Independence Day 2: Resturgeonce

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Which Thread Title shall we name this new thread? This poll is closed.
Independence Day 2: Resturgeonce	44	21.36%
ScotPol - Unclustering this gently caress	19	9.22%
Trainspotting 2: Independence is my heroin	9	4.37%
Indyref II: Boris hosed a Dead Country	14	6.80%
ScotPol: Wings over Bullshit	8	3.88%
Independence 2: Cameron Lied, UK Died	24	11.65%
Scotpol IV: I Vow To Flee My Country	14	6.80%
ScotPol - A twice in a generation thread	17	8.25%
ScotPol - Where Everything's hosed Up and the Referendums Don't Matter	15	7.28%
ScotPol Thread: Dependence Referendum Incoming	2	0.97%
Indyref II: The Scottish Insturgeoncy	10	4.85%
ScotPol Thread: Act of European Union	5	2.43%
ScotPol - Like Game of Thrones only we wish we would all die	25	12.14%
Total:	206 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

Angepain: Jul 13, 2012; what keeps happening to my clothes

I do wish the media could give a bit more context about these kinds of figures, rather than just throwing a big number in your face and running off. In my amateur attempt to understand it better, a wikipedia page i found gives Scotland's 16/17 budget as about 33bn, so if that's the right figure then 800m is 2.4%? Seems fairly decent, even if it is stretched out over a few years, but then I'm no budgetologist.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 01:28

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# ? May 14, 2024 16:22

Extreme0: Feb 28, 2013; I dance to the sweet tune of your failure so I'm never gonna stop fucking with you.

Continue to get confused and frustrated with me as I dance to your anger.

As I expect nothing more from ya you stupid runt!

Angepain posted:

I do wish the media could give a bit more context about these kinds of figures, rather than just throwing a big number in your face and running off. In my amateur attempt to understand it better, a wikipedia page i found gives Scotland's 16/17 budget as about 33bn, so if that's the right figure then 800m is 2.4%? Seems fairly decent, even if it is stretched out over a few years, but then I'm no budgetologist.

Mind this isn't an actual increase to the Scottish Budget but rather just a one-off.

800 Million is not going to fix what's going to be massively damaged soon.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 01:33

Angepain: Jul 13, 2012; what keeps happening to my clothes

Can we use the cash to attach extra triangles onto our Scottish toblerones?

# ? Nov 24, 2016 01:34

Extreme0: Feb 28, 2013; I dance to the sweet tune of your failure so I'm never gonna stop fucking with you.

Continue to get confused and frustrated with me as I dance to your anger.

As I expect nothing more from ya you stupid runt!

Angepain posted:

Can we use the cash to attach extra triangles onto our Scottish toblerones?

�800 million in establishing our own Scottish Toblerones which instead of triangles, it's hexagons.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 01:35

baronvonsabre: Aug 1, 2013

Shock as SNP policy which could absolutely never ever result in school league tables being produced leads to league tables being produced

quote:

Scotland�s prominent teachers union have spoken out after the appearance of a local school league table in East Lothian.

THE SCOTTISH Government has repeatedly insisted that a new regime of standardised testing will not result in league tables comparing schools across the country.

CommonSpace was sent the tables, which compared pupil performance across schools in the East Lothian area and were distributed to local parents. The primary years highlighted are years P1, P4 and P7; the same years as those set for standardised testing when it is rolled-out in 2017. The �Experimental statistics�, which a covering letter from East Lothian council stressed represented a preparatory stage before the implementation of standardised testing, record the percentage of pupils reaching expected Curriculum for Excellence (CfE) standards across reading, writing, listening and talking and numeracy.

...

An East Lothian council spokesperson told CommonSpace that the data distributed to parents �was to explain that there is no agreed national framework for gathering information and that local data cannot be used in comparison with other authorities�.

Campaigners and unions now worry that the appearance of localised league tables, even before the national roll-out of standardised testing, sets a dangerous precedent.

Commenting on the tables, a Scottish Government spokesperson said: �The Scottish Government will not be publishing league tables. We believe it is important to have school level data that provides a clearer, more complete picture and understanding of where performance is strong and where improvement activity must be focused.

�It is for local authorities to choose whether they distribute teacher professional judgement data in this fashion to parents and other stakeholders.�

All emphasis mine.

