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After finishing the WE campaign I'm pretty sure the big issue with balancing the faction is the decision to make Sacrificial Ground stack which can lead to some really bonkers stats if you get enough of them. I bet Eagles are pretty OP when you have 25 sacrificial grounds.
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Dec 13, 2016 06:54
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Kestral posted:Nope. Check this out: Maybe having mods enabled at the start of the campaign broke it? You should get Occupied Marienburg instead of the usual Asrai lookout for the building. No special actions required.
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Dec 13, 2016 07:00
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Ravenfood posted:Also Great Eagles loving suck, jesus. I'm using one from a Waystone garrison defense and this poo poo is going even with a unit of Ungor Raiders, for gently caress's sake. What are they even for? Hawk Riders at least are semi-decent flank chargers with bonus arrows I guess. I think it's the fear/terror flying flank at T4? I can't even think of anything else, and they aren't even sort of worth having.
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Dec 13, 2016 07:03
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Kestral posted:Nope. Check this out: I guess your Marienburg is glitched (maybe not just you, I didn't conquer Marienburg). But I took over a bunch of special cities in my Grand Campaign, and it did indeed replace the primary building
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Dec 13, 2016 07:16
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So having played the mini-campaign and a round of the grand campaign with the Wood Elves as npcs, I conclude that they are assholes. Looking forward to being snooty and French when I turn the tables as Bretonnia.
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Dec 13, 2016 07:43
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1st_Panzer_Div. posted:I think it's the fear/terror flying flank at T4? I can't even think of anything else, and they aren't even sort of worth having. If the stupid thing was able to disengage super easily it would be really useful to bolster your line at a moments notice, but its mass is so low and its so poo poo at fighting that its bound to get stuck and die on the first charge.
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Dec 13, 2016 08:08
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Carcer posted:If the stupid thing was able to disengage super easily it would be really useful to bolster your line at a moments notice, but its mass is so low and its so poo poo at fighting that its bound to get stuck and die on the first charge. This is so frustratingly true. I just had one get locked down by Free Company Militia for god's sake.
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Dec 13, 2016 08:41
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Mine got tangled up in goblin archers. Swooped in, couldn't get out before squig hoppers charged in from a distance away and was dead in about 10 seconds. If it would do swooping attacks where it never actually landed but rather "strafed" ground targets it would be so much better, even considering its pathetic damage output.
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Dec 13, 2016 10:44
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Deified Data posted:Right, I don't like to min-max my armies, I just like filling them up with the coolest units that I feel truly represent the faction, but amber costs for stuff as middling as hawks actively punishes that mindset. Yeah, I feel the same. I wanted to use all the units but as amber was so restictive I only ever built dragons. Nothing worse than confederating and not realising the amber upkeep of the main province will put you in the red so easily. If their intention is to have either elves with a smattering of trees or vice versa then they need to tweak the amber system. Doubling up the amber costs/earnings and make certain units cost either 1 or 2 amber might help. I ended up bitting the bullet and using a more amber mod just for variance sake and to liven them up a bit.
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Dec 13, 2016 11:28
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Has anyone managed to confederate mousillon as vc? I've got them at 90 approval but they just wont bite, lmao
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Dec 13, 2016 11:57
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Eagles need the melee upgrades on the wood elf lords redline just like all their other melee units. Two units of hawk riders and an eagle will chew up anyone's back line. They are basically super mobile shock cavalry, and will kill hellcannons and dwarf artillery 4eva. Just don't charge them into a high hitpoint infantry unit. Like, don't charge anything big towards spears. Wood elves are the glass cannon army, can't expect birds to face tank a tarpit of spears!
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Dec 13, 2016 12:04
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Surprise Giraffe posted:Has anyone managed to confederate mousillon as vc? I've got them at 90 approval but they just wont bite, lmao I could have sworn confederation wasn't a thing with the VC... Have the changed that recently or something? I can have moments of... eccentricity and sometimes be quite curious about things. Please forgive me if I do something foolish or rude.
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Dec 13, 2016 12:29
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numptyboy posted:Yeah, I feel the same. I wanted to use all the units but as amber was so restictive I only ever built dragons. I've not found going into negative amber to be a real problem. I was keeping 1 or 2 in reserve for most of this campaign but I doubt I'll bother in the future.
