a blog where they just chose a new student to personally disparage each day and never lose their job as long as they didn't threaten violence? I don't understand why if this rear end in a top hat can get away with this why other professors don't poo poo all over their students in this manner, given how many lovely people there are out there.
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Nov 30, 2016 23:27
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MaxxBot posted:So there has been a situation at UNC-CH where this professor who is basically a freeper has been going on racist and homophobic rants directed at specific students for years, he's basically been trying to bait them into firing him as he has already successfully sued the school before. It'd be institution-specific, probably. He's a full prof now, which would give him tenure protections.
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Dec 1, 2016 02:08
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Tenure might protect him from the school, but does it immunize him against a (civil rights?) suit on the part of the students?
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Dec 1, 2016 03:12
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Subjunctive posted:Tenure might protect him from the school, but does it immunize him against a (civil rights?) suit on the part of the students? No, but a lack of a cause of action would do that. Hurt feelings and being mad aren't a tort.
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Dec 1, 2016 04:27
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Sounds like a great reason to break up teachers unions and get rid of tenure, OP.
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Dec 1, 2016 07:12
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Number Ten Cocks posted:No, but a lack of a cause of action would do that. Hurt feelings and being mad aren't a tort. I was thinking something along the lines of a hostile workplace suit. Having your boss spew racist drivel is actionable, no?
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Dec 1, 2016 07:16
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Number Ten Cocks posted:No, but a lack of a cause of action would do that. Hurt feelings and being mad aren't a tort. Two words: Title IX
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Dec 1, 2016 07:23
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Subjunctive posted:I was thinking something along the lines of a hostile workplace suit. Having your boss spew racist drivel is actionable, no? I haven't read beyond what's in this thread but the most obvious cause of action would be IIED. I don't know the local standards or actual severity of the case, but if 'nonconsensual outing of a gay person from a country that kills gay people' doesn't raise a flag, well idk, what would on a superficial reading?
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Dec 1, 2016 07:28
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Kazak_Hstan posted:I haven't read beyond what's in this thread but the most obvious cause of action would be IIED. I don't know the local standards or actual severity of the case, but if 'nonconsensual outing of a gay person from a country that kills gay people' doesn't raise a flag, well idk, what would on a superficial reading? Extremely hard to prevail on, especially if the person who was outed was in fact a leader of a lgbtq group and openly posted about it, Even if the posts were under a pseudonym Also having outing people being grounds for iied would be a bad precedent I think. Iirc there have been a few well known websites that out prominent anti gay politicians, could set them out as a target
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Dec 1, 2016 08:21
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EwokEntourage posted:Also having outing people being grounds for iied would be a bad precedent I think. Iirc there have been a few well known websites that out prominent anti gay politicians, could set them out as a target Good?
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Dec 1, 2016 11:17
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Subjunctive posted:Good? The websites, not the politicians. If only the law worked in our favor and not in theirs, it'd be easy.
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Dec 1, 2016 14:00
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Pollyanna posted:The websites, not the politicians. Good?
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Dec 1, 2016 14:08
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Subjunctive posted:Good? 
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Dec 1, 2016 14:13
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Outing prominent gay people who are hostile to LGBT rights is not a cut and dry ethical question. I feel like you're making yourself fair game by entering the public sphere and campaigning against the rights of a group of people, but I'm not gay.
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Dec 1, 2016 14:18
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Northwestern still has the holocaust denier on faculty after 50 years, so good luck tossing the UNC guy
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Dec 1, 2016 14:20
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Number Ten Cocks posted:Yes, gay marriage can go back to being the winning electoral issue it was pre-Obergfell, truly a boon for the Democrats. Yep, in the same way getting your legs crushed in an industrial accident means you don't have to go to work anymore It'll be great
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Dec 1, 2016 14:23
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That guy is not going to have anything happen to him short of students getting physical and beating the poo poo out of him. He knows that isn't going to happen and that there's nothing that can legally be done to stop what he's doing. Welcome to reality.Pollyanna posted:The websites, not the politicians. Oh no, what will we do in a world without sites like Gawker.
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Dec 1, 2016 18:37
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I love how the guy uses the First Amendment as a shield to spout hate speech with no consequences but I guarantee you he believes white male conservatives are the most persecuted group in America. Yeah the guy who Tweeted: "Right now I'm learning Black Queer English: "Thtop it fo I spaz on you ... and scratch yo eyes out!" I'm sure has reasoned views on the concept of white privilege in America. Also we can't divine anything from his avalanche of racist/bigoted tweets. What he really believes is a mystery. VVVV Unzip and Attack fucked around with this message at 19:28 on Dec 1, 2016 |
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Dec 1, 2016 19:04
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Unzip and Attack posted:I love how the guy uses the First Amendment as a shield to spout hate speech with no consequences but I guarantee you he believes white male conservatives are the most persecuted group in America.
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Dec 1, 2016 19:17
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Dead Reckoning posted:And I bet he rolls coal in a lifted pickup and has a small penis and is sexually frustrated and smugly posts gun rights memes on Facebook, and arrgh he's just a perfect vessel to pour all the opinions of people I disagree with into! Have you read the quotes though? Seems pretty fitting for what Unzip has said...
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Dec 1, 2016 21:10
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Kawasaki Nun posted:Have you read the quotes though? Seems pretty fitting for what Unzip has said...
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Dec 1, 2016 21:15
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Unzip and Attack posted:I love how the guy uses the First Amendment as a shield to spout hate speech with no consequences but I guarantee you he believes white male conservatives are the most persecuted group in America. How dare you suggest that a known racist may also have other racist beliefs.
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