# ? Nov 25, 2016 18:08

Niric: Jul 23, 2008

baronvonsabre posted:

Shock as SNP policy which could absolutely never ever result in school league tables being produced leads to league tables being produced

All emphasis mine.

I don't think I've spoken to anyone, of any political stripe, who has a good word to say about the SNP's education policy with regard to schools. Does anyone know of any good articles that offer an overview?

Completely unrelated, the always-engaging Brian Taylor* has an piece on the most recent FMQs, and makes an interesting argument about how the Tories have, potentially, traded seats and political visibility for direct policy influence. He speculates that the Greens are in a good position to capitalise, which could be a very good thing for leftish policy-making at the Parliament.

quote:

In politics - as on our railways - timing is key. Such became clear once more during questions to the First Minister at Holyrood today.

I suspect Ruth Davidson knows by now that she should have tackled the FM on the issue of rail transport last week. She did so today - but stumbled over a tricky set of points, somewhat derailing her attack.

Ms Davidson, she of the principal opposition Conservatives, opened her attack in fine fettle. There were, she said, some 250 items in the improvement programme imposed upon ScotRail as a consequence of under-performance.

Her timbre stentorian, she demanded of the First Minister: "Will her government now publish those 250 action points - or not?" Up popped Nicola Sturgeon to reply: "Yes." She said a bit more but the impact was all in that opening word.

Nothing daunted, Ms Davidson persisted. Except it appeared that she was decidedly daunted, indeed thrown. She began to read her prepared supplementary - which was formulated on the presumption that the FM would turn down the request for publication.

She rallied - if not with aplomb, at least with a disarming smile. But the moment was lost. Her attack, entirely understandably, lacked bite from that moment onwards.
Dugdale's Dossier

Still, there will be other days. But did not Labour's Kezia Dugdale make it worse still for the cheerfully grinning Tory leader?

Ms Dugdale was already basking in the knowledge that she had raised the trains last week. But she had more. She brandished a weighty dossier - OK, ten pages with big print and lots of pictures.

It was Labour's plan for a price freeze on rail fares for next year. Compensation, she argued, for poor service at the moment.

You could almost hear Ruth Davidson's teeth grinding as, still contriving to smile, she contemplated the prospect that her Labour rival had outpaced her again with a cunning wheeze. One that I now believe Ms Dugdale will evangelise to commuters.

Nicola Sturgeon responded in somewhat chilly fashion. Yes, of course, she would look at any constructive plan - but she wondered where the cash was coming from and whether it would risk eating into the Scottish Government's substantial plan to upgrade rail services.

You could almost hear Kezia Dugdale thinking: job done. Timing is all.

And timing matters too in the negotiations to come over the Scottish Budget. Looking at the emerging shape, it is hard to escape the conclusion that it may be time... for the Greens. I stress, may.

Patrick Harvie, he who co-convenes the verdant tendency, seemed to add to that impression by delivering what amounted to a shopping list with regard to the Budget.

To recap slightly. The Chancellor has set out plans for the UK in his Autumn Statement. But it is for the Scottish finance secretary to propose spending plans for devolved matters. And, in these days of enhanced Holyrood power, it is for that self-same FS to outline Scottish income tax rates and bands.

That wider scope, those wider powers, increase the prospect for division among the parties. But, equally, ministers need to assemble a majority to get their Budget carried. They lack such a lead at Holyrood.
Dealmaker Derek

From 2007 to 2011, the SNP were similarly short of a majority. In those days, John Swinney negotiated long and hard, generally contriving to strike a deal with the Tories in return for concessions to the Conservative agenda. (Margo MacDonald usually managed to extract something as well, to win her independent vote.)

So what might happen, now that we are back to those minority days - albeit by a narrower margin? Derek Mackay has begun the search for a deal, by offering talks.

Given the arithmetic, he only needs one party to support him - or, at least, abstain. Where might he look?
Image caption As a minority government, the SNP will need at an opposition party to at least abstain in the final budget vote

The Conservatives? Certainly, their approach in 2007-11 was to bargain, gaining for example concessions on business rates and town centre redevelopment.

But their approach, their self-awareness, has altered. At the 2016 election, they contrived to place themselves in contradistinction to the SNP as the chief defenders of the Union.