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Dec 13, 2016 12:57
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With testing, hawk riders can easily dispatch 2 units of goblin archers by quickly switching which ones they're currently mauling in melee. The arrow fire helps because it helped keep both goblin units on low morale until they both finally broke. The hawks didn't suffer a single casualty. The eagle gets beaten by 2 units of goblin archers, even with the ai being absolutely retarded and having the 2nd goblin unit stand around doing nothing. It eventually routed with a sliver of health while the 2 goblins where about 50% damaged. It can't disengage and rengage as easily as he hawks, it does less damage in melee than the hawks somehow and critically it doesn't do as much moral damage as the hawks, even with fear.
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Dec 13, 2016 13:11
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sassassin posted:I've not found going into negative amber to be a real problem. I was keeping 1 or 2 in reserve for most of this campaign but I doubt I'll bother in the future. It seems to stop replenishment of troops, which could leave you hosed unless you are moneybags.
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Dec 13, 2016 13:34
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numptyboy posted:It seems to stop replenishment of troops, which could leave you hosed unless you are moneybags. If you're fighting battles and losing troops then you're almost certainly in a position to be raking in raid/ransom income and/or capture some new outposts. As a temporary issue it's not worth worrying about imo.
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Dec 13, 2016 13:41
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Surprise Giraffe posted:Has anyone managed to confederate mousillon as vc? I've got them at 90 approval but they just wont bite, lmao I did. As the Wood Elves  
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Dec 13, 2016 14:05
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Hernia The Hunter posted:Eagles need the melee upgrades on the wood elf lords redline just like all their other melee units. Two units of hawk riders and an eagle will chew up anyone's back line. Irritatingly, you need to recruit 3 Wild Rider units to kick off Orion's Spear of Kurnous quest but the shield variants don't count. And since Orion is basically running a max-ranked army right now currently rampaging through TIlea, he's kind of far away from everything else. Oh well.
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Dec 13, 2016 14:09
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I found that the best way to use hawks against chaos in the campaign is to hover over their hellcanon's blind spots and pelt them with arrows instead of diving in and getting bogged down in infantry because the AI always puts them together so they can't cover each other so the full extend of their AA is the everfailure trying to fireball you(and wasting all his mana on shots that will miss 95% of the time) 2 hawks can take out all 4 of his cannons and do so before they get a single shot off at your main army and depending on how many sacrificial grounds you have you may have a significant of arrows left to shoot into some chosen's backs in the now 20v16 unit fight.
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Dec 13, 2016 14:28
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Kestral posted:Nope. Check this out: I loaded up my Wood Elf campaign and took Marienburg to test it and it seems you've done nothing wrong, Marienburg is bugged. I got the default Asrai Lookout too. In the same game, I have Miragliano and its special building and previously took Drakenhof which also had its special. Not running any mods.
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Dec 13, 2016 15:19
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Wafflecopper posted:I loaded up my Wood Elf campaign and took Marienburg to test it and it seems you've done nothing wrong, Marienburg is bugged. I got the default Asrai Lookout too. In the same game, I have Miragliano and its special building and previously took Drakenhof which also had its special. Not running any mods. Probably not related but Marienburg is also the bugged city map that has uncaptureable towers thus their towers never fire in a siege. Its cursed.
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Dec 13, 2016 15:46
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theDOWmustflow posted:I love the Waystalker hero. Great unit for sniping the big ticket units and if you can get one behind engaged enemy lines, he becomes basically Legolas, due to Hawkish Finesse. It gets even better: Waywalkers and Waystalkers are currently bugged. They are supposed to have another special ability trait that activates if there are enemies within 70m (and finesse deactivates), which then gives them +40% rate of fire.