That sense of status was bolstered by their relative success in those elections. Put most simply, they are now sounding more oppositional.

Plus there is the question of tax. Nicola Sturgeon today stressed that her government would not replicate the Chancellor's effective cut for higher earners, achieved by increasing to �50,000 the higher rate threshold.

Ms Sturgeon is at pains to stress that this does not increase the individual tax bill for people in Scotland. But it would mean that Scotland residents would pay more than comparable folk in England.

I do not believe that the Tories could bring themselves to back a budget which resulted in such a development. So I think, at this stage, it is: Tories - No Deal.
Deal or no deal

Labour? Don't think so. Their longer-term objective is to regain the ground lost to the SNP. Labour's aim will be to set themselves firmly apart from the Nationalists, suggesting that it is Labour MSPs who are speaking up for the proletariat.

Hence their 2016 manifesto proposal to increase income tax on the standard and upper rates by one per cent, using the money to "stop the cuts to public services." They have continued to pursue that objective since - and will do so in the budget negotiations.

I do not remotely see Nicola Sturgeon overturning a key element of her programme in order to bolster the party who came third in the election. So it's Labour - No Deal.

Ditto the Liberal Democrats. On tax, they wanted a Penny for Education. They will talk with Mr Mackay - as will the other parties. But, again as things stand, I think it is: LibDems - No Deal.

Which leaves the Greens. Yes, they also took a different stance on tax from the SNP, advocating substantial reform to leave upper earners paying more.

But, against that, they are more intuitively open to engaging with the SNP on the grounds that both parties support independence.

Plus, to repeat, Patrick Harvie appears the most willing to talk - in that he has already submitted his proposals and repeated them today in questions to the First Minister.

He wants investment in energy efficiency, a top up to child benefit and an extension of the use of the Living Wage.

Ministers, I suspect, could look at these and other ideas - without necessarily conceding the entire package.

But, again, there is tax. Mr Harvie has today repeated his tax proposals and warned that his party will only be able to support "a bold and creative anti-poverty budget."

These talks could be tricky.

* of all the UK political commentators, I think Taylor has my favourite writing style; it's witty, clear and every so slightly self-consciously wordy without being irritating or pompous

# ? Nov 27, 2016 13:08

Extreme0: Feb 28, 2013; I dance to the sweet tune of your failure so I'm never gonna stop fucking with you.

Continue to get confused and frustrated with me as I dance to your anger.

As I expect nothing more from ya you stupid runt!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0833d4b/sunday-politics-scotland-27112016

38 Minutes in and David Mundell is a little bit unhinged with Gordon Brewer

Then Fiona Hyslop came on and continued to be a little unhinged with Gordon Brewer.

# ? Nov 28, 2016 01:46

Chas McGill: Oct 29, 2010; loves Fat Philippe

Any Aberdonian ppl in Edinburgh tell me where I can find Moray Cup in edinburgh? It is for a joke gift.

If there's another Scottish thread, I can't be bothered finding it.

# ? Nov 29, 2016 21:14

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Chas McGill posted:

Any Aberdonian ppl in Edinburgh tell me where I can find Moray Cup in edinburgh? It is for a joke gift.

If there's another Scottish thread, I can't be bothered finding it.

Try chippers. They may have it in the fridge.

# ? Nov 29, 2016 21:29

keep punching joe: Jan 22, 2006; Die Satan!

Why did no one tell me that Banff has its own brand of ginger. Is it just Red Kola, or something else entirely?

# ? Nov 29, 2016 21:56

Chas McGill: Oct 29, 2010; loves Fat Philippe

Jedit posted:

Try chippers. They may have it in the fridge.

Good idea. I can't find it anywhere actually for sale online and I'm worried it'll cease production because it should be illegal, probably.

# ? Nov 29, 2016 21:58

Niric: Jul 23, 2008

I know this was getting some discussion in UKMT, but it seemed appropriate to cross post here too:

TinTower posted:

This is actually bad for Labour:

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/803901731981688832

Coohoolin got a bit piled on, but I think he made a solid (if poorly worded) point:

Coohoolin posted:

The Tories are winning votes in Scotland because they're hoovering up the unionist support that Labour helped galvanize and then lost by being as flimsy as possible and because Scottish politics is slowly polarising into Left Wing Independence and Right Wing Unionism.