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Dec 13, 2016 15:49
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What does 'Forest Spirit' actually do? The game gives a fluffy explanation, but I want to know what kind of mechanics are going on when you have tree dudes in forests. And Forest Stalker really needs to just have the drat arrows ignore trees completely, that would make fighting in forests MUCH more effective.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:13
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Panfilo posted:What does 'Forest Spirit' actually do? The game gives a fluffy explanation, but I want to know what kind of mechanics are going on when you have tree dudes in forests. Its all in their abilities; 20% physical resist, 40% weakness to fire, cause fear, part of their attack is magic damage is the standard pack I believe. All the stuff is listed below in the unit card, the green points are just fluff to give you a broad overview of the unit.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:22
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Panfilo posted:And Forest Stalker really needs to just have the drat arrows ignore trees completely, that would make fighting in forests MUCH more effective. Use melee troops instead of shooting.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:23
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theDOWmustflow posted:I love the Waystalker hero. Great unit for sniping the big ticket units and if you can get one behind engaged enemy lines, he becomes basically Legolas, due to Hawkish Finesse. Declare war on your elfy neighbors then go into ambush stance in support range of your city. If they have most of a full stack and they think you're gone, they will send an attack force that you can then crush and counter siege the next turn.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:36
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Really glad to see the good ol' "Enemy army in your own territory can outrun you" bug is still a huge pain in the rear end. Big stack of Vampire Counts came to my territory. They sacked a village and I ended up a hairs breadth away from them. Next turn, they force march further into my territory, with me chasing behind. Numerous terrain obstacles keep me one step behind them at all times. They hop a cliff, and then I hop a cliff and am just out of reach from starting a fight. This went on for 5 turns and they went and sacked another settlement WHILST I WAS SO CLOSE TO THEM. It's honestly bullshit. How the gently caress do I defend against that? There really ought to be a speed bonus in your own territory. So now I'm reverting a save so I can try and divert a bunch of my armies to choke points and hem the Vamps in, but it's ridiculous that I need to use 3 armies just to stop 1 enemy stack from force marching loops around me.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:42
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Ambush stance. If the AI doesn't know your army is there, then even if they don't run into the ambush they'll often stop within easy reach of your forces.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:45
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Ambush stance or you can just get the mod that gives you a movement bonus in your own provinces.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:45
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I had no idea ambush stance instantly hides your army. I will give that a go. It's oversights like this that really ruin the experience. I was going at it for two hours, and then this happens and I have to break off 2 sieges just to handle the situation and then I just quit to desktop. I can handle one settlement being sacked due to my own fault, but then having an army run rampant in my territory with me having no way to properly counteract it makes me want to save scum. Except I can't, since I only have turn-saves and last time I quick-saved was ages back.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:48
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You can use banshees to block the army movement, banshees in general are amazing agents that i try to spam out a few of. Edit: misread your post, insert factions block army agent instead.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:50
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Inch perfect army movement is one of the very few ways the AI can present a challenge without actually cheating/playing by different rules to the player.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:52
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You can also hire a second army to initiate fights when you're just slightly out of range.
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Dec 13, 2016 16:52
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sassassin posted:Inch perfect army movement is one of the very few ways the AI can present a challenge without actually cheating/playing by different rules to the player. Yeah I actually agree with this. It can be very annoying to deal with but the point of the game shouldn't be "the AI presents no challenge and I roll over everyone until I eventually win"
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Dec 13, 2016 17:03
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Waystalkers have enough campaign movement range to leave your main force and block an army after travelling with Worldroots. I've ran down a whole bunch of Beastmen stacks this way, spares a lot of frustration!
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Dec 13, 2016 17:13
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Always build walls in your settlements. The beefy garrisons should be able to delay and damage the stack enough for you to catch up and destroy.
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Dec 13, 2016 17:20
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John Charity Spring posted:Ambush stance. If the AI doesn't know your army is there, then even if they don't run into the ambush they'll often stop within easy reach of your forces. Access to Ambush stance might be the main reason the Beastman campaign is better than Chaos.
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Dec 13, 2016 17:34
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Avasculous posted:Access to Ambush stance might be the main reason the Beastman campaign is better than Chaos. Why would Sigvald want to hide his magnificence, though?
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Dec 13, 2016 17:52
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Surprise Giraffe posted:Has anyone managed to confederate mousillon as vc? I've got them at 90 approval but they just wont bite, lmao 90 isn't that high. What's their strength rating compared to yours? Usually factions will only want to confederate if they're really weak and you're a lot stronger.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:01
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Danann posted:Always build walls in your settlements. The beefy garrisons should be able to delay and damage the stack enough for you to catch up and destroy. Nah, no point using up important building slots of garrisons unless it's a chokepoint settlement that holds back constant threats (it makes it easier to defend with a smaller army constantly sitting in the settlement). Also, on another note: what does getting sacked actually do? My settlement was sacked and they walked off with 4700 gold, but none of my buildings were damaged and the settlement was still producing quite a lot of gold each turn.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:11
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