With respect to that particular poll, it's not the Tories gaining at labour's expense, but there's definitely something in this. Putting aside the whole "the SNP are not really left wing" thing fr a second, there's pretty inarguably a perception, at least, that they are left wing amongst a decent chunk of the left. If nothing else, they're (generally) to the left of the Tories, and quite frankly I don't think left/right is a useful way of looking at politics any more, at least electorally. I know that's been basically the message since the early 90s and third wayism, but it really does seem like trying to define a party in those terms has no resonance, because the overwhelming majority of people don't care. There's a very broad and vague narrative going on about tax cuts vs no tax cuts, but that doesn't seem to be getting all that much traction, ane simply saying "the SNP aren't left wing" has done nothing to shift perceptions of them as the anti-tories.

That this is being folded into a (binary) constitutional issue is interesting to compare with brexit, and in both cases it's labour who are getting screwed with no obvious way to respond. Unlike the SNP in Scotland, becoming the focal point of the losing side in the referendum doesn't have the same power, because there's not the same clear case of being able to try again next time.

Someone (jedit?) made an interesting point before about a Tory revival in the north east, and there's the potential for a more or less reversion to (simplistically) town v country voting, with the SNP essentially just supplanting labour as the city/central belt party and the Tories as the not-snp "natural" opposition. It's really difficult to see how labour could fit into that dynamic, and they could be condemned to be the new lib dems, getting 10-20% as the third party protest vote, but lacking any means or clear platform to build on that.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 17:03

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

The tories are currently a nationalist party with more power than the SNP, people who like nationalism can easily vote for them.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 17:13

EmptyVessel: Oct 30, 2012

Thought some of you might be interested in this event happening in Glasgow this weekend. It's too far/travel's too expensive for me to go unfortunately.

War On Want posted:

Neoliberal Scotland: the lost decade

Free event - Saturday 3 December - 10:30am to 4:30pm
39 Napiershall Street, Glasgow, G20 6EZ
Book Ticket (see link below)

Mark Langdon, a War on Want member in Scotland, is co-organising a series of events we thought you may be interested in.
You are invited to discuss the last ten years of neoliberalism in the Scottish context - this Saturday 3 December - at Neoliberal Scotland: The lost decade.
The event will also give participants the opportunity to offer ideas for, and get involved in the planning of the important Neoliberalism v Democracy - Waking Up to Reality event which is due to take place in Glasgow on 11 & 12 February 2017.

If you have any questions about either event, please contact Mark Langdon at mflangdon@gmail.com

The link to book a free ticket is here:
https://www.eventbrite.com/e/neoliberal-scotland-the-lost-decade-tickets-29203957824

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:17

Pissflaps: Oct 20, 2002; by VideoGames

I think it's clear that the SNP and nationalism has reached its high water mark.

The case for independence is weaker now than it was two years ago: and it was piss poor then.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:18

mehall: Aug 27, 2010

Pissflaps posted:

I think it's clear that the SNP and nationalism has reached its high water mark.

The case for independence is weaker now than it was two years ago: and it was piss poor then.

Shut the gently caress up Pissflaps.

Like, i can add content, but thats basically what I'd end up saying.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:22

forkboy84: Jun 13, 2012; Corgis love bread. And Puro

The case for independence is weaker than it was when the UK was still in the EU & it didn't really look likely that we would leave?

OK Flaps. That's silly but par for the course I guess.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:26

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

forkboy84 posted:

The case for independence is weaker than it was when the UK was still in the EU & it didn't really look likely that we would leave?

OK Flaps. That's silly but par for the course I guess.

I think it unlikely that independence would occur before the UK leaves the EU which would then mean that Scotland would be out of the EU upon becoming independent.

Which isn't a good position for it to be in.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:28

Pissflaps: Oct 20, 2002; by VideoGames

forkboy84 posted:

The case for independence is weaker than it was when the UK was still in the EU & it didn't really look likely that we would leave?

Absolutely.

The UK is a far more important economic union to Scotland than the EU is: Brexit means that an independent Scotland would be even worse off than before.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:29

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

forkboy84 posted:

The case for independence is weaker than it was when the UK was still in the EU & it didn't really look likely that we would leave?

OK Flaps. That's silly but par for the course I guess.

Of course it is. Scotland needs the UK more than it needs Europe. Even more so now that they would be leaving the UK after it has already left Europe, thereby any far fetched unicorn claims of Scotland being granted immediate entry to Europe upon independence disappear and it would have to go through the usual method of joining.

More to the point the political taste for independence has been souring since the referendum. The people simply aren't calling for it.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:50

Pissflaps: Oct 20, 2002; by VideoGames

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/803902659396771840

Yep. High water mark.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 19:51

hyper from Pixie Sticks: Sep 28, 2004

Pack it up, lads. Independence is a bad idea.

Source: Some twat in Middlesbrough.

# ? Nov 30, 2016 20:12

Extreme0: Feb 28, 2013; I dance to the sweet tune of your failure so I'm never gonna stop fucking with you.

Continue to get confused and frustrated with me as I dance to your anger.

As I expect nothing more from ya you stupid runt!

Smoking in Cars with children now banned

Social network page exploiting the patrols of the MPVs to get more fish past their quota

Pro Lifers banned from making offical club. They get hosed instead

# ? Dec 5, 2016 17:28

Cerv: Sep 14, 2004; This is a silly post with little news value.

quote:

�Allowing an anti-choice group to form would be a barrier to freedom, equality and body autonomy for those with uteruses on campus and therefore not only violate existing standing policy, but also act against the interests of a large amount of the student population.�

What an odd phrasing. Makes it sound like students are carrying uteruses around in their laptop bags.

Think this will backfire. If they'd let the society affiliate to the union and get on with it they'd be small and unremarkable. Now they've got an excuse for a load of publicity

# ? Dec 5, 2016 17:37

forkboy84: Jun 13, 2012; Corgis love bread. And Puro

Once again proving that the people involved in student politics are complete fuckwits, so good job many of them will go on to be elected officials in due course.

# ? Dec 5, 2016 17:56

Hoops: Aug 19, 2005; A Black Mark For Retarded Posting

Just ignore student politics, all of it. It doesn't matter, it's just a hobby.

# ? Dec 5, 2016 18:34

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

forkboy84 posted:

Once again proving that the people involved in student politics are complete fuckwits, so good job many of them will go on to be elected officials in due course.

They aren't wrong though, I don't really see a reason to let people start the "women shouldn't have control of their own bodies" club.

# ? Dec 7, 2016 03:53

Niric: Jul 23, 2008

In response to the lovely, counterproductive news that half of Glasgow's job centres are to close, a reddit user has done a quick round up of how far apart the "merged" centres will be:

# ? Dec 8, 2016 18:06

Coohoolin: Aug 5, 2012; Oor Coohoolie.

If a proposed society violates the student union's rules on equal opportunities, tough poo poo.

# ? Dec 8, 2016 18:26

Niric: Jul 23, 2008

Coohoolin posted:

If a proposed society violates the student union's rules on equal opportunities, tough poo poo.

If there's one thing to learn from the ukmt (besides that even lefties can be irritating as hell), it's:

Hoops posted:

Just ignore student politics, all of it.

# ? Dec 8, 2016 19:47

ContinuityNewTimes: Dec 30, 2010; Я выдуман напрочь

I don't get the point of unions for people who just sit around eating pot noodles

# ? Dec 9, 2016 00:18

Angepain: Jul 13, 2012; what keeps happening to my clothes

OfficialGBSCaliph posted:

I don't get the point of unions for people who just sit around eating pot noodles

students tend to be very idealistic so it's good to teach them that all the structures that supposedly represent them are chosen entirely through name recognition and popularity contests and are generally just a meaningless front that gets to make a lot of noise and symbolic gestures while the people who actually make decisions go on making the decisions they would have done anyway, except maybe if you work really hard and relentlessly and everyone feels really strongly about something you might be able to enact a small change in actual policy which will then be overwritten in four years once everybody's forgotten about it and an entirely new bunch of assholes are ~~matriculated~~ in power

# ? Dec 9, 2016 00:34

Angepain: Jul 13, 2012; what keeps happening to my clothes

The nation's lovable stuffy academic uncle Andy Wightman MSP is apparently getting sued by parties unknown for �750k over some blog posts he wrote. Thread favourite news source The National is the only place with anything approaching details at this point, of which there are few for what I assume are good legal reasons, but I've already decided he's in the right here.

Additionally, I didn't know insolvency disqualified one from being an MSP. Seems a bit odd.

# ? Dec 10, 2016 12:30

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

I'm surprised nobody mentioned that Tory MSP Alex Johnstone passed away. He was one of only 29 founder members of the Scottish Parliament still sitting, and one of the 24 who have sat without interruption since 1999.

# ? Dec 10, 2016 14:00

forkboy84: Jun 13, 2012; Corgis love bread. And Puro

Angepain posted:

The nation's lovable stuffy academic uncle Andy Wightman MSP is apparently getting sued by parties unknown for �750k over some blog posts he wrote. Thread favourite news source The National is the only place with anything approaching details at this point, of which there are few for what I assume are good legal reasons, but I've already decided he's in the right here.

Additionally, I didn't know insolvency disqualified one from being an MSP. Seems a bit odd.

This is crummy. Hope he wins, he's a credit to the parliament, we desperately need strong voices on land reform.

# ? Dec 10, 2016 14:04

bitterandtwisted: Sep 4, 2006

I hadn't realised Edinburgh Trams were likely to be extended down Leath, but apparently, that's part of the reason Leith Walk is currently being dug up. What's everyone's thoughts on that?

I rather like the trams now they're here and it would be handy to have a stop near me.

# ? Dec 11, 2016 14:05

forkboy84: Jun 13, 2012; Corgis love bread. And Puro

bitterandtwisted posted:

I hadn't realised Edinburgh Trams were likely to be extended down Leath, but apparently, that's part of the reason Leith Walk is currently being dug up. What's everyone's thoughts on that?

I rather like the trams now they're here and it would be handy to have a stop near me.

The Sheffield tram system was my favourite part of living in Sheffield. Obviously they were a complete nightmare to build in Edinburgh because of all the disruption and the fact it went on forever and was about �375m over budget. It's like how we've forgotten to do infrastructure projects in the entire UK. They could probably do with another route that actually goes to spots where folk live, serving some of the schemes. But those are the sort of spots some of Edinburgh would rather forget exists.

# ? Dec 11, 2016 14:23

Scikar: Nov 20, 2005; 5? Seriously?

I live near a tram stop so it should be convenient, but most of the time I can get a bus from the same place that will get me closer to where I want to go in about the same amount of time. I'd much rather they spent the money on joining up the loose bits of cycle infrastructure. We have the odd poorly maintained cycle lane scattered about, generally in places where there's lots of room for a cyclist anyway, but the only options for getting between Princes Street and the Royal Mile involve cycling in bus lanes in an area where almost all of the bus routes converge. The usual idiots in the motoring lobby are pissing and moaning about the money spent on the cycle path along Water of Leith though so I can't see the council ever having the guts to dig up a major road just to encourage a mode of transport that they can't sell advertising space on.

# ? Dec 11, 2016 14:54

Lord of the Llamas: Jul 9, 2002; EULER'VE TO SEE IT VENN SOMEONE CALLS IT THE WRONG THING AND PROVOKES MY WRATH

bitterandtwisted posted:

I hadn't realised Edinburgh Trams were likely to be extended down Leath, but apparently, that's part of the reason Leith Walk is currently being dug up. What's everyone's thoughts on that?

I rather like the trams now they're here and it would be handy to have a stop near me.

The original plans have the trams going to New Haven. They stopped at York Place because the project was going so far over budget. I remember when we had the referendum on a congestion charge which would have meant we would have a line that went from Waverley through the bridges/Newington/Kings buildings etc. As always referendums produce the wrong result.

# ? Dec 11, 2016 15:54

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# ? May 14, 2024 16:22

Angepain: Jul 13, 2012; what keeps happening to my clothes

Lord of the Llamas posted:

I remember when we had the referendum on a congestion charge which would have meant we would have a line that went from Waverley through the bridges/Newington/Kings buildings etc. As always referendums produce the wrong result.

oh god I remember this, I'm very sad that the fine work of campaigning art described here has since disappeared from the internet

# ? Dec 11, 2016 16:04